EPTWherebugsgo specifically said that the game could not be broken based on this so i don't know why he keeps pushing it. Even though the nightkills and Muso seem to strengthen this theory, I wouldn't believe for a second that the theory will work for every player.
The way i see it, Kush has been hugging this theory so closely so that at any time in the game, he can safely change his mind about anything (more likely a suspected scum and claim town) without having to provide a legitimate reason for doing so. Drazzak is an excellent example of this:
I'm pretty sure i established that Drazzak's filter is pretty much all fluff and there is a paucity of useful information in there if at all during day 1.
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 02 2012 23:54 kushm4sta wrote:
Well draz is being wish washy as fuck here.
So you felt the need to weigh in on both me and prom, even though you have no idea what to think of either of them?
DRAZZAK
Anyone I am NOT trolling. I don't see how you would come to that conclusion.
I have been focusing on mechanics rather than behavior, though, that is true. I will focus on whatever I need to to find scum honestly. Analyzing behavior and analyzing mechanics are both tools you can and should use. I don't know why anyone would dismiss either.
Hypothetically, let's say that all vts have non character names like the ones that have been revealed so far (anvil, kid watching tv). Do you really think the mod would give break up that theme by randomly giving 1 vt a character name?
Well draz is being wish washy as fuck here.
So you felt the need to weigh in on both me and prom, even though you have no idea what to think of either of them?
DRAZZAK
Anyone I am NOT trolling. I don't see how you would come to that conclusion.
I have been focusing on mechanics rather than behavior, though, that is true. I will focus on whatever I need to to find scum honestly. Analyzing behavior and analyzing mechanics are both tools you can and should use. I don't know why anyone would dismiss either.
Hypothetically, let's say that all vts have non character names like the ones that have been revealed so far (anvil, kid watching tv). Do you really think the mod would give break up that theme by randomly giving 1 vt a character name?
here Kush points out one of drazzak's fluffy posts, and calls him scummy because of the wishy-washiness. Fair enough.
Here is the vote for the fluffiness:
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 03 2012 01:03 kushm4sta wrote:
Six hours till lynch. If we want to lynch someone based on behavior I think it should be drazak.
He has contributed nothign he has not given any reads except saying he doesn't know.
"A D1 mafia kill would definite ensure our town victory" LOL... no it wouldn't.
Also why would town say that? Completely unproductive comment. He's just trying to paint himself as town.
Anyway, read drazzak's filter it's real short.
##unvote
##vote drazzak
I still want any vt with a character name to claim btw. If no one claims then I will also want to lynch acro.
Six hours till lynch. If we want to lynch someone based on behavior I think it should be drazak.
He has contributed nothign he has not given any reads except saying he doesn't know.
"A D1 mafia kill would definite ensure our town victory" LOL... no it wouldn't.
Also why would town say that? Completely unproductive comment. He's just trying to paint himself as town.
Anyway, read drazzak's filter it's real short.
##unvote
##vote drazzak
I still want any vt with a character name to claim btw. If no one claims then I will also want to lynch acro.
as well as some more blue-hunting and hugging his theory.
However
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 03 2012 06:00 kushm4sta wrote:
huh its a great time for him to claim imo. It looks like he's going to be lynched right now, so he should claim before its too late.
##unvote
So I need another wagon now.
huh its a great time for him to claim imo. It looks like he's going to be lynched right now, so he should claim before its too late.
##unvote
So I need another wagon now.
On November 03 2012 06:11 kushm4sta wrote:
carrot fits perfectly. He came up with it fast.
No one else is a viable lynch but muso.
carrot fits perfectly. He came up with it fast.
No one else is a viable lynch but muso.
Kush doesn't exonerate Drazzak for anything particularly townie except for his theory.
This suggests that Kush established his love of his theory so that (as i mentioned earlier) he could change his mind without having to appear too conspicuous. This also suggests that the aggression against Drazzak was not really agression because the points against Drazzak were his fluffiness and wishy-washyness, neither of which was defended against or given any justification.
