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On January 17 2014 09:32 Amethyst21 wrote:
I'm 99% sure Montecristo cursed Alliance when he put them in his top 10 of his power rankings.
Alliance needs a coach/analyst right away (in before Nyph retires to be the analyst and they bring back Kazmitch)
I don't think he put Alliance in top 10, but he did put PE very high up and as the highest Chinese team on the list which is possibly equally hilarious
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On January 17 2014 09:34 Volband wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:27 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:24 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. Not really, they've struggled like a whale on the coast until ROC made that chain of mistakes, so it was nowhere near in the air that they could actually overcome them without lucky events like that. After 10 lost team fights in a row, you kinda know that. Butthurt Alliance fans are almost as nice as TSM ones, so whatever. If you are satisfied with their choice, I'm not opposed to it, I mean, they almost managed to chain two ultimates with gigantic cast range. Emphasis on almost. On January 17 2014 09:21 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Worst troll 2014.0/10 Nafta having the same quality arguements as always. Looking forward the NA LCS tomorrow, lol. Wait you were actually serious?LOL How does not trying to end 5v3 show confidence?ROFL They had full hp, and Caitlyn barely tickeled them when she had no frontline to grant her non-stop AAs. I'm fairly positive they could've won that but even if they failed, it would've been damn close. But to answer your question: they had the opportunity to finish. Was that 100%? No, it was not. Was it a double or nothing? Pretty much. Maybe ROC couldn't have pushed them back even if Alliance got aced, but free baron and towers/inhibs for sure, which is gg. Anyway, they said no to the possible game winning play. Now, if you do something like that, you have to have a reason for it. Let's say the tables were turned, and ROC could've done the same at the opposite side. If they actually tried it, I would've called them crazy, because they were winning every single teamfight and skirmish, so there was absolutely no reason for them to risk something like that. If they already won a 100 fights, they'll probably won a 100 more, because their lead has been snowballed constantly, and Alliance looked worse and worse as the time passed. Now back to Alliance's perspective: what on Earth could they possible hope for? Wicked learns to fight? Froggen will magically do something other than being overshadowed by everyone in the game? Vi's or Leona's (or both) ultimates won't get blackshielded? They eithe had confidence they will have a better chance at winning if they not risk going for the finish right there, which means they had confidence in a.) they being better than their opponent b.) their opponent will make more mistakes like this.
I really don't think they could've ended but you really give them wayyyyy too much credit to be thinking like that.Even if they could end a team which is 0/3 and losing 4-th game when they were super hyped is just scared to take ANY risks.Anyone who has played in any team based tournament should know that feeling.They were just hoping the enemy team would throw like in solo.
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They need a coach, one of the reason why skt is so succesfull.
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On January 17 2014 09:38 Solaris.playgu wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:34 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:27 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:24 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. Not really, they've struggled like a whale on the coast until ROC made that chain of mistakes, so it was nowhere near in the air that they could actually overcome them without lucky events like that. After 10 lost team fights in a row, you kinda know that. Butthurt Alliance fans are almost as nice as TSM ones, so whatever. If you are satisfied with their choice, I'm not opposed to it, I mean, they almost managed to chain two ultimates with gigantic cast range. Emphasis on almost. On January 17 2014 09:21 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Worst troll 2014.0/10 Nafta having the same quality arguements as always. Looking forward the NA LCS tomorrow, lol. Wait you were actually serious?LOL How does not trying to end 5v3 show confidence?ROFL They had full hp, and Caitlyn barely tickeled them when she had no frontline to grant her non-stop AAs. I'm fairly positive they could've won that but even if they failed, it would've been damn close. But to answer your question: they had the opportunity to finish. Was that 100%? No, it was not. Was it a double or nothing? Pretty much. Maybe ROC couldn't have pushed them back even if Alliance got aced, but free baron and towers/inhibs for sure, which is gg. Anyway, they said no to the possible game winning play. Now, if you do something like that, you have to have a reason for it. Let's say the tables were turned, and ROC could've done the same at the opposite side. If they actually tried it, I would've called them crazy, because they were winning every single teamfight and skirmish, so there was absolutely no reason for them to risk something like that. If they already won a 100 fights, they'll probably won a 100 more, because their lead has been snowballed constantly, and Alliance looked worse and worse as the time passed. Now back to Alliance's perspective: what on Earth could they possible hope for? Wicked learns to fight? Froggen will magically do something other than being overshadowed by everyone in the game? Vi's or Leona's (or both) ultimates won't get blackshielded? They eithe had confidence they will have a better chance at winning if they not risk going for the finish right there, which means they had confidence in a.) they being better than their opponent b.) their opponent will make more mistakes like this. I'm pretty sure 2-3 people were below half hp. Unless my memory fails me.
