• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 03:11
CEST 09:11
KST 16:11
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon9[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent10Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12[ASL20] Ro24 Preview Pt2: Take-Off7[ASL20] Ro24 Preview Pt1: Runway13
Community News
SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia7Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues24LiuLi Cup - September 2025 Tournaments3Weekly Cups (August 25-31): Clem's Last Straw?39Weekly Cups (Aug 18-24): herO dethrones MaxPax6
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon What happened to Singapore/Brazil servers?
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia LANified! 37: Groundswell, BYOC LAN, Nov 28-30 2025 LiuLi Cup - September 2025 Tournaments
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around Mutation # 487 Think Fast
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams ASL20 General Discussion alas... i aint gon' lie to u bruh...
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro16 Group B SC4ALL $1,500 Open Bracket LAN CPL12 SIGN UP are open!!! [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile General RTS Discussion Thread Borderlands 3
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Effective ED Solutions for Better Relationships Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Personality of a Spender…
TrAiDoS
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
RTS Design in Hypercoven
a11
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1545 users

[Patch 3.10: Yimake Patch] General Discussion - Page 137

Forum Index > LoL General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 135 136 137 138 139 331 Next
No more bad posting
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-06 20:30:41
August 06 2013 20:30 GMT
#2721
As an interesting note; what is wrong with having a support that becomes very effective at level 6 just take double golems (on blue or lane swapped purple) with a machete every time they spawn, giving the ad more levels, the support more levels (and more gold after a few minutes), provided the AD can actually lane solo for 10-20 seconds at a time.
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-06 20:34:06
August 06 2013 20:32 GMT
#2722
You'd be surprised at how many AD's die in the 5-10 seconds when the support goes to ward the river.

EDIT: A Yi with Zilean bomb and Zilean ult on him seems pretty potent. Still, this strategy applies to Yi as a melee carry only cuz he's ridiculously strong right now.
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
August 06 2013 20:32 GMT
#2723
On August 07 2013 05:27 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:23 Slusher wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:21 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:20 Slusher wrote:
on topic,

ever since New Yi came out I can't help but think of the old Najin Sword strat with Zilian/Jax, only perhaps running Mid Zilian with Jungle Yi, the synergy seems super high right down to Zilian being able transition into a support farm role after the lane phase. I really want to play it but nobody I play with is a Zilian player.

Maybe Janna mid? similar farm allocation like in VES's jungle ez/janna mid strat.


Zilian revive and zilian slow are too core to the strat.

I was thinking like

1:Yi
2:Ashe/Varus
3:Shen/Zac/Renek
4ilian
5:Nami/Zyra

I don't see why Zilian is core to the strat? Revive is nice, but Jannas ability to peel, and crowd control is nothing to scoff at just for a revive.
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:26 Requizen wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:25 kainzero wrote:
I saw jungle Yorick in LPL last weekend. Is that a thing now? I thought it was kinda weird.

Yorick should not be a "thing". Not top, not in jungle, nowhere.

I not mad.
But I mad.

I don't know think you have a word in this. TEEMO PLAYER.


the idea is similar to the feed the kha'zix strat people would run back when his W was OP, mass cc + Yi. The importance of Zilian is because he can produce a psudeo Invunerability for Yi, and unlike kayle has other useful abilities with bad farm.
Carrilord has arrived.
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
August 06 2013 20:32 GMT
#2724
Other than zyra and nunu I don't know of many other supports that can do that without drinking 50 pots.
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-06 20:34:36
August 06 2013 20:32 GMT
#2725
On August 07 2013 05:32 ticklishmusic wrote:
You'd be surprised at how many AD's die in the 5-10 seconds when the support goes to ward the river.

Well as a solo queue thing it seems bad because you can't trust AD players especially ones with CLG flair, but in organized play it seems definitely do-able.

On August 07 2013 05:32 nafta wrote:
Other than zyra and nunu I don't know of many other supports that can do that without drinking 50 pots.

zyra nunu raka taric thresh elise fiddle kayle lulu all can do it pretty easily with a machete. some aren't used as supports much anymore though.
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-06 20:34:24
August 06 2013 20:34 GMT
#2726
On August 07 2013 05:32 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:32 ticklishmusic wrote:
You'd be surprised at how many AD's die in the 5-10 seconds when the support goes to ward the river.

