[Patch 3.10: Yimake Patch] General Discussion - Page 237

On August 14 2013 00:25 The_Unseen wrote:
Haha I've been hearing about them hackzor skins for a while now, what are they and what makes them so imba in game actually?

On August 14 2013 00:42 mr_tolkien wrote:
Ok, just did a pretty long theorycraft session on Kayle.

Nashor's tooth is pretty bad on her outside of the CDR it gives.
Lichbane is pretty awesome if you can proc it multiple times with your heal. And ofc the AS means a lot to her.
Guinsoo is nice but doesn't augment her damage that much. Only the 2nd passive is really useful.
DFG is awesome if you can DFG/Q/auto for the remaing seconds of DFG active.
Rabadon is not to be rushed at all.

EDIT : the page with all the calculations https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApcDmhu0hIeddGJaQUxJVXZwU2JVWHpla1Via0ZaZnc#gid=0

On August 14 2013 00:48 beefhamburger wrote:

How do/would you calculate Nashor's efficiency with her E on?

On August 14 2013 00:50 mr_tolkien wrote:

Well just look at the formulas, I took it into account.

The biggest shortcut I took was making it like Wits end had 25 Mpen instead of really calculating it for every hit, but even like this it's shit on Kayle.

For Lich bane, I calculated that you could count 1 proc for each Q + 1 for the heal.

On August 14 2013 00:50 mr_tolkien wrote:

Well just look at the formulas, I took it into account.

The biggest shortcut I took was making it like Wits end had 25 Mpen instead of really calculating it for every hit, but even like this it's shit on Kayle.

For Lich bane, I calculated that you could count 1 proc for each Q + 1 for the heal.

On August 14 2013 01:11 Seuss wrote:


Your spreadsheet is, unfortunately, about as intuitive as golf fashion.

For example, what's going on in columns E and F starting at row 29? You've got some sort of item combinations in column D, but nothing to indicate where or how you got the numbers to the right or what they mean.

To the best of my ability to tell it looks like your spreadsheet is designed to make one calculation at a time, which you've done and recorded the values. I'm pretty sure anyone who isn't familiar with making spreadsheets for the purposes of theorycraft would never figure that out, let alone locate your formula.

Aside from aesthetics, I have one mathematical criticism of your spreadsheet. First, your auto-attack calculation is incorrect. The number of auto-attacks a champion can perform in X seconds is X*AS+1, as you get a free auto-attack at T-0:00. Second, you're assuming only 4 seconds of time for auto-attacks, but at the same time assume that Kayle will be able to Q twice. The minimum cooldown for Q is 4.8 seconds with maximum CDR, which means you're leaving 0.8-4 seconds of potential auto-attack time unaccounted for. This also ignores the potential for Kayle to continue auto-attacking after the second Q. In short, whatever scenario it is you've cooked up, regardless of how practical it may or may not be, devalues auto-attacking significantly (i.e. it's absolutely no surprise that Nashor's and Wit's End perform poorly).

On August 14 2013 00:53 nyxnyxnyx wrote:
OP skins

iBlitzcrank, hook animation makes it harder to dodge
Blackthorn Morgana, Dark Binding has no directional facing (usually it's =) but Blackthorn's Q is just an O)
Mecha-Kha'zix, Void Spikes harder to dodge due to the twisty missile thingy
Monarch Kog'maw, occasionally flies up which throws off people trying to aim skillshots on you
Astronaut Teemo, little side-to-side jaunt while walking, see above

On August 14 2013 01:30 AsmodeusXI wrote:


Isn't there something where Blood Lord Vlad (or w/e) has better auto/spell animations?

On August 14 2013 01:29 mr_tolkien wrote:

You realize I changed the auto attack/Q numbers quite a large amount of times right ? Indeed though, I didn't take the first auto into account, and that's a pretty big problem.

And yeah I just linked the spreadshit so you can locate the formula, not for further use. I have other things to do than work on layout for a freaking maths page. It's pretty easy to use for me, so that's pretty much what matters.

EDIT : Full AD is not really worth though, since your laning will be pretty bad, as well as your teamfights (how do you buy CDR in a pure AD build ?). From a pure afk-auto DPS ofc it's better.

On August 13 2013 20:33 JonGalt wrote:
@Whoever was talking about Shyv lvl 2 all in:

EQ = 358 + 8% max opponent hp
WQ = 453

Both assume 4 autos. However, you have to consider that WQ assumes they stood in your burnout for the full duration of 7 seconds.

I want Shyv to see more play.

On August 14 2013 01:49 Seuss wrote:


Freudian slip or ingenious term?

I know you changed around the Auto/Q numbers. My concern was with your methodology, not the specific numbers you used. I want to know how you decided those numbers were appropriate, because without context they seem unreasonable.

On August 13 2013 13:09 Gahlo wrote:

Mallet builds from Belt, Ruby, Pickaxe according to Surr@20

What I want to know is if Phage will build into a dedicated AD/Armor item now.

On August 13 2013 23:22 Capped wrote:
So i was thinking about buying a toplaner but i already have a ton of top laners that i just never learnt to play properly that are completely viable but i dont own enough mids, especially assassins. (My mid pool consists of Morg, Lux + Ahri / cassio if i have to.)

I was looking at Talon, who is viable for both mid and top or is there a better option for assassin i know talon doesnt really qualify as one I mean there is Zed, but he just seems meh. Doesnt really need to be a top laner too so i guess i can take my pick of assassins.

What should i buy to learn how to play assassins + they are a solid pick?

On August 14 2013 02:13 mr_tolkien wrote:

Well most of the time I worked with 2 Qs/5s autos. But indeed it lacks 1 auto which might make Nash better.

From my games with Kayle though, you very rarely have the occasion to auto anybody more than 5s. Being bursty is a good thing on her.

On August 14 2013 02:16 Ghost-z wrote:


I would love if they rework Atma's to build out of the new phage.