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On June 12 2012 01:03 chaoser wrote:
@gonzaw I'm surprised you're asking millers to claim and then shoot day 1 when it's just as good to have millers claim day 1 and then you yourself volunteer to shoot day 1.
Since you yourself did not volunteer immediately to shoot on day 1, I was wondering if you'd like to start us off by shooting on day 1.
In this game, to find 3 out of the 4 mafia, I feel like it's pretty easy. We just force the person we think is the most suspicious to shoot the person THEY think is most suspicious. If they can shoot, they are not one of the three regular mafia. The only anti-town that gets out of this is the GF and the SK but they should be easy to narrow down when we combine this method with regular analysis.
If they can't shoot, then they are either mafia or blue.
In terms of blue roles, I actually don't think they matter that much this game and I'd totally be ok with any blue role that gets suspected and put on the spot to shoot to just claim. RB is nerfed this game to only be able to roleblock the same person on every other night so that means mafia can't just nilly willy claim blue and then when they don't die to mafia gunfire for a few days, get off scott free.
So basically it goes discussion--->decide who is "most suspicious"--->force them to shoot who THEY think is most suspicious--->if they can't shoot, they will be forced to claim--->we then decide if the claim is valid or not--->shoot if we don't think the claim is valid.
I don't want to volunteer to shoot myself because that would be selfish as fuck, and I know people would oppose that throwing the "But I don't know your alignment!" argument around.
Millers shooting is an "universal" plan that everybody can follow.
However, I agree with what you said, we can force the most suspicious player to shoot to prove he's not regular Goon.
Actually I thought about it once I read Bang Bang Mafia...but for some reason I forgot about it when this game started :/
I find one problem with having the most suspicious player shoot the guy he thinks is scum and not the 2nd most suspicious player:
If that player is the Godfather he will easily shoot a townie.
If we forced that player to shoot the 2nd most suspicious player, the GF would be forced to shoot him, and if that 2nd suspicious player was another scum, he'd be forced to shoot his scumbuddy (or not shoot and out BOTH of them as scum).
We also prevent the chaos of that player being the VT, but shooting our cop or medic and then spending the rest of the night/day wondering if he's GF or not.
@Toad: Well, every single game I've played had only 1 Miller in it. Okay, we can try to be careful if there are more than 1 Miller claim.
To be honest, having Millers shoot on D1 or following chaoser's plan is good either way. It certainly beats what they did on Bang Bang Mafia 1.
Anyways, this shouldn't even be a discussion, no matter what plan we take:
Millers claim at most on D1
So, let's hope this is taken care of, so let's try to get some analysis up in this bitch
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No dude, you are the most pro-town motherfucker as town, and the most anti-town scummy motherfucker as scum.
Every time you've been lynched you flipped scum, I don't remember a single time you've been lynched as town.
So that's crap
If you start acting similar like that game I'll policy lynch you.
However you are acting normal now so that's not the case (see? It wasn't hard).
If you really want to volunteer, then you know that you should shoot the player town tells you to, right?
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Granted I never really read any of your TL games >_>
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Meh actually I'm lazy as fuck I'll analyze later.
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RoL, you should have claimed when D1 started, if not it's likely scum may shoot you tonight.
Anyways, I had a sudden doubt:
-If all VTs of us died, and only blue remained...would we instantly lose the game? I mean, we wouldn't have anybody to shoot at day, meaning we wouldn't have "lynches". So every day would either be NL or the GF shooting townies; then scum would shoot at night.
Is this true or did I miss something?
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On June 12 2012 07:56 kitaman27 wrote:
The biggest problem with setups where so many people have guns is the town's lack of organization. It eventually ends up in a trollfest, where townies shoot each other, while the scum team sits in the background without attracting much attention. If you are town, don't forget to submit your vote for a 48 hour day cycle.
If you shoot five minutes into the game, you will be shot day two.
If you shoot within the first 24 hours of a cycle, you will be shot the following cycle
If you shoot without the town's consensus, you will be shot
I don't care if you shoot a mafia player. If you break one of those three rules, you will be shot in return.
I support a miller claim on day one. If they fail to claim on day one, then they get shot if they claim miller at any point after d1. Millers shouldn't claim night one as it assists the mafia team with blue sniping.