Well as a solo queue thing it seems bad because you can't trust AD players especially ones with CLG flair, but in organized play it seems definitely do-able.

Because if you have strong lane control, you can just give the golems to the support with ADC's help, and still not miss a single minion in lane, without having to buy a mashitty.
liftlift > tsm
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
August 06 2013 20:34 GMT
#2727
On August 07 2013 05:20 Slusher wrote:
on topic,

ever since New Yi came out I can't help but think of the old Najin Sword strat with Zilian/Jax, only perhaps running Mid Zilian with Jungle Yi, the synergy seems super high right down to Zilian being able transition into a support farm role after the lane phase. I really want to play it but nobody I play with is a Zilian player.


Here's a really weird question.

Is there any sense to having a mid laner and a jungler who switch roles after level 6?

I am just spitballing crazy ideas here but.

Lets say you have a jungler who has a weakish early game but needs farm and develops into something scary after.

And lets say you have a mid with a strong early game who likes to roam, but can't really do early jungle clears.

So they start out doing the normal thing, then after the 2nd blue buff just switch roles, the jungler starts farming mid and the mid goes roaming and ganking.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
nafta
Profile Joined August 2010
Bulgaria18893 Posts
August 06 2013 20:35 GMT
#2728
Pretty sure fiddle can't considering you max fear.Still you need to drink potions which is pretty much the same gold that you get from them.
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
August 06 2013 20:35 GMT
#2729
LOL well I didn't expect to get everyone so off-topic. Thanks for all the advice guys, I had a pretty good idea of how I was going to survive but you guys gave me a lot of good ideas. <3
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
August 06 2013 20:35 GMT
#2730
On August 07 2013 05:34 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:32 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 ticklishmusic wrote:
You'd be surprised at how many AD's die in the 5-10 seconds when the support goes to ward the river.

Well as a solo queue thing it seems bad because you can't trust AD players especially ones with CLG flair, but in organized play it seems definitely do-able.

Because if you have strong lane control, you can just give the golems to the support with ADC's help, and still not miss a single minion in lane, without having to buy a mashitty.

Eh, but the AD doesn't get the levels from this.
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-06 20:40:34
August 06 2013 20:36 GMT
#2731
On August 07 2013 05:34 Ketara wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:20 Slusher wrote:
on topic,

ever since New Yi came out I can't help but think of the old Najin Sword strat with Zilian/Jax, only perhaps running Mid Zilian with Jungle Yi, the synergy seems super high right down to Zilian being able transition into a support farm role after the lane phase. I really want to play it but nobody I play with is a Zilian player.


Here's a really weird question.

Is there any sense to having a mid laner and a jungler who switch roles after level 6?

I am just spitballing crazy ideas here but.

Lets say you have a jungler who has a weakish early game but needs farm and develops into something scary after.

And lets say you have a mid with a strong early game who likes to roam, but can't really do early jungle clears.

So they start out doing the normal thing, then after the 2nd blue buff just switch roles, the jungler starts farming mid and the mid goes roaming and ganking.


I mean in a way thats partly the idea, although it more or less is hopeful to translate into zilian roam with ad mid once a sidelane tower falls.

Think of like Flame's role on Blaze.
Carrilord has arrived.
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
August 06 2013 20:38 GMT
#2732
On August 07 2013 05:35 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:34 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 ticklishmusic wrote:
You'd be surprised at how many AD's die in the 5-10 seconds when the support goes to ward the river.

Well as a solo queue thing it seems bad because you can't trust AD players especially ones with CLG flair, but in organized play it seems definitely do-able.

Because if you have strong lane control, you can just give the golems to the support with ADC's help, and still not miss a single minion in lane, without having to buy a mashitty.

Eh, but the AD doesn't get the levels from this.

Your point was AD gets levels in lane, while support gets level from double golem.
My point is AD doesn't lose anything by helping support get levels/gold by letting support get last hit on golem. If you have the wave controlled correctly, you should routinely grab double golems, without losing any CS.
liftlift > tsm
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-06 20:40:40
August 06 2013 20:40 GMT
#2733
On August 07 2013 04:41 Requizen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 04:36 Ketara wrote:
This might be my favorite off topic conversation of all time.