I don't know, they caught Mundo and killed him for free, and then Gragas, who probably threw a barrel at them. Anyway, ROC's dps was Caitlyn alone, and she had a Lee sin kick and a Morg ult to assist her. Morg would've been blown up if she goes for it (and she would've, since she had to). We'll never know how it would've turned out, someone will analyze it and enlighten us.
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On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed.
If Royal or SKT T1 were put in that situation they would definitely go for finishing rather than just an inhibitor. AP carry died, Mundo died and the whole team were pretty healthy. Actually I believe any top team in Korea/China would do the same thing. That might be a tough turret dive but you cannot expect to win a game from behind without taking any risk.
But I guess we already knew the difference between those regions and eu from the fnatic royal series at worlds.
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On January 17 2014 09:36 Volband wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:30 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:25 fantasticoranges wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. They had like 40 seconds on death timers, and I'm pretty sure most people would've said that was their big chance to win the game. If they messed that up, if anyone called it a bad call, it would've been because of how they played it, not because they made that call. Except in these situations "kinda 40 seconds" and the sub 30 seconds it was in reality on one champion is kinda a big difference. How would they have dived Caitlyn behind the nexus turrets without any ultimates to finsih her off in the few seconds they had? They don't have to dive her, Mundo walks into her face, and 4 people with a rich ADC (it was around the 40minutes mark, right?) can tear two towers apart easily. They had full hp, and Cait had no protection whatsoever. Winning was definetly possible there.
I like how we are calling 2 people from the winning team "no protection at all".
At that point Caitlyn was at full HP, fed as fuck, had 2 summoners ready to go and a Morgana with all CDs ready to peel for her.
Sorry but I don't think you are going to catch Caitlyn behind her nexus towers without their big ticket ultimates (Leona and Vi had used their ults to catch Gragas).
Heck why am I even answering you? Mundo was on Caitlyn's team.
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They dont have to catch anyone. They just need Jinx to shoot down the nexus towers and nexus which are basically made of paper at that stage of the game. They would probably lose most of their team but who cares if they win.
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On January 17 2014 09:40 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:34 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:27 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:24 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. Not really, they've struggled like a whale on the coast until ROC made that chain of mistakes, so it was nowhere near in the air that they could actually overcome them without lucky events like that. After 10 lost team fights in a row, you kinda know that. Butthurt Alliance fans are almost as nice as TSM ones, so whatever. If you are satisfied with their choice, I'm not opposed to it, I mean, they almost managed to chain two ultimates with gigantic cast range. Emphasis on almost. On January 17 2014 09:21 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Worst troll 2014.0/10 Nafta having the same quality arguements as always. Looking forward the NA LCS tomorrow, lol. Wait you were actually serious?LOL How does not trying to end 5v3 show confidence?ROFL They had full hp, and Caitlyn barely tickeled them when she had no frontline to grant her non-stop AAs. I'm fairly positive they could've won that but even if they failed, it would've been damn close. But to answer your question: they had the opportunity to finish. Was that 100%? No, it was not. Was it a double or nothing? Pretty much. Maybe ROC couldn't have pushed them back even if Alliance got aced, but free baron and towers/inhibs for sure, which is gg. Anyway, they said no to the possible game winning play. Now, if you do something like that, you have to have a reason for it. Let's say the tables were turned, and ROC could've done the same at the opposite side. If they actually tried it, I would've called them crazy, because they were winning every single teamfight and skirmish, so there was absolutely no reason for them to risk something like that. If they already won a 100 fights, they'll probably won a 100 more, because their lead has been snowballed constantly, and Alliance looked worse and worse as the time passed. Now back to Alliance's perspective: what on Earth could they possible hope for? Wicked learns to fight? Froggen will magically do something other than being overshadowed by everyone in the game? Vi's or Leona's (or both) ultimates won't get blackshielded? They eithe had confidence they will have a better chance at winning if they not risk going for the finish right there, which means they had confidence in a.) they being better than their opponent b.) their opponent will make more mistakes like this. I really don't think they could've ended but you really give them wayyyyy too much credit to be thinking like that.Even if they could end a team which is 0/3 and losing 4-th game when they were super hyped is just scared to take ANY risks.Anyone who has played in any team based tournament should know that feeling.They were just hoping the enemy team would throw like in solo.
