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United Kingdom31255 Posts
On July 07 2011 00:38 Drazerk wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 00:34 GMarshal wrote:
Also, VOTE TIME.
We all agree Mataza needs to be killed. We can nuke him and use the lynch on someone else, so lets have a vote, if I can get 15 people to agree in time we nuke Mataza, otherwise we lynch.
So vote in the following way
I vote to nuke Mataza If we nuke Mataza I want no more nukes to be used today and possibly tomorrow We can not keep nuking or conspirators will win. If so ill agree Nuke Mataza and get Ciryandor / syllo as a lynch target
Wow I am bad at this
Caller is a genius
Caller is a real hero
Caller is the mafia god
Caller should kill me for not being a faithful servant.
( Sorry )
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On July 07 2011 00:36 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
Also DT check OPZ the difference between a SK and a conspirator is quite huge.
Conspirator isn't just a fancy SK?
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
On July 07 2011 00:40 ~OpZ~ wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 00:36 TheAwesomeAll wrote:
Also DT check OPZ the difference between a SK and a conspirator is quite huge. Conspirator isn't just a fancy SK?
No they want the radiation level to rise high enough for world death.
Also caller is a legend among men and won 6 GSL's wearing masks of varies players
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Conspirator is the reason we're lynching and not nuking Mataza.
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On July 07 2011 00:34 GMarshal wrote:
Also, VOTE TIME.
We all agree Mataza needs to be killed. We can nuke him and use the lynch on someone else, so lets have a vote, if I can get 15 people to agree in time we nuke Mataza, otherwise we lynch.
So vote in the following way
I vote to nuke Mataza
I vote to NOT nuke Mataza
We already have one nuke in the air, we don't want +2 radiation on the first day.
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Doesn's day end in like 10 minutes?
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I vote to nuke Mataza
This lets us still get a real lynch out today, also if we keep to this policy which nuking him would do then I don't think we will need to worry too much about conspirator wins.
I would like to see what the arguments are for a Ciryandor/Syllo lynch. Also
With the day ending at the landing of the last fired nuke, will we see the results of the nuke before our vote is finalized or is it simultaneous? Also is there anything in place to keep us from firing a nuke every 12 hours right before the day ends to create a never-ending day?
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Let me explain this.
We kill Mataza, there is no deterrence in a policy if people don't follow the policy. This has the nasty side-effect of clogging our lynch today, but we just have to deal with it. Generally mafia games seem to be balance in such a way that the town can mislynch approximately as often as there are mafia in the game. For example in a 12 player setup with 3 mafia, there town loses if they mislynch 3 times and wins if they lynch correctly 3 times. Obviously every lynch changes, this, but best case and worst case are generally like this.
Why am I talking about this? Because it has a direct influence on our situation. We have a conspirator in the game that likes radiation (Hi Sandroba). Even if (and I'm not even sure it is) the Mataza lynch is a mislynch, we can always make up for that with a nuke on day 4. The difference is that the longer we wait with nuking, the more accurate the nukes become. Sending a nuke after a possible townie is even worse than lynching one.
It's a shitty situation, ideally we wouldn't have to kill Mataza because he didn't decide to troll the game, but it's one we have to deal with. The sensible thing is to do just that and then resume on day 2.
Chaos13 called me out for creating town order, well I think I've been doing just that. While people like Syllo and Sandroba are tunneling me, the best thing I can do is to make sure they don't lynch me, while keeping the discussion alive. I don't have the same kind of time available in this game as in RTM, so don't expect me to spam as much, although I am always quite active.
We cannot achieve town order if we so blatantly go back on our policies. I will not be pushing an alternative lynch today because if Mataza gets away with it, I think we're about to turn this game into armageddon.
I will start pushing for another lynch as soon as day breaks.
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On July 07 2011 00:56 syllogism wrote:
Doesn's day end in like 10 minutes?
I think the day gets extended for the duration of the nuke flight, not sure though.
