EPTCosmic Horror Mafia
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Palmar
Iceland22633 Posts
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Palmar
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On August 23 2011 23:25 Hesmyrr wrote: Unfortunately I haven't read that many Lovecraft stories  Tackster may be able to take care of it on later dayposts though. I PM'd you already, but game starts now. If you give confirmation that you are not currently busy, I'll start sending out the role PMs.##Vote Chaos13 | ||
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On August 24 2011 00:46 tnkted wrote: Oh!? You have a win condition other than winning with town? derp. | ||
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Palmar
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stop reading things you want to read. | ||
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Palmar
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This is not what happened. My win condition is to eliminate all threats to town. I did not slip, you're trying to manufacture evidence out of something that doesn't exist. My joke can't even be shrugged off as bad town play because nothing exists in it that would indicate I'm not town. | ||
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Palmar
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Like, I personally never dig into that policy thing, I just wait till people start arguing about them and try to pick out the scum. But for some reason you feel that it's somehow a necessity for the EA to play that way, ie: you're artificially inflating your argument, which is weird to me. | ||
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On August 24 2011 08:18 Sevryn wrote: If he is new I wanna know where he came from really awesome posts. he's not new, he's read way too many games for that to make sense. | ||
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On August 24 2011 09:45 tnkted wrote: Ferryman, if you are new, then welcome to mafia! You have a bright future here, and if you're town mafia will probably want to hit you n1. In this case though, I think you might be right but lynching palmar is a better move here. Sir Jesse Wiggles ESQ (duke of yorkshire) is a notoriously difficult person to read at the best of times because he plays so close to the chest, and I've written my share of analysis on him and been wrong every time. That being said, your evidence makes a lot of sense, and if we don't have any other leads tomorrow I'd be totally happy gettin' wiggy wit' it. But right now, palmar is a better lynch because A) His response to the FOS has been very scummy B) The slip thing I mentioned earlier C) It's day 1 so if I'm wrong, it's not THAT big of a deal. Keep your eye on Wiggles and if you find anything else we'll act on it. For now though, Palmar is scummier than wiggles and I'd rather lynch him, Just some advice: the first post you posted felt to me like more of a pressure post (ie it wasn't very convincing) but the second one (the meta one) was much more convincing (wiggles rather comprehensive response notwithstanding). Anyone pushing the idea that day 1 lynches are a crapshots is stupid. | ||
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Palmar
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If you guys are up for it I want a bit more time to read this thread, pretty busy with xliv atm. | ||
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This raises the questions, where does the deadline begin? | ||
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On August 25 2011 00:40 tnkted wrote: What's happening in XLIV? shouldn't talk about other games in here, I can pm you. | ||
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Ferryman posted a good analysis on the original indecisiveness of Wiggles's original post, but what finally convinced me was the fact Wiggles tried to draw up a case from another game where he was wrongly accused as town. ##Vote Mr. Wiggles | ||
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On August 25 2011 04:16 tnkted wrote: Forgive me for playing devils advocate, but isn't wiggles claiming that he's being wrongly accused as town in this game? So wouldn't that be exactly what he SHOULD quote? No, because if he was town, he'd be so convinced of his own innocence that the mere idea of him being scum should be way too far out for him to defend himself in the manner that he's doing. I think the case was a good one, but what's damning isn't the case, but much rather wiggles's responses to the case. I like him as our day 1 target. | ||
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On August 25 2011 20:25 Eiii wrote: I don't really see it. Drawing evidence to support a pretty scary-looking case against you-- especially evidence that's a frustrating, memorable, and recent experience of just about the same situation-- isn't all that damning to me. yes, but look at the way tnkted is posting. I'd rather lynch almost everyone in this town than him. Wiggles is the alternative wagon, and while I have no clue how Ferryman goes about pinning him EA vs just "anti-town", I think the case against wiggles is much stronger. Wiggles is a great player, but I just don't think it'll work in our favour this game. | ||