But something's is pretty wrong with that mentality, that the first, and possibly last chance when you could decide how the game ends (one team would've lost there for sure) on your own, you rather pussy out, and hope that the opponent will make more mistakes, because if not, you're done.
What you are talking about is true for close games (or where you have a team comp, that shines with more money/levels, and the opponent falls off), and there are waaaaaaaaaay too many examples where a team got way ahead of themselves, went for the win for no particular reason, and ended up falling behind miserably.
The only thing that changed after that scenario is that Alliance tried to play more aggressively, but they fell on the floor with their faces, when they had to realize 5v5 is not as easy as 5v2.
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On January 17 2014 09:40 Dan HH wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:32 Amethyst21 wrote:
I'm 99% sure Montecristo cursed Alliance when he put them in his top 10 of his power rankings.
Alliance needs a coach/analyst right away (in before Nyph retires to be the analyst and they bring back Kazmitch) I don't think he put Alliance in top 10, but he did put PE very high up and as the highest Chinese team on the list which is possibly equally hilarious
You are right, thanks for the correction!
I guess it was the RIOT internal ranking that put them pretty high. Oh well, only one week.
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On January 17 2014 09:42 Tula wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:36 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:30 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:25 fantasticoranges wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. They had like 40 seconds on death timers, and I'm pretty sure most people would've said that was their big chance to win the game. If they messed that up, if anyone called it a bad call, it would've been because of how they played it, not because they made that call. Except in these situations "kinda 40 seconds" and the sub 30 seconds it was in reality on one champion is kinda a big difference. How would they have dived Caitlyn behind the nexus turrets without any ultimates to finsih her off in the few seconds they had? They don't have to dive her, Mundo walks into her face, and 4 people with a rich ADC (it was around the 40minutes mark, right?) can tear two towers apart easily. They had full hp, and Cait had no protection whatsoever. Winning was definetly possible there. I like how we are calling 2 people from the winning team "no protection at all". At that point Caitlyn was at full HP, fed as fuck, had 2 summoners ready to go and a Morgana with all CDs ready to peel for her. Sorry but I don't think you are going to catch Caitlyn behind her nexus towers without their big ticket ultimates (Leona and Vi had used their ults to catch Gragas). Heck why am I even answering you? Mundo was on Caitlyn's team.
Well sorry, all week long I've been watching Mundos and Shyvanas, they are pretty much the same for me.
They had to kill two towers and the Nexus, not Cait. And don't tell me "but Cait would've slayed them all!", when you can watch the VOD and see how much damage she did when she tried to poke them at her inhib. She had to run 5 meters back after every shot, because Lee and Morg are 0 protections, when 5 people can just jump on your head any time. Yes, Black Shield is pretty awesome, when you have a Gragas, who deals tons of damage and throw people away from you, and you have a Mundo, who chases away the biggest threat(s) on the opponent's team.