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I think we've like 5 people who haven't voted too
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On July 06 2011 22:29 Drazerk wrote:I thank caller for being a shining inspiration for this post. Right then, Mataza has the noose already around his neck so lets see what my current FoS Ciryandor has done this game. Well actually he has typed Four posts in total and made a stealth vote proving that he is Active lurking. First post - Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 15:27 Ciryandor wrote:
Honestly, I'd be very wary of anyone who's trigger-happy right now. And PLEASE FFS, don't throw nukes unless you want multi-kills on some people. At this point we had no real policy in check and we needed to keep the trigger happy players in their place some how. Yet he seems to state we should use Nukes for multi kills which I Don't like if we want to kill we will lynch Cir seems intent on nuking people to raise the radiation level higher. After Palmar / GM make their policies clear to one another he pops up again for a bit longer of a post Show nested quote +On July 05 2011 23:36 Ciryandor wrote:
It's quite nice to read as I catch up that everyone has thought it is a good idea to do a no-nuke unless absolutely necessary AND agreed upon by town as its policy, to stifle the chances of the Conspirator winning as the town tries to take out the Mafia. While right now, I do agree with Palmar's invocation that we should keep independent thought on our targets, at the end of the day, one has to show WHY it would be a good idea to nuke someone, then as the person who proposed it, take the shot themselves if they have a nuke at hand. Could someone update me on how long there is time left before the deadline? He seems to have shifted his stances from, Nuking to kill multiple targets to Nuking only when the town agrees pretty much mimicking the policies already stated trying to blend in without adding anything of value himself. Now here is his first and only contribution this game. Show nested quote +On July 06 2011 11:38 Ciryandor wrote:
##Vote: Zona
He's supposed to be bloody active in the forums, though I'm not sure now that BW PL regular season is already over; so I'm wondering where he could be. In the same vein, why is Eiii's only recent comment not very relevant to the game? Is he lurking as well?
##Vote: Dunkirk Operation
It gives us more return to do this, we're assured of extra lives for Brit Townies unlike the ambiguity of "Up to 3 nukes" of Gunnerside (which implies anything from 1-3; and may even involve a scum counter-op to reduce the number), and Watchtower just stops everything (but if people start voting that way it just slows down the nuke-throwing people are going to do by a day, no more, no less.
And I don't want anyone to nuke anyone just yet, it's unwarranted to be throwing the septic tank around in the air just yet. Maybe target proposals for the next day, but no more than that. I think at this time we had already stated that Dunkirk is the most logical one to pick and it was pretty much set in stone at this stage. As for Zona, Yes he hasn't posted yet but nor has Ciryandor when you really look at things, He just wanted to try and stir some activity up to point at later when people will suspect him. He claims people are lurking but I have seen no one more actively lurk than he does esspecially when we take into consideration the Ninja vote he did earlier What I am suggesting - We lynch Mataza as planned and then we move onto Ciryandor as he is a conspirator
I'll answer all your accusations one by one:
First, this is MY FIRST GAME, so if I'm not going to be as contributory as you should think a townie would be, then you have my complete naiveté with regards to TL Mafia's meta to thank for. This makes me emphasize having the voice of reason and economy of speech so townies can think straight and not be emotionally swayed.
Next, I specifically said that we shouldn't be throwing around nukes, unless we want multiple people to die on the same day because I don't want the Conspirator getting any more rad points than we can spare, i.e. conservation of firepower versus scum so we don't hit his win condition when we've got them all lined up because of their actions.
Once again, I emphasize in shorter form for everyone why one option is better than another. Not everyone can dig out the core of people's arguments for or against certain actions quickly, I try to provide some clarity instead of leaving them in the dark.
