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On July 19 2012 06:29 Risen wrote: Gonzaw why are you voting Mattchew here? Who do you think his partner is? I think keir has been acting way more scummy than mattchew. If Matt is playing his #1 townie style I don't see why we aren't lynch keir. Btw, that's the only way I see Matt as scum is if he's playing as his pro townie self, dude is ruthless and probably why I don't trust him. Also yeah it's just a meta read Matt :/ thats fine just wanted to be open and honest about it.
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Gonzaw you have a seven page filter, mind reposting your accusations against me
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On July 19 2012 07:04 s0Lstice wrote:Show nested quote +On July 17 2012 11:04 Mattchew wrote:I just read Risen's entire filter, and couldn't find any inconsistencies or holes in logic. Even his read on me I can't really argue with. I haven't been as active as I should this game and while I don't think I have tried to fly under the radar, I could see where one may draw that conclusion. His reads are constantly evolving and changing more WAY more than when I played with him as scum, and he basically started and got Vivax lynched. While I didn't agree with the lynch + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 03:27 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 03:23 marvellosity wrote: What do you see in Vivax that makes you think he might be town? his effort and his not giving a fuck style he didn't push it in a scummy way. Late voters of Vivax should actually be looked at more strongly. This leads me to my next scum candidate. Gonzaw. I was waiting to push this until Talis flipped because A. I wanted to see if he was scum and B. I wanted to keep the conversation on Talis. I will make my case before deadline tomorrow. I have a lot of it mapped out in my head just not written down yet and I want to keep up with the fast pace of Bureaurcracy Mafia tonight Is this statement still true Mattchew? Not exactly, because of his gonzaw play which I don't fully understand, but I don't think that changes my read on him in anyway
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On July 19 2012 07:16 s0Lstice wrote: I also really like how Mattchew is concerning himself with answering the accusations of his top scum read, instead of pushing said read right now, as the town is losing focus. have we lost focus? I think a very high percentage of posts today are about who people think are scum and who to lynch today
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On July 19 2012 07:27 s0Lstice wrote: @mattchew - from your standpoint, yes. risen is all over keir, s&b seems to be suspicious of risen, dropbear wants to kill risen, gonzaw wants to kill you. the only person who is firmly in your camp at this time seems to be sciberbia.
aside from all that, we've been talking about the set-up, NK stuff, the other mason etc....and you don't seem to care that we aren't talking about gonzaw
your push on gonzaw feels very, very different from your push on Talis so far.
So, why you not voting gonzaw
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On July 19 2012 09:30 sciberbia wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 09:23 Risen wrote: I'm fairly certain I answered. With scum gonzaw matt is the only link I see. I think he's playing to his #1 townie meta if gonzaw is scum. Therefore, scum gonzaw = scum matt.
And what wasn't answered there keir? I'm sorry, but am I the only one completely confused by this? What exactly do you mean by "matt is the only link I see"? Why can't you see a dropbear + gonzaw scumteam or a keirathi + gonzaw scumteam? Also, if gonzaw's being scum implies that mattchew is strictly adhering to his town meta, isn't the logical conclusion that matt is town? Since when is acting like a townie a scumtell? Is anybody else confused by this or I am just retarded? Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 09:10 sciberbia wrote: 1) On N1, you got an inno check on strongandbig 2) On N2, you got an inno check on s0Lstice 3) You did not think gonzaw was scum at the start of D3 4) You intentionally started a wagon on gonzaw just to see who would jump on the wagon 5) You think that keirathi is scum because he jumped on the wagon so easily, and he also is interested in lynching you 6) You still do not think gonzaw is scum 7) You mistakenly used the word 'bus' when referring to you (Risen) starting a wagon on gonzaw
Also, can you please confirm that all 7 of these statements are true, or otherwise point out where I am wrong? He thinks that I am the only one that could be Gonzaws partner because A. He (gonzaw) was wishy washy and hesitant to lynch Talis, just like he is acting with me and B. I am known to bus all my teammates ruthlessly. Also, gonzaw has push for a keirathi lynch HARD so thats probably not his teammate and idk why Risen doesn't see dropbear as a possible teammate.
heres the thing though
Gonzaw is scum. I have made a full case against him, which not enough of you have taken the time to read and respond to. Right now, like literally as you read this post, go back and read through it.
