So, KtheZ has roleclaimed. There are no other claims out yet, hence it's safe to assume that he really is the DT?

ShiaoPi has been roleblocked, if he speaks the truth then there really is a DT among town.

I've read the case on ha2 and Release went through his posts pretty thoroughly, but we have to set priorities guys, who to vote next?I'm not sure between grush and ha2. We have to make a safe choice or we'll end up LYLO.

Punish grush for his weird, lying and ballsy playstyle or punish ha2 for his perfect lack of cases except for the OMGUS against Release and s0lstice?

##unvote

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 13 2012 20:28 GMT

#457

On June 12 2012 22:33 Vivax wrote:
I said earlier that I would vote for Zen_Man in case that there was a majority possible on him.
While I was writing that, town was about to lynch ha236.
If I switched my vote at the point you find suspicious cause I didn't do so, then I would have put the town at danger of a no lynch.
Gl the next day with no new information gained except for a nightkill that might allow mafia to make someone look suspicious or get rid of a better townie than the would-have-been-lynched one.A lynch is always better than no lynch,
Zen_Man really appeared scummy. He didn't even claim. It was a solid lynch from a perspective of someone not knowing his alignment, and if he wouldn't have died, he just would have kept the circle of suspects bigger along with town's insecurity.

On June 14 2012 04:00 Lazermonkey wrote:
Okay, I kinda buy this one. Still, you weren't the first one to swap the vote.

Guess why I only quote this. This quoted part is a good example of your way of bad thinking (or acting).

'Vivax doesn't swap his vote first, thus his argument is invalid and he is mafia'.

Yeah sure. Really smart move bro. Read the quote.
There's already the reason why I wasn't among the first to swap, it's cause it might have put the town at risk of a no lynch.
You don't just say: 'I BUY IT', no, you're even so clever to say right next to it: 'BUT YOU'RE SUSPICIOUS CAUSE OF IT'.

And this is how town should look at you after reading this:

-> + Show Spoiler +

I really hope that other townies recognize how often you are contradicting yourself (within really close textparts!!!) in your desperate attempts to tunnel me.

There are cases promising a ton of information, and while you try to blend in on each of these cases, your main objective remains to tunnel me, throughout a ton of pages. You're incredibly narrowsighted or you seek to spread as much distrust against me as possible.

But I don't mind, once new information pops up I'm sure that I will discover further mistakes in your play. And I'll let you hang if and once I find scumtells there.

Oh and btw. Grush is about to get lynched.

If I don't switch vote now, I risk a no lynch and you'll throw that at me. If I switch vote now, you'll say I bandwagoned.
Know what?Why should I risk a no lynch?I really don't care about what you have to say after all your slips, but you can try and keep tunneling. You better hope you're not the next scum to hang, cause I think that might be very possible.

##vote grush57

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 13 2012 20:52 GMT

#462

On June 14 2012 05:48 grush57 wrote:
It's kinda sad mafia already won and there just throwing out scumslips :'(

Enlighten us on the scumslips. If you really are town, even if you die, you can still let town win. Just tell us about your thoughts, where are the slips, who do you think is suspicious etc. etc.

Don't throw away all hope and go into emo mode.Write something that's not an anti-town lie this time. People might still believe you and switch their votes. 2 hours to go, that's a long time.

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 13 2012 21:01 GMT

#464

I've quit wasting my time with you lazer. Aside from the personal attacks, I think it's pretty obvious that you're tunneling me hard.

A good townie has to keep an overview of all players in the cases he decides to pursue, and that's not what you're doing. On the other hand it allows you to claim you're being consistent in your play if your target flips town. Just try to pull that card.

You are excessively afraid to make other cases. Instead you post high content low information ones (wall of text ugh).

You even admit that you made a weak point. Make good cases or don't make them at all. There is much better information out there you plainly ignore.

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 13 2012 21:07 GMT

#465

And no, tunneling is not hunting scum. Tunneling is being stubborn as hell and blind to alternatives, constantly only pushing one player. Heist did that to me last game and left me unable to post cases cause I was busy defending attacks.
And like in this game, other townies just didn't care. I hope they will during day 3.

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 13 2012 21:42 GMT

#471

I wasn't sure that KtheZ was DT when I first wrote the case. Try to follow the logic (and the posting time):

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=342960&currentpage=20#385

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=342960&currentpage=20#393

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=342960&currentpage=23#443

You are actually right. I didn't think of the DT check, only about the roleblock and the alignment, should I apologize for not thinking of something? If grush did that he would write a book.

I came home and saw another post from the monkey heating me up, and actually this makes me realize my accusations against him are OMGUS.
But his case still sucks, and my defense is still solid. Go look that up and decide who of us is most likely saying something funded, he contradicts himself within 1 line of text, and his first list of suspicious players looks extremely scummy. You will find that in list in the first link up there. From a scumhunting point of view before the DT roleclaim happened, he WAS suspicious.

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 13 2012 21:44 GMT

#472

EBWOP: The case against Lazermonkey

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 14 2012 21:22 GMT

#499

Ok. I have analyzed ha2's posts especially concentrating on his voting behavior.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=342960&currentpage=13#247

Here voted s0lstice after defending from Release, without posting any case against s0lstice.

Then he votes Release omgus style, but only after he voted for s0lstice for whatever reason.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=342960&currentpage=13#247

Here that pattern repeats again. He defends from Release, and votes for grush based on something which has been repeated over and over by whole town.
On the other hand, there's really not that much to say about grush, his play was...original. The point isn't as strong, but the repeating pattern 'make cases against 1, vote 2 for no reason' is kinda suspicious.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/postmessage.php?quote=494&topic_id=342960

The last post.

He has been playing in incredibly inconsistent way regarding his very few votes, while mantaining a style trying to post as few as he can. He only starts engaging into discussion when there are townies pressuring him, and even then he keeps his posts as short as possible.

Please consider what I wrote just now if I die tonight. If I survive, I will reevaluate the case against him with more information.
For sure he's a lategame lurker when there is so much information available. He didn't post any lengthy cases yet, just defending and bandwagoning.

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 14 2012 21:54 GMT

#501

Yea

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 14 2012 23:26 GMT

#530

Meh, still played well enough to get this far, and most of you weren't believing I was scum until this :d .

GG however, Lazer. Watched through both urs and ShiaoPi's posts, and ShiaoPi looked like he gave more DT tells.

The breadcrumb post Release quoted is also the post which made me think you might be DT.

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 14 2012 23:32 GMT

#538

It's ironic cause without grush's weird posts KTheZ wouldn't have roleclaimed.

You should thank him, he carried you.

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 14 2012 23:35 GMT

#542

You were tunneling a lot of townies in the beginning, and in the end you couldn't make up your mind.
You caused a lot of confusion by pushing so many different cases, then constantly backing off.

Vivax

22106 Posts

June 14 2012 23:40 GMT

#544

I conceded.

Could you post mafia and observer qt?

There you will see how much work there's involved in playing scum <_<

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