It seems very unlikey that the mafia team has two godfather type roles. Based on the way the shot cooldown works, they would be able to day kill four consecutive days. Combined with the six night kills that come with their deaths and lynches, thats a 2:10 trade, assuming there isn't a SK or town night vig role. I like chaoser's plan of forcing certain players to shoot, but I wouldn't leave it up to them to decide their own target. By shooting early and often, the mafia godfather gets the most out of his role. We shouldn't allow a random player to shoot at will.
I think this is what we've already agreed on initially.
This is another thing I've thought of:
Medics, try to protect our claimed VTs that already shot as much as you can instead of blues
Reasons:
- There are a bunch of VTs (valid assumption), and most likely 1 GF like kita said. If someone shoots, it's very likely that player is VT and not GF (i.e you won't protect a mafia)
- Because of that previous thought, it's very likely that we can "confirm" said player as town (if he doesn't act like a scummy idiot), therefore having him in the game longer is better for us
- I already mentioned that if all our VTs die, we have like a 99% chance of losing this game because we can't "lynch" at all. Having at least 1 VT alive throughout the game ensures that we'll always have a shot to use, meaning we have a chance to win
- Who would you protect otherwise? Someone random? There's a chance he's either blue or mafia
- If he's blue...then if he's Medic (like yourself) or Cop he's mostly useless since it's likely he doesn't know his sanity, and there may be framers and shit around (in the case of the Cop) or he could even kill someone (in the case of the medic)
- If he's mafia you wasted your ability (unless you are Insane Doc, or the one that can RB his target) or could have saved a vig shot on him (if we have a vig)
If you have to choose someone to protect, then I'd say choose watchers and trackers, since the checks from those are confirmed (i.e they know their "sanity").
Cops and other Medics need lots of days to figure out their alignment, so in early game they are not useful.
So in N1 I'd suggest the medic protects the VT/Miller that used his shot. Kind of like if the one that shot was a claimed blue that confirmed his action of sorts (and needs protection at night).
Although....figure out your sanity first. Tonight protect someone and see the result of your action (e.g the guy you protected claimed RBed, etc).
Anyways, damn, I really want to start some analysis, but this whole night is just a bunch of discussion about plans 
@Marv: What do you think of RoL's claim? Do you think it's legit or not?
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If we force him to shoot, you think he may be GF then?
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I don't find him suspicious mostly because of the claim itself (I've never seen scum fake-claim Miller in my whole life, and I doubt I will).
We can force him to shoot and have trackers/watchers/cops (not all of them at the same time of course) on him to determine if he's GF or not.
As in, we force him to shoot someone of our (town) liking, with voting and shit, not just someone he randomly wants to shoot (like he says he'll shoot Toad).
Of course he'll have to follow this or we'll just shoot him the next day for being a scummy scum/rogue.
If he's really GF he'll be alive for quite a while (and obviously under quite scrutiny like he's under now) so I doubt he can get away with it (again, like I said in my other Miller post).
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On June 12 2012 10:23 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2012 10:14 gonzaw wrote:
I don't find him suspicious mostly because of the claim itself (I've never seen scum fake-claim Miller in my whole life, and I doubt I will).
We can force him to shoot and have trackers/watchers/cops (not all of them at the same time of course) on him to determine if he's GF or not.
As in, we force him to shoot someone of our (town) liking, with voting and shit, not just someone he randomly wants to shoot (like he says he'll shoot Toad).
Of course he'll have to follow this or we'll just shoot him the next day for being a scummy scum/rogue.
If he's really GF he'll be alive for quite a while (and obviously under quite scrutiny like he's under now) so I doubt he can get away with it (again, like I said in my other Miller post).
For someone who likes his setup speculation this is some weak shit. We have no idea what roles we have and if they can come close to confirming anything. Watchers doesn't even make sense. Scum have 1 KP and they'd send their GF? Doesn't make sense either, what does a tracker do. Cop takes forever to confirm sanity and he can't keep checking RoL. Towns very rarely lynch mafia day 1 so forcing him to do anything is probably going to lead to a townie death regardless and will confirm nothing of his alignment. Anyway guys, RoL, gonzaw...