This means Risen, I love you dearly, but you are wrong about me being his teammate. I have my suspicions of who is teammate could and could not be, but this really doesn't matter right now. We need to lynch a scum, not the entire scum team. If we lynch scum today we go up 6 town to 1 scum come day 4. With the ability to confirm Risen and get more confirmed town then night kills and lynches we will basically be unable to lose.
This is why we lynch Gonzaw. I would really really like to see why people are not voting him
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For your eyes I spoiled the long stuff (my responses are in there) + Show Spoiler +On July 19 2012 10:39 s0Lstice wrote:I'm starting to like this game more, because I have found scum. Listen up town, Mattchew is scum. Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 22:39 Mattchew wrote: Strong I feel like the entirety of your posts could easily be made by either town or scum, if this is you trying to establish your alignment you have done a poor job with me. Your post is longwinded and looks to explain your thought process, but we both know that 95% of your posts content has nothing to do with this game at all. Not only that but your early attempt at a read on marv does not even account for his other posts in the thread. And your reasoning for voting him from this game is too, extremely weak.
Let's start here. Look at what he tells s&b. Your posts thus far could come from either town or scum i.e. are neutral. He then goes on listing problems with it. -longwinded -off topic -bad read -bad reasoning for vote ...and the conclusion from this is neutral. After listing reasons for finding something suspicious, your end result should be 'I am suspicious of you.' More, who accuses someone of not looking definitively town in their first few posts? Someone who already knows the alignment of the person they are addressing. It wasn't 's&b your first few posts are crap and scummy looking,' it was 's&b you haven't shown me you are town in your first few posts.' Those things you listed, are exactly what I said, neutral alignment. Its the intention behind these posts that I was trying to figure out. Do you disagree with what I said about S&B's posts? Do you draw alignment from people being long-winded, off-topic and playing poorly? Because if you do, you are going to vote a lot of mislynches. Look now at what he did on day 1. This was basically his scum-hunting: Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 02:43 Mattchew wrote:Marv I want to disagree with you so bad, but I was wrong about something JUST LIKE this is MTG mafia... hmm I don't like the way sciberbia has been posting... it all seems forced as hell like the way he says On July 12 2012 13:31 sciberbia wrote:gonzaw asked for some thoughts on Risen, strongandbig, and Mattchew. Obviously there is not much to go on yet, but here are my thoughts so far He clarifies that he's only saying this cause gonzaw asked, kinda reads to me like hes paranoid about not answering a question in the thread Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 07:13 Mattchew wrote:Lets kill talis, Keirathi or scib Talis cause he's proposing anti town plans and then backpeddling super fast Keirathi cause he's posting super carefully, and his reads seem forced scib cause he seems hesitant to post, and he posts this (it was spoilered) Obviously, we should be lynching every day until we have good reason not to. I will push to get my scumreads lynched, but I will prefer any lynch to a No-Lynch.
I'm not a big fan of lynching lurkers. Obviously, lurking hurts town, but I don't think lurking is all that alignment-indicative. Seeing as our goal is to lynch scum, I will only give slight preference to lynching the lurker over the active player, everything else being even.
