|
Same rules apply, per usual. Please use the appropriate threads (QQ, Brag, Champion, etc) whenever appropriate. Keep the resident Banling content.
Thanks. Happy Gaming. |
United States37500 Posts
On March 20 2012 02:22 Mogwai wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 02:14 NeoIllusions wrote:On March 20 2012 02:05 Mogwai wrote:On March 20 2012 01:52 NeoIllusions wrote:On March 20 2012 01:49 Mogwai wrote:
aight, let's knock it off and start talking about how Shen probably isn't really all that good.
he's a strong champion, but after the hotfix shit, he's not OP and should be falling out of the insta-ban, insta-pick status over the next few weeks. We talking about solo q here? He's still a beast in lane and the reason Shen is ever banned is always because of his ally-saving ulti. The reason why he fell out of f(l)avor months ago was because his laning blew and most people couldn't play him as a support besides Laoching. I still say he's going to be mainstay for at least another tournament (IPL4). Banned or picked status. mmm, I dunno, maybe I'm just not that good with Shen, but I feel like his lategame teamfight presence is pretty meh. all he does is split push well, but if they have anyone who can stand up to you and hang onto a TP or disrupt your ult, he just feels underwhelming IMO due to really rough energy constraints in teamfights. Well, like with any champ, team comp must be taken into consideration. If you have an AoE team, obviously Ramble is going to do better than Shen. But like you said, Shen's strength is split push and ulti in. I never feel like there are energy problems unless you make an extremely poor decision. Miss a Dash and you will be fucked. Feint can be tricky to use because it's questionable whether or not people are going to target you in a team fight. For the most part, I avoid using Feint unless it's for life saving purposes (I'm near death, people are gunning to kill me, etc) I guess what I'm trying to get at is that I ran into a Singed with TP with Shen in AHGL and even though I could bully him in lane a bit, he eventually hit critical mass and felt infinitely more useful than me late game because I can't beat him 1v1, he out pushes me and does tons more in late game teamfights. It was just very frustrating to me to feel like I could ultimately be outclassed by a 1400 Singed as Shen. This is definitely a weird case since the skill levels of all the players in AHGL varies pretty wildly and that puts a lot of pressure on me to carry from top, but I just felt like Shen's lategame vs. a good 1v1er and pusher with TP is totally forgettable.
Examples help a lot. Ty.
How did the picks work out? I assume Shen picked first, Singed to counter?
I feel like Shen is a supplement in the big picture. He's going to beast in lane and tip the balance of certain team fights to make the odds benefit your team. But in a straight up 5v5 brawl, he isn't as appealing. I can see that from your perspective.
The problem is that your goal and pick aren't aligned. You say you're supposed to carry from Top but Shen isn't a carry, per se. He can get farmed and bully a lot but he doesn't have the kill potential of say, J4.
Singed is a good pick against Shen because he doesn't have to play by Shen's rules. Singed can farm at his tower, farm beyond your tower. At creep line, he just has to walk up for a few seconds to place poison on creeps and run away. During that time, you'll get to Q+auto at best. He builds resists and regens from Ulti. The best you can do in that lane specifically is stay ahead of Singed in farm and have slightly better items. It's up to your team comp (and players) to deal with Singed and make the most out of your Ulti.
|
On March 20 2012 02:32 NeoIllusions wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 02:22 Mogwai wrote:On March 20 2012 02:14 NeoIllusions wrote:On March 20 2012 02:05 Mogwai wrote:On March 20 2012 01:52 NeoIllusions wrote:On March 20 2012 01:49 Mogwai wrote:
aight, let's knock it off and start talking about how Shen probably isn't really all that good.
