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On November 03 2012 19:45 da0ud wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 14:05 debears wrote:
##Vote Dau0d
Just so you lurkers know I'm serious @DebearsYou are being an active player, maybe too active and all over all arguments same as last game for me to get a read out of it. I will consider this more as a neutral townie-ish read but at least even if you were not town you do contribute and it will be easier to catch you later on. What I don't like about your post is to create noise in the voting thread. You are creating some activity by voting, unvoting, revoting, etc. I don't like that. You could have just FoSed me, and I would have agreed with you on that. I would have explained as well that the timezone differences do not help, but I will do my best to participate as much as I can. I will not post just for the sake of posting or fluffing though...
You may not like it, but pressure votes are usually effective. Considering you're lack of activity last game, I want you to step it up. Hence, my vote on you.
##Unvote
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On November 03 2012 20:58 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 10:21 debears wrote:
@obsy
Its mafia favored compared to the last setup. Only 9 players means a quicker game. A quicker game is better foe mafia since they don't have to fake their townieness for so long.
Also look at the roles like medic. Medic can't target the same person twice (was it also that he can't target himself? I'm on my phone and i really don't want to check @ debearsSo, are you saying that the fact that we have a medic which cannot target the same person twice is such a big imbalance that this game is obviously mafia favored or are you role-fishing ? I'm not sure why you mention this in this post, could you elaborate ?
Idk how you get that I'm role fishing from that.
1) I talked about the speed of the game and number of players being mafia favored
2) Combined with the roles setup, the game is pretty mafia favored imo
How do you get that I'm role fishing for that when I in no way ask anyone if they are blue?
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On November 03 2012 21:23 Clarity_nl wrote:
Where did I make a list? Unless you're talking about my reads on everyone, which I don't see can ever be a bad thing.
You are the one who pointed out that it is a plurality lynch, and that we should not focus too deeply on a select few.
My "list" forces everyone to comment on it, and perhaps gain insight on others through my observations or sees a flaw in my logic and helps me out by pointing it out.
Yeah, I've read that lists are generally a mafia tell, or newbie town, but this is only the case if they do not contribute.
Are you saying that my post will not contribute?
Don't do lists like that. They really aren't that helpful. You ask too many questions and you can't pursue them, which is something scum want.
Pick a couple people at a time to pursue and question them specifically on stuff.
No more lists like that
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On November 03 2012 14:44 sylverfyre wrote:Holy shit, this flavor. What. If we're gonna lynch a lurker, I'd rather it be early game than late, at least. But I think that we have more... dedication among the townies this game. There wasn't a long wait for the last few signups - everyone here seems pretty pumped to play some mafia seriously. I don't think lurker policy lynch will come up at all. I kinda expected a bit more... substance in the thread by now. A lot of people are dicking around... lots of oneliners, debears and cheesecake geez you're firing off the oneliners like crazy, you've already got 4 and 3 page filters respectively (75% of it post-gamestart) You've got tons of posts within 1 minute of each other, and often at least one of them has no content. I mean, posting a lot is great, but you're posting a lot of nothing. You're also posting shit with content, but can you PLEASE make your posts a little more substantial so it isn't impossible to read your filter? Would be really helpful. I like Rad's suspicion about people labeling CC being funny as a towntell. Shit, last game people were calling "only posts towntells" as scummy (including on people who turned out to be townie when lynched/NK'd) Cheesecake is also filling this thread with fluff a lot too. I don't kno wwhat to think about Alsn or debears. Could be one of the two is scum, need to see more from them on this topic. Don't like debears fluff. da0ud, please post. Don't pull what you did last game and vacation your life away. (If you're on vacation again, I'm going to be mildly annoyed you even chose to /in) Obviously, morning over there now. You've got time. ##Vote debearsYour fluff, and your reaction against Alsn seem odd to me. Also, your claim of always being perfect about on at lynchtime. Now we can't even use it (in the future) as a scumtell on you because it'd turn into WIFOM. + Show Spoiler [off-topic complaint] +TL went down for several minutes as I'm typing this. Frustrating, can't finish the post because I want to check more filters!