as he has not pushed a single read yet This would be a weak day 1 from anybody, but it is especially so from a vet. He leaves his vote on sciberbia and drops off the face of the earth. Compare that now to day 2, where he goes balls to the wall trying to get Talismania lynched. He is sure of himself, he convinces others to get on board. He basically doesn't leave it alone until he gets what he wants: a Talis lynch. Have a look: Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 03:10 Mattchew wrote: Drop you should be voting Talis with me, what do you think makes solstice more scummy than Talis? Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 05:42 Mattchew wrote:On July 16 2012 03:43 talismania wrote: also wtf happened to your suspicions of sciberbia - what made you change your mind there? still suspicious, just sure of you, nice scummy deflection btw and risen, do you not agree with my case on Talis? What do you find wrong with it or townie about him Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 07:05 Mattchew wrote:On July 16 2012 07:01 gonzaw wrote:On July 16 2012 06:55 Mattchew wrote:On July 16 2012 06:49 gonzaw wrote:On July 16 2012 06:45 Mattchew wrote: So I couldn't have left 2 hours before the lynch? I wasn't voting Vivax, and my questions werent answered before I had left. Not without explaining why you kept your vote on sciberbia (if you knew you weren't going to be back before the deadline) ro explaining anything at all or if you still thought sciberbia was scum. Or anything at all basically. People not giving you an exact vote count isn't an excuse to waste your vote, leave the thread and come back 24 hours later without giving a shit about the lynch. I had given my opinion on Vivax, because I wasn't confident in it doesn't mean I was ever going to vote to lynch him. So I left my opinions and my vote as they were Vivax wasn't the 100% sure lynch at that point. Dropbear already had votes, and to be honest you could have voted for someone else like austin, Keriathi, etc since they had votes as well. What made you keep your vote on sciberbia and not even consider changing it? What made you not even discuss about it? Or were you in too much of a hurry to explain stuff? If so you could have mentioned you were in a hurry before so we'd avoid this whole mess I was in a hurry, but I am sick of playing in games and making weekend excuses for not being able post as much as I would like. Read my case on Talis, tell me where I am wrong or vote with me on him. Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 07:06 Mattchew wrote: S&B your thoughts on talis? I want him dead This is a mismatch, like he flipped a switch and all of a sudden he is a scum-finding machine. It also reeks again of Mattchew already knowing someone's alignment. Now let's move to after the lynch. Show nested quote +On July 17 2012 12:08 Mattchew wrote:But later (after your D1 fiasco) you just parked your vote on talis, and spent 80% of your posts just going "what do you think of talis" or "vote talis" or "I want talis dead" or "talis talis talis". Like, no offense to scib, but I would put a lot of the weight on Talis actually getting lynched on me forcing attention onto him. Scib's case was good and all, but would you agree that without me pushing individuals (not just HEY THREAD I MADE A CASE) was the real reason for all the votes on Talis? I wanted to get Talis lynched, something you flipflopped on a lot which I am extremely suspicious of. I think I did a pretty good job of bringing people from "I would lynch x,x, and talis," to actually voting and getting on Talis. But thats enough for patting myself on the back. What is he doing here? Why does he care so much about who is getting the credit for Talis' lynch? What's more, he's justifying it to the person who he is the next most suspicious of after Talis' lynch. Why even bother? Because who is getting the credit directly affects how well Mattchew's bus on Talismania worked.I thought Gonzaw was playing down my role in Talis getting lynched. I wanted to point out this inaccuracy and defend myself from his accusation. I posted later that I took too much from Scib, I just thought/think Gonzaw was intentionally down playing my role in the lynch. Now let's move on to night2/day2. He is supposedly trying to get Gonzaw lynched. Let's look at him pushing this case: Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 13:57 Mattchew wrote: Wait Risen, why dont you think gonzaw is scum anymore? Show nested quote +On July 18 2012 14:54 Mattchew wrote: Yeah so we should be lynching Gonzaw, cause hes scum The end. That is, until I called him out on it, then he is all about getting us on-board. This does not match with how he was pushing Talis. The early part of day 2 turned out to be a crucial time for Mattchew if he wanted his target lynched. At the time (earlier today) there was a lot of finger-pointing going on/discussion of things not gonzaw. I summarized it before, but I'll repeat it for shits and giggles. -Dropbear wants to kill Risen -s&b is suspicious of Risen -risen is suspicious of keir -we talk about the NK -we talk about the set-up -we talk about the mason claim We are definitely not focusing on gonzaw at that time. So Mattchew should be seeking to get us on track. But instead he is doing this: Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 06:55 Mattchew wrote: Gonzaw you have a seven page filter, mind reposting your accusations against me 'Gonzaw, my #1 scum read, could you please post your suspicions of me again so I can address them?' Doesn't fit. We were half way through day 2, starting to peel away from Mattchew's target, and he is asking his scum read to remake his case against him. Show nested quote + We haven't started to peel away from Gonzaw, a whole bunch of new setup information was announced today, including a cop claim, a mason death (with no other mason claim), and a roleblock claim. We have new information thats being sorted through and there is 24 more hours to lynch. I don't see the rush you didn't even give me the whole day cycle to push, so this point is completely rushed and unproven.