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On August 25 2011 21:24 Cyber_Cheese wrote: The more I think about it, the more I think Tnkted is much in the same boat that I put myself in to, he took his intial theory a little bit too far and spoke too much That said, I'm keeping my vote on him because of two reasons: 1) He might actually be scum 2) I have to have a vote placed and he's still what I consider the safest bet Why are you more concerned with not being wrong than killing scum? | ||
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Palmar
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someone hammer it so we can move on without extending the day. ##Unvote ##Vote tnkted | ||
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On August 25 2011 22:34 Forumite wrote: Palmar, of all players in this game, you looked like the last one that would switch your vote, what changed your mind? Ferryman has a good argument. People don't listen to good arguments because they're afraid of being wrong. I just spent XLIV presenting good arguments only to be ignored so people could kill some townies who are obviously town but make silly mistakes. All I got for that performance was people hating me or thinking I'm scum because I was right, and I told them they were wrong. I don't think tnkted is scum, but whatever, someone else can take the responsibility of convincing us to do the right thing. If there is ANY chance we can switch to wiggles, that's what I want to do. | ||
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Palmar
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I have a new strategy, I'll never vote for people I think are town. I'll actually force a no-lynch over it. I'm just not going to spam the thread away trying to convince people I'm right. ##Unvote tnkted ##Vote Mr. Wiggles | ||
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On August 25 2011 23:07 Forumite wrote: Right... What's your reasoning to believe Wiggles is town? | ||
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Palmar
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Tnkted is not scum because of this tiny little exchange. Thing is, the lololo thing is too unforced, too reactive and too casual for him to possibly be scum. If he was scum, he'd know I was town and be a little more hesitant to take my "derp" as an admission of slipping up (whereas, it's real intention was to portray the silliness of the accusation upon tnkted). If he's scum he's really good scum. I don't think he'd ever do what he did there as scum. He could have pushed the same issue, trying to paint my joke as a slip, but he would have gone about it completely differently if he was scum. | ||
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Palmar
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On August 25 2011 23:36 Forumite wrote: I don´t trust the primary argument made against him. Meta is usefull, sometimes, but I don´t think it´s applicable in finding a new kind of 3rd party with an unknown optimal play, especially as the meta argument focused specifically on his first post, which wanted to start a discussion more than anything. Since then wiggles has sometimes overreacted in his defences, there might be something there, but some players has said that Wiggles is hard to read, and I´m prepared to trust that Meta more than what Ferryman brought up. Then take a look at some of the things that have happened in the game. Wiggles decided to vote Eiii in his opening post. There is nothing wrong with randomly voting, but the fact that he felt the need to specify it was a pressure vote (through linking an awesome song by bowie/queen), shows inherent signs of guilt, and not wanting to stick his neck out. I don't even understand what the purpose of voting someone with the intent of only pressuring would be. At he point in time he threw down that vote it'd have been more sensical to go after one of the players that have posted, or to simply claim the vote on Eiii was to get rid of lurkers. | ||
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On August 26 2011 01:58 tnkted wrote: Sorry for triple post - I'm at work, no time to sit down and do it myself. I just don't want town to languish in afk land. Why do you not just want to switch the vote over to mr. wiggles? Ferryman already pointed out some very suspicious stuff in his play, I added a couple of pointers to it. He has a stronger case against him than anyone else currently playing. And I need to think harder about the implications of Cyber's plan, but I think that agreeing on which person the psych should visit, would indeed be the best way to proceed, that anonymously clears the person visited of being the EA. | ||
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Palmar