As for the vote, I voted without leaving a reasoning behind because it's self evident that if we want to implement the no nukes rule that the town has agreed upon. So if it happens that we agree on launching a nuke at Mataza for his irresponsibility, and have someone else lynched, I am willing to volunteer my nuking services to protect the town.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
Caller is a baller and I am not worthy of worshipping him
All right with that out of the way, I completely agree with palmar we shouldn't be nuking as we have to remember conspirators / Scum will fire nukes off if they are about to be lynched in retaliation. as and so the world radiation will rise every time we lynch one which could lead to a terrible situation.
After Mataza I have made it clear who I think should be lynched ( Syllo / Ciryandor Read my previous reasons as for why )
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On July 07 2011 00:59 Palmar wrote:I think the day gets extended for the duration of the nuke flight, not sure though.
yeah it does according to op.
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On July 07 2011 01:08 Drazerk wrote:
Caller is a baller and I am not worthy of worshipping him
All right with that out of the way, I completely agree with palmar we shouldn't be nuking as we have to remember conspirators / Scum will fire nukes off if they are about to be lynched in retaliation. as and so the world radiation will rise every time we lynch one which could lead to a terrible situation.
After Mataza I have made it clear who I think should be lynched ( Syllo / Ciryandor Read my previous reasons as for why )
Don't tase me bro, I'm on the town's side. I'm actually wondering who else is keeping their head down or has it completely buried in the sand, not everyone can be as active as you want them to be; and I'm going to sleep now.
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On July 07 2011 01:08 Drazerk wrote:
Caller is a baller and I am not worthy of worshipping him
All right with that out of the way, I completely agree with palmar we shouldn't be nuking as we have to remember conspirators / Scum will fire nukes off if they are about to be lynched in retaliation. as and so the world radiation will rise every time we lynch one which could lead to a terrible situation.
After Mataza I have made it clear who I think should be lynched ( Syllo / Ciryandor Read my previous reasons as for why )
Ok I was willing to go for nuking mataza but that wasn't actually a must, I just want to keep to policy so ignore my vote for the nuke.
##Vote: Mataza
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On July 07 2011 01:08 Ciryandor wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2011 22:29 Drazerk wrote:I thank caller for being a shining inspiration for this post. Right then, Mataza has the noose already around his neck so lets see what my current FoS Ciryandor has done this game. Well actually he has typed Four posts in total and made a stealth vote proving that he is Active lurking. First post - On July 05 2011 15:27 Ciryandor wrote:
Honestly, I'd be very wary of anyone who's trigger-happy right now. And PLEASE FFS, don't throw nukes unless you want multi-kills on some people. At this point we had no real policy in check and we needed to keep the trigger happy players in their place some how. Yet he seems to state we should use Nukes for multi kills which I Don't like if we want to kill we will lynch Cir seems intent on nuking people to raise the radiation level higher. After Palmar / GM make their policies clear to one another he pops up again for a bit longer of a post On July 05 2011 23:36 Ciryandor wrote:
It's quite nice to read as I catch up that everyone has thought it is a good idea to do a no-nuke unless absolutely necessary AND agreed upon by town as its policy, to stifle the chances of the Conspirator winning as the town tries to take out the Mafia. While right now, I do agree with Palmar's invocation that we should keep independent thought on our targets, at the end of the day, one has to show WHY it would be a good idea to nuke someone, then as the person who proposed it, take the shot themselves if they have a nuke at hand. Could someone update me on how long there is time left before the deadline? He seems to have shifted his stances from, Nuking to kill multiple targets to Nuking only when the town agrees pretty much mimicking the policies already stated trying to blend in without adding anything of value himself. Now here is his first and only contribution this game. On July 06 2011 11:38 Ciryandor wrote:
##Vote: Zona
He's supposed to be bloody active in the forums, though I'm not sure now that BW PL regular season is already over; so I'm wondering where he could be. In the same vein, why is Eiii's only recent comment not very relevant to the game? Is he lurking as well?
