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Yiruru
Canada690 Posts
On January 08 2011 03:06 Blitzkrieg0 wrote: Too bad one poor decision or a small bit of greed can quickly snowball into completely fucking yourself over. This is so untrue it's not even funny | ||
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arnath
United States1317 Posts
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spinesheath
Germany8679 Posts
On January 08 2011 03:30 arnath wrote: I would argue that late in games (like after 40 minutes), it's very possible to lose a game in which you're well ahead through one mistake. Lategame this definitely is true. Someone important for holding towers gets picked off because he solo farmed a bit too far outside, enemy team dives, takes tower and rolls your nexus. Although I would call this a major mistake. Lategame not getting picked off is SO important that you should spend most of your attention on this. | ||
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L0CUST.
38 Posts
My last game vs CLG this happened. My team was up 4 dragons and 6 kills.. two players on my team got caught, so we had to fight in an awkward position (wasting a few ultimates) and it was nearly a double ace, only my team's kennen survived. Doesn't sound too bad.. however, their team had 3 support + tristana. My team had zilean and lots of burst. After that fight, it was a slow-winding road to defeat. That is just one example, I have had games lost because our oracle user got a little greedy and die.. putting him too far behind to buy another oracle, so we spent a ton of gold on keeping wards up.. Anyway, those are 5v5 premade games. Solo queue seems to be a battle of who can throw the game the hardest; to the winner goes the defeat ;D | ||
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L0CUST.
38 Posts
When taking the game serious, and trying your best to win.. the #1 best option is to treat the game like a twisted spy-hunter game where you must secretly kill monsters and towers around the map, without letting your opponents realize you are doing so, or putting them in a position where trying to stop you would be counterproductive. Essentially avoiding all serious combat until you are 100% certain your team will be victorious. Now the game is claiming to be PvP, so people who play it expect PvP action to be rewarding.. I assume. It isn't. Well it is, but it is super risky. Just yesterday I was playing hotshot in a 5v5 ladder match, and he and his team's shaco jumped on mid. I came out of jungle.. and Rambo killed the Shaco.. getting double buff. I don't want to say the game was over at that moment, but it was certainly largely in my team's favor. People want and expect to be able to kill/ outplay their opponents. With summoner spells, turrets hitting like trucks, junglers/ roamers hidden around the map, objectives littered all over the map worth 3-6x as much as a kill.. it just isn't worth it. Especially when killing players only nets you less and less gold, and makes your bounty go higher and higher. As soon as a team fight comes, if everyone on your team is 0-2.. and the enemy has 4 0-0 players and one 10-0 player. Guess how much gold exchanges? They have one player worth 40g more than your entire team.. Throw into account that the only champions to get high scores that early are champions that generally fade out if they fall behind, or the enemy catches up (Akali). Basically, in solo queue when people have a lead they want to get kills. It makes sense that getting more kills is a good thing. Finishing 20-2 sounds way better than 5-0. That isn't the case though. Getting kills for the sake of getting kills is a waste of time in LoL. Kills have to lead to something bigger, Tower, Dragon, Nashor, Buff steals, or even more kills that lead to more of these objectives taken. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
On January 08 2011 04:51 L0CUST. wrote: Might as well chime in with my LoL rant :D When taking the game serious, and trying your best to win.. the #1 best option is to treat the game like a twisted spy-hunter game where you must secretly kill monsters and towers around the map, without letting your opponents realize you are doing so, or putting them in a position where trying to stop you would be counterproductive. Essentially avoiding all serious combat until you are 100% certain your team will be victorious. Now the game is claiming to be PvP, so people who play it expect PvP action to be rewarding.. I assume. It isn't. Well it is, but it is super risky. Just yesterday I was playing hotshot in a 5v5 ladder match, and he and his team's shaco jumped on mid. I came out of jungle.. and Rambo killed the Shaco.. getting double buff. I don't want to say the game was over at that moment, but it was certainly largely in my team's favor. People want and expect to be able to kill/ outplay their opponents. With