|
On October 27 2012 00:53 Requizen wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 00:47 upperbound wrote:
Rengar is just as broken as he was. Nothing's changed.
Jayce is still strong and wins trades in hammer form, but it's possible to not just get chased out of lane from 1000 range anymore. Is 20 more mana on gate really that noticeable, especially if you're using hammer every so often for the W passive?
a lot of his lane strength against melees comes from having two disengages on a low mana cost so that there's no point putting your gap closer on cooldown to get to him because he'll have another escape up before yours refreshes. The main way it's possible to beat jayce with a bruiser is for him to make a mistake with his cooldowns, because if he just sits there brawling with any melee hero he loses. For example, if he goes hammer form + QE you have six seconds to get back on top of him and wail on him before his transform comes back up and he can gate out.
as you can see if you think about this, you usually don't want to just sit there in hammer form for CSing because being in melee range of the minions means your opponent doesn't have to use a gap closer to get on you, which means the rotations won't work in your favor. So: the W mana gain doesn't really counter this nerf. Also so: This opens up the option of *using* your gap closer enough that you oom him and force him back. 20 mana doesn't really add up with the frequency jayce had to gate before the patch but it might be more rewarding now because you can actually get something out of fighting him. think of the disengages as equivalent to an udyr shield (which is the function they perform in lane) and how it would play out if you increased or reduced the mana cost on that.
|
this new TT map hurts my head. i have no idea what's going on...
|
On October 27 2012 01:41 kainzero wrote:
this new TT map hurts my head. i have no idea what's going on...
I had the same problem. It didn't help I was on my old laptop either  Probably should have read the changes before trying lol. Also laning was non-existent in my game haha.
|
PSA: Syndra's E stun combo is still bad, got stunned 1 out of 4 or 5 times that it hit me last game.
|
On October 27 2012 01:45 Dusty wrote:
PSA: Syndra's E stun combo is still bad, got stunned 1 out of 4 or 5 times that it hit me last game.
All my stuns have worked perfectly the last few days. Even gotten a couple that I didn't think I would (if they were on top of the orb) since the changes
|
United States23745 Posts
On October 27 2012 01:42 mordek wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 01:41 kainzero wrote:
this new TT map hurts my head. i have no idea what's going on... I had the same problem. It didn't help I was on my old laptop either Probably should have read the changes before trying lol. Also laning was non-existent in my game haha.
Yeah, the new TT is kind of rough at the moment. A lot of people are trying it out for the first time without doing any research so they have no idea what the alters do (or little things like they grant vision before they unlock and for the team that captures them) or how much the spider actually hurts.
Also the lack of a defined meta means people just kinda pick what they want and you just hope your team comp works out. If there is no jungler in your game and you're stuck in the bot duo lane, the idea of sharing farm isn't something other players are used to (I had 20 one game while my lane mate had 60). Honestly I think duo top would be better though, better spider control if you don't have a jungler. I need to play with some friends but I want to try AP solo lane, double bruiser duo lane, I think that would be pretty powerful.
Also I'm not sure how viable this is yet, but rushing Hextech Sweeper and Lantern for vision is really useful.
|
Question about elise. Do her spiderlings creepblock or are they ghostable?
|
On October 27 2012 01:56 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 01:42 mordek wrote:On October 27 2012 01:41 kainzero wrote:
this new TT map hurts my head. i have no idea what's going on... I had the same problem. It didn't help I was on my old laptop either Probably should have read the changes before trying lol. Also laning was non-existent in my game haha. Yeah, the new TT is kind of rough at the moment. A lot of people are trying it out for the first time without doing any research so they have no idea what the alters do (or little things like they grant vision before they unlock and for the team that captures them) or how much the spider actually hurts. Also the lack of a defined meta means people just kinda pick what they want and you just hope your team comp works out. If there is no jungler in your game and you're stuck in the bot duo lane, the idea of sharing farm isn't something other players are used to (I had 20 one game while my lane mate had 60). Honestly I think duo top would be better though, better spider control if you don't have a jungler. I need to play with some friends but I want to try AP solo lane, double bruiser duo lane, I think that would be pretty powerful. Also I'm not sure how viable this is yet, but rushing Hextech Sweeper and Lantern for vision is really useful.
I've run into a lot of the same things. Also, I've run into Tryndamere still being the King of Twisted Treeline. Not sure if it was my teams play, or because he works well on the map. Lots of 1v2's, 1v1's and 1v3's. In addition, a lot of people are choosing top bruisers . Oh, and most teams forget CC.
|
Is TT still all bruisers all day or are the new items helping the other champs?