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That doesn't mean I'm scum, there is a logical leap you're taking right there. Could it possibly be that I'm a townie and I wanted to get another townie's head off the chopping block? You intentionally avoid that scenario. I already explained my reasoning for thinking tnkted cannot be scum, you choose to ignore that to paint me red. This is basically you grasping at straws, knowing that you're against a wall. I'm fine with it, I like a race between myself and you much better than a race between tnkted and cyber. And hopefully enough of town is reading the thread properly to see what's truly going on here. | ||
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On August 26 2011 17:51 Eiii wrote: ...it's still a no lynch today unless someone switches to tnk. C'mon now. Not me. | ||
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On August 26 2011 18:48 Forumite wrote: Sevryn, you´ve jumped between Cyber and Wiggles, what made you decide Wiggles was the one? What do you think he is, Scum or EA? Why that role? Palmar, you´ve been fairly sure about Wiggles since the start, apart from the brief vote on Tnkted which you withdrew before the deadline. Why isn´t Tnkted a good target anymore? Do you still think Wiggles is EA or do you believe Ferrymans "TRAP" and it´s suggestion that Wiggles is Scum? Even when I voted for tnkted I did not think he was a good target. Then I decided to change my policies around, and from now on I'm not supporting lynching targets I see no reason to believe are anti-town. The vote on tnkted was simply based on my older policy that no-lynching was anti-town, even at the cost of killing a townie, but now I have changed my mind. I don't really care all too much about Ferryman's case and his trap. I tend to form my own opinions. I don't read exactly the same things as Ferryman does in Wiggles's play, but the attention it has drawn to both of them has given me enough material to work with. While I don't agree with his methods, I do agree with his conclusion. I said even before the trap was revealed that I had no clue how Ferryman pinned him as "EA" rather than just "anti-town", but the trap simply explains why Ferryman thought he could do that. Because from where I stand I was leaning towards Wiggles being normal scum, rather than EA. Me saying I don't agree with his methods doesn't mean they're bad btw, I use some very questionable methods (including tunneling, riling up emotion etc) but they are very effective even if people don't like them. It just means he has a completely different style of play than I do. I think everyone needs to review the case against tnkted, realize they're incorrect and switch the vote onto Mr. Wiggles. | ||
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On August 26 2011 19:13 Cyber_Cheese wrote: On the candidate pool: Wiggles first- We should lynch someone believed to me mafia overnight, while the psych should visit MrWiggles tonight and if he rocks up insane(+dead by logical extension), we know Ferrymans arguments have a solid base While lynching the Eldritch is a great move for town, a day 1 that's extended via Eldritch lynch isn't as useful as say extending day 3/4 At this point, it's a bad idea to introduce people that don't already have votes You're clearly not reading the thread. None of the people pushing Wiggles think he's EA over any other kind of anti-town entity. I have no idea if he's the EA, and neither does Ferryman. The reason people are defending me is because it's sensible to defend me. You're new to this game so I'm leaning that the reason you ignore facts, don't read the thread and approach the game from the point you're doing, is because you're unintentionally bad, instead of Mr. Wiggles's accusation of me which is almost certainly maliciously bad. The fact that Wiggles has tried to swing a vote on me in a game where I am in my opinion radiating townie sunshine all over, is especially incriminating, because it's bad play, and wiggles isn't a bad player. By elimination the only remaining option is Wiggles being maliciously bad, which is almost certainly the case. I still need to form an opinion on you, but I was leaning town. Now that you have proved to me you aren't reading the thread, I need another look. | ||
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On August 26 2011 19:38 Cyber_Cheese wrote: I intentionally disregard the 'trap' for three reasons: 1) If it was a trap, wouldn't it be well thought out? Why wouldn't this 'trap' have been sprung BEFORE the extension? Surely if it were designed to be a trap from the get-go there was plenty of time in which the 'trap' could have been sprung with time to spare to secure votes 2) It seems more like a compromise. "Well guys you obviously don't all agree the horror so I'll just call him mafia and you guys vote on him now?" I'm not really sure of a better way to word this, it's just an impression I got 3) Only Palmar and Jackal have expressed any positive interest in the trap, for a grand total of three, and there are three mafia. This one I admit isn't a fair argument to use against it, but the first point basically convinces me on it's own To the first point, It's absolutely false that the extension is better saved, with less people in the game there is less to discuss. The first day of mafia is always the most important day. I have no idea why/how the trap is set the way it is, I have my own reasons for voting Wiggles, I think I have outlined them pretty well. on point three, again you're guilty not reading the thread. I have no particular interest in the trap, I have never expressed any positive interest in the trap, you're simply saying things that aren't true because you're not reading. The only comment I've given about the trap is that it's weirdness explains something I already questioned. To think that a mafia team would out themselves like that on day one is simply... naive. I hope you really put in the effort to backtrack and read what's truly going on here. | ||