Now for some extraneous stuff: -here's him swinging the WIFOM bat around: Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 04:55 Mattchew wrote: The moment you think marv is scum, is the moment you should realize hes town.
Also, marv and gonz, what do you think of scib Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 07:43 Mattchew wrote:On July 13 2012 07:24 Keirathi wrote:On July 13 2012 07:13 Mattchew wrote: Keirathi cause he's posting super carefully, and his reads seem forced
Thats because they were kind of forced. I was specifically asked to make reads, so I responded with the two single scummiest things I've noticed. But I have a method to the way I play this game. Take a look at this. I take notes like this for a reason: so I can recognize patterns in people's play, rather than harping on one or two scummy things they've done. That's why I'm hesitant to make hard reads early. So you know that you do this as town, whats to stop you from doing so as scum? Well the first one is true, please go look at Marv's filter from Movie Star Mafia ( Here's the link!) The second is pointing out someone else's WIFOM, not using it for my own, so thats stupid Here's some buddying: Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 23:57 Mattchew wrote: Marv how fucking buddied up are we right <3 Show nested quote +On July 17 2012 13:55 Mattchew wrote: And yeah I probably took too much credit from scib... meh <3 he's my bud now <3 You call me a Vet, and you think that doing this would tell my alignment? NK shit:
I don't care how you want to WIFOM around this, I have a very hard time thinking a scum team would leave Mattchew alone on N2 after he just wtfpwned Talis on day 2. He is a vet and a known good player. There was no N1 RB, so they could be reasonably sure that there was no JK.
s&b does this fit with your early game thoughts on Marv? ;D
Marv is generally regarded as a better player than me and Austin completely outplayed me LVI... they are both better with WAY less suspicions on them. But thanks for Batting back with NK WIFOM His dealings with Risen: Here is an older read on Risen: Show nested quote +On July 17 2012 11:04 Mattchew wrote:I just read Risen's entire filter, and couldn't find any inconsistencies or holes in logic. Even his read on me I can't really argue with. I haven't been as active as I should this game and while I don't think I have tried to fly under the radar, I could see where one may draw that conclusion. His reads are constantly evolving and changing more WAY more than when I played with him as scum, and he basically started and got Vivax lynched. While I didn't agree with the lynch + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 03:27 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 03:23 marvellosity wrote: What do you see in Vivax that makes you think he might be town? his effort and his not giving a fuck style he didn't push it in a scummy way. Late voters of Vivax should actually be looked at more strongly. This leads me to my next scum candidate. Gonzaw. I was waiting to push this until Talis flipped because A. I wanted to see if he was scum and B. I wanted to keep the conversation on Talis. I will make my case before deadline tomorrow. I have a lot of it mapped out in my head just not written down yet and I want to keep up with the fast pace of Bureaurcracy Mafia tonight I question him on this. Risen has been making logic holes the size of Jupiter since his claim. Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 07:16 Mattchew wrote: Not exactly, because of his gonzaw play which I don't fully understand, but I don't think that changes my read on him in anyway A read, that lead off with the strength of Risen's logic and consistency, is not affected by Risen's recent logic and inconsistency? This really smells scummy. One last thing. Look at his opinion of the current state of the thread when we are talking about anything EXCEPT his top scum read: Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 07:18 Mattchew wrote:On July 19 2012 07:16 s0Lstice wrote: I also really like how Mattchew is concerning himself with answering the accusations of his top scum read, instead of pushing said read right now, as the town is losing focus. have we lost focus? I think a very high percentage of posts today are about who people think are scum and who to lynch today He thinks it's good that we are trying to find scum outside of gonzaw, even though he has already found it in gonzaw. This is stupid and untrue. I think that the day has been discussing the new information and therefore has been pretty productive. Also, my read on Risen is slightly less townie then before and during the night I plan to go back and read his filter assuming he is the cop, but that doesn't matter because regardless I WANT TO LYNCH SCUM TODAY. I said that people are talking about the lynch, which will help in making future reads.