This post screams scummy to me for a few reasons.
1) Sylver had obviously been following the thread before this post, yet he posts it AFTER I leave the thread. This is especially alarming considering he suddenly accuses and votes me for terribad reasoning
2) It's a big post, showing that he had it written for a while
3) He neglects that I actually do have content in my filter
4) He pretty much peaced out right after (was onlly posting for 45 minutes, made very few posts)
5) He casts suspicions on me and Cheese
6) Fails to refer the convo's btw me and alsn----me, CC, and Djo
7) He lectures us about not having conent in the thread, yet he hasn't been here, and he has provided literally nothing. what good does that do for town.
8) How do you know who the townies are, and how do you know they are more dedicated? The only ones posting alot are me, CC, and Djo with a little Rad and Clarity sprinkled in. So, since we are showing dedication, you obviously think we are town, yet you vote me and spread suspicion on cheese.
Scumslip alert boys
##Vote Sylver
Explain yourself
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ebwop
look at point 8 about the red text and scumslip
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On November 03 2012 23:44 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 23:33 debears wrote:On November 03 2012 20:58 Djodref wrote:On November 03 2012 10:21 debears wrote:
@obsy
Its mafia favored compared to the last setup. Only 9 players means a quicker game. A quicker game is better foe mafia since they don't have to fake their townieness for so long.
Also look at the roles like medic. Medic can't target the same person twice (was it also that he can't target himself? I'm on my phone and i really don't want to check @ debearsSo, are you saying that the fact that we have a medic which cannot target the same person twice is such a big imbalance that this game is obviously mafia favored or are you role-fishing ? I'm not sure why you mention this in this post, could you elaborate ? Idk how you get that I'm role fishing from that. 1) I talked about the speed of the game and number of players being mafia favored 2) Combined with the roles setup, the game is pretty mafia favored imo How do you get that I'm role fishing for that when I in no way ask anyone if they are blue? @ debearsMaybe you were waiting for a possible medic to confirm you the fact that he cannot heal himself. I would expect a medic to carefully read his role's rules and I'm expecting you to know that medics usually cannot heal themselves. But you are asking this question nevertheless. I'm agreeing that the speed of this game is benefit the mafia but I don't see why the role setup would be mafia favored. It is only because the medic cannot heal the same person twice ?
That, with no vig, no vet, yet the Mafia still have the same power roles for possiblities, except the godfather.
Oh, and roleblocks aren't notified.
Mainly it's the number of players and speed of the game combined with only having 2 mafia
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@Djo
What do you think of my points on Sylver?
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On November 03 2012 22:06 da0ud wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 22:01 Djodref wrote:
Definition of casting suspicion: suggest that something or someone might be suspect
I had to look up in the dictionary to be sure ^^
This coupled to the fact that his reasons to vote debears are insufficient in my eyes (you vote someone for some facts, not because he is fluffy without showing where he is fluffy) made sylverfire my top scumread right now. I see your point Djodref but I don't think because someone else votes another one for being a "poor" contirbutor and sees that as a scum read would make himself scum. He is trying to put pressure on Debears in order to get him to maybe post less and better content.
What does me posting less exactly accomplish?
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On November 04 2012 00:06 Rad wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 18:43 Clarity_nl wrote:
Rad: Null. He's being more careful than last game, lurking a bit more. He mentioned he would be more careful, but not in pregame, he did this after the role PMs were sent. He also seems really invested in helping Obzy out as he's the newest, the only one here who wasn't in XXIX.
@ Rad
Why the interest in Obzy? Are you going to use MLG as an excuse at any point this weekend?