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Palmar
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Or are the scum maybe people who tried to defend the townie? Thing is, a dead townie is not a good option for us. A preferable option is to kill scum, but failing that I'd actually prefer no-lynch. | ||
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On August 26 2011 21:52 Forumite wrote: Fear of mislynching should not keep us from lynching. If we reason like that, then we might just as well sit quietly and wait a week until the scum have killed off everyone. Well the field is open right now, Wiggles is leading the race with 5 votes on him. You should probably take your own advice and make those six! | ||
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On August 26 2011 21:52 chaos13 wrote: This. We already fucked up with Palmar moving his vote, and now we're having even more deflection away from tnkted. You know what that means? tnkt is scum and mafia want him to stay alive, and they want to make us waste our extended Day 1. I cannot help but to question your thought process here. Are you trying to smear tnkted and I together to make us look like two thirds of a scum team? Do you think his push towards getting me lynched was not genuine? You seem to share Forumite's opinion that lynching a townie is better than lynching no one, I read this from your initial "This". So, by the logic that you agree with, wouldn't the best option moving forward be switching your vote to Mr. Wiggles? Or does the logic only apply when the person about to be lynched is someone you want to get lynched? | ||
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Palmar
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It's very interesting that the same people who were at my throat for forcing a no-lynch and the use of our extension have yet to make a reasonable case for why wiggles is town (I at least explained my thought process behind why tnkted is town). In fact those same people are doing exactly the same thing as they accused me of, and forcing a no lynch. What has changed? By their own definition only the target has changed, and since forumite has explicitly stated that lynching a townie day 1 is fine, and chaos 13 backed up his opinion, I'd expect them to be happy about lynching Wiggles today! | ||
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On August 26 2011 22:53 Forumite wrote: I´d rather lynch a supposed Scum, than a supposed Town. In case I´m wrong, sorry Wiggles. I share this sentiment, except I will actively oppose lynching someone I think is town. I don't think Wiggles is town, so let's kill him. | ||
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Palmar
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Let's just do it like this, the night lasts 24 hours, so we have 12 hours to vote for whom the psychiatrist should visit. the format will be ##visit jeejee | ||
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On August 26 2011 21:52 chaos13 wrote: This. We already fucked up with Palmar moving his vote, and now we're having even more deflection away from tnkted. You know what that means? tnkt is scum and mafia want him to stay alive, and they want to make us waste our extended Day 1. This guy is almost definitely scum. He does not practice what he preaches. | ||
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On August 27 2011 07:10 Erandorr wrote: ##visit jeejee , makes sense. btw palmar you seem ultra passive right now , you scum or traumatized? passive, now? or versus my previous games? | ||
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Palmar
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I've learned that lesson now. | ||
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On August 27 2011 12:27 chaos13 wrote: I think the psychologist should do whatever they feel like. Too often the town majority ends up failing hard. Blue roles are distributed to individuals for this very reason. what the hell is this? | ||
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the 58 in jackal's name is just the year he was born, I think! GG girls! Go Town! | ||
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chaos13 can confirm I thought jackal was ea and forumite the remaining scum, just claiming that for bragging rights. But yeah, it was filled with some townies using terrible logic, and some townies simply not playing. This is what happens when town doesn't play, we lose terribly. The bus was very well executed by the mafia team, but they all played quite scummy during day 1 which should've lead to a quick town win. | ||
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