Yeah I got carried away when I mentioned the watcher 
He's under scrutiny just by claiming Miller. Mafia may take the chance to shoot him tonight or on N1 just because of the reasons I presented previously.
The "real" game hasn't started yet (the analysis and shit), so there's really no behaviour that can convince me Rol is GF (like I said his claim alone makes me think its legit).
Anyways I gotta eat so I'll expand later
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On June 12 2012 10:44 wherebugsgo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2012 10:14 gonzaw wrote:
I don't find him suspicious mostly because of the claim itself (I've never seen scum fake-claim Miller in my whole life, and I doubt I will).
Because the games where self-aware millers are possible on this forum are practically nonexistent.
I played 2 (I think? Or maybe it was just once) games with self-aware Millers on UG and there weren't any fake-claims either.
The rest of your post and filter is just unsubstantiated assumptions (for example, the repeated language toward you assuming RoL is town).
Yeah I'm not really putting too much effort this game for now (other than just coming up with a plan of action).
Mostly because I expect to get shot tonight, so anything I do would basically be pointless (I knew that in pre-game though).
And no, the "real" game hasn't started because there's basically nothing to analyze or to respond to. There aren't any cases, or people's thoughts on other players, and I'm lazy to check each filter to try and gauge a read out of people just by their opinion on the plans presented.
For now I only have a few town reads, and a slight suspicion on Dirkzor for his "eagerness" to show people what to do or correct them but being absent since then.
You also contradict yourself fairly heavily in that you urge specifically for a day 1 miller claim but you seem to have no problem at all with a n0 miller claim
I already posted he fucked up by claiming right now.
But at least he claimed, Miller claim >>>> no Miller claim, whether on N0 or D1
The only bad thing about doing so on N0 is that scum may shoot him....and that's not the end of the world or anything (again like I posted in my previous post
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Yeah I'm ignoring you for now marv.
If you really want to shoot me or something at least wait 24 hours into D1 so you don't waste the whole day and so we can put some sense into you.
You are being needlessly aggressive as well, I don't know what's up with that.
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On June 12 2012 11:47 talismania wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2012 10:58 marvellosity wrote:On June 12 2012 10:57 talismania wrote:On June 12 2012 10:50 wherebugsgo wrote:On June 12 2012 10:35 talismania wrote:I've realized that an idea I had after Space Station might be applicable here. I was saving it up for a game with a mayoral election and PMs, but I then saw that in this game we all get to be mayor! So here's the outlines of the idea. The goal is to catch scum out in the long run by forcing them to post cases, suspicions, etc. Scum operate by feeling out the thread, sensing where discussion is going and nudging it along in a favorable direction or whatever. Blending in and all that jazz. To make it harder for this to happen (and to simultaneously make it so that everyone is playing harder), I came up with this proposal. (1) Everyone has to pick one person to make a case on, for why they think that person is scum. You have to actually make the case, like you're radfield or qatol or whatever. Nice decent-length post. (2) Everyone reveals their case at the same time (a good time would be near daybreak). This is the part that makes it hard for scum to blend in. (3) Note that there's extra information to be had here: who participated and who didn't. And why did the people who didn't participate not do so? (4) We take a look at the cases and go from there. FAQ: What's this good for again?
--Forces participation / thread reading --Forces scum to make their own cases rather than hanging back --Additional information: HOW do people make their cases etc --When someone flips scum, there's a wealth of information to look back on. Who did they make a case on? Who made a case on them? Etc etc How the fuck do you get everyone on the thread at the same time?
--You don't need to. You can post your case before the deadline but encrypt it using http://www.fourmilab.ch/javascrypt/javascrypt.html and then post the key later. Yay encryption! What's wrong with just posting our cases as we make them?--Nothing really. That's obviously how every other game is played. But doing it this way can force everyone to play harder, better, etc. See the first question. It's not like posting has to stop until the cases are made or anything. Does it have to be a case on a single person?--All that matters for point (1) above is that it's something agreed to by everyone. It could be a case on a single person. It could be reads on everyone in the game. It could be a top four list of scum contenders. Whatever we think generates the most information. Your point (4) - how do we get from this to a lynch?--Nothing in particular. This acts as an info dump. We can get from it to the shooting however we want. Boohoo it will spam the thread up!
