[?] Polyphasic sleep - Page 2

eshlow

United States5210 Posts

March 23 2009 02:26 GMT

#21

Trust me, it does NOT work well.

It's not worth wasting your time over (especially if you're in school or have shift work jobs).

JeeJee

Canada5652 Posts

March 23 2009 03:08 GMT

#22

On March 23 2009 11:26 eshlow wrote:
Trust me, it does NOT work well.

It's not worth wasting your time over (especially if you're in school or have shift work jobs).

well for statements like these, it's usually common sense to put in some sort of self-qualification so that we may have a reason for trusting you. have you tried it? or have you extensively studied it? as of now your post holds little more value than me posting 'Trust me, it DOES work well.'

talismania

United States2364 Posts

March 23 2009 03:30 GMT

#23

the reason we engage in monophasic compared to polyphasic sleep should be obvious... evolutionarily, what's the point of being awake when it's dark out and our sense of sight sucks? The light/dark cycle is critically important for sleep rhythms. (We have an entire neural circuit devoted merely to light detection and circadian rhythms [retina - suprachiasmatic nucleus]).

Also, I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss NREM sleep. In general, slow-wave sleep has been associated with an increase in ability with regard to episodic and semantic memory consolidation (while REM has been more associated with implicit memory consolidation). There are also important hormonal emissions linked to SWS (growth hormone, for one), so trying this as a teenager might be downright stupid.

The Storyteller

Singapore2486 Posts

March 23 2009 03:43 GMT

#24

I think teenage sleep patterns change considerably. I remember needing to sleep over 12 hours a day to feel refreshed during some of my teenage years, and hardly needing to sleep at all during others. So teenagers may be a bad gauge of the preferability of sleep paterns.

Fen

Australia1848 Posts

March 23 2009 06:57 GMT

#25

On March 23 2009 08:17 Marradron wrote:
http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2005/10/polyphasic-sleep/

This is a blog and provides both the details about polyphasic sleep and a great first hand experience log.

This man stopped his polyphasic pattern because of he was out of touch with the real world since everyone uses a monophasic sleeping pattern. This is where the problem I want to address rises.

I read this blog a while ago, but from what I read, he had a lot of difficulty when it came to flexable sleep. This is the biggest problem faced by someone in polyphasic sleep that I see.

On my current 8 hours a night sleeping pattern, If need be, I can extend my awake time out to 30 hours before fatigue begins to be a problem. Steve said he had trouble extending his awake time out by 30 mins. Its just too difficult to live without that flexability which is what makes polyphasic sleep something that just wont work.

Mista

Singapore1022 Posts

March 23 2009 07:01 GMT

#26

Man is it just me or is TL filled with mostly intelligent people..Everytime i see a thread with an obnoxious title,there are bound to be answers :S

ZerglingShepherd

Canada99 Posts

March 23 2009 07:07 GMT

#27

It's a little scary how much you lose the concept of a "day" when you go by the polyphasic sleep pattern, and how much it really means to us. Regularly, you plan your days in the sense that "oh, today I am going to do this, and tomorrow I'll do that". This way, all your time just kind of meshes into one long never-ending day.

Polyphasic

United States841 Posts

March 23 2009 07:16 GMT

#28

over the past 5 years, i've attempted the hardcore polyphasic sleep pattern 3 times and failed all 3 times

.

It doesn't work and there are some myths about it. first off, polyphasic sleep isn't all rem sleep. it's actually a speeded up version of normal sleep, like watching a sc replay in 4x instead of 1x. during the first 2 weeks of transition, your sleep phase will be completely random and chaotic. after 2 weeks, your sleep phase goes in the order of 1,2,3,4,rem, except very quickly.

stampi (the person who invented it) doesn't believe it works for long term. the only people who have ever done it under his supervision only do it for a few weeks at a time, and require months of time to recover. interestingly, stampi published a text book about a computer programmer who was on the schedule for 2 years. however, he doesn't release a name and there are no interviews, so that is mehh.

what i would suggest would be a biphasic sleep schedule. this one actually works. you reduce your daily sleep time to 6 hours (which stampi agrees to be the minimum amount of sleep necessary per 24 hour period to be awake and be sustainable over long periods of time). if you decide to do the biphasic sleep schedule, consider buying a sleep watch.

sleep watches monitor your sleep cycle while you are sleeping by recording things like pulse, blood pressure, breathing, etc etc. they wake you up only when you are at the end of REM, which is the best time to wake up. they go for like, 70$, but for students like me who always oversleep or undersleep so i'm always tired, they save my life.

