[Champion] Viktor - Page 17

jcarlsoniv

United States27922 Posts

February 27 2015 15:56 GMT

#321

Rylai's is not even remotely close to core. Lichbane is an item I really like having, but I can rarely convince myself to get it earlier than 6th item, and even then, it's kinda "win more".

Been looking through Kuro's past Viktor games after he picked Viktor in LCK today. Gonna try out these runes (I have the page, just haven't been using it on Viktor) and build paths:

http://www.probuilds.net/kuro

He gets Aug 2 before building other damage items, and he does not get Morello's.

Alaric

France45622 Posts

February 27 2015 17:45 GMT

#322

I'd like to see their playstyles too, but spectating them isn't exactly easy I assume.
Faker goes scaling CDR blues and Augments E before building Grail for near-max CDR (effectively maxed when he gets blue).

Kuro gets either scaling AP blues, or flat MR, depending on match-up. He also seemed to take Cleanse against support Veigar rather than Lissandra.
Not sure about Abyssal, he takes it even against a Lulu/support Morgana/Kog'Maw line-up that will outrange the aura.

I don't see the point of what looks like a level 8-9 Augment, where he spends 1k for under 30 AP, 150 mana, and the augmented Q. It's clearly cost-inefficient.

It looks like you'd want to brawl, taking Ghost, a fast completed Hexcore for the faster ult, and Abyssal, trying to stay near people to maximise the ult damage. My own style is closer to "poke until an ult-E can kill them in less than 2s worth of ult ticks" because it's so unreliable to try and get the 7s of damage. Apparently that's what he does in fights though? I'd be curious to see his games.

mordek

United States12705 Posts

February 27 2015 18:05 GMT

#323

On February 28 2015 00:56 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Rylai's is not even remotely close to core. Lichbane is an item I really like having, but I can rarely convince myself to get it earlier than 6th item, and even then, it's kinda "win more".

Been looking through Kuro's past Viktor games after he picked Viktor in LCK today. Gonna try out these runes (I have the page, just haven't been using it on Viktor) and build paths:

http://www.probuilds.net/kuro

He gets Aug 2 before building other damage items, and he does not get Morello's.

Any thoughts on Ghost?

jcarlsoniv

United States27922 Posts

February 27 2015 18:36 GMT

#324

On February 28 2015 03:05 mordek wrote:

Show nested quote +

Any thoughts on Ghost?

Definitely seems interesting and I want to try it. I know I'll fuck up a lot thinking I have ignite, but it seems nice to stick to targets with chaos storm (especially with full Augment speed storm), and it also helps make up for low move speed.

jcarlsoniv

United States27922 Posts

February 28 2015 00:05 GMT

#325

Based on preliminary test (1 game) - I really fucking like Ghost

Goumindong

United States3529 Posts

February 28 2015 00:14 GMT

#326

He wasn't very effective in that game. It was seen mainly as a troll pick against a weaker team

Rylai's is the most efficient AP item in the game for raw stats, and Viktor can use all parts of it(the slow, the HP, and the AP). The extra HP gives him ways to bully that he otherwise would not be able to due to his very low stats and the slow gives you the advantage of Q augment without buying the really inefficient item. Its super useful on him.

SHr3DD3r

Pakistan2137 Posts

February 28 2015 00:27 GMT

#327

I wouldn't make rylais a part of the core item build. But as a situational item for sure. Like vs assasins vs some kitable tankline etc.

And Lichbane is an amazing item but as soniv mentioned, not too sure when to actually get it. I think it would be good vs ezreal mid

Viktor spam incoming

Goumindong

United States3529 Posts

February 28 2015 01:05 GMT

#328

Lichbane does less damage than Voidstaff and Deathcap for your combo.(unless you get two Q's per E and don't have ult) So there isn't much point in getting it before them. Get it after Void/Cap if you are looking for a third pure damage item. Its OK to get a sheen and sit on it due to the bonus damage application being magic.

jcarlsoniv

United States27922 Posts

February 28 2015 01:39 GMT

#329

I'm not saying they're bad items on Viktor, they're not. But they are not core. Shr3dd3r is correct in saying they are situational.

Goumindong

United States3529 Posts

February 28 2015 06:54 GMT

#330

Try Rylai's as a first item for me.

jcarlsoniv

United States27922 Posts

February 28 2015 16:52 GMT

#331

mordek

United States12705 Posts

March 01 2015 01:17 GMT

#332

On March 01 2015 01:52 jcarlsoniv wrote:
no

How about for me?