summoner spells, turrets hitting like trucks, junglers/ roamers hidden around the map, objectives littered all over the map worth 3-6x as much as a kill.. it just isn't worth it. Especially when killing players only nets you less and less gold, and makes your bounty go higher and higher. As soon as a team fight comes, if everyone on your team is 0-2.. and the enemy has 4 0-0 players and one 10-0 player. Guess how much gold exchanges? They have one player worth 40g more than your entire team.. Throw into account that the only champions to get high scores that early are champions that generally fade out if they fall behind, or the enemy catches up (Akali). Basically, in solo queue when people have a lead they want to get kills. It makes sense that getting more kills is a good thing. Finishing 20-2 sounds way better than 5-0. That isn't the case though. Getting kills for the sake of getting kills is a waste of time in LoL. Kills have to lead to something bigger, Tower, Dragon, Nashor, Buff steals, or even more kills that lead to more of these objectives taken. I agree completely. I cant tell you how many times I've been in a game where we aced the enemy team, and everyone on my team decided that going back to buy shiny new items with their gold was worth more than getting drag, towers, or stealing enemy buffs. I hate so say it, but phreak really needs to do a how to play lol video just so that all of the sheep get some idea of how to play. | ||
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Scorcher2k
United States802 Posts
On January 08 2011 04:51 L0CUST. wrote: Might as well chime in with my LoL rant :D When taking the game serious, and trying your best to win.. the #1 best option is to treat the game like a twisted spy-hunter game where you must secretly kill monsters and towers around the map, without letting your opponents realize you are doing so, or putting them in a position where trying to stop you would be counterproductive. Essentially avoiding all serious combat until you are 100% certain your team will be victorious. Now the game is claiming to be PvP, so people who play it expect PvP action to be rewarding.. I assume. It isn't. Well it is, but it is super risky. Just yesterday I was playing hotshot in a 5v5 ladder match, and he and his team's shaco jumped on mid. I came out of jungle.. and Rambo killed the Shaco.. getting double buff. I don't want to say the game was over at that moment, but it was certainly largely in my team's favor. People want and expect to be able to kill/ outplay their opponents. With summoner spells, turrets hitting like trucks, junglers/ roamers hidden around the map, objectives littered all over the map worth 3-6x as much as a kill.. it just isn't worth it. Especially when killing players only nets you less and less gold, and makes your bounty go higher and higher. As soon as a team fight comes, if everyone on your team is 0-2.. and the enemy has 4 0-0 players and one 10-0 player. Guess how much gold exchanges? They have one player worth 40g more than your entire team.. Throw into account that the only champions to get high scores that early are champions that generally fade out if they fall behind, or the enemy catches up (Akali). Basically, in solo queue when people have a lead they want to get kills. It makes sense that getting more kills is a good thing. Finishing 20-2 sounds way better than 5-0. That isn't the case though. Getting kills for the sake of getting kills is a waste of time in LoL. Kills have to lead to something bigger, Tower, Dragon, Nashor, Buff steals, or even more kills that lead to more of these objectives taken. Completely agree. I had the most ridiculous game that was a prime example of this a week or so ago in which my team was up something like 36-2 in team kills but we had only pushed 4 towers down. The fact that we were tank heavy and didn't have a hard carry meant that we were going to do worse the longer the game went on but I just couldn't get the team to push and end it. We ended up losing with the final team kills being like 40-60something at like 57 minutes. It was one of the most frustrating games I've had. | ||
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L0CUST.
38 Posts
On January 08 2011 05:00 Two_DoWn wrote: I hate so say it, but phreak really needs to do a how to play lol video just so that all of the sheep get some idea of how to play. I'd rather RIOT shift the game to make PvP the core aspect of game play rather than stealthy PvE. There are so many reasons why making a "this is how you play LoL" video would be a bad idea, or really any game making a "players guide".. beyond a basic tutorial. People like figuring stuff out, and exploring the design space. Also stating that attempting to kill enemy players is generally a poor idea.. would not be a wise decision for RIOT xD | ||
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L0CUST.