One of these days Neo is just gonna come in and ban like a dozen people at once.

One of these days, I'm gonna snap and just darkness all of you. -_-

4 pages of pancake talk. Real.

P.S.: Not even Lilly can save you, Req.
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
August 06 2013 20:41 GMT
#2734
On August 07 2013 05:38 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:35 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:34 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 ticklishmusic wrote:
You'd be surprised at how many AD's die in the 5-10 seconds when the support goes to ward the river.

Well as a solo queue thing it seems bad because you can't trust AD players especially ones with CLG flair, but in organized play it seems definitely do-able.

Because if you have strong lane control, you can just give the golems to the support with ADC's help, and still not miss a single minion in lane, without having to buy a mashitty.

Eh, but the AD doesn't get the levels from this.

Your point was AD gets levels in lane, while support gets level from double golem.
My point is AD doesn't lose anything by helping support get levels/gold by letting support get last hit on golem. If you have the wave controlled correctly, you should routinely grab double golems, without losing any CS.

If the support can do it solo and make up the gold investment by minute 3 and have everything past that be profit for the support and your AD gets more xp from lanes, i don't see why that isn't superior to having the support camp behind XP range in lane and then go help clear golems after every wave.
Zdrastochye
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Ivory Coast6262 Posts
August 06 2013 20:41 GMT
#2735
On August 07 2013 05:40 NeoIllusions wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 04:41 Requizen wrote:
On August 07 2013 04:36 Ketara wrote:
This might be my favorite off topic conversation of all time.

One of these days Neo is just gonna come in and ban like a dozen people at once.

One of these days, I'm gonna snap and just darkness all of you. -_-

4 pages of pancake talk. Real.

P.S.: Not even Lilly can save you, Req.


Shame on you for being a bad influence on these boards.
Hey! How you doin'?
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
August 06 2013 20:44 GMT
#2736
On August 07 2013 05:34 Ketara wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:20 Slusher wrote:
on topic,

ever since New Yi came out I can't help but think of the old Najin Sword strat with Zilian/Jax, only perhaps running Mid Zilian with Jungle Yi, the synergy seems super high right down to Zilian being able transition into a support farm role after the lane phase. I really want to play it but nobody I play with is a Zilian player.


Here's a really weird question.

Is there any sense to having a mid laner and a jungler who switch roles after level 6?

I am just spitballing crazy ideas here but.

Lets say you have a jungler who has a weakish early game but needs farm and develops into something scary after.

And lets say you have a mid with a strong early game who likes to roam, but can't really do early jungle clears.

So they start out doing the normal thing, then after the 2nd blue buff just switch roles, the jungler starts farming mid and the mid goes roaming and ganking.

As soon as they get a whiff of what you're doing you'll get crazy counterjungled, though. I mean, I understand the idea of "early game jungle is free levels and gold", but a coordinated invade is more devestating to a jungler than ganks/zoning is to a laner.

On August 07 2013 05:40 NeoIllusions wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 04:41 Requizen wrote:
On August 07 2013 04:36 Ketara wrote:
This might be my favorite off topic conversation of all time.

One of these days Neo is just gonna come in and ban like a dozen people at once.

One of these days, I'm gonna snap and just darkness all of you. -_-

4 pages of pancake talk. Real.

P.S.: Not even Lilly can save you, Req.

Neo most patient mod NA/EU/KR/BR
It's your boy Guzma!
onlywonderboy
Profile Joined August 2012
United States23745 Posts
August 06 2013 20:44 GMT
#2737
On August 07 2013 05:40 NeoIllusions wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 04:41 Requizen wrote:
On August 07 2013 04:36 Ketara wrote:
This might be my favorite off topic conversation of all time.

One of these days Neo is just gonna come in and ban like a dozen people at once.

One of these days, I'm gonna snap and just darkness all of you. -_-

4 pages of pancake talk. Real.

P.S.: Not even Lilly can save you, Req.

Better than two pages of fish puns.
RIP Ryan Davis / TL or Die / @onlywonderboy
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-06 20:44:51
August 06 2013 20:44 GMT
#2738
On August 07 2013 05:41 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:38 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:35 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:34 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 ticklishmusic wrote:
You'd be surprised at how many AD's die in the 5-10 seconds when the support goes to ward the river.