So, to sum up: 1. shitty day 1 scum hunting 2. extreme pursuit of Talis on day 2... 3. ...which doesn't match at all his pursuit of the gonzaw read 4. lack of pursuit on his 2nd main scumread 5. play which exhibits signs of Mattchew knowing people's alignment 6. very bad logic in his read on Risen 7. WIFOM batting us all 8. buddying 9. being alive after N2
I think Mattchew is scum and I want us to kill him today
##vote Mattchew
TLDR 1. Wasn't around enough on the weekend to get a good start to the game. Played like shit day 1 is this alignment telling? 2. Yay I found scum! 3. We haven't actually completed the day and this day we have like 5 times more information than the last so its different 4. Is just number 3 again, but I haven't pushed anyone else and I still have time 5. I don't know where you point this out, but uh, how do I respond to something you just made up out of thin air? 6. My logic was not bad and I still believe that other than the Gonzaw read to stay alive gambit thingy, it is all still true, but that stiffles my focus on lynching Gonzaw 7. This is just untrue as I pointed out above 8. You either think I am stupid, or you realize this reasoning is stupid, you be the judge. 9. Night Kill WIFOM reasoning, right after number 7 too!
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wait dont go I want to discuss this further with you, so that we can get a Gonzaw lynch together, <3 buddddy <3
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Actually nvm GF agro, off to bed be back tomorrow.
I still want responses to my case on Gonzaw, something s0lstice did not do.
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Wanna know how I know Gonzaw is scum. Cause he's not stupid. Posting all this shit about 2 scum members, is stupid. Guess what guys, WE CAN STILL ONLY LYNCH 1 PERSON, and if they flip scum town goes up 6 to 1 (and if that person isn't risen, we can get 3 confirmed townies real quick).
Gonzaw to answer your question I could not have a care in the world TODAY who your teammate is. You seem to forget something (that I know you are smart enough to know), and that is that scum (OMG SHOCKING INFO AHEAD) can talk to each other and fake relationships in the thread! This is why connection theories like the awful ones you are flooding the thread with lose so many games for town.
Guys, Gonzaw is scum.
s0l what did you think of my response to your case?
s&b what do you think of my case on gonzaw
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who said dropbear went after talis?
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Dropbear what do you think of gonzaw, my case against him, and the most recent points I've brought up
Also what do you make of people lying about you pushing Talis
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On July 19 2012 23:30 DropBear wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 23:26 Mattchew wrote: Dropbear what do you think of gonzaw, my case against him, and the most recent points I've brought up
Also what do you make of people lying about you pushing Talis ??? I kind of did push talis on day 1, secondary to Vivax though. Same on day 2, I pushed solstice mostly with talis secondary. I never properly committed to a solely talis push, yes, but I brought him up regularly especially on day 1. I think your case against him is ok but not great. Kind of like solstice's case on you. I would lynch Keirathi over gonzaw and unless somewhere Risen has god-forbid actually answered my question, I would take Risen over both of them. S&B, this is why I think dropbear is town, do you think a scum would actaully say out loud that a scum member lynch took a backseat to a mislynch? Aren't scum supposed to be paranoid and afraid to share? Has dropbear lied or appeared fearful of posting in the thread?
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milton it was a way of explaining the posts i made that gonzaw (i believe) was calling me out on, insinuating that I didn't push Talis's lynch
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On July 19 2012 23:51 s0Lstice wrote: also how are people ignoring the part of my case where Mattchew talks about his read on Risen?