he's a strong champion, but after the hotfix shit, he's not OP and should be falling out of the insta-ban, insta-pick status over the next few weeks. We talking about solo q here? He's still a beast in lane and the reason Shen is ever banned is always because of his ally-saving ulti. The reason why he fell out of f(l)avor months ago was because his laning blew and most people couldn't play him as a support besides Laoching. I still say he's going to be mainstay for at least another tournament (IPL4). Banned or picked status. mmm, I dunno, maybe I'm just not that good with Shen, but I feel like his lategame teamfight presence is pretty meh. all he does is split push well, but if they have anyone who can stand up to you and hang onto a TP or disrupt your ult, he just feels underwhelming IMO due to really rough energy constraints in teamfights. Well, like with any champ, team comp must be taken into consideration. If you have an AoE team, obviously Ramble is going to do better than Shen. But like you said, Shen's strength is split push and ulti in. I never feel like there are energy problems unless you make an extremely poor decision. Miss a Dash and you will be fucked. Feint can be tricky to use because it's questionable whether or not people are going to target you in a team fight. For the most part, I avoid using Feint unless it's for life saving purposes (I'm near death, people are gunning to kill me, etc) I guess what I'm trying to get at is that I ran into a Singed with TP with Shen in AHGL and even though I could bully him in lane a bit, he eventually hit critical mass and felt infinitely more useful than me late game because I can't beat him 1v1, he out pushes me and does tons more in late game teamfights. It was just very frustrating to me to feel like I could ultimately be outclassed by a 1400 Singed as Shen. This is definitely a weird case since the skill levels of all the players in AHGL varies pretty wildly and that puts a lot of pressure on me to carry from top, but I just felt like Shen's lategame vs. a good 1v1er and pusher with TP is totally forgettable. Examples help a lot. Ty. How did the picks work out? I assume Shen picked first, Singed to counter? I feel like Shen is a supplement in the big picture. He's going to beast in lane and tip the balance of certain team fights to make the odds benefit your team. But in a straight up 5v5 brawl, he isn't as appealing. I can see that from your perspective. The problem is that your goal and pick aren't aligned. You say you're supposed to carry from Top but Shen isn't a carry, per se. He can get farmed and bully a lot but he doesn't have the kill potential of say, J4. Singed is a good pick against Shen because he doesn't have to play by Shen's rules. Singed can farm at his tower, farm beyond your tower. At creep line, he just has to walk up for a few seconds to place poison on creeps and run away. During that time, you'll get to Q+auto at best. He builds resists and regens from Ulti. The best you can do in that lane specifically is stay ahead of Singed in farm and have slightly better items. It's up to your team comp (and players) to deal with Singed and make the most out of your Ulti.
picks went:
Shen
Cait + Sona
Kog + Soraka
Maokai + Kennen
Anivia + Shyvana
Singed
we were building a babysit the kog team and I felt useless as shen even though peeling is supposed to be sorta his niche in teamfights. meh, w/e, lesson learned, Smash should play Jarman/Monkey in AHGL.
|
Teutonica having a rough game on Dyrus stream. They commented on how he was building Philo first xD
Edit: Nevermind he seems to be in good shape now, just successfully killed both Dyrus and TOO
|
On March 20 2012 02:22 Ferrose wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 02:01 GoSuChicken wrote:
Since there is no thread about Fiora i just wanted to quickly ask you guys what you think about the Fiora ulti. For me its totally gamedestroying, because you just become untouchable. In my opinion it totally destroys the whole Idea of teamfighting, since one enemy simply just cant be attacked for a not too short duration ... Just play Jax. Press E when she ults, dodge it completely and stun her. GG Fiora. Jax has gotten me a lot of free wins this week do to all the free week noobs first-picking Fiora >.>
^^ ferrose^^
|
According to www.fow.kr
Contrary to popular belief, Vayne is the most popular champion in korea not Shaco.
|
Is ap alistar not viable anymore? Cause he's alot of fuckin fun.
|
On March 20 2012 02:52 arb wrote:
Is ap alistar not viable anymore? Cause he's alot of fuckin fun.
Her ratios aren't that good anymore imo. .5 and .7 on your only 2 damaging abilities.
|
Why all those elo hell discussions pop-up all the time , 15 pages since i was last home lol.
Elo is pretty accurate , yes you can get unlucky streaks , get trolled ( no matter what rating ) or just fuck up. But its really really hard to be lower or highier than 150-200 elo to the relative skill you "deserve".
Any roles works to carry yourself with really low amount of games , except probably top.
At different ratings , different roles have the most impact:
up to 1600 it doesnt matter
1600-1900 mid is the easiest to carry with
1900-2100 Ranged ad -> Support -> Jungler -> Mid -> Top
2100-2300 Jungler -> Ranged ad -> Mid -> Top -> Support
2300 + Its the same but its quite a limbo because at high elo ( even less than 2300 ) people just play heroes that they like playing and have fun even if they arent the "best" for the role.
Also a self note to EVERYONE should have the mentality "what could i have done better" even if you did good but your bottom went 2-8.