I felt a bit of inig coming through in obzy. Overwhelmed, confused, but potentially useful to town. I didn't want to see him shy away due to how fast the conversations were coming and going here. I wanted him to open up and let his thoughts be known. Yes, I'll be watching MLG pretty much every minute it's on until it's done on Sunday. I do that for every MLG I get a chance to watch. My fiance is working all day today so all I got is MLG and this newbie mafia to pay attention to :D Might play a game here and there (ns2), but I expect a lot of my time today to be dedicated towards this game while watching MLG. As for my being more careful, it's based strictly on how I changed over the course of last game. I based my cases on a lot of stupid things and confirmation bias but couldn't ever realize it until after townies started flipping when I was sure they were scum. I want to avoid that this time and at least have some more solid reasoning when I decide to center in on someone.
Rad, alot of early d1 cases will end up being stupid in hindsight. Hapa, a good player, even stated so in GSL III I believe. That doesn't excuse you from scumhunting.
I understand getting Obsy to post to avoid having him lurk, but you seemed too focused on it.
What are your thoughts on Dau0d/syler/Djo from the last couple of pages?
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On November 04 2012 00:24 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
On the Sylverfyre vote...
While I don't necessarily agree with a vote on Debears, I can see where he's coming from. A half-assed FoS on Alsn, asking all the questions to seem pro-town; it's exactly how he played last game. About Sylver's "scumslip"... hmm, perhaps. He could just be referring to the entire town (thread) in general.
You don't get it.
He said he likes town's dedication;
The ones showing dedication are me, djo, you, rad, and clarity
Yet, he votes me, who is definitely most dedicated right now (and he thinks the town is dedicated)
See the mafia-oriented contradiction?
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On November 04 2012 00:29 da0ud wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 23:59 debears wrote:
@Djo
What do you think of my points on Sylver? your case against Sylver is way more constructed than Djo's initial scumslip read. I agree on most point apart maybe for the last point in red which might be over exagerated interpretation. Dont you think Debears ?
Why is it over exaggerated? I need specifics
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On November 04 2012 00:46 Rad wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On November 04 2012 00:10 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2012 00:06 Rad wrote:On November 03 2012 18:43 Clarity_nl wrote:
Rad: Null. He's being more careful than last game, lurking a bit more. He mentioned he would be more careful, but not in pregame, he did this after the role PMs were sent. He also seems really invested in helping Obzy out as he's the newest, the only one here who wasn't in XXIX.
@ Rad
Why the interest in Obzy? Are you going to use MLG as an excuse at any point this weekend?
I felt a bit of inig coming through in obzy. Overwhelmed, confused, but potentially useful to town. I didn't want to see him shy away due to how fast the conversations were coming and going here. I wanted him to open up and let his thoughts be known. Yes, I'll be watching MLG pretty much every minute it's on until it's done on Sunday. I do that for every MLG I get a chance to watch. My fiance is working all day today so all I got is MLG and this newbie mafia to pay attention to :D Might play a game here and there (ns2), but I expect a lot of my time today to be dedicated towards this game while watching MLG. As for my being more careful, it's based strictly on how I changed over the course of last game. I based my cases on a lot of stupid things and confirmation bias but couldn't ever realize it until after townies started flipping when I was sure they were scum. I want to avoid that this time and at least have some more solid reasoning when I decide to center in on someone. Rad, alot of early d1 cases will end up being stupid in hindsight. Hapa, a good player, even stated so in GSL III I believe. That doesn't excuse you from scumhunting. I understand getting Obsy to post to avoid having him lurk, but you seemed too focused on it. What are your thoughts on Dau0d/syler/Djo from the last couple of pages? I haven't said I don't plan on scumhunting. What gives you that impression? You're coming to a false conclusion on what I've been talking about. Concerning obzy, what do you mean I seemed too focused on it? I tried to help him understand my stance on lurkers because he had some issues with it. Then I had to jump in and make sure he didn't get super demotivated because YOU were calling his posts useless and worthless. What does a town want a newbie town to do? Learn how to play the game and be useful to town. What does a scum want a newbie town to do? Feel scared at the thought of being terrible at the game, back off, say nothing out of fear. How exactly are you helping town by talking shit to the new guy at the beginning of d1?