--Suck it up and play the game. Mafia is about reading things and making decisions. If you're concerned about this, then we can all put our encrypted cases in spoiler tags. ___________ I will do this for sure. Anyone with me? I'm not going to wade through walls of bullshit to find scum. If I were on the scumteam I personally would love doing this, as I'd instantly be the most townie motherfucker in the thread. Look at my first post in Mini X if you don't believe me. Right here.Do you have any idea how damaging it is to town to have to wade through walls of completely fabricated text? Even townies will end up fabricating cases just to create fluff if we impose this rule. I know I will, because often times when I run into a scum, it's one or two lines that make or break the read. Fair point, but if people don't want to wade through walls of shit, then we don't have to make a case. It can be a list of four names, simply. Maybe one sentence for why each is scum. So effectively you want townie to behave like townies would anyway and scum to appear more townlike than they'd appear otherwise Nice =/ You miss the point. Participation doesn't mean scum are acting "more townlike" at all. The strongest information that comes out of it is what happens when someone flips scum. Now there's a repository of information to be gleaned from, as we've instituted a policy requiring everyone to post their reads/cases/top 4 whatever. Furthermore, there's info in HOW the cases or whatever policy is presented. How strongly are they worded - how much do people push what they wrote afterwards? It gives the people that like to read something to study, and those that want to ignore it can do so too.
Do you think RoL is fake-claiming scum or real Miller?
Do you think I'm scum because I think RoL is real Miller or not?
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On June 12 2012 12:18 marvellosity wrote:
Because I'm so nice gonzaw, I'm just going to lay out a post for other people to read instead of tunnelling you. And I will not be unilaterally shooting you.
I don't like your passive-aggressiveness there, but okay I'll respond to it.
It will make a fine start to discuss and take sides though.
gonzaw completely ignores anything to do with the behaviour, content and mentality, because he has 'never seen scum fake-claim miller in his whole life'. His speculation on how to confirm or otherwise RoL is equally weak, as I note here:
I basically saw your case as nitpicking.what RoL said and didn't hold much water.
RoL specifically said there were benefits in claiming Miller N1 (I think he meant N0, the one we are at now), which were basically having the cop not publicly claim if he were to check him later.
I didn't see anything wrong with what he said, even though it seemed confusing at times (like he was at times berating "plans" regarding Millers and discussions about it, but intertwined it with the benefits of actually claiming).
Even if his behaviour was "suspicious" in some way, I'd be glad to ignore it until D1, or until the "real game started" (like I put it), where RoL has to contribute himself, present cases, reads, etc.
I made a thorough post on why I thought no scum would claim Miller at all, so yeah as soon as he claimed I didn't take much notice of it and didn't doubt it initially.
VE received similar flak when he claimed Miller (with people instantly FoSing him when he did), and that only served to clutter when (because of reasons previously explained) heuristics just show that he's likely town.
I actually asked you that thing about RoL because I found you somewhat shady (with your initial aggressiveness and nonchalance in a matter of speaking) , saw that you were talking about Millers and stuff and thus wanted your reaction to it.
Before you go asking me what I think of your reaction....I do find it weird indeed. You seem too aggressive, too aggressive compared to the previous games I've played with you.
Is there anything specific that made you play like this?
So gonzaw ignores all the analysis of RoL's behaviour because he has played in at most 2 games where miller wasn't fake-claimed. He doesn't even bother actually looking at the content of the posts, and dismisses the case multiple times with "there haven't been analysis or cases yet". Yet his sole reason for dismissing was his 1 or 2 out of how many games he's played with self-aware millers.
Yes basically that, and because of all the reasons I previously stated on why I think the real GF wouldn't actually claim Miller at all.
Saying my "sole" reason for dismissing it is quite an exageration though, considering I've been talking about Miller claims, their benefits and likelihood since my first post or so since the game started.
