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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
If it's a townie, then you know he's confirmed because he didn't do anything. If it's a doctor, then you would know he's confirmed because he didn't hit Artanis(assuming artanis is town, which shall be found out via the above.) So there's no way to know who is. | ||
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12973 Posts
On November 15 2010 01:47 Pandain wrote: So here: Artanis, since it doesn't matter, are you calm or clam. then if someone counter claims, we caught ya'. We aren't told in the role PM if we're calm or clam. It says you don't remember which one you are. I presume this is done to give mafia a chance to roleclaim. | ||
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KtheZ
United States813 Posts
He said that he is neither calm nor clam, but nowhere in the rules said that the vet role would be both calm/clam. Unless another vet comes and refutes artanis's role pm claim (because it is safe to assume the other vet got the same pm), then we can say artanis really is town. | ||
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Kenpachi
United States9908 Posts
On November 14 2010 19:01 Coagulation wrote: I think right now im most suspicious of youngminii This post just seems anti town. who would want town to lynch randomly and not plan? also worth noticing that glass appears to be trying to fly under the radar I somewhat agree but hes just suggesting it. Hes not giving much support to it so it was probably to generate ideas. On November 15 2010 02:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote: We aren't told in the role PM if we're calm or clam. It says you don't remember which one you are. I presume this is done to give mafia a chance to roleclaim. How would we resolve if mafia counterclaims as the third clam? | ||
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Kenpachi
United States9908 Posts
On November 15 2010 02:39 KtheZ wrote: I think it is probably safe to say artanis really is a vet; He seems to have a legit role pm. He said that he is neither calm nor clam, but nowhere in the rules said that the vet role would be both calm/clam. Unless another vet comes and refutes artanis's role pm claim (because it is safe to assume the other vet got the same pm), then we can say artanis really is town. oh i missed this post | ||
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Glasse
Canada1237 Posts
On November 15 2010 02:56 Kenpachi wrote: I somewhat agree but hes just suggesting it. Hes not giving much support to it so it was probably to generate ideas. How would we resolve if mafia counterclaims as the third clam? we could kill EVERYONE irl | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On November 15 2010 02:39 KtheZ wrote: I think it is probably safe to say artanis really is a vet; He seems to have a legit role pm. He said that he is neither calm nor clam, but nowhere in the rules said that the vet role would be both calm/clam. Unless another vet comes and refutes artanis's role pm claim (because it is safe to assume the other vet got the same pm), then we can say artanis really is town. he didn't say he was neither calm nor clam he said he was either calm or clam, he just doesn't know which one big difference. we can't just accept artanis as 100% town. vet is one of the best fakeclaims for a mafia, but something about his play doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me as mafia. he's at the bottom of my suspects list really wish he refused to answer that question about his role pm. would have been such a good trap if he said he was calm and then some mafia said "well im clam" | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On November 15 2010 01:20 LSB wrote: Come to think about it Artanis[Xp] was probably hit because 1) He didn't have any relations to anyone. 2) He's probably regarded as a vet. i would think i'd be the day 1 target maybe mafia predicted i would be protected by a doctor or they're doing the same strategy I did in Micro Mafia Redemption where we intentionally avoided hitting vets so I wouldn't fall under suspicion for being the "last vet alive" | ||
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
An Analysis of Dr. H: Summary: Dr.H strikes me as more mafia than town. Note how he has been playing this game, almost like he doesn't care. Note in Insane mafia, the game where he was town, he was constantly talking, contributing, trying to actively find out whos town. In this game, he's hardly contributed at all! More so, he's contradicted himself by saying we should pressure people and now says we shouldn't because it's pointless. Furthormore still, the fact he has been saying we need to actively scum hunt and pressure people is conflicting with the fact HE HAS DONE NEITHER. Finally, the icing on the cake is the fact he wasn't shot, when in all truth he was probably the most likely to get shot/converted. His posts: On November 12 2010 13:23 DoctorHelvetica wrote: thought you were talking to me when you said doctor >_> Irrelevant. On November 12 2010 13:48 DoctorHelvetica wrote: and the mafia will just circumvent that by mindcontrolling everyone else lol One line contribution. On November 13 2010 05:57 DoctorHelvetica wrote: he was good in both games imo Irrelevant. spam. On November 14 2010 08:26 DoctorHelvetica wrote: I really don't like the idea of everyone knowing what the shrink/doctors are gonna do. If we direct the blues that easily then the mafia simply only have to do exactly the opposite of what they shrink has claimed to do in the thread. If the mafia know the shrink is protecting player x, they will just never convert player x, meaning they will never fail in their conversion. The doctor and the shrink should feel comfortable acting on their own discretion. You need to understand what the best targets for mafia are. For death, strong blues (like LSB) will be the main target. For conversion, veterans/good players (myself, LSB) will be the strongest targets. Try to predict what the mafia are going to do, don't give them information. If we're going to do some sort