Also a note @ neo , doublelift played only AD with those accounts and when you destroy the bottom lane ( there are far less people in the us that play only ad's) its easier to win most of your games. On top of my head i had a 2450 elo ahri go 0-8 vs orianna mid in under 20mins and we still won because out sivir was 2-0 and got quadra at their baron attempt snowballing into oblivion. Also more than 80% of the high elo games in soloq are decided by how good your ranged ad is doing in fights and his positioning , assuming almost equal farm and or few kill difference.
|
On March 20 2012 02:49 nojitosunrise wrote:According to www.fow.krContrary to popular belief, Vayne is the most popular champion in korea not Shaco.
That's a surprise?
|
On March 20 2012 03:19 TheBJ wrote:
Why all those elo hell discussions pop-up all the time , 15 pages since i was last home lol.
Because once they end, you make posts like these that may start them again~.~
|
On March 20 2012 03:19 TheBJ wrote:
Elo is pretty accurate , yes you can get unlucky streaks , get trolled ( no matter what rating ) or just fuck up. But its really really hard to be lower or highier than 150-200 elo to the relative skill you "deserve".
I'm only 1530 or something. Nidalee gets banned game 2 of every tourney.
|
On March 20 2012 02:40 ViZe wrote:
Teutonica having a rough game on Dyrus stream. They commented on how he was building Philo first xD
Edit: Nevermind he seems to be in good shape now, just successfully killed both Dyrus and TOO
Was a pretty hard game, I didn't get my team to follow me to their blue so dyrus alone stopped me doing it and I was not even level 3 when I got dived by level 6/5 oddone and dyrus, but we managed to pull through. Cass was doing well early but got caught constantly by olaf and dyrus so we had to really work hard to teamfight even when cass had warmogs and zonyas toward the end.
In teamfights basically I just started doing my best to zone out some of their bruisers (or stun+have my team poke if they didnt run) so they couldn't coordinate the dive like they were doing. I was probably a lot more effective than it looked like.
Musta been 50 minute game. I'll upload to replay to leaguereplays now.
|
All my Elo Welfare games were completely anonymous. I didn't stream or tell anyone my true Elo.
This is not me getting the last word in, but just giving the example that will suposedly end this discussion.
Anyways, on my stream I always get asked "what is the best role to carry out of elo hell with" and while I believe any hero you're really good at is a great choice I think being good at AD carry is just so fuckin good. If you can position better than the people tryin to kill you the you can literally 1v5. Like a fed lategame Trist who can position really should NEVER lose vs lesser opponents.
|
On March 20 2012 03:25 redtooth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 03:19 TheBJ wrote:
Elo is pretty accurate , yes you can get unlucky streaks , get trolled ( no matter what rating ) or just fuck up. But its really really hard to be lower or highier than 150-200 elo to the relative skill you "deserve". I'm only 1530 or something. Nidalee gets banned game 2 of every tourney.
What has nidale to do with anything i said ?? :D
|
On March 20 2012 03:32 Slayer91 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2012 02:40 ViZe wrote:
Teutonica having a rough game on Dyrus stream. They commented on how he was building Philo first xD
Edit: Nevermind he seems to be in good shape now, just successfully killed both Dyrus and TOO Was a pretty hard game, I didn't get my team to follow me to their blue so dyrus alone stopped me doing it and I was not even level 3 when I got dived by level 6/5 oddone and dyrus, but we managed to pull through. Cass was doing well early but got caught constantly by olaf and dyrus so we had to really work hard to teamfight even when cass had warmogs and zonyas toward the end. In teamfights basically I just started doing my best to zone out some of their bruisers (or stun+have my team poke if they didnt run) so they couldn't coordinate the dive like they were doing. I was probably a lot more effective than it looked like. Musta been 50 minute game. I'll upload to replay to leaguereplays now.
That's what I'm talking about!
|
|
|
Just checked the heroes , kerp was olaf , i swear i played 10 games with him being olaf the past 2 days. 2 of them me being tf and him tunneling me whole game so annoying
|
what happened to chauster? so far, i've seen every clg members stream except for him.
|
On March 20 2012 03:59 TheBJ wrote:
Just checked the heroes , kerp was olaf , i swear i played 10 games with him being olaf the past 2 days. 2 of them me being tf and him tunneling me whole game so annoying
That's how you play olaf though.
|
I tried to put Elo hell in graph form:
+ Show Spoiler +
It's almost exactly like people who think they're good at poker with a few good nights.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/hifh2.jpg)