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On June 12 2012 12:34 Cephiro wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2012 08:48 gonzaw wrote:Anyways, damn, I really want to start some analysis, but this whole night is just a bunch of discussion about plans If you want to start doing some analysis, you should stop writing about possible plans yourself. Seems kind of contradictory to me. This nightphase is by no means just discussion about plans, in my opinion it is very well possible to analyze someone's behavior already. (Of course a larger sample size is always better, but sometimes you can get a good start with just a little.) Adding to what you were talking about medics, if they find out that they are insane, they should stop protecting VT's unless the 50% chance is crucial for our survival and still having a shot at winning the game for town.
I personally don't find people's opinion on certain plans (or policy lynches, etc) alignment telling at all. So no matter how much someone talks and talks about plans, I can't analyze their alignment based on their behaviour, if everybody else is discussing plans as well.
Also I was lazy so I didn't want to filter everybody and try to find subtle hints of scumminess (I did do it later and found Dirkzor slighly suspicious, and marv a little bit as well).
On June 12 2012 12:34 Cephiro wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2012 10:30 gonzaw wrote:Yeah I got carried away when I mentioned the watcher He's under scrutiny just by claiming Miller. Mafia may take the chance to shoot him tonight or on N1 just because of the reasons I presented previously. The "real" game hasn't started yet (the analysis and shit), so there's really no behaviour that can convince me Rol is GF (like I said his claim alone makes me think its legit). Anyways I gotta eat so I'll expand later Everyone should be under scrutiny. Not just someone claiming Miller. I don't like how you state that the real game hasn't started yet, and you give an absolute "There is really no behaviour that can convince me RoL is GF", just because in your opinion the game hasn't started yet?
Someone claiming Miller will obviously be in the spotlight. I never said he shouldn't be under more scrutiny than someone else, I said that he just was by the nature of his claim, the way it brings attention to himself and sparks people to analyze his actions and behaviour more thoroughly to figure out if he's lying or not.
Yes, there is no game-related "behaviour" from RoL to convince me he's GF. RoL hasn't accused anybody yet. He hasn't commented on other cases yet either.
He hasn't been part in discussion about other players' behaviour either, and yet he hasn't been absent from those either.
The only thing he did was give his opinion on some setup talk, about Miller plans, and claimed Miller. There's no way you can figure out his alignment with that, because (like I said) it's not alignment-telling.
Show nested quote +On June 12 2012 11:03 gonzaw wrote:
Yeah I'm not really putting too much effort this game for now (other than just coming up with a plan of action). Why not? You talked about how you want to get to analyze stuff but then you keep just talking about random plans when you didn't really want to. That doesn't make any sense to me. Where's the enthusiasm?
...because I'm not?
Really? What kind of question is that?
I was lazy, had to do some work for uni, was spending time and effort in the other mafia game I am, and wasn't in the mood to put a lot of effort in this game, specially since there wasn't much to motivate me to do so (i.e there weren't any meaningful discussions going on, just talk about the setup).
Show nested quote +Mostly because I expect to get shot tonight, so anything I do would basically be pointless (I knew that in pre-game though). .... I don't even know what to say to this. You don't even know your role pre-game, why would you expect to get shot on N0 before the game has even started? I don't like that attitude at all. You can't play mafia going into the game thinking "I'm going to die soon anyway so anything I do is pointless." You have to make the best out of it while you are alive. If you die and are a townie, you better have made the time you were alive count for your teammates to take the game for you.
Because I had the feeling I would. I've been shot N1 in 2 out of 3 games I've been town...and in like 90% of the games I've been town in UG mafia.
Knowing that and knowing that there wasn't going to be any meaningful discussion going on (that wasn't related to the setup) it just disheartens you a little bit and doesn't put you in the right mood.
Show nested quote +And no, the "real" game hasn't started because there's basically nothing to analyze or to respond to. There aren't any cases, or people's thoughts on other players, and I'm lazy to check each filter to try and gauge a read out of people just by their opinion on the plans presented. Every post is analyzable or respondable. It may not be useful in every case, but there is certainly a lot to go by already. If there aren't any cases, you can make one. If people don't post their thoughts yet, you can ask for them. What's up with this sudden lazyness of yours?
See above.
Again, I don't think plan posts and opinions are alignment telling at all (without taking into account their context. If someone is still talking about plans in D3 of course you can analyze it).