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On January 17 2014 09:47 Volband wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:40 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:34 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:27 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:24 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. Not really, they've struggled like a whale on the coast until ROC made that chain of mistakes, so it was nowhere near in the air that they could actually overcome them without lucky events like that. After 10 lost team fights in a row, you kinda know that. Butthurt Alliance fans are almost as nice as TSM ones, so whatever. If you are satisfied with their choice, I'm not opposed to it, I mean, they almost managed to chain two ultimates with gigantic cast range. Emphasis on almost. On January 17 2014 09:21 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Worst troll 2014.0/10 Nafta having the same quality arguements as always. Looking forward the NA LCS tomorrow, lol. Wait you were actually serious?LOL How does not trying to end 5v3 show confidence?ROFL They had full hp, and Caitlyn barely tickeled them when she had no frontline to grant her non-stop AAs. I'm fairly positive they could've won that but even if they failed, it would've been damn close. But to answer your question: they had the opportunity to finish. Was that 100%? No, it was not. Was it a double or nothing? Pretty much. Maybe ROC couldn't have pushed them back even if Alliance got aced, but free baron and towers/inhibs for sure, which is gg. Anyway, they said no to the possible game winning play. Now, if you do something like that, you have to have a reason for it. Let's say the tables were turned, and ROC could've done the same at the opposite side. If they actually tried it, I would've called them crazy, because they were winning every single teamfight and skirmish, so there was absolutely no reason for them to risk something like that. If they already won a 100 fights, they'll probably won a 100 more, because their lead has been snowballed constantly, and Alliance looked worse and worse as the time passed. Now back to Alliance's perspective: what on Earth could they possible hope for? Wicked learns to fight? Froggen will magically do something other than being overshadowed by everyone in the game? Vi's or Leona's (or both) ultimates won't get blackshielded? They eithe had confidence they will have a better chance at winning if they not risk going for the finish right there, which means they had confidence in a.) they being better than their opponent b.) their opponent will make more mistakes like this. I really don't think they could've ended but you really give them wayyyyy too much credit to be thinking like that.Even if they could end a team which is 0/3 and losing 4-th game when they were super hyped is just scared to take ANY risks.Anyone who has played in any team based tournament should know that feeling.They were just hoping the enemy team would throw like in solo. But something's is pretty wrong with that mentality, that the first, and possibly last chance when you could decide how the game ends (one team would've lost there for sure) on your own, you rather pussy out, and hope that the opponent will make more mistakes, because if not, you're done. What you are talking about is true for close games (or where you have a team comp, that shines with more money/levels, and the opponent falls off), and there are waaaaaaaaaay too many examples where a team got way ahead of themselves, went for the win for no particular reason, and ended up falling behind miserably. The only thing that changed after that scenario is that Alliance tried to play more aggressively, but they fell on the floor with their faces, when they had to realize 5v5 is not as easy as 5v2.
No you don't realise that mental state and logic don't go together in situations like these and it is rather obvious that [a] were not playing as good as they could have.Shit goes down like that when a team is new and doesn't have a clearly defined leader or he isn't good at it.Also pretty sure every team thinks they are at the very least contenders for the best.If not they probably won't ever be either.
You keep talking like it was a free win but a 6 item ad with ga a morgana a lee kick/slow to delay could have stopped them easily.They had no ultimates and they would have to focus the morgana so she doesn't stun which is even more delay.
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it was 6item cait with IE, GA and static shiv to clear waves there was no way they could dive her with 2 people up +2 turrets not to mention alliance had no minion wave
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Wow that last Alliance game was so hard to watch when I was rooting for Froggen and friends... No direction at all after laning phase and no cohesiveness in teamfights. They had their chance after catching Mundo and should have all inned the nexus since they knew conventional fights they couldn't win. Sad day, but hopefully as a team they learned a lot from these losses.