You are way overblowing my post on obsy.
1) I only said useless, not worthless. Stop putting words in my mouth
2) Yeah it's cool to encourage him, but you have to still scumhunt
3) You said that you were going to make a case later today and be more passive. How is that case going to come about if you aren't actively trying to find scum in the thread?
I was in no way talking shit to him. I was stating my views on him. 1 sentence and 1 word in that sentence is hardly talking shit. In no way was it an, 'OH HES DEFINITELY SCUM GUYS'. It was a "you're posts are slightly scummy, defend yourself and contribute". Why are you overblowing my post?
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On November 03 2012 14:44 sylverfyre wrote:
Holy shit, this flavor. What.
If we're gonna lynch a lurker, I'd rather it be early game than late, at least. But I think that we have more... dedication among the townies this game. There wasn't a long wait for the last few signups - everyone here seems pretty pumped to play some mafia seriously. I don't think lurker policy lynch will come up at all.
You said townies. That's very different than saying the town or players. Very, very different.
It means that you either
1) Think the people being active are townies
2) Know that the people being active are townies
There is no other reason for using townies to describe those of us who are showing activeness and dedication
Also, you voted me, meaning you voted for someone who you think is townie based on the above. That is scummy as shit
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@Rad
I concede on the worthless point.
Also, there are two ways of encouraging newbies to post
1) Pressure
2) Kindness
I chose 1 initially. Notice my reaction after Obsy responds. Would you say that is talking shit to him?
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@Rad
A little bit of context for the useless and worthless words. They were used to group 3 players, not just obsy
On November 03 2012 13:28 debears wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 13:26 Djodref wrote:On November 03 2012 13:22 debears wrote:On November 03 2012 13:11 Djodref wrote:On November 03 2012 13:04 Clarity_nl wrote:
Okay re-reading your post you're saying we shouldn't focus on one/two people, instead considering everyone and not consolidate on a lynch? @ ClarityExactly, I think you everyone should just vote for his top scumread while giving enough reason to do so and then we start again from there and see who is likely to be lynched, be it 2 or 3 players. I think it's the best way to use plurality lynch. Considering only 2 possibilities narrows the discussion and allows mafia players to have some excuse to lynch town (cf Cheese last game lynching daoud in the daoud/ini match-up). The downfall is that the end of the day could be a bit messy. seriously.....why are we having to explain this? 1) Scumhunt 2) Vote for your top scumread 3) When the voting comes down to 2 candidates and lynch is near, pick one of two said candidates and give reasoning why you're voting them Is that clear enough for all of you to understand? Please stop talking about policy @ debearsMy point is that it would benefit us to consider more than 2 candidates for the lynch. Anyway it's too late to discuss about it now, I was just answering Clarity's question about it. By the way it's not policy, it's lynch mechanics  More semantics, anyways it's useless. What do you think of Obsy's, Dau0d's, and Sylver's epic uselessness so far?
Also, why didn't I bash him for being general if I'm so set on shutting him out? Why did I ask a very specific question that is easy to answer in response?
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Also, apparently useless is my hot word for this game lol
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@Alsn
Debears on the other hand is OMGUS voting. His points 1 and 2 contradicts each other, his point 8 mentions a supposed scum slip when the paragraph is merely an answer to what sylver thinks about lurker policy, something which debears brought up in the first place! Saying that the town seems more dedicated when there's not a single truly lurking player in the game(at least considering the short amount of time the game has been up) seems about as genuine an answer that one can give at this point.
Give me some specifics on why my points are wrong
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On November 04 2012 01:39 Alsn wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2012 01:13 debears wrote:On November 03 2012 14:44 sylverfyre wrote:
Holy shit, this flavor. What.