of mass roleclaim thing, it needs to be set-up so that the mafia are forced to give the town bogus information. Mafia want to play the game giving as little information as possible in regards to everything, forcing them to come out of the woodwork is what will make them slip-up. Don't be scared to pressure. I don't like this post. For one, he's basically saying we shouldn't help the shrink/doctor. But we have been saying (for the most part) that the doctor should RNG between people. Of course we're going to protect LSB via the shrink, that's the most logical thing to do. Note we have to say this so we are sure, he says "well then mafia will just convert someone else" but we have to make it so they don't convet other people. Also keep in mind that one of them would have to die if they want to convert, so that is even less of a point. Furthormore, he says don't do what people in thread are saying. But again, the doctor is free to do his own choice. We are giving him valuable advice, mafia don't know if the person is going to follow it. Also note he says mafia wants to play the game giving as little information as possible, and don't be scared to pressure. Later note he never pressures, and he gives hardly any analysis/information. One of the main things about this post is that it doesn't really help with our situation, it just gives general advice. That's one of the favorite things for mafia to do, just pretend to help via "generic" advice while not contributing to the matters at hand. On November 14 2010 08:28 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Also town, if you feel someone is pretty strongly pro-town I'd advise you not to tell the town (hey I think player X is definitely a townie) wait and watch, mafia might try to make a bad case on that person and fall into the trap. it's ok to keep your thoughts to yourself. we don't need to know everything you're thinking and the mafia CERTAINLY don't. I do not like this AT ALL. First of all, we SHOULD be talking about in thread who we feel is pro town. Just because mafia "might" try to make a bad case on a person is a horrible reason to shush discussion about who we feel is pro town. If you make your point now, then mafia aren't going to attack them at all. In fact, mafia probably won't attack those clearly pro town players since they'd have no proof. All this is doing is limiting discussion, which I DO NOT LIKE. *yawn*. I still don't get how this would work. On November 14 2010 14:56 DoctorHelvetica wrote: That is true. You're also the best target in the case of there being no mafia suspects. We need to scumhunt instead of putting pressure on you. You never respond well to it anyway, it's pointless. This is what really set me off and made me decide to do this analysis. Dr. H has not been scum hunting, and this is the first time he comes out and defends someone(out of the blue basically.) In addition, HES CONTRADICTING HIMSELF. Previously he said "Don't be afraid to pressure people" now he's saying "we need to scum hunt instead of putting pressure on you." BUT NOTE HES NOT DOING EITHER. Also saying it's pointless is false, pressure is always informative. On November 15 2010 03:21 DoctorHelvetica wrote: he didn't say he was neither calm nor clam he said he was either calm or clam, he just doesn't know which one big difference. we can't just accept artanis as 100% town. vet is one of the best fakeclaims for a mafia, but something about his play doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me as mafia. he's at the bottom of my suspects list really wish he refused to answer that question about his role pm. would have been such a good trap if he said he was calm and then some mafia said "well im clam" Makes a very vauge analysis on ARtanis(something doesn't seem right to me about his play if he were mafia, but I won't elaborate.) Also Artanis IS confirmed if a calm/clam doesn't reveal that they in fact did get a specific role(aka clam or calm.) So I don't like how he's saying he's not. And then he says "I don't think he's mafia." Again, not a total contradiction, but should be noted. On November 15 2010 03:23 DoctorHelvetica wrote: i would think i'd be the day 1 target maybe mafia predicted i would be protected by a doctor or they're doing the same strategy I did in Micro Mafia Redemption where we intentionally avoided hitting vets so I wouldn't fall under suspicion for being the "last vet alive" Agreed. Why did scum not target you. Why did they decide to hit Artanis instead. It just doesn't make sense to me. Again, it's possible that they thought you would be protected, but that's not that likely. | ||
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KtheZ
United States813 Posts
On November 15 2010 03:21 DoctorHelvetica wrote: he didn't say he was neither calm nor clam he said he was either calm or clam, he just doesn't know which one big difference. we can't just accept artanis as 100% town. vet is one of the best fakeclaims for a mafia, but something about his play doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me as mafia. he's at the bottom of my suspects list really wish he refused to answer that question about his role pm. would have been such a good trap if he said he was calm and then some mafia said "well im clam" You know DrH, I was thinking the same thing. It would have been so much more convenient if a mafia claimed clam or something. But getting back on track: Artanis stated that in his role pm calm/clam were interchangeable, since he did not know which one he was. It is probably safe to assume the other vet also got the same PM. Since there is another vet, if they remain silent, it is most likely a confirmation that what artanis said is correct, and that he really is vet. If Artanis IS lying about his role, I would urge the other vet to tell us. However, while saying this, I also want to note that roleclaiming as the second vet may not be a good idea at this point. You would paint yourself as a prime target for MC. Anyway, if artanis is correct about his role PM, vet stay silent. If he is lying, sorry for the WIFOM, then real vet, you get to make a decision. | ||