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On January 17 2014 09:54 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:47 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:40 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:34 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:27 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:24 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. Not really, they've struggled like a whale on the coast until ROC made that chain of mistakes, so it was nowhere near in the air that they could actually overcome them without lucky events like that. After 10 lost team fights in a row, you kinda know that. Butthurt Alliance fans are almost as nice as TSM ones, so whatever. If you are satisfied with their choice, I'm not opposed to it, I mean, they almost managed to chain two ultimates with gigantic cast range. Emphasis on almost. On January 17 2014 09:21 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Worst troll 2014.0/10 Nafta having the same quality arguements as always. Looking forward the NA LCS tomorrow, lol. Wait you were actually serious?LOL How does not trying to end 5v3 show confidence?ROFL They had full hp, and Caitlyn barely tickeled them when she had no frontline to grant her non-stop AAs. I'm fairly positive they could've won that but even if they failed, it would've been damn close. But to answer your question: they had the opportunity to finish. Was that 100%? No, it was not. Was it a double or nothing? Pretty much. Maybe ROC couldn't have pushed them back even if Alliance got aced, but free baron and towers/inhibs for sure, which is gg. Anyway, they said no to the possible game winning play. Now, if you do something like that, you have to have a reason for it. Let's say the tables were turned, and ROC could've done the same at the opposite side. If they actually tried it, I would've called them crazy, because they were winning every single teamfight and skirmish, so there was absolutely no reason for them to risk something like that. If they already won a 100 fights, they'll probably won a 100 more, because their lead has been snowballed constantly, and Alliance looked worse and worse as the time passed. Now back to Alliance's perspective: what on Earth could they possible hope for? Wicked learns to fight? Froggen will magically do something other than being overshadowed by everyone in the game? Vi's or Leona's (or both) ultimates won't get blackshielded? They eithe had confidence they will have a better chance at winning if they not risk going for the finish right there, which means they had confidence in a.) they being better than their opponent b.) their opponent will make more mistakes like this. I really don't think they could've ended but you really give them wayyyyy too much credit to be thinking like that.Even if they could end a team which is 0/3 and losing 4-th game when they were super hyped is just scared to take ANY risks.Anyone who has played in any team based tournament should know that feeling.They were just hoping the enemy team would throw like in solo. But something's is pretty wrong with that mentality, that the first, and possibly last chance when you could decide how the game ends (one team would've lost there for sure) on your own, you rather pussy out, and hope that the opponent will make more mistakes, because if not, you're done. What you are talking about is true for close games (or where you have a team comp, that shines with more money/levels, and the opponent falls off), and there are waaaaaaaaaay too many examples where a team got way ahead of themselves, went for the win for no particular reason, and ended up falling behind miserably. The only thing that changed after that scenario is that Alliance tried to play more aggressively, but they fell on the floor with their faces, when they had to realize 5v5 is not as easy as 5v2. No you don't realise that mental state and logic don't go together in situations like these and it is rather obvious that [a] were not playing as good as they could have.Shit goes down like that when a team is new and doesn't have a clearly defined leader or he isn't good at it.Also pretty sure every team thinks they are at the very least contenders for the best.If not they probably won't ever be either. You keep talking like it was a free win but a 6 item ad with ga a morgana a lee kick/slow to delay could have stopped them easily.They had no ultimates and they would have to focus the morgana so she doesn't stun which is even more delay.
Not a free win, but I'd definetly put around 50%. If you think that's not high enough, watch the final fight, where Cait didn't even got a BS I believe, she could only flash out, because the Leona ult was too late. Anyway, after they couldn'T instagib her (hell, couldn't even lock her) with mistakes being made on ROC's side, the teamfight went on like A had a 20k gold deficit, it was that one sided. Sure, you could say they did not see the future, but the wounds of past battles had to be on their minds vividly.
All in all, in my eyes not going for that play KNOWING THEIR SITUATION implies they have much much much more problems to sort out. If they can't beat Mill next week, heads will have to fall.
On January 17 2014 09:54 kongoline wrote:
it was 6item cait with IE, GA and static shiv to clear waves there was no way they could dive her with 2 people up +2 turrets not to mention alliance had no minion wave
On January 17 2014 09:46 Hagen0 wrote:
They dont have to catch anyone. They just need Jinx to shoot down the nexus towers and nexus which are basically made of paper at that stage of the game. They would probably lose most of their team but who cares if they win.
Exactly. Everyone but Jinx was expendable, and she is exceptionally good at taking towers with stacking her Q. We can argue all day long whether they could've actually finish it, or the Nexus would've survived with a 100hp, we will never know, but I don't think you can deny that it was a realistic scenario to try and finish it there. If Mundo or Gragas were alive instead of Morg or Lee, Alliance's chances would've been abyssmal, but they just happened to fish out 2 out of the 3 most important guys in defending a base.
