• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:03
CEST 00:03
KST 07:03
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202531Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 20259Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder8EWC 2025 - Replay Pack4Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced38BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams10Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0
StarCraft 2
General
Classic: "Serral is Like Hitting a Brick Wall" The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation Serral wins EWC 2025 EWC 2025 - Replay Pack
Tourneys
Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) TaeJa vs Creator Bo7 SC Evo Showmatch Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $10,000 live event Esports World Cup 2025
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Flash Announces (and Retracts) Hiatus From ASL BW General Discussion [BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder Brood War web app to calculate unit interactions
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL] Non-Korean Championship - Final weekend [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China
Strategy
Does 1 second matter in StarCraft? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason Total Annihilation Server - TAForever [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Link Between Fitness and…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Eight Anniversary as a TL…
Mizenhauer
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 677 users

Newbie Mini Mafia XXX - Page 40

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 38 39 40 41 42 92 Next
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 22:36 GMT
#781
On November 05 2012 07:31 Clarity_nl wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 03 2012 12:53 debears wrote:
Besides stating the obvious, do you agree with me or djo on this?


Now, debears calls everyone usless one way or the other so that's a null tell, but I just found this and I can't tell if this makes scumteam debears/djo more or less likely? After this there are a bunch of instances of one following the other.
It's rather interesting that he asked me to pick between him and djo, rather than asking me if Cheese's joke is a null tell or not. Am I just getting paranoid now? I need fresh eyes.
I think debears was right for calling you out there. I don't particularly agree that you needed to take a stance there, or that him wanting you to take a stance was anything but a null tell. But I can appreciate him wanting an actual opinion other than something to the effect of "wow, isn't that interesting" and nothing else.
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 22:42 GMT
#782
On November 05 2012 07:33 Clarity_nl wrote:
@ Alsn

I don't think there's a way for me to comment on cheese without screwing myself over. I don't think "staying neutral" is a scum tell on D1, but people clearly think so since it's the lynchpin (lol) of the cases on me.
I'd say there is. If you get lynched as town, the best thing we have to go on is your (then confirmed) honesty.

I honestly couldn't tell you if commenting will make everyone else more or less likely to vote for you, or less/more likely to vote for debears, who you seem convinced is scum. But that's forum mafia for you. I guess it depends on what you actually think.
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 04 2012 22:46 GMT
#783
I think that if you were to go on: being neutral and not making points = scum (on day 1) then Cheese would be a good target.
I'm not convinced that it's scummy though, as I think keeping a clear head and taking in as much information as possible is most important day 1. I find there are always people to push information out of others, and I feel that (for me personally) if I push people I tend to get confirmation bias, so I avoid it early.
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 22:46 GMT
#784
How about him not actually pushing his top scum read then?
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
Obzy
Profile Joined April 2009
United States525 Posts
November 04 2012 22:48 GMT
#785
On November 05 2012 07:26 Alsn wrote:
Anyone going to even consider Cheese or at least point out if I'm wrong about something? If you truly think Clarity was just blending in, then why should Cheese be excused? Clarity is at least pushing someone he has stated was his top scum read. Cheese just wants to wait for more information without even having to commit to a vote? Come on.


I've been worried about Cheese, but nobody has seemed interested in grilling him. I don't really feel comfortable questioning people rapidly, my posting is too slow to keep up with a forum argument. I want to know who the two people he thinks are scum, and any neutral reads. (Honestly, I like lists, so I want him to list his town reads, too. But he's hinted at an aversion to lists so

With regards to Clar's post just now - "I don't think "staying neutral" is a scum tell on D1" - whyever not? You should be showing that you are town through your actions. Staying neutral is ridiculous. If you don't have an opinion whatsoever, you should have a reason for it- like, "My house caught fire and my dog died and I was kidnapped by terrorists and thusly I haven't been reading the thread at all so I have no opinions." If your opinion is that every single person looks towny or scummy, cool. Whatever. Judgment problems maybe, but at least it's honest. Not wanting to hold an opinion[being neutral] is what doesn't make any sense, unless you're afraid of being wrong. CC hasn't had anybody go after him, he's had a fairly soft impact on the direction that the thread has been taking. Why would he fear being wrong? He wouldn't necessarily be the one who was blamed.

IMO, anyways. I don't feel comfortable voting CC today because nobody has really gone after him so it would feel very sudden, but I really would like to see people looking at him a bit more. He should appreciate that too, because it gives him a chance to open up and not look so "neutral"; and also prevents him from "avoiding attention and skating by".
I have nothing to put here. Obzy#1821 on Bnet.
Rad
Profile Joined May 2010
United States935 Posts
November 04 2012 22:48 GMT
#786
On November 05 2012 07:33 Clarity_nl wrote:
@ Alsn

I don't think there's a way for me to comment on cheese without screwing myself over. I don't think "staying neutral" is a scum tell on D1, but people clearly think so since it's the lynchpin (lol) of the cases on me.