Also, nice of you to bring up the usual "pro-town" speech that's brought up D1 every game (or N0 this one).
What do you think of marv's aggressiveness towards RoL and me Cephiro?
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On June 12 2012 12:52 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On June 12 2012 12:42 gonzaw wrote:
[
Yes basically that, and because of all the reasons I previously stated on why I think the real GF wouldn't actually claim Miller at all.
Saying my "sole" reason for dismissing it is quite an exageration though, considering I've been talking about Miller claims, their benefits and likelihood since my first post or so since the game started. Yes, it is interesting, given your view on this. Show nested quote +On June 12 2012 10:14 gonzaw wrote:
I don't find him suspicious mostly because of the claim itself (I've never seen scum fake-claim Miller in my whole life, and I doubt I will).
That seems to be your view, that it's practically impossible. Funny then, that your first major post is entirely about discussing millers and the possibilities of scum fake-claiming. + Show Spoiler +On June 11 2012 17:25 gonzaw wrote:Please everybody don't make a L plan to shoot a townie 5 minutes into D1. If you think someone is scum and really want to shoot them...you can always shoot them later (if everybody follows this trail of thought we'll have normal days). Okay people, if we have a Miller, do they claim tonight or tomorrow? If they claim tonight, and we have a cop the cop won't check them, but if they don't claim tonight there' s a chance the cop will. If they claim tonight however, there's a chance scum will shoot them because of their "semi-confirmed" status (i.e scum never fake-claim Miller, so someone claiming Miller is 80% telling the truth). Oh wait, here's the plan: Miller, as soon as D1 starts, claim and you'll be the one in charge of shooting on D1My plan goes like this: First of all, a Miller claim will avoid a cop checking him subsequent nights. Second, the Miller can shoot at day, therefore we can use him to choose the D1 shot. Third, like said before the Miller is "semi-confirmed" because in average scum never fake-claim Miller, and they will most likely not do it today. Why? Because then the Godfather will be the one forced to fake-claimSince the plan is for the Miller to shoot on D1, and the only scum that can do so is the GF, then only him can fake-claim Miller (if any other scum claims Miller, they'll get instantly caught once they refuse to shoot). So, let's imagine the GF fake-claims Miller, what then? Then there is another Miller or there isn't: 1) There is another Miller claim:Then there will be a counterclaim; and one of them will basically be confirmed scum (the chances of 2 Millers is EXTREMELY low). We then let them shoot each other. If the real Miller is faster, great he'll shoot the GF and we'll live happily ever after. If the GF is faster, well then we can kill the GF the next day/night. 2) There is no other Miller claim:In this case, although we may take him as "confirmed" for a while, he'll be in the spotlight for quite a while. Not only that, we can make a tracker track him at night, that way we can catch him as GF. After we get rid of the GF, then catching the remaining scum will be easy if we all claim if we have a gun (and can shoot) or not. Those that claim they have a gun take turns in shooting each day (to actually confirm they have a gun) into the group that claimed they didn't have a gun (of course shooting those we think are actually scum from that group, not shooting our freaking blues >_>). So, if the GF claims Miller there is a high chance he'll get fucked, therefore I don't think he will. Therefore I think we can trust a Miller claim tomorrow, and in the worst case we'll get a tracker on him at N2. So people, this is the plan I was thinking of, do you agree or not?: To Miller:- If someone else already claimed Miller, he's GF so shoot him (and claim Miller in the process)
- If nobody claimed Miller, then claim Miller
- After you do, we'll discuss normally and you'll decide the shot, preferably with town consensus, so don't go rogue on our asses.
