BC's Arkham City - Page 148

On February 14 2012 04:18 Toadesstern wrote:
why do you believe rad is not mafia.

wherebugsgo
02-07-2012
02:45 AM ET (US)
Radfield is an incredibly hard player to read sometimes because he is very good; which means that even if he appears town, he may not be. It leads people to become paranoid sometimes (look at Sleeper Cell II where he gets lynched day 1 as town) and misread him. Indeed the first time I played with him as town in PYP:I I felt similarly. (I had previously played with him in LoTR where he was scum, though I died n1; I caught him in the obs QT)

With that said, so far I feel like he is very town. To answer your question, I dunno exactly why Radfield likes asking questions, however for me I ask questions as town because it's an effective way to gauge a person's reads and thus their alignment.

Think about it this way: the hardest thing for scum to do is to forge analysis. So, if you're constantly forcing them to "contribute" by asking questions, you'll wear them out and they will slip and slip and slip. Their responses to your questions also will be shaded in a way that is mafia-flavored. Every scum is different, but most will have a very hard time coming up with convincing analysis on the spot, because convincing analysis as scum is very hard to do (you're essentially forcing the scum to fabricate shit over and over, which is hard).

Think of it as lying to your parents or something; you can only keep up a lie for so long before it becomes so convoluted that no one would ever believe you.

Another thing is, Radfield's incessant question-asking is incredibly consistent with his meta, because it is one of the most effective ways of hunting scum as town. Indeed, that's actually how I caught him in the LoTR obs QT; he was making assumptions (and he subtly slipped on knowledge he wouldn't have has as town)without asking people in the thread questions. He was not proactive about asking people questions and it was readily apparent.

Compare his play in this game to his play in XLVIII:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessag...¤tpage=16#306

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessag...52884¤tpage=3


XLVIII posts from Radfield

compare to this game, so far he's posted twice in this fashion:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessag...¤tpage=22#424

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessag...¤tpage=22#427

Pretty similar, IMO.

Ofc a good player will be able to replicate this kind of thing as scum, but for now I'm inclined to believe Radfield is town. This is not at all like his day 1 play from LoTR, and it is not like his play from Couples' Therapy either, where we were scumbuddies (we were a hydra, in fact)

The only thing lacking is that Radfield hasn't posted anything like a plan or anything of the sort (like he usually does) but he does that as both alignments, so I don't think it's that relevant.

From what you have said so far, Deepthroat, I'm going to make the assessment that you are a newer player. I'm going to guess Toad.

wherebugsgo
02-07-2012
02:50 AM ET (US)
apparently I can't post more than 4 links in a post without it getting blocked by the spambot protection thing.

couple more posts of Radfield's from XLVIII that I used for meta analysis:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessag...¤tpage=17#322

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessag...¤tpage=21#401

As for Palmar, he hasn't done enough yet to be readable. So far he has largely been useless, but we are only halfway through day 1. After the debacle in L where I pushed the lynch on him day 1 for being useless, I'm wary of lynching him day 1 just for that reason. I feel like there are probably out-of-game reasons for his lack of activity as well, as he scolded me in skype after he died about the lynch that game. For that reason I think it's kinda fruitless to try to analyze Palmar right now without further information.

He'd be a very good target to poke today and get answers from. I want to hear his thoughts, since that'll be the fastest way to determine his alignment. He'll probably be quite stubborn about it, though.

If the phone operator can get him in here, that'd be awesome. If he's scum we'll know very quickly (especially if he refuses to use this) and if he's not then he'll be a valuable resource and addition to the discussion.

wherebugsgo
02-07-2012
02:54 AM ET (US)
yeah I definitely agree with you, Radfield should be pressured into contributing.

The great thing about Radfield is that if he's town mafia will definitely not want to leave him alive on n1. If he pursues a Foolishness-style of play day 1 there's a chance he'll live, but either way we should definitely pressure him (and the other vets) so that we can determine their alignments quickly.

oh also I had two other guesses for who you were (my third was Dr. H hahaha)

I should've been able to guess from your posting style!

On February 14 2012 04:37 Forumite wrote:
Hmmm, that´s not good. Trying to make a huge case on Radfield early doesn´t make sense if they both be scum.

On February 14 2012 04:46 Palmar wrote:


Read the comments again. WBG concludes Radfield is kinda towny and then agrees he may need to be pressured. If Bugs genuinely felt radfield was worth hanging he'd have been much more to the point.

On February 14 2012 04:50 chaoser wrote:


agreed. even though I'm a master scum =[

On February 14 2012 03:09 Kurumi wrote:

We went to lynch Radfield because everything he has done so far together with info we have is too convienient.
-Can't die from Batman, but he had claimed DT already
-Wasn't RB-ed after claiming DT and bringing Town one scum, what?
-Wasn't killed after claiming DT and bringing Town one scum, what?
-Claims to have checked wbg. Convienent, given he's dead.
So, what's Your opinion?

On February 14 2012 00:10 Tunkeg wrote:
Palmar is finally making sense. I think you are right Palmar. I think Radfield is scum. Scumteam decided to bus Sheth for towncred on Radfield. Then Radfield "checks" WBG, oh, how convinient. And his last move is claiming the Calender Man (same as Palmar said he was).He have played a bold scumgame, but he have done it in the safest possible manner.

Sheth as a DT read, very safe way to get towncred for bussing a teammate that were allready somewhat in trouble. It probably were Sheth himself that proposed it...

WBG as a DT read after he died. "Proving" that he is a good DT checking the right players, and that he needs to be kept alive, while not having to tell someone a wrong read.

Claiming Calender Man, same as Palmar, knowing he had to claim, and that only Azrael and Calander Man was unclaimed it was a easy choice. because everyone knows Palmar is Batman, and because there is no need for the real Calander Man to come forth and claim when it allready is a contested claim.

##Vote Radfield