Well as a solo queue thing it seems bad because you can't trust AD players especially ones with CLG flair, but in organized play it seems definitely do-able.

Because if you have strong lane control, you can just give the golems to the support with ADC's help, and still not miss a single minion in lane, without having to buy a mashitty.

Eh, but the AD doesn't get the levels from this.

Your point was AD gets levels in lane, while support gets level from double golem.
My point is AD doesn't lose anything by helping support get levels/gold by letting support get last hit on golem. If you have the wave controlled correctly, you should routinely grab double golems, without losing any CS.

If the support can do it solo and make up the gold investment by minute 3 and have everything past that be profit for the support and your AD gets more xp from lanes, i don't see why that isn't superior to having the support camp behind XP range in lane and then go help clear golems after every wave.


AD isn't getting more EXP from the lane if nothing is dying while the support is gone.

Presuming no interference from the enemy team you can do golems between waves and not miss a single CS.

Splitting the duo up just makes that interference more likely.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
August 06 2013 20:47 GMT
#2739
On August 07 2013 05:44 Ketara wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 07 2013 05:41 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:38 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:35 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:34 wei2coolman wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 PrinceXizor wrote:
On August 07 2013 05:32 ticklishmusic wrote:
You'd be surprised at how many AD's die in the 5-10 seconds when the support goes to ward the river.

Well as a solo queue thing it seems bad because you can't trust AD players especially ones with CLG flair, but in organized play it seems definitely do-able.

Because if you have strong lane control, you can just give the golems to the support with ADC's help, and still not miss a single minion in lane, without having to buy a mashitty.

Eh, but the AD doesn't get the levels from this.

Your point was AD gets levels in lane, while support gets level from double golem.
My point is AD doesn't lose anything by helping support get levels/gold by letting support get last hit on golem. If you have the wave controlled correctly, you should routinely grab double golems, without losing any CS.

If the support can do it solo and make up the gold investment by minute 3 and have everything past that be profit for the support and your AD gets more xp from lanes, i don't see why that isn't superior to having the support camp behind XP range in lane and then go help clear golems after every wave.


AD isn't getting more EXP from the lane if nothing is dying while the support is gone.

Presuming no interference from the enemy team you can do golems between waves and not miss a single CS.

Splitting the duo up just makes that interference more likely.

That doesn't respect reality though. assuming no creeps are going to die in lane is pretty inaccurate.
Ketara
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States15065 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-06 20:49:36
August 06 2013 20:48 GMT
#2740
But the reality is that if the support leaves the lane to go kill golems while the ADC is farming alongside the enemy duo, the ADC is going to get all inned, at worst die, and at best not get any CS.

I don't know about super high level games but in my games if one member of the duo leaves lane and the other doesn't leave as well, the guy who doesn't leave gets killed.
http://www.liquidlegends.net/forum/lol-general/502075-patch-61-league-of-legends-general-discussion?page=25#498
Prev 1 135 136 137 138 139 331 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 49m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 182
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 5875
Shuttle 627
sSak 240
Hyun 239
Larva 57
JulyZerg 48
Bale 14
ToSsGirL 10
Dota 2
The International2346
League of Legends
JimRising 582
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K662
semphis_45
Super Smash Bros
C9.Mang0276
Other Games
WinterStarcraft613
XaKoH 168
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick904
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 136
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH220
• Sammyuel 22
• LUISG 1
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo942
• Jankos680
• Stunt461
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
2h 49m
Maestros of the Game
6h 49m
ShoWTimE vs Classic
Clem vs herO
Serral vs Bunny
Reynor vs Zoun
Cosmonarchy
8h 49m
Bonyth vs Dewalt
[BSL 2025] Weekly
10h 49m
RSL Revival
1d 2h
Maestros of the Game
1d 9h
BSL Team Wars
1d 11h
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Snow vs Sharp
Jaedong vs Mini
Wardi Open
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
[ Show More ]
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Light vs Speed
Larva vs Soma
LiuLi Cup
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-10
SEL Season 2 Championship
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL Polish World Championship 2025
BSL Season 21
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
EC S1
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.