EPTUpcoming Balance Change to Warsong Commander - Page 9
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Orcasgt24
Canada3238 Posts
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Moriquenti
Greece0 Posts
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RogerChillingworth
2840 Posts
On October 18 2015 05:12 Iknowwhy wrote: nerf a complex and fun to play deck into oblivion. Yeah, because being fun to play or complex matters when compared with being able to OTK your opponent through taunts who's at 40+ life. If you want to blame a card, blame Thaurissan. What felt like was going to be a great card for control decks with big hands ended up benefiting combo decks a lot more. Which only means a harsher, faster OTK. Force/savage/savage ring any bells? 14 damage of charge at turn 7 with no board ring any bells? Not sure if you could die at 50 life vs patron sound familiar? Fuck that deck. Druid's next. | ||
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Drazerk
United Kingdom31255 Posts
On October 20 2015 08:26 RogerChillingworth wrote: Yeah, because being fun to play or complex matters when compared with being able to OTK your opponent through taunts who's at 40+ life. If you want to blame a card, blame Thaurissan. What felt like was going to be a great card for control decks with big hands ended up benefiting combo decks a lot more. Which only means a harsher, faster OTK. Force/savage/savage ring any bells? 14 damage of charge at turn 7 with no board ring any bells? Not sure if you could die at 50 life vs patron sound familiar? Fuck that deck. Druid's next. Woah Woah Woah Freeze mage is next. | ||
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ejozl
Denmark3364 Posts
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Slydie
1913 Posts
On October 20 2015 08:26 RogerChillingworth wrote: Show nested quote + Yeah, because being fun to play or complex matters when compared with being able to OTK your opponent through taunts who's at 40+ life. If you want to blame a card, blame Thaurissan. What felt like was going to be a great card for control decks with big hands ended up benefiting combo decks a lot more. Which only means a harsher, faster OTK. Force/savage/savage ring any bells? 14 damage of charge at turn 7 with no board ring any bells? Not sure if you could die at 50 life vs patron sound familiar? Fuck that deck. Druid's next. Woah Woah Woah Freeze mage is next. Freeze mage?? -It has almost no board -It has an almost 0% matchup vs Control Warrior with Justicar Trueheart -It is countered very well by any deck with Kezan Mystic and Loatheb. -Its combos does not go nuts with a board (like druid) or punish the enemy's board (like patron.) -A simple Antique Healbot saved for after Alexstrasza can screw a freeze mage. -Bad draws can screw a freeze mage. -It was already targetted by the biggest nerf in HS history: Frost nova was 2, cone of cold was 3, blizzzard was 5 and (for a while longer) pyroblast was 8. | ||
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The_Masked_Shrimp
425 Posts
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litlnoobs
United States8 Posts
"oh buddy, you're so good" "no buddy, you're so good" "ah man, look how good you are" "nah man, look how good you are" | ||
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Alej
0 Posts
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litlnoobs
United States8 Posts
so hard. how hard are you? so hard, bro this deck is so hard hard enough for you? yeah man, hard enough for you? damn hard. oh man | ||
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Drazerk
United Kingdom31255 Posts
On October 21 2015 03:57 Slydie wrote: Freeze mage?? -It has almost no board -It has an almost 0% matchup vs Control Warrior with Justicar Trueheart -It is countered very well by any deck with Kezan Mystic and Loatheb. -Its combos does not go nuts with a board (like druid) or punish the enemy's board (like patron.) -A simple Antique Healbot saved for after Alexstrasza can screw a freeze mage. -Bad draws can screw a freeze mage. -It was already targetted by the biggest nerf in HS history: Frost nova was 2, cone of cold was 3, blizzzard was 5 and (for a while longer) pyroblast was 8. Exactly - has almost no board interaction - matches play themselves with no actual input for either player in some match ups - Its combos can go overboard depending on the version you run - Its too heavily draw dependent when you face a freeze mage there isn't any interaction other than "Does the freeze mage draw what they need" - It was targetted for the biggest nerf because it was the most boring deck to go against at the time and no one enjoyed playing verses one. That hasn't changed in nearly 2 years | ||
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Dark_Chill
Canada3353 Posts
Very few cards should be up for nerf unless really, really broken. It's wrong to say that Warsong hurt future design space, because the cards that blizzard might be making aren't out and wouldn't be out for a while, and, most importantly, Blizzard aren't as good as the actual top players of the game who are much better testers of what's too broken. The real reason is that Patron was keeping several decks down. But that's to be expected, as that's what the top deck does. Secret pali and Driud are now the ones keeping several decks down now. Whatever decks might come up now that Patron is gone will also shape the meta. No matter what, most decks are going to be bad because there will be some which are just better. It reminds me a lot of League of Legends, where Riot would nerf certain champions and then other champions would come back into the meta because they're no longer being held down and they would in turn keep other champions down. I find that when a solution can be reached by nerfing a card, the same solution can probably be reached by introducing more hate cards or introducing cards which interact more with the problems of a deck. Chillmaw didn't work out as well as Blizzard had hoped, but it was a good idea. Maybe more cards that went against charge could have worked, or more silence cards. If you have a problem with 1-turn kills, maybe make a card that prevents attacks for a full round. If secret pali is a huge problem, what if there were more cards like Kezan and flare? If combo druid is a problem, maybe more cards like Loatheb. | ||
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The_Masked_Shrimp
425 Posts
On October 21 2015 18:06 Alej wrote: anyone denying that patron warrior (or freeze mage, or miracle rogue) are hard to play decks, has never tried them. It's a children card game; it's easy by essence. There is no outstanding complexity in decision making for any turn in any match-up and in any card game. If by hard you mean making simple additions well, not good for you ! And hearthstone is even easier than the others because it has such a low variety of mechanics. Do patron and freeze mage require you to make some more additions than some other decks? Sure, but it is still pretty damn easy. So yes I tried them, and no they are not hard to play, no deck of any card game of any kind is hard to play. However, it was an obviously superior deck to the rest with both high versatility and high power while being a combo deck so without real counter. Freeze mage is less outrageously powerfull because it is very much more unlikely to do an OTK with it and it has some terrible matchups. And often BGH + healbot after alex is enough to destroy the whole purpose of their deck. | ||
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willoc
Canada1530 Posts
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Acritter
Syria7637 Posts
On October 22 2015 07:13 The_Masked_Shrimp wrote: It's a children card game; it's easy by essence. There is no outstanding complexity in decision making for any turn in any match-up and in any card game. If by hard you mean making simple additions well, not good for you ! And hearthstone is even easier than the others because it has such a low variety of mechanics. Do patron and freeze mage require you to make some more additions than some other decks? Sure, but it is still pretty damn easy. So yes I tried them, and no they are not hard to play, no deck of any card game of any kind is hard to play. However, it was an obviously superior deck to the rest with both high versatility and high power while being a combo deck so without real counter. Freeze mage is less outrageously powerfull because it is very much more unlikely to do an OTK with it and it has some terrible matchups. And often BGH + healbot after alex is enough to destroy the whole purpose of their deck. I, uh. I guess you thought you had a lot of unwinnable games with that deck which actually weren't. | ||
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