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
Also would like to hear feedback from other players(like KtheZ) | ||
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LSB
United States5171 Posts
On November 15 2010 03:23 DoctorHelvetica wrote: i would think i'd be the day 1 target maybe mafia predicted i would be protected by a doctor or they're doing the same strategy I did in Micro Mafia Redemption where we intentionally avoided hitting vets so I wouldn't fall under suspicion for being the "last vet alive" The difference between this game and Micro Mafia Redemption, was that you were basically the only vet who actively plays. This game there is plenty of vets. | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
i believed artanis claim, i was hoping mafia would bandwagon the shit out of him trying to make his claim look fake, that's what i meant when i was talking to kthez anyway about pressure being a bad thing. coagulation is bad at this game. if he is town pressuring him will just make him look bad, if he is mafia pressuring him will make him look equally bad. the best bet with him if he's mafia is that he'll be really transparent and defend some mafia buddy in a super obvious way I was just going to say how pressuring inactive players with votes can be good as long as it doesn't become a deathwagon as far as me not scumhunting sure I am. i'm reading everyones post and thinking. i'm not gonna spam the thread with FoS's on everyone who says something mildly dumb or suspicious otherwise I'd be FoS'ing all the time lol. i decided my biggest mistake as town in insane mafia was posting too much and thinking too little. and i wasn't analysing artanis really. you said "i don't like how you're saying he isn't confirmed" but he fucking isn't lol. the other bulletproof shouldn't claim, this narrows mafia targets down way too much, the whole purpose of a bulletproof role is you goad the mafia into shooting you. sure if the other one claims the same thing it "confirms" artanis but then we just lose the whole point of the role, don't do it now as far as not saying "i think this person is 100% townie" here's why. if I say and convince everyone, say, Kenpachi is definiiiiitely town. Mafia just won't even bandwagon them. If I hold my tongue and wait to see if mafia pressure him with bullshit then I can come out and hopefully cut through their bullshit and catch a mafia. we all know who we think is town, it doesn't limit discussion, it's a pointless discussion in the first place imo you can feel free to disagree but I want to a play a game where the mafia makes mistakes, the more we tell them the less room for that there is. artanis claiming was a mistake, let's not do additional damage by having the other BP roleclaim even if its to do something like confirm artanis | ||
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LSB
United States5171 Posts
As for my analysis, I feel dumb for missing out on a post, so I'll do my analysis later. | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On November 15 2010 03:45 KtheZ wrote: You know DrH, I was thinking the same thing. It would have been so much more convenient if a mafia claimed clam or something. But getting back on track: Artanis stated that in his role pm calm/clam were interchangeable, since he did not know which one he was. It is probably safe to assume the other vet also got the same PM. Since there is another vet, if they remain silent, it is most likely a confirmation that what artanis said is correct, and that he really is vet. If Artanis IS lying about his role, I would urge the other vet to tell us. However, while saying this, I also want to note that roleclaiming as the second vet may not be a good idea at this point. You would paint yourself as a prime target for MC. Anyway, if artanis is correct about his role PM, vet stay silent. If he is lying, sorry for the WIFOM, then real vet, you get to make a decision. good post. other BP claim if artanis is full of shit, otherwise stay quiet | ||
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LSB
United States5171 Posts
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LSB
United States5171 Posts
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On November 15 2010 03:51 Pandain wrote: Just putting this out here: Dr. H what was your plan? Also would like to hear feedback from other players(like KtheZ) plan in regards to what | ||
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LSB
United States5171 Posts
On November 15 2010 03:45 KtheZ wrote: You know DrH, I was thinking the same thing. It would have been so much more convenient if a mafia claimed clam or something. But getting back on track: Artanis stated that in his role pm calm/clam were interchangeable, since he did not know which one he was. It is probably safe to assume the other vet also got the same PM. Since there is another vet, if they remain silent, it is most likely a confirmation that what artanis said is correct, and that he really is vet. If Artanis IS lying about his role, I would urge the other vet to tell us. However, while saying this, I also want to note that roleclaiming as the second vet may not be a good idea at this point. You would paint yourself as a prime target for MC. Anyway, if artanis is correct about his role PM, vet stay silent. If he is lying, sorry for the WIFOM, then real vet, you get to make a decision. Cut the role PM stuff. Anyone who payed attention to the thread could figure that out On November 12 2010 12:11 deconduo wrote: Mafia can choose to not use their bribery skill. Its entirely optional. They have a normal 1KP between them, no matter how many mafia are alive. Being Calm or Clam does not make you immune to bribery. In other random news, it appears that Calm and Clam can no longer even tell each other apart. They don't even know which one of them is which. + Show Spoiler + The bullet proof role is not name dependant. This is to help mafia if they wish to claim bulletproof, they don't have to pick which of Clam/Calm they are. Calm and Clam were informed that they do not know which one of them is which. | ||
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