|
On October 27 2012 02:07 TeuTeu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 01:56 onlywonderboy wrote:On October 27 2012 01:42 mordek wrote:On October 27 2012 01:41 kainzero wrote:
this new TT map hurts my head. i have no idea what's going on... I had the same problem. It didn't help I was on my old laptop either Probably should have read the changes before trying lol. Also laning was non-existent in my game haha. Yeah, the new TT is kind of rough at the moment. A lot of people are trying it out for the first time without doing any research so they have no idea what the alters do (or little things like they grant vision before they unlock and for the team that captures them) or how much the spider actually hurts. Also the lack of a defined meta means people just kinda pick what they want and you just hope your team comp works out. If there is no jungler in your game and you're stuck in the bot duo lane, the idea of sharing farm isn't something other players are used to (I had 20 one game while my lane mate had 60). Honestly I think duo top would be better though, better spider control if you don't have a jungler. I need to play with some friends but I want to try AP solo lane, double bruiser duo lane, I think that would be pretty powerful. Also I'm not sure how viable this is yet, but rushing Hextech Sweeper and Lantern for vision is really useful. I've run into a lot of the same things. Also, I've run into Tryndamere still being the King of Twisted Treeline. Not sure if it was my teams play, or because he works well on the map. Lots of 1v2's, 1v1's and 1v3's. In addition, a lot of people are choosing top bruisers . Oh, and most teams forget CC.
tryndamere was never the king of TT
|
On October 27 2012 02:10 VayneAuthority wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 02:07 TeuTeu wrote:On October 27 2012 01:56 onlywonderboy wrote:On October 27 2012 01:42 mordek wrote:On October 27 2012 01:41 kainzero wrote:
this new TT map hurts my head. i have no idea what's going on... I had the same problem. It didn't help I was on my old laptop either Probably should have read the changes before trying lol. Also laning was non-existent in my game haha. Yeah, the new TT is kind of rough at the moment. A lot of people are trying it out for the first time without doing any research so they have no idea what the alters do (or little things like they grant vision before they unlock and for the team that captures them) or how much the spider actually hurts. Also the lack of a defined meta means people just kinda pick what they want and you just hope your team comp works out. If there is no jungler in your game and you're stuck in the bot duo lane, the idea of sharing farm isn't something other players are used to (I had 20 one game while my lane mate had 60). Honestly I think duo top would be better though, better spider control if you don't have a jungler. I need to play with some friends but I want to try AP solo lane, double bruiser duo lane, I think that would be pretty powerful. Also I'm not sure how viable this is yet, but rushing Hextech Sweeper and Lantern for vision is really useful. I've run into a lot of the same things. Also, I've run into Tryndamere still being the King of Twisted Treeline. Not sure if it was my teams play, or because he works well on the map. Lots of 1v2's, 1v1's and 1v3's. In addition, a lot of people are choosing top bruisers . Oh, and most teams forget CC. tryndamere was never the king of TT
I dunno about king, but he was picked/banned quite a bit back when I had ranked 3's binge with my friends.
|
Singed and Mundo are the kings of TT because it takes more than 3 people to kill them.
|
On October 27 2012 02:07 TeuTeu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 01:56 onlywonderboy wrote:On October 27 2012 01:42 mordek wrote:On October 27 2012 01:41 kainzero wrote:
this new TT map hurts my head. i have no idea what's going on... I had the same problem. It didn't help I was on my old laptop either Probably should have read the changes before trying lol. Also laning was non-existent in my game haha. Yeah, the new TT is kind of rough at the moment. A lot of people are trying it out for the first time without doing any research so they have no idea what the alters do (or little things like they grant vision before they unlock and for the team that captures them) or how much the spider actually hurts. Also the lack of a defined meta means people just kinda pick what they want and you just hope your team comp works out. If there is no jungler in your game and you're stuck in the bot duo lane, the idea of sharing farm isn't something other players are used to (I had 20 one game while my lane mate had 60). Honestly I think duo top would be better though, better spider control if you don't have a jungler. I need to play with some friends but I want to try AP solo lane, double bruiser duo lane, I think that would be pretty powerful. Also I'm not sure how viable this is yet, but rushing Hextech Sweeper and Lantern for vision is really useful. I've run into a lot of the same things. Also, I've run into Tryndamere still being the King of Twisted Treeline. Not sure if it was my teams play, or because he works well on the map. Lots of 1v2's, 1v1's and 1v3's. In addition, a lot of people are choosing top bruisers . Oh, and most teams forget CC.
Tryn isn't a strong TT champ. He just isn't.
|
On October 27 2012 02:12 Sabin010 wrote:
Singed and Mundo are the kings of TT because it takes more than 3 people to kill them.
By that logic Skarner would be perma banned.
Also, Trynd has a pretty rough laning phase with all the new bruisers out (Darius says hi).
|
United States23745 Posts
On October 27 2012 02:09 Requizen wrote:
Is TT still all bruisers all day or are the new items helping the other champs?
I find AP champs to be reasonably viable, but ADCs are still pretty trash in my experience. Wooglet's Witchcap helps a lot. 900 gold cheaper than Rabadon's, and the movespeed boost makes evading bruisers easier. Itemization for ADCs is still far too expensive to deal with early game bruiser dominance.