Frudgey

Canada3367 Posts

March 01 2015 06:25 GMT

#333

On February 28 2015 09:05 jcarlsoniv wrote:
Based on preliminary test (1 game) - I really fucking like Ghost

So I'm certainly not a Viktor player (and I can't even claim to be a mid player), but I can say that I really, really like ghost. I actually run Ghost + Ignite on Darius instead of Flash + Ignite.

And I think that for Viktor at least, I think Flash + Ghost is really powerful. I know you're giving up quite a bit of kill power by not having ignite, but I don't think that you'll always be in range to get that ignite off.

Furthermore, increased movement speed for 10 seconds is really strong in my opinion. Especially when you're playing top lane, I think in some circumstances ghost can save you where flash can't. Also popping Ghost during a team fight or just before a team fight can help your positioning immensely or even reach the team fight on time (Not that you have that problem in your ELO).

I just think Ghost has much more utility than Ignite on Viktor, but I'm not a Viktor player so forgive me if I spoke out of my element.

Alaric

France45622 Posts

March 01 2015 13:16 GMT

#334

Don't you get 5% MS per enemy affected by your passive as Darius? So easily 10-15% in teamfights, and even the 5% is huge, it's like having MS quints anytime you hit a Q in lane, makes for strong level 1 if you hit a blade Q and walk into melee because you can chase them down if you're stronger.
Also the strength of Flash-Apprehend.

Viktor's base MS isn't as good, and a lot of his power is tied to his ult's churning damage, he also lacks both tankiness and escapes.

Positioning is a big draw though, mostly because Viktor's ult's range is so low. You can't get too close for fear of being picked off, but when your frontline initiates at a distance (like a Malphite or J4) you often end up having to Flash-ult to make sure you get the burst off.

Frudgey

Canada3367 Posts

March 01 2015 17:35 GMT

#335

The other thing I wanted to mention about Ghost, and why I like it more than Flash is because of it's lower cooldown. Having Ghost every three minutes and thirty seconds can really mean a lot, especially when you're someone like Viktor who has no escapes. But if you're playing him in the midlane, Ghost might not always be necessary as the lane is so short.

Alaric I would love to fiercely debate Ghost versus Flash on Darius with you, but this isn't the place to do it!

jcarlsoniv

United States27922 Posts

March 01 2015 22:05 GMT

#336

I agree with you Frudgey. If anything, not having ignite makes me play a little smarter rather than always balls to the walls aggro.

I even like Ghost mid, and I've taken Cleanse a few times where their team has a lot of CC that is super punishing (Morgana binding or Xerath stun or Ahri charm with the right comp = auto death)

sob3k

United States7572 Posts

March 01 2015 22:47 GMT

#337

I've played so much mid/jungle that I literally can't play anything other than ignite or smite. I run ignite on support because my brain just doesn't understand what exhaust is and I either never use it or only use it in the most stupid obvious situations when I can think about it for days. I'm way more effective with ignite because I just automatically use it at a certain hp threshhold lol.

Apoptotic

United States137 Posts

March 02 2015 00:57 GMT

#338

I feel like Flash is generally mandatory. The last summoner I change depending on the team. Versus heavy CC I play with Cleanse, versus big burst I play Barrier. Ghost if I wanna run around a lot, etc.

One of the things I'm still figuring out is when the best time to upgrade the rest of the trinkets. My build is generally Dorans 2pots -> Dorans + 1st Augment and from here it varies a lot. The last few games I've played I haven't upgraded my augment till after my first two big items. When are you guys upgrading yours? And does everyone upgrade in the order E > Q > W?

jcarlsoniv

United States27922 Posts

March 02 2015 02:52 GMT

#339

E > Q > W for aug, yes

There's no need to get a 2nd Doran's, you want to get that E aug as soon as possible (which you should have at lvl 5 if you're csing properly). I've been experimenting getting 2nd aug after my first mid tier item (seeker's or codex) and after my first full item (Morello or Zhonya). The third one is a bit weird for me still, but I've kinda been liking getting it right after aug 2 or after the next item. Having speed storm is nice.

Apoptotic

United States137 Posts

March 02 2015 04:08 GMT

#340

Whelp I guess I'm just not csing properly ahaha thanks for the help. I'll give your build orders a run tonight

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