--read on Risen is based largely on consistency and logic --is Risen still displaying consistency and logic Mattchew? --not exactly, but that doesnt change my read in any way
wtf???? woah, i said that it changed a little, but not nearly enough to make me think he is scum, or someone I would wanna lynch today. I want to lynch scum Gonzaw today, discussion of Risen's alignment can take place tonight when theres 7 town vs 1 scum
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On July 19 2012 23:58 s0Lstice wrote:nope, here's what you said Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 07:16 Mattchew wrote:On July 19 2012 07:04 s0Lstice wrote:On July 17 2012 11:04 Mattchew wrote:I just read Risen's entire filter, and couldn't find any inconsistencies or holes in logic. Even his read on me I can't really argue with. I haven't been as active as I should this game and while I don't think I have tried to fly under the radar, I could see where one may draw that conclusion. His reads are constantly evolving and changing more WAY more than when I played with him as scum, and he basically started and got Vivax lynched. While I didn't agree with the lynch + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 03:27 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 03:23 marvellosity wrote: What do you see in Vivax that makes you think he might be town? his effort and his not giving a fuck style he didn't push it in a scummy way. Late voters of Vivax should actually be looked at more strongly. This leads me to my next scum candidate. Gonzaw. I was waiting to push this until Talis flipped because A. I wanted to see if he was scum and B. I wanted to keep the conversation on Talis. I will make my case before deadline tomorrow. I have a lot of it mapped out in my head just not written down yet and I want to keep up with the fast pace of Bureaurcracy Mafia tonight Is this statement still true Mattchew? Not exactly, because of his gonzaw play which I don't fully understand, but I don't think that changes my read on him in anyway not changing in any way means....not changing in any way. I don't think there's much wiggle room there. Ugh I'm being hounded on a read that I honestly don't care about right now and gave a knee-jerk response to, to keep the focus of my discussions on Gonzaw
What do you think of what I recently posted about Gonzaw?
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Announcement:
I dont care about Risen's alignment today. He claimed cop, no one counter claimed, and no one has claimed any other blue role, which with a GF flip and no mason buddy claim makes me believe he is telling the truth.
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s0lstice, you haven't answered my questions on Gonzaw, and originally (like 24 hours ago) you agreed with everything I wrote about him... Has your view of Gonzaw changed?
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On July 20 2012 00:39 sciberbia wrote:I have a couple quick points to make in Mattchew's defense. First of all, does this sound like scumbuddies talking? Not to me. Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 07:54 talismania wrote:On July 13 2012 07:13 Mattchew wrote:Lets kill talis, Keirathi or scib Talis cause he's proposing anti town plans and then backpeddling super fast Keirathi cause he's posting super carefully, and his reads seem forced scib cause he seems hesitant to post, and he posts this (it was spoilered) Obviously, we should be lynching every day until we have good reason not to. I will push to get my scumreads lynched, but I will prefer any lynch to a No-Lynch.
I'm not a big fan of lynching lurkers. Obviously, lurking hurts town, but I don't think lurking is all that alignment-indicative. Seeing as our goal is to lynch scum, I will only give slight preference to lynching the lurker over the active player, everything else being even.
as he has not pushed a single read yet loooool I love how you shit on my plan and then literally followed it to the T in that post. Three reads, one sentence explanation, at 24 hours into the game. :-) In response to your blurb on me I think "backpeddling super fast" twists my words. I posted a half-assed plan expecting it to get shot down but knowing it would probably generate discussion. don't see how analyzing the reactions means I'm backpeddling. What's with your needling of me in general? I ignored the "are you just active lurker" post at first but maybe keirathi is onto something with you. This is a bad point, like really bad, I just said that scum can fake relationships. Judging on interactions is bad.
On July 20 2012 00:52 s0Lstice wrote: sciberbia I don't see how that couldn't be two scummers talking to eachother.
mattchew- I still find things about gonzaw that are scummy. I am much more confident in my read on you though, and I don't think it's likely that you are partners. So where is this confidence stemming from, the fact i sucked day 1? What did you think of my defense against your case? Was there illogical holes in there too? Did you think about how my buddying, not dying, your rushed view of my gonzaw push and your failed use of WIFOM against me were not points that were either right or alignment telling?
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So as people start to wane and move away from Gonzaw where is he to help dictate and direct town?
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