Edit: Here's a quote from the Season 2 TT Guide post about Trynd:
"Lategame champs are not ideal on TT. Tryndamere needs at least a Wriggles and a PD before he gets strong, and good luck getting that kind of farm against Darius, Jayce, Jax, or any other anti-autoattack bruiser. He is mobile but has no real burst to speak of, and absolutely no utility."
|
When I look at Elise, I find her itemization as an AP pretty awkward. She scales pretty badly with AP (base values on both Q too strong not to rush pen) but is she doesn't build some while maxing W, she basically has no waveclear apart from spamming spiderlings and pressing W when in melee range of most minions. It just won't work versus anyone with harass.
Welp, twitch lagging on me when TOO's jungling Hecarim for once. :<
|
On October 27 2012 02:12 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 02:10 VayneAuthority wrote:On October 27 2012 02:07 TeuTeu wrote:On October 27 2012 01:56 onlywonderboy wrote:On October 27 2012 01:42 mordek wrote:On October 27 2012 01:41 kainzero wrote:
this new TT map hurts my head. i have no idea what's going on... I had the same problem. It didn't help I was on my old laptop either Probably should have read the changes before trying lol. Also laning was non-existent in my game haha. Yeah, the new TT is kind of rough at the moment. A lot of people are trying it out for the first time without doing any research so they have no idea what the alters do (or little things like they grant vision before they unlock and for the team that captures them) or how much the spider actually hurts. Also the lack of a defined meta means people just kinda pick what they want and you just hope your team comp works out. If there is no jungler in your game and you're stuck in the bot duo lane, the idea of sharing farm isn't something other players are used to (I had 20 one game while my lane mate had 60). Honestly I think duo top would be better though, better spider control if you don't have a jungler. I need to play with some friends but I want to try AP solo lane, double bruiser duo lane, I think that would be pretty powerful. Also I'm not sure how viable this is yet, but rushing Hextech Sweeper and Lantern for vision is really useful. I've run into a lot of the same things. Also, I've run into Tryndamere still being the King of Twisted Treeline. Not sure if it was my teams play, or because he works well on the map. Lots of 1v2's, 1v1's and 1v3's. In addition, a lot of people are choosing top bruisers . Oh, and most teams forget CC. tryndamere was never the king of TT I dunno about king, but he was picked/banned quite a bit back when I had ranked 3's binge with my friends.
I've tried Trynd, he's MUCH better on the new TT, for a few reasons:
- Normally Tryn needs a good amount of farm before he can get going. However, on the new TT you start with more gold, this accelerates Tryn's early game farm.
- Similar to above, the new TT wriggles, Grez's Spectral Lantern, only costs 1100, and with it Tryn jungles like a BOSS
- Speaking of jungling, the camps in the new TT offer a lot of gold, and re-spawn extremely quickly. Between lane minions and jungle camps, Tryn can constantly stay at full fury
- Tryn has bad laning phase, TT has extremely short laning phase, so the period of time where Tryn is weakest is much shorter compared to other modes
Not sure if he's king, but he's damn strong on TT. If you can get to level 6 without dying more than once, you become beast extremely quickly. Ghost/Cleanse for chasing/escaping, and then you also have his W/E for chasing, as well as RK blade for chasing down fast tanks (hello mundo/singed). So far the new TT seems very favorable towards melee carries.
The only problem is that even though the laning phase is very short, it's still there, so if Tryn gets behind early, it will be hard to come back. However one thing I've done is that if there's noone Tryn can lane against, go bot and farm up enough to get Grez's lantern, then just jungle.
|
all my syndra stuns have worked perfectly... haven't had any problems. when i can get stuns on jungle minions i know it's good.
as for TT and why i'm confused, i played 4 games with my group of 3. random thoughts:
-ap teemo seems strong. cap is cheaper and grants MS, and he has mushrooms for map control when map control is desperately needed.
-no BT =\ i think that's a pretty hard nerf to bruisers. i don't like sanguine blade. the bligewater cutlass upgrade felt really strong though. not sure about the other new items, though i suspect that the thing that looks like the DotA ghost scepter that does burning damage will be really strong on someone like leblanc.
-the jungle is really easy to clear, i don't think you even need smite. i'm not even sure smite is worth it for spider control. with no wards it's very difficult to control.
-speaking of the spider, it hurts a lot. in between baron and dragon, though more on the baron side. and the buff doesn't last that long.
-towers are really fragile.
-if you're standing on the altar you have no vision of the sides, only the ramps leading in.
the games we won were really strange... i did a roam/jungle syndra and we won at 15, and also won a puzzling game where we 2v3'd the enemy at the end even though our 3rd fed. not sure what happened there. we lost 2 games, one where i was roaming eve (i felt like she did no damage) and another with tiger udyr.
i do really like the graphics and look of it though.
|
on the old TT some common perm bans were champs like Lee sin, Nunu, Singed, jayce, rengar,yorick.
People also got fancy and would do targeted bans to get certain comps like Ezrael/vayne with 2 peelers and banning out gapclosers like olaf/jax/etc
|
Loco has a really good stream if you want to learn. He literally talks about almost every move he does and why he does so. Very chill and calm so it may get boring if his commentary isn't your cup of tea. But information-wise, very good.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