Essentially, Kush has freed himself from voting almost-certain scum because of his theory.
I don't see any townie motivation for voting against someone that seems so scummy.
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 03 2012 14:05 kushm4sta wrote:
Acrofales
There's the flavor theory but that is just one piece of the puzzle.
What are the odds of two town fake claiming?
I think it was a calculated scum risk.
Question to people who know mafia possibilities better than me: Is there some way scum could know muso was fake claiming?
Even if he didn't know, consider this: Would acro's claim have looked more scummy if Muso turned out to be mason? It seems like the is yes, but there is equal scumminess to action whether muso was mason or not. This is because when the action took place, acro had no way to know if the claim was fake or not. The only tool he had to discern the fake claim was his wits, which he has as mafia or town.
So don't let muso not being mason make you think his action is any less scummy.
His defense is that it would be retarded for scum to fake claim. Do you see how that logic is circular? It is retarded for scum to do that, therefore doing that makes you look town, therefore it is smart for scum to do that.
Also don't forget the flavor theory!
Acrofales
There's the flavor theory but that is just one piece of the puzzle.
What are the odds of two town fake claiming?
I think it was a calculated scum risk.
Question to people who know mafia possibilities better than me: Is there some way scum could know muso was fake claiming?
Even if he didn't know, consider this: Would acro's claim have looked more scummy if Muso turned out to be mason? It seems like the is yes, but there is equal scumminess to action whether muso was mason or not. This is because when the action took place, acro had no way to know if the claim was fake or not. The only tool he had to discern the fake claim was his wits, which he has as mafia or town.
So don't let muso not being mason make you think his action is any less scummy.
His defense is that it would be retarded for scum to fake claim. Do you see how that logic is circular? It is retarded for scum to do that, therefore doing that makes you look town, therefore it is smart for scum to do that.
Also don't forget the flavor theory!
Here he gives some justifiable reason for being suspicious of Acro (acro's scumminess doesn't become affected much by Muso's flip and this reveals nothing about Acro)
And he butthugs his flavor theory too.
On November 03 2012 22:57 kushm4sta wrote:
@prome You said your name doesn't fit my flavor theory, so why wouldn't you claim? You are basically calling yourself vt with that statement so the damage from claiming is already done. You might as well just do it
@Acro you actually bring up some good points in your defense.
1 Town has more reason to think the claim is fake because they do not know who mafia is.
2 Bugs games are meticulously put together and they would not have some broken mechanic that overrules scumhunting
So for those reasons I'm laying off acro.
@prome You said your name doesn't fit my flavor theory, so why wouldn't you claim? You are basically calling yourself vt with that statement so the damage from claiming is already done. You might as well just do it
@Acro you actually bring up some good points in your defense.
1 Town has more reason to think the claim is fake because they do not know who mafia is.
2 Bugs games are meticulously put together and they would not have some broken mechanic that overrules scumhunting
So for those reasons I'm laying off acro.
Agreement with Acro's defense. I feel this is reasonable. Not tunneling.
However, in bold is the gold: The flavor theory cannot overdo scumhunting, which begs:
Why did Kush give himself a free pass on unvoting drazzak for flavor and voting Muso? (actually because theoretically he hadn't realized it yet.) But plenty of people had called the flavor theory retarded before Acro did and he dismissed them all, yet he agrees with Acro.
Again, the way I see it, the agression against Acro was never meant to be agression at all. He simply did this hint doubt at Acro's behavior, only to exonerate him later.
In fact, at this point, i don't think Kush has actually had any forceful (or strongly self-supported) cases against anyone.
he voted for Muso because "there's no one else"
Despite this golden post, he still hugs his flavor theory, which i think at this point is completely bullshit and has the scum motivation of giving him an excuse to switch votes without having any legitimate reason.
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 04 2012 02:49 kushm4sta wrote:
Prome already said his name does not fit my flavor theory. Prome please claim, since you already admitted to being a vt.