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On January 17 2014 09:40 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:34 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:27 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:24 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. Not really, they've struggled like a whale on the coast until ROC made that chain of mistakes, so it was nowhere near in the air that they could actually overcome them without lucky events like that. After 10 lost team fights in a row, you kinda know that. Butthurt Alliance fans are almost as nice as TSM ones, so whatever. If you are satisfied with their choice, I'm not opposed to it, I mean, they almost managed to chain two ultimates with gigantic cast range. Emphasis on almost. On January 17 2014 09:21 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Worst troll 2014.0/10 Nafta having the same quality arguements as always. Looking forward the NA LCS tomorrow, lol. Wait you were actually serious?LOL How does not trying to end 5v3 show confidence?ROFL They had full hp, and Caitlyn barely tickeled them when she had no frontline to grant her non-stop AAs. I'm fairly positive they could've won that but even if they failed, it would've been damn close. But to answer your question: they had the opportunity to finish. Was that 100%? No, it was not. Was it a double or nothing? Pretty much. Maybe ROC couldn't have pushed them back even if Alliance got aced, but free baron and towers/inhibs for sure, which is gg. Anyway, they said no to the possible game winning play. Now, if you do something like that, you have to have a reason for it. Let's say the tables were turned, and ROC could've done the same at the opposite side. If they actually tried it, I would've called them crazy, because they were winning every single teamfight and skirmish, so there was absolutely no reason for them to risk something like that. If they already won a 100 fights, they'll probably won a 100 more, because their lead has been snowballed constantly, and Alliance looked worse and worse as the time passed. Now back to Alliance's perspective: what on Earth could they possible hope for? Wicked learns to fight? Froggen will magically do something other than being overshadowed by everyone in the game? Vi's or Leona's (or both) ultimates won't get blackshielded? They eithe had confidence they will have a better chance at winning if they not risk going for the finish right there, which means they had confidence in a.) they being better than their opponent b.) their opponent will make more mistakes like this. I really don't think they could've ended but you really give them wayyyyy too much credit to be thinking like that.Even if they could end a team which is 0/3 and losing 4-th game when they were super hyped is just scared to take ANY risks.Anyone who has played in any team based tournament should know that feeling.They were just hoping the enemy team would throw like in solo.
Yup, I agree with that. They were so scared they didn't even try to pressure the nexus. As soon as the inhib was dead they just backed. With 40 secs on the opponent's solo laners they easily can poke a bit, hit the towers couple of times(or even kill a tower) and maybe force a mistake from lee sin or cait and finish the game there.
Also Wickd was playing so scared in team fights, even in the last fight he was full hp and last alive... And that is their tank and secondary initiator.
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They have a 5 item jinx, a 5 item ziggs with sheen iirc and passive, a super tanky shyvana with warmog. You do not have to dive caitlyn, You only have to attack the tower and kill any champion who dive in and try to interrupt you. Even if you fail to finish the game, you wont lose the game if you can get one or two kills there.
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On January 17 2014 10:09 Pr0wler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:40 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:34 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:27 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:24 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:21 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Yeah sure. I bet you would have been the first one to scold them for the "retarded call" if they had gone for the finish and had failed. Not really, they've struggled like a whale on the coast until ROC made that chain of mistakes, so it was nowhere near in the air that they could actually overcome them without lucky events like that. After 10 lost team fights in a row, you kinda know that. Butthurt Alliance fans are almost as nice as TSM ones, so whatever. If you are satisfied with their choice, I'm not opposed to it, I mean, they almost managed to chain two ultimates with gigantic cast range. Emphasis on almost. On January 17 2014 09:21 nafta wrote:On January 17 2014 09:18 Volband wrote:On January 17 2014 09:14 Redox wrote:On January 17 2014 09:12 Volband wrote:
I like how Alliance had the confidence that they felt they don't have to do double or nothing when they could finish the game. They are not just bad, but delusional too.