##Vote: Dunkirk Operation
It gives us more return to do this, we're assured of extra lives for Brit Townies unlike the ambiguity of "Up to 3 nukes" of Gunnerside (which implies anything from 1-3; and may even involve a scum counter-op to reduce the number), and Watchtower just stops everything (but if people start voting that way it just slows down the nuke-throwing people are going to do by a day, no more, no less.
And I don't want anyone to nuke anyone just yet, it's unwarranted to be throwing the septic tank around in the air just yet. Maybe target proposals for the next day, but no more than that. I think at this time we had already stated that Dunkirk is the most logical one to pick and it was pretty much set in stone at this stage. As for Zona, Yes he hasn't posted yet but nor has Ciryandor when you really look at things, He just wanted to try and stir some activity up to point at later when people will suspect him. He claims people are lurking but I have seen no one more actively lurk than he does esspecially when we take into consideration the Ninja vote he did earlier On July 06 2011 21:03 Ciryandor wrote:
##Unvote Zona
##Vote Mataza What I am suggesting - We lynch Mataza as planned and then we move onto Ciryandor as he is a conspirator I'll answer all your accusations one by one: First, this is MY FIRST GAME, so if I'm not going to be as contributory as you should think a townie would be, then you have my complete naiveté with regards to TL Mafia's meta to thank for. This makes me emphasize having the voice of reason and economy of speech so townies can think straight and not be emotionally swayed. Next, I specifically said that we shouldn't be throwing around nukes, unless we want multiple people to die on the same day because I don't want the Conspirator getting any more rad points than we can spare, i.e. conservation of firepower versus scum so we don't hit his win condition when we've got them all lined up because of their actions. Once again, I emphasize in shorter form for everyone why one option is better than another. Not everyone can dig out the core of people's arguments for or against certain actions quickly, I try to provide some clarity instead of leaving them in the dark. As for the vote, I voted without leaving a reasoning behind because it's self evident that if we want to implement the no nukes rule that the town has agreed upon. So if it happens that we agree on launching a nuke at Mataza for his irresponsibility, and have someone else lynched, I am willing to volunteer my nuking services to protect the town.
dont you think nuking is better, since thats the only way to get a proper lynch? Mafia will try to stay out of the spotlight as much as possible so if we force them to do a meaningful vote we get some good slips. for example skim through XL where the votes were basicly lists of mafia members if you combined them, now in this situation the votes will give just a list of townies, with mafia blend in.
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I vote to nuke Mataza
The whole point of the nuke was to be a second lynch, and that is what we should use it for. Mataza should be policy nuked for nuking without a majority.
And on the subject of who to lynch, ##Vote: ciryandor for active lurking and switching his vote without posting in-thread.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
Caller is a man of many talents all of them great.
Depending on how Mataza will flip I want that nuke list checked as we will probably have Conspirators on it but regardless of how Mataza dies we need to start focusing on alternate lynch targets and conserve our nukes for the late game.
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HAHAHAHAHA
watching drazerk post is the funniest part of this game
so do we want to save gmarshal or not
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On July 07 2011 01:14 TheAwesomeAll wrote:Show nested quote +On July 07 2011 01:08 Ciryandor wrote:On July 06 2011 22:29 Drazerk wrote:I thank caller for being a shining inspiration for this post. Right then, Mataza has the noose already around his neck so lets see what my current FoS Ciryandor has done this game. Well actually he has typed Four posts in total and made a stealth vote proving that he is Active lurking. First post - On July 05 2011 15:27 Ciryandor wrote:
Honestly, I'd be very wary of anyone who's trigger-happy right now. And PLEASE FFS, don't throw nukes unless you want multi-kills on some people. At this point we had no real policy in check and we needed to keep the trigger happy players in their place some how. Yet he seems to state we should use Nukes for multi kills which I Don't like if we want to kill we will lynch Cir seems intent on nuking people to raise the radiation level higher. After Palmar / GM make their policies clear to one another he pops up again for a bit longer of a post On July 05 2011 23:36 Ciryandor wrote:
It's quite nice to read as I catch up that everyone has thought it is a good idea to do a no-nuke unless absolutely necessary AND agreed upon by town as its policy, to stifle the chances of the Conspirator winning as the town tries to take out the Mafia. While right now, I do agree with Palmar's invocation that we should keep independent thought on our targets, at the end of the day, one has to show WHY it would be a good idea to nuke someone, then as the person who proposed it, take the shot themselves if they have a nuke at hand. Could someone update me on how long there is time left before the deadline? He seems to have shifted his stances from, Nuking to kill multiple targets to Nuking only when the town agrees pretty much mimicking the policies already stated trying to blend in without adding anything of value himself. Now here is his first and only contribution this game. On July 06 2011 11:38 Ciryandor wrote:
##Vote: Zona
He's supposed to be bloody active in the forums, though I'm not sure now that BW PL regular season is already over; so I'm wondering where he could be. In the same vein, why is Eiii's only recent comment not very relevant to the game? Is he lurking as well?