How would commenting on cheese screw you over?
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 04 2012 22:49 GMT
#787
I haven't done that either. His top scumread was djo, right? Djo has been pushed for most of the day. I've already said that I dislike pushing people who are already being pushed unless they're missing something obvious.
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 04 2012 22:59 GMT
#788
On November 05 2012 07:48 Obzy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 05 2012 07:26 Alsn wrote:
Anyone going to even consider Cheese or at least point out if I'm wrong about something? If you truly think Clarity was just blending in, then why should Cheese be excused? Clarity is at least pushing someone he has stated was his top scum read. Cheese just wants to wait for more information without even having to commit to a vote? Come on.


I've been worried about Cheese, but nobody has seemed interested in grilling him. I don't really feel comfortable questioning people rapidly, my posting is too slow to keep up with a forum argument. I want to know who the two people he thinks are scum, and any neutral reads. (Honestly, I like lists, so I want him to list his town reads, too. But he's hinted at an aversion to lists so

With regards to Clar's post just now - "I don't think "staying neutral" is a scum tell on D1" - whyever not? You should be showing that you are town through your actions. Staying neutral is ridiculous. If you don't have an opinion whatsoever, you should have a reason for it- like, "My house caught fire and my dog died and I was kidnapped by terrorists and thusly I haven't been reading the thread at all so I have no opinions." If your opinion is that every single person looks towny or scummy, cool. Whatever. Judgment problems maybe, but at least it's honest. Not wanting to hold an opinion[being neutral] is what doesn't make any sense, unless you're afraid of being wrong. CC hasn't had anybody go after him, he's had a fairly soft impact on the direction that the thread has been taking. Why would he fear being wrong? He wouldn't necessarily be the one who was blamed.

IMO, anyways. I don't feel comfortable voting CC today because nobody has really gone after him so it would feel very sudden, but I really would like to see people looking at him a bit more. He should appreciate that too, because it gives him a chance to open up and not look so "neutral"; and also prevents him from "avoiding attention and skating by".


Let me rephrase... I don't think that because you're not pushing hard /you're not accusing someone of being scum is being scummy. I actually feel that (WIFOM incoming) scum wants to be active in this format, and gain town favor early, ride that out to a win.

@ Rad

He's being accused of the same things I am, if I argue for/against Cheese it'll all be major WIFOM
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 22:59 GMT
#789
On November 05 2012 07:49 Clarity_nl wrote:
I haven't done that either. His top scumread was djo, right? Djo has been pushed for most of the day. I've already said that I dislike pushing people who are already being pushed unless they're missing something obvious.
Yet he never pushed Djo. He only alluded to doing so. I'm guessing he was actually hoping that someone else would push the Djo lynch letting him sheep onto it. Or possibly that Djo is actually his scum buddy and the whole joke stupidity in the early game was arranged.

Either way, I can't forgive him for just letting his supposedly top scum read go because he wants to be "neutral". For crying out loud he even accuses you of being neutral in order to get everyone to lynch you as I pointed out in my top spoiler in this post.

So he clearly thinks himself that it's ok to lynch you for being neutral, yet he doesn't want to push a lynch himself but would prefer to wait for "more information".
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 04 2012 23:03 GMT
#790
I would love it if the people who haven't voted asked more questions, rather than just hoping the thread develops so you can make up your mind.
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 23:10 GMT
#791
Obzy, the thing about lists is that it's almost impossible to stay "up to date" on everyone in the thread. So even in the case of a townie making a truthful list there are bound to be reads in a list that look pretty weird/end up being wrong once they read some more of someone's filter. That's a perfect way for scum to push a mislynch based on someone's list not reflecting reality. On the other hand, it's also not particularly hard to "hide" behind a list saying you find some people slightly scummy or that you "don't know much" about someone. All in all, lists don't actually say very much about what someone actually thinks, behaviour does(such as who is this person pushing as scum? who do they listen to in the thread? etc.).

In/actions speak louder than words.
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
debears
Profile Joined September 2012
United States2516 Posts
November 04 2012 23:11 GMT
#792
Yeah....Could everyone that hasn't voted vote? We have 3 hours to lynch right? That's getting dangerously close to late mayhem

@Alsn
And I agree with you on CC neutrality. I'm also looking at Sylver/Clarity for a few reasons. And if people don't show up for lynch (I think dau0d was the only one that said he couldn't be here for lynch) we are gonna have some problems
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 04 2012 23:13 GMT
#793
10pm forumclock. So a little less than 2 hours from now.
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 23:14 GMT
#794
@Rad
Seeing as you seemingly still can't decide who you want to lynch, what are your thoughts about my case on Cheese? You didn't want to push a debears/clarity lynch, well, what about Cheese?
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 23:15 GMT
#795
Oh, it's two hours from now? I thought it was just one.