38 Posts
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0123456789
United States3216 Posts
On January 08 2011 05:24 L0CUST. wrote: I'd rather RIOT shift the game to make PvP the core aspect of game play rather than stealthy PvE. There are so many reasons why making a "this is how you play LoL" video would be a bad idea, or really any game making a "players guide".. beyond a basic tutorial. People like figuring stuff out, and exploring the design space. Also stating that attempting to kill enemy players is generally a poor idea.. would not be a wise decision for RIOT xD I really think having PvE objectives in this game is what makes it so unique and exciting. Riot always said they want to tone down the amount of power capturing these objectives bring. | ||
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Yiruru
Canada690 Posts
Two guys getting caught isn't one mistake =[ A Oracled player thats tries to be aggressive is beyond "a little bit of greed" too imo. Anyhow I was more of talking about players that lose their lane, either through deaths or lack of farm and somehow blaming that on their hugely negative score when they don't adapt their play afterward. | ||
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L0CUST.
38 Posts
On January 08 2011 06:06 Yiruru wrote: Getting caught late game is huge of course, but that's not exactly a snowball and fucking yourself over. Winning with a fairly large lead then one mistake snowballs the game in the other direction. I guess its not what it used to be.. 3 kills + dragon at level 1 sort of snowballing with everyone buying catalyst ;D but to me it is still a snowball. This "late-game" snowball generally has to do with the silly bounty system RIOT implemented to "ease the pain of having feeders on your team." Were you around in beta when they changed the bounty system a bit? 10-0 used be be 1400 and the % reduction was 30% on death without a minimum cap. RIOT and their crazy "anti-feeding" bounty system. 50g per kill was no fun xD On January 08 2011 06:06 Yiruru wrote: Anyhow I was more of talking about players that lose their lane, either through deaths or lack of farm and somehow blaming that on their hugely negative score when they don't adapt their play afterward. I haven't played solo queue in 3 weeks, so I haven't really thought about this xD heh.. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On January 08 2011 00:46 Kingske wrote: Its pretty frikin simple people. When you play serious, if your are not a moron (a.k.a a little kid playing chess) you are easily a respectable 1500 elo player. Just by NOT being an idiot and following rules/ orders unfortunately getting to 1500 is pretty hard as teh 1200-1300s are fucking infested with leavers/afkers/feeders. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On January 08 2011 07:17 Ryuu314 wrote: unfortunately getting to 1500 is pretty hard as teh 1200-1300s are fucking infested with leavers/afkers/feeders. Unfortunately, you're going to regularly find retards who singlehandedly sink teams through the 1400s. You'll even see it in the 1500s. The only thing that you can really control is how you play. The thing to keep in mind is that, all things being equal, the opposing team is just as likely to have a retarded player as your team is. If you take care of business and play well -- in other words, you're not "the retard" in your games -- you should still win most of your games until you arrive at an appropriate ELO for how well you're playing. | ||
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Chrispy
Canada5878 Posts
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Dgiese
United States2687 Posts
On January 08 2011 04:51 L0CUST. wrote:Getting kills for the sake of getting kills is a waste of time in LoL. Kills have to lead to something bigger, Tower, Dragon, Nashor, Buff steals, or even more kills that lead to more of these objectives taken. Definitely agree, it seems far too many people confuse the objective of the game with "Kill as many people as you can" instead of "Kill the enemies nexus". Although hey, maybe some people play just to kill other people and don't give two fucks about actually completing team objective... but they are fucking annoying to have on a team in ranked. | ||
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BlackPaladin
United States9316 Posts
Yes, the point is to push towers and kill the enemy nexus, but you can't do stupid shit like that. You need to be intelligent about how you push towers. | ||
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ZERG_RUSSIAN
10417 Posts
On January 08 2011 07:17 Ryuu314 wrote: unfortunately getting to 1500 is pretty hard as teh 1200-1300s are fucking infested with leavers/afkers/feeders. No it's not. Carry them and they won't leave. | ||
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rewtamus
United States327 Posts
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
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