##Vote: Dunkirk Operation
It gives us more return to do this, we're assured of extra lives for Brit Townies unlike the ambiguity of "Up to 3 nukes" of Gunnerside (which implies anything from 1-3; and may even involve a scum counter-op to reduce the number), and Watchtower just stops everything (but if people start voting that way it just slows down the nuke-throwing people are going to do by a day, no more, no less.
And I don't want anyone to nuke anyone just yet, it's unwarranted to be throwing the septic tank around in the air just yet. Maybe target proposals for the next day, but no more than that. I think at this time we had already stated that Dunkirk is the most logical one to pick and it was pretty much set in stone at this stage. As for Zona, Yes he hasn't posted yet but nor has Ciryandor when you really look at things, He just wanted to try and stir some activity up to point at later when people will suspect him. He claims people are lurking but I have seen no one more actively lurk than he does esspecially when we take into consideration the Ninja vote he did earlier On July 06 2011 21:03 Ciryandor wrote:
##Unvote Zona
##Vote Mataza What I am suggesting - We lynch Mataza as planned and then we move onto Ciryandor as he is a conspirator I'll answer all your accusations one by one: First, this is MY FIRST GAME, so if I'm not going to be as contributory as you should think a townie would be, then you have my complete naiveté with regards to TL Mafia's meta to thank for. This makes me emphasize having the voice of reason and economy of speech so townies can think straight and not be emotionally swayed. Next, I specifically said that we shouldn't be throwing around nukes, unless we want multiple people to die on the same day because I don't want the Conspirator getting any more rad points than we can spare, i.e. conservation of firepower versus scum so we don't hit his win condition when we've got them all lined up because of their actions. Once again, I emphasize in shorter form for everyone why one option is better than another. Not everyone can dig out the core of people's arguments for or against certain actions quickly, I try to provide some clarity instead of leaving them in the dark. As for the vote, I voted without leaving a reasoning behind because it's self evident that if we want to implement the no nukes rule that the town has agreed upon. So if it happens that we agree on launching a nuke at Mataza for his irresponsibility, and have someone else lynched, I am willing to volunteer my nuking services to protect the town. dont you think nuking is better, since thats the only way to get a proper lynch? Mafia will try to stay out of the spotlight as much as possible so if we force them to do a meaningful vote we get some good slips. for example skim through XL where the votes were basicly lists of mafia members if you combined them, now in this situation the votes will give just a list of townies, with mafia blend in.
No, not really, as I see it we have two bad options.
a) follow town policy at the cost of a possible bad lynch. It will take us a correct lynch to recover
b) break town policy at the cost of radiation and the policy itself. I'm not quite sure what it will take us to recover
Towns have recovered from bad day 1 lynches, the nuclear holocaust that could (or could not) happen with option b seems like the worse alternative.
I'm not even sure Mataza is town, as nuking without reason is so anti-town that I can hardly believe anyone trying to play to their win condition would do it.
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EPT
