|
On May 18 2015 20:58 Nyast wrote:- it's OP in PvT vs bio - it's average in PvZ ( mostly good for harass and early pressure ) - it's annoying in PvP ( because it dictates the builds ) Now clearly, if the adept is buffed, I don't see how Terrans are gonna survive. If the adept is nerfed, I don't see how Protoss can do well in PvZ. It looks tricky no matter what Blizzard chooses to do 
Totally agree
|
P should not have to rely on the adept being close to broken (to the point it restricts PvP hugely). As long as the lurker will outrange the colossus, PvZ will be a bad match-up anyway.
|
On May 30 2015 05:30 [PkF] Wire wrote:
P should not have to rely on the adept being close to broken (to the point it restricts PvP hugely). As long as the lurker will outrange the colossus, PvZ will be a bad match-up anyway.
Do you think that the collossus provided great games? They should just scrap the unit entirely and come up with something new such as buffing storm or introducing the reaver.
|
On May 30 2015 05:30 [PkF] Wire wrote:
P should not have to rely on the adept being close to broken (to the point it restricts PvP hugely). As long as the lurker will outrange the colossus, PvZ will be a bad match-up anyway.
I think that this is not all about Adepts being a bit OP that obviously are in a bad state, because they are ridiculously tanky and based hardcuontering, but their poor weapon desing, inneficient at dealing damage. . Adepts have an added problem now which is the shadow mechanic, that makes them a very strong early game harass. Harass + high HP = problems.
Adepts are a good introduction specially to deal with bio, but they carry some design problems and Blizz seems to like the idea of letting Adepts get all the buffs that should be a general Gateway buff.
I think that on Adepts, shooting very slow with high damage is stupid on a unit that is supposed to counter masses of cheap units (Marines), something that made them stupdily innefficent with no place in the meta, so as Devs have that very beautiful minds, they gave us 230 max HP on a basic unit. And the fun fact is that designing a good early game unit with some extra late-game utility wasn't that hard: just look at Marauders. Consistent damage, good mobility.
Adepts are a try to have 1 solution to various problems of Protoss and they simply overbuffed it. . IMAO, less health, more speed, lowered damage and much more faster attack speed (same DPS or a bit more) would lead us to better rounded Adepts,and the shade mechanic delayed and with some extra on it (shield heal, bonus damage after teleport, etc).
We might see then much more micro involved and Banelings being a more decent unit in ZvP.
Part of the problem of Protoss in PvZ is the absolute dependency on Forcefields to fight, and the overpriced Immortal. Now that Zergs have 2 mid-game counters to the Protoss Deathballs (Mass Sentry Stalker/ Colossi Deathball) with Ravagers and Lurkers, and Immortals have been nerfed on the long run vs Roaches. PvZ is going to be shit unless they change all 4 units to allow more tradings between Zerg and Protoss armies without massforcefields or heavy snowball.
|
On May 31 2015 20:56 B-royal wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2015 05:30 [PkF] Wire wrote:
P should not have to rely on the adept being close to broken (to the point it restricts PvP hugely). As long as the lurker will outrange the colossus, PvZ will be a bad match-up anyway. Do you think that the collossus provided great games? They should just scrap the unit entirely and come up with something new such as buffing storm or introducing the reaver.
Disruptor > Reaver. Disruptor is a controlable huge scarab. Why Reaver?
Disruptor is pure micro from both parts. Reavers just shoot and deal splash damage with it. No counterplay.
Even if I think that Reavers are much more what Protoss need, Disruptors provide more interesting interactions IMAO.
|
On May 30 2015 05:30 [PkF] Wire wrote:
P should not have to rely on the adept being close to broken (to the point it restricts PvP hugely). As long as the lurker will outrange the colossus, PvZ will be a bad match-up anyway.
I'm really curious to see how top koreans tosses will deal with lurkers. Lurkers outrange colossus and shoot through forcefields. I can't deal with them without air based compositions.