Alright then, that makes me a little less worried. I'd still like it if people actually started arguing instead of just sitting back and waiting.
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
debears
Profile Joined September 2012
United States2516 Posts
November 04 2012 23:16 GMT
#796
Wait did lynch move up????? It's usually 8 pm my time, which is 3 hours from now....
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 23:17 GMT
#797
Someone talked about DST going into effect in the U.S. today I think? Don't remember who it was.

The lynch is one hour later compared to pre DST changes in Europe, but since there were DST changes, it's 2:00 am again for me.
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
Clarity_nl
Profile Joined November 2011
Netherlands6826 Posts
November 04 2012 23:18 GMT
#798
On November 05 2012 08:17 Alsn wrote:
Someone talked about DST going into effect in the U.S. today I think? Don't remember who it was.

The lynch is one hour later compared to pre DST changes in Europe, but since there were DST changes, it's 2:00 am again for me.


Okay, now I'm confused. When is lynch time?
FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT AGAINST STUPIDITY CLARITY, I BELIEVE IN YOU! - Palmar
Mr. Cheesecake
Profile Joined October 2012
United States3756 Posts
November 04 2012 23:19 GMT
#799
Everyone seems so concerned on why I haven't been pushing my case on Djo. You know why? Because everything that I find scummy about him, people attribute to his "Djo" attitude and the way he words things. I made a ton of mistakes last game that I find him doing this game. I point them out, but the entire thread is just like "You know, it's just Djo being Djo". Incredibly frustrating. I dropped my case and accusing him of scummy behavior because I actually didn't feel like hitting my head into this brick wall anymore. So, I decided to go back to a neutral stance and look at what other people were doing.

His 180 on pressure voting is something that I found to be damning as hell (Alsn, I think you agree on this?) He explains this by giving some sorry excuse about the difference between suspicion votes and pressure votes and blah blah blah. You know what? Fuck that. Djo is scummy as hell to me. Was last game(regardless of me being scum), is this game. I don't give two shits how he handles the language or his defense. The only reason he gets away with a ton of his posts is because his meta is cheerfully innocent.

/Engageconfirmationbiasgoggles

##Vote: Djodref

Also, Regular Fapper right here. Just fappin' away.
But CC isn't protown as town. 100% real heuristic.
Alsn
Profile Joined February 2008
Sweden995 Posts
November 04 2012 23:19 GMT
#800
I'm on CET. OP says "02:00 CET (+01:00 UTC)" which is in 1 hour 41 minutes.
Machina improba! Vel mihi ede potum vel mihi redde nummos meos!
Prev 1 38 39 40 41 42 92 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
BSL
20:30
Team Wars - Round 1
Bonyth vs Sziky
ZZZero.O117
LiquipediaDiscussion
OSC
18:00
Mid Season Playoffs
ByuN vs SHINLIVE!
SteadfastSC354
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SteadfastSC 354
UpATreeSC 159
CosmosSc2 28
ForJumy 9
StarCraft: Brood War
ggaemo 370
ZZZero.O 117
Aegong 57
MaD[AoV]42
NaDa 40
Dota 2
capcasts768
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K960
flusha430
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu311
Other Games
tarik_tv9185
summit1g8474
fl0m2458
shahzam671
mouzStarbuck294
C9.Mang0126
ZombieGrub52
PPMD40
Sick34
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 20 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta175
• StrangeGG 78
• musti20045 47
• sitaska33
• Kozan
• Migwel
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 36
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21201
League of Legends
• Doublelift3326
Other Games
• Scarra1195
• imaqtpie1174
• Shiphtur182
Upcoming Events
WardiTV European League
17h 57m
MaNa vs NightPhoenix
ByuN vs YoungYakov
ShoWTimE vs Nicoract
Harstem vs ArT
Korean StarCraft League
1d 4h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 11h
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
1d 13h
Mihu vs QiaoGege
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs TBD
WardiTV European League
1d 17h
Online Event
1d 19h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
Bonyth vs TBD
WardiTV European League
2 days
Wardi Open
3 days
[ Show More ]
OSC
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 20 Non-Korean Championship
FEL Cracow 2025
Underdog Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
CC Div. A S7
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025

Upcoming

BSL 21 Qualifiers
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.