To Town:- No VT shoot until a Miller claims, or until 24 or more hours have passed (to give the Miller time to claim)
- Everybody, just discuss, scumhunt and catch some filthy scum for the Miller to shoot at
To Tracker the next night:If we don't have any Millers it will be apparent soon (before the 24 hours or so) since everybody will post but there will be no claim. If that happens, then after the 24 or so hours normal VTs are allowed to shoot. The purpose of this plan is: - Out the Miller so we have a "semi-confirmed" townie, and so Cops don't check him at night
- Either basically catch the GF if he fake-claims, or have the Miller as confirmed townie (after the tracker tracks him)
- If we catch the GF; then the rest of the game will be easy as pie
- If we don't, then we'll have a "confirmed" townie in the Miller by D2
- When D1 starts, we are guaranteed to have time to discuss and not have a random VT shoot 10 minutes into the day, because we'll be waiting for a Miller to claim
- When a Miller claims, he'll be the one in charge of the shot so we'll be sure no shenanigans and weird stuff happen (like 2 guys fighting each other and one randomly shooting the other one)
Of course this means everybody would follow the plan (those that have a gun and those that don't), so we are guaranteed to have some D1 time to discuss So people, what do you think? Observation:Maybe the SK can fake-claim Miller, since he can shoot at Day. However, the SK is forced to shoot at night, therefore a tracker on him WILL catch him. Also, since a "confirmed" Miller is bad reputation for scum, scum are likely to shoot the Miller claim, so the chances of scum shooting the SK will increase, blowing his cover once he survives the hit (and no medic claims his save). Basically, the SK fake-claiming Miller will let us/scum catch him sooner or later, and doing so to get the D1 shot (why would he want the D1 shot?) and a little confirmed status for a while isn't worth it for him. Observation2:There is a chance we don't have a tracker. In which case we can't confirm the Miller. First of all, the point is that scum don't know if we have a tracker either, so by having the GF fake-claim Miller they risk we actually having one. Second, even if we don't have a tracker, the GF will still be in the spotlight, because town will assume the tracker tracked him and got a "good" result (i.e that he didn't visit anyone), but the "Miller" claim will keep being alive throughout the whole game. This will mean that one day or the other the Miller-fake-claiming-Godfather will fall; so again it's not very convenient for him to do so That's an awful lot of effort to go to to explain something you think will never happen 'in your lifetime', don't you think?
Why are you being this aggressive and "in-your-face" on purpose?
Really? "That's an awful lot of effort to go to explain something you think will never happen 'in your lifetime', don't you think?" ? That's the best you can come up with to discredit me?
I doubt I even need to explain why you are just nit-picking and stretching things out
+ Show Spoiler [Just in case I do] +
Yes, I know mafia are less likely to fake-claim Miller, and will most likely not this game.
I need to express why I think that wouldn't you think? It's not like I can say "Yeah mafia will never fake-claim thanks bye!" and just drop the subject.
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Either our Medic is not sane, he doesn't exist or he wasn't doing his job as intended (saving claimed VTs).
Of course, if someone took a hit claim, until someone does I'll assume all KP is accounted for.
It seems weird there was only 1 night kill, because of this:
Serial Killer - Lone wolf. You must survive until the end of the game and eliminate both Town,Mafia and any other factions. At night you are bulletproof and can't be shot. You also show up as Innocent to role checks. You can kill at Night OR Kill during the day. You must kill at Night or the following Day or else I will mod kill you.
Check the bolded.
If there is a SK this game, and he didn't shoot last night, he HAS to shoot today.
If we go forward with the "RoL the claimed Miller should shoot" plan (and RoL isn't SK of course), then the SK will be forced to shoot himself and out himself. He can just shoot soon though and pass it off as a mistake and try to hide it though.
Again the other possibility is that he did indeed shoot last night but was RBed, or his hit was saved by a Medic/Vet.
Or again there's the possibility he doesn't exist
I doubt that though, 4 scum in a 20 player game with only 1 KP seems too little for a game like this. It's likely there is a SK, just like in the previous Bang Bang Mafia game.
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On June 12 2012 13:18 chaoser wrote:
or mafia didn't shoot
Why wouldn't they?
They have to kill either 12 townies or 11 townies and 1 SK to win, I'm sure they'll take any chance to kill townies they get.
On June 12 2012 13:15 chaoser wrote:
gonzaw, if you want to dispell the suspicions on you, I'd suggest you just shoot
No I won't, not until 24 or more hours have passed at least
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Derp days last 24 hours (thought they lasted 48).
Anyways people, be sure to chime in and post your thoughts on RoL and marv's "case" against me please.
Dirkzor I want your opinion the most.
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See Coag? If you get your mind to it you can play good as town so much that you get shot in N0 (I still can't fathom what you did in that game)
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EPT