If that is a character name I will stfu about flavor theory forever.
Also why did you reveal it now and not during d1?
~~
What is the difference between risk town and risk scum? Does anyone know?
Same question for mattchew.
~~
3 people want to lynch me now! Zealos, acro, thrawn. Anyone else?
Are there any questions you want me to answer? The cases are quite spread out so it's a little hard to respond to everything.
Summary of the case against me:
1 over reliance on flavor theory
I have been pretty obsessed with it sorry.
2 blue hunting
I just wanted more evidence for my theory. I only ever advocated 1 vt claiming their name. Also I thought mason should claim in the beginning but changed my mind about it. (The reason I actually made the case for mason claiming is I read in Sandroba's filter from a game a long something he said about there being no downside to millers claiming. But I thought he were talking about the role that is actually masons. Then I see someone this game talking about millers claiming and that authoritative opinion is only enforced, so I assume millers claiming is a smart play.)
^ a lot of text about something pretty insignificant.
3 thrawn saying im off my meta
Every game I try to improve and play better. I am being less emotional I think it's better play. (and also I've been hurt so many times in the past)
4 my "scumslip"
I said "Why is town fake claiming?"
2 people fakeclaimed mason. I doubt both of them are mafia. So I can say with almost a certainty that town is fakeclaiming because at least one of them is town.
Prome already said his name does not fit my flavor theory. Prome please claim, since you already admitted to being a vt.
If that is a character name I will stfu about flavor theory forever.
Also why did you reveal it now and not during d1?
~~
What is the difference between risk town and risk scum? Does anyone know?
Same question for mattchew.
~~
3 people want to lynch me now! Zealos, acro, thrawn. Anyone else?
Are there any questions you want me to answer? The cases are quite spread out so it's a little hard to respond to everything.
Summary of the case against me:
1 over reliance on flavor theory
I have been pretty obsessed with it sorry.
2 blue hunting
I just wanted more evidence for my theory. I only ever advocated 1 vt claiming their name. Also I thought mason should claim in the beginning but changed my mind about it. (The reason I actually made the case for mason claiming is I read in Sandroba's filter from a game a long something he said about there being no downside to millers claiming. But I thought he were talking about the role that is actually masons. Then I see someone this game talking about millers claiming and that authoritative opinion is only enforced, so I assume millers claiming is a smart play.)
^ a lot of text about something pretty insignificant.
3 thrawn saying im off my meta
Every game I try to improve and play better. I am being less emotional I think it's better play. (and also I've been hurt so many times in the past)
4 my "scumslip"
I said "Why is town fake claiming?"
2 people fakeclaimed mason. I doubt both of them are mafia. So I can say with almost a certainty that town is fakeclaiming because at least one of them is town.
1) he doesn't stop obsessing with the flavor theory
2) he uses the flavor theory as a defense for blue-hunting which is entirely unacceptable
3) w/e (i always have thought meta is bullshit anyways)
4) reasonable enough.
_________________________________________________________
After this he does have some aggression against Prome and what i was waiting for all night and for most of the day was some sort of the same reconciliation (similar to Acro's and Draz's) but such a reconciliation didn't happen. This is why i have been lurking.
_______________________________________________________________
On November 04 2012 23:34 kushm4sta wrote:
thrawn why did you say this right before lynch, esp when you said muso had the best chance of flipping red?
thrawn why did you say this right before lynch, esp when you said muso had the best chance of flipping red?
On November 05 2012 04:20 kushm4sta wrote:
With all this claim nonsense we forgot about hoe scummy release looks lol.
You case convinces me.
##unvote
##vote release
With all this claim nonsense we forgot about hoe scummy release looks lol.
You case convinces me.
##unvote
##vote release
We forgot even though thrawn gave us a friendly reminder? Dream on.
In conlusion, acrofales, drazzak, kush/ and prome
Kush is the godfather and prome, the serial killer.