If we're gonna lynch a lurker, I'd rather it be early game than late, at least. But I think that we have more... dedication among the townies this game. There wasn't a long wait for the last few signups - everyone here seems pretty pumped to play some mafia seriously. I don't think lurker policy lynch will come up at all. You said townies. That's very different than saying the town or players. Very, very different. It means that you either 1) Think the people being active are townies 2) Know that the people being active are townies There is no other reason for using townies to describe those of us who are showing activeness and dedication Also, you voted me, meaning you voted for someone who you think is townie based on the above. That is scummy as shit debears, even if we hypothetically assume the two most active players are scum, it would still mean that town on the whole is being active and not lurking. I think your argument is bad and your insistence that his statement is a scum slip is far fetched imho.
Eh. I think it's very odd to say that townies have good dedication, and I'm one of the guys showing dedication, yet he votes me.
Also, what do you think of this part of his post alsn?
I kinda expected a bit more... substance in the thread by now.
For a guy who hadn't posted anything, why is he calling all the actives out for substance? What good does that do?
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On November 04 2012 01:40 sylverfyre wrote:
You're reading what you want to read.
Remember that I spent last game mostly obsing, and it was depressing watching town lose because of inactivity when 2 out of 3 scum had blatantly labelled scum. I said what I said because I don't WANT that to happen this game. And I don't think any of these 9 players will do that. Just because "oh, I'm the most active" doesn't mean you're the only one contributing.
I am expecting a better game this time, and predicting that we aren't going to need to enact a policy lynch on lurking, or have town suffer from excessive lurking. Why are you trying to read more into what I said anyway?
Maybe I said townies because I am scum. Maybe I said townies because I'm town. You can't read into it - it's just a dumb WIFOM loop.
Or maybe, I'm just talking about the whole friggin game and you're reading WAY TOO MUCH into arbitrary word choice.
(technically, even scum are "part of the town" when it comes to posting voting and lynching) I reiterate: Your vote is both OMGUS and backed up by arbitrary "scum tells".
Also it's interesting that you're defending your own "make them post with pressure" while OMGUS voting me. You know your OMGUS vote is doing here? Nothing. It's just keeping my pressure on you, because they remove any reason.
(Press F5 to check thread again)
I liked "Confidence" a whole hell of a lot better than "Useless." Useless reeks of hostility.
Last game literally has nothing to do with voting me for "fluff" when I do have content. You weren't active. You hadn't posted anything. That's no content up to the point you vote for me in my view.
The "townies showing dedication" comment is not WIFOM at all. WIFOM is whether a scum would make a certain action (nks for example)
The townies comment is about you contradicting what you said
You either thought or know that the actives are townies, based on your word choice.
You vote one of the actives
Yeah I have my vote on you because I find your inital post pretty scummy. I'm keeping my vote on you because I want to pressure you back. OMGUS? Sure. Warranted if I find you scummy? Hell yes.
And about useless. It reeks of "hostility". Does it reek of scumminess? If not, your just trying to cast suspicion on me for bullshit reasons
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On November 04 2012 01:44 Alsn wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 23:44 debears wrote:
1) Sylver had obviously been following the thread before this post, yet he posts it AFTER I leave the thread. This is especially alarming considering he suddenly accuses and votes me for terribad reasoning
2) It's a big post, showing that he had it written for a while
You say it's a big post and that it must have taken a while to write, yet you don't even acknowledge the possibility that maybe that's why you weren't around any more? Because it had taken him a lot of time to write it and you had simply left at that point? Given your point 2) I don't see how you can at the same time accuse him of deliberately waiting until you were gone.
Alsn, you don't find the timing convenient at all? It seems he had covered the whole thread at that point.
What's the best way to discredit someone? Waiting til they aren't there to argue with you
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EPT