And two or three burrowed lurkers can save one expansion from any amount of zealot harass. Snute will have a nice time turtling with them.
|
Most of new additions are problematic and should get the hammer like the ravager did (OK, maybe not as harsh as the ravager). Lurkers, 8 armor ultras, cyclones, disruptors, adepts... are just frustrating and restricting in their current state. And they said they wanted to move away from hardcounters, from "A builds X -> B builds Y", from stale match-ups and unforgiving units... LotV is, at the moment at least, just going the opposite way.
|
drop.sc links arent working, mind if we get the replays via another source?
|
I'll PM them to you when I get a hand on my computer 
|
tsssss but ravagers had to be nerfed to unusable since there were "some strong early game builds"...
|
Unfortunately for me... you 3-0ed me on ladder with this. It feels demoralizing honestly don't know what to do against it LOL
|
Haha most of the pros and good players are used to this by now. When I have time I'll upload some replays of me losing.
|
On July 06 2015 23:14 Geiko wrote:
Haha most of the pros and good players are used to this by now. When I have time I'll upload some replays of me losing.
Or maybe your skill deficit is not enough anymore to win versus pro players. This says nothing about the actual state of adepts at pro level..
|
On July 20 2015 22:51 B-royal wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2015 23:14 Geiko wrote:
Haha most of the pros and good players are used to this by now. When I have time I'll upload some replays of me losing. Or maybe your skill deficit is not enough anymore to win versus pro players. This says nothing about the actual state of adepts at pro level..
This, though it seems adepts are definitely counterable and make gateway armies really solid and viable. I really disliked them initially but I think they're a great addition.
Though... WHY DO THE FREAKIN SHADES GO PAST FORCEFIELDS ? They should behave like mineral walking probes I think. Would make adept wars soooooo much easier to manage in PvP.
|
I don't think 1 base plays are very good vs terran and zerg just like they aren't in hots. Terran players can wall off their main preventing adepts from entering, whereas zerg players can rely on queens and eventually roaches (adepts alone suck against them).
Personally I got to top 16 GM very easily by doing 2 base adept builds vs terran and zerg. Against terran I usually load up 4 adepts in a warp prism and then start spamming adepts in the terran's base off of 7-8 warpgates. Against zerg I go for warp prism adept/sentry harass into immortal/adept/sentry all in.
It's rare to find Protoss opponents but I had lots of free wins against adepts with proxy stargate, since it's also harder to scout in LotV compared to hots (you can do it with the 3rd pylon at the same timing).
|
On July 20 2015 22:59 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2015 22:51 B-royal wrote:On July 06 2015 23:14 Geiko wrote:
Haha most of the pros and good players are used to this by now. When I have time I'll upload some replays of me losing. Or maybe your skill deficit is not enough anymore to win versus pro players. This says nothing about the actual state of adepts at pro level.. This, though it seems adepts are definitely counterable and make gateway armies really solid and viable. I really disliked them initially but I think they're a great addition. Though... WHY DO THE FREAKIN SHADES GO PAST FORCEFIELDS ? They should behave like mineral walking probes I think. Would make adept wars soooooo much easier to manage in PvP.
Just let them behave like normal units in their pathing to begin with. I block them, well that's it you've been outmicroed, time to cancel the shade.
Then also add the ability to insta-teleport to them. More possibilities for both sides.
|
Adepts are imba, they will be nerfed soon i'm sure, they are too strong and also too cheap.
|
On July 21 2015 04:05 GGzerG wrote:
Adepts are imba, they will be nerfed soon i'm sure, they are too strong and also too cheap.
Playing against Protoss right now:
Question (1): Does he make adepts?
Question (2): Does he have Carriers yet?
Question (3): Just kidding, your opponent has probably left already.
|
I blind bunker at ramp and in base natural vs protoss every game because of adept openings -_-
|
On July 21 2015 04:20 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2015 04:05 GGzerG wrote:
Adepts are imba, they will be nerfed soon i'm sure, they are too strong and also too cheap. Playing against Protoss right now: Question (1): Does he make adepts? Question (2): Does he have Carriers yet? Question (3): Just kidding, your opponent has probably left already.
I do all 3.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