Lol you are incredibly delusional when you were able to spot confidence anywhere in Alliance's play. So what do you call that when you don't go for the finish, because you believe you'll not only have another shot at winning a game, but probably an even more preferrable one? It's either faith or confidence, and I did not see many crosses hanging aroung their necks, so I assume the latter. There's still the joker option that they are stupdid and didn't even realize they could finish, but I doubt that one. Worst troll 2014.0/10 Nafta having the same quality arguements as always. Looking forward the NA LCS tomorrow, lol. Wait you were actually serious?LOL How does not trying to end 5v3 show confidence?ROFL They had full hp, and Caitlyn barely tickeled them when she had no frontline to grant her non-stop AAs. I'm fairly positive they could've won that but even if they failed, it would've been damn close. But to answer your question: they had the opportunity to finish. Was that 100%? No, it was not. Was it a double or nothing? Pretty much. Maybe ROC couldn't have pushed them back even if Alliance got aced, but free baron and towers/inhibs for sure, which is gg. Anyway, they said no to the possible game winning play. Now, if you do something like that, you have to have a reason for it. Let's say the tables were turned, and ROC could've done the same at the opposite side. If they actually tried it, I would've called them crazy, because they were winning every single teamfight and skirmish, so there was absolutely no reason for them to risk something like that. If they already won a 100 fights, they'll probably won a 100 more, because their lead has been snowballed constantly, and Alliance looked worse and worse as the time passed. Now back to Alliance's perspective: what on Earth could they possible hope for? Wicked learns to fight? Froggen will magically do something other than being overshadowed by everyone in the game? Vi's or Leona's (or both) ultimates won't get blackshielded? They eithe had confidence they will have a better chance at winning if they not risk going for the finish right there, which means they had confidence in a.) they being better than their opponent b.) their opponent will make more mistakes like this. I really don't think they could've ended but you really give them wayyyyy too much credit to be thinking like that.Even if they could end a team which is 0/3 and losing 4-th game when they were super hyped is just scared to take ANY risks.Anyone who has played in any team based tournament should know that feeling.They were just hoping the enemy team would throw like in solo. Yup, I agree with that. They were so scared they didn't even try to pressure the nexus. As soon as the inhib was dead they just backed. With 40 secs on the opponent's solo laners they easily can poke a bit, hit the towers couple of times(or even kill a tower) and maybe force a mistake from lee sin or cait and finish the game there. Also Wickd was playing so scared in team fights, even in the last fight he was full hp and last alive... And that is their tank and secondary initiator.
It's good you bring up this point, I didn't even think of it. What you just said was pretty much a MUST for Alliance, since they could lose nothing with trying to take towers, or spend 5-10 seconds to "feel out" whether they should go for it or not - though I'm still convinced that with a decent leader they would've went berzerk mode and probably win it.
On January 17 2014 10:09 lega wrote:
They have a 5 item jinx, a 5 item ziggs with sheen iirc and passive, a super tanky shyvana with warmog. You do not have to dive caitlyn, You only have to attack the tower and kill any champion who dive in and try to interrupt you. Even if you fail to finish the game, you wont lose the game if you can get one or two kills there.
The problem with this, is that they didn't really have time to deal with the defenders as a 5 man army. 35 seconds is not that much, and they probably had to sack all of their players to do dps to the nexus, which means win the game or get aced badly. The safe way was to poke and try to take towers, the ballsy play was to go all the way, but I don't think there was a B plan if they went for the latter. 50 sec death timers with just 1 inhib down on your side is a free baron, dragon and some towers, and it's just too much, especially since they were behind to begin with.
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The land of freedom23126 Posts
On January 17 2014 09:48 Amethyst21 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 09:40 Dan HH wrote:On January 17 2014 09:32 Amethyst21 wrote:
I'm 99% sure Montecristo cursed Alliance when he put them in his top 10 of his power rankings.
Alliance needs a coach/analyst right away (in before Nyph retires to be the analyst and they bring back Kazmitch) I don't think he put Alliance in top 10, but he did put PE very high up and as the highest Chinese team on the list which is possibly equally hilarious You are right, thanks for the correction! I guess it was the RIOT internal ranking that put them pretty high. Oh well, only one week.
It's not.
Monte just predicted them to win Spring Split.
There is no [A] in Riot PowerRank.
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It is already 40 min in the game. In soloq I once even finished the double turret and nexus in 20 sec as an ezreal alone , though I had (no super) minions with me. Both ziggs and jinx are better turret taker than ezreal.
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So much for super team.
Losing to Fnatic is no shame, but losing to two challenger teams is really meh. I feel Wicked and Tabzz are really really bad.
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EPT