Polyphasic

United States841 Posts

March 23 2009 07:19 GMT

#29

Oh ya, if you have any more questions of if you decide to do the biphasic sleep thing, feel free to pm me. i don't check threads after i post, hahaha.

Equaoh

Canada427 Posts

March 23 2009 07:19 GMT

#30

I think what you're describing is REM debt, mostly. After a while of not getting enough REM sleep your brain 'prioritizes' your sleep to try to offset the deficiency - leading to faster initiation of REM and a longer duration. The problem is you still have a lot of REM debt building up and you're not working nearly enough of it off (note that REM periods lengthen the longer you sleep in one sitting).

Also, and more importantly, the napping leads to a real lack of stage 4 or slow-wave sleep which can be problematic - your body takes advantage of this 'metabolic downtime' for anabolic processes like secreting GH. An extended period of time without slow wave sleep can lead to fybromyalgia among other health problems.

I'm not a sleep specialist but I'd stick to a regular sleep schedule.

Polyphasic

United States841 Posts

March 23 2009 07:25 GMT

#31

On March 23 2009 16:01 Mista wrote:
Man is it just me or is TL filled with mostly intelligent people..Everytime i see a thread with an obnoxious title,there are bound to be answers :S

DAMN RIGHT BITCH!!! hehe

.

tlnet. winning the internet since world war 2.

Polyphasic

United States841 Posts

March 23 2009 07:27 GMT

#32

On March 23 2009 16:19 Equaoh wrote:
I think what you're describing is REM debt, mostly. After a while of not getting enough REM sleep your brain 'prioritizes' your sleep to try to offset the deficiency - leading to faster initiation of REM and a longer duration. The problem is you still have a lot of REM debt building up and you're not working nearly enough of it off (note that REM periods lengthen the longer you sleep in one sitting).

Also, and more importantly, the napping leads to a real lack of stage 4 or slow-wave sleep which can be problematic - your body takes advantage of this 'metabolic downtime' for anabolic processes like secreting GH. An extended period of time without slow wave sleep can lead to fybromyalgia among other health problems.

I'm not a sleep specialist but I'd stick to a regular sleep schedule.

yah ur right. stampi's textbook talked about rem debt. after the 2 week acclimation period, the sleep % divoted to rem goes up a bit, but still isn't nearly 100%. as i recall, it was something less than 50%. so in any case, it doesn't cover the rem debt, not that rem sleep is the only important sleep cycle. fuck polyphasic sleep.

now polyphasic orgasm, that's where it's at.

Centric

United States1989 Posts

March 23 2009 08:17 GMT

#33

I have real problems waking up if I don't sleep more than 8 hours. I don't know how I'd be able to do this.

Phrujbaz

Netherlands512 Posts

March 23 2009 08:20 GMT

#34

Biphasic works (afternoon nap 1.5~3 hours). You can reduce sleep to 6.5 hours / day average or maybe 6.5 hours one day 8 the next. Slight improvement over monophasic which is slightly less efficient.

Humans can sleep well both in biphasic monophasic schedules though so the difference isn't too large.

Humans can not sleep well in a polyphasic schedule - we have the ability for survival situations but otherwise it's just going to mess up too much of your stuff.

luiohh

Bangladesh78 Posts

March 23 2009 08:20 GMT

#35

On March 23 2009 16:19 Equaoh wrote:
Also, and more importantly, the napping leads to a real lack of stage 4 or slow-wave sleep which can be problematic - your body takes advantage of this 'metabolic downtime' for anabolic processes like secreting GH. An extended period of time without slow wave sleep can lead to fybromyalgia among other health problems.

This. I'm not sure if there are any conclusive studies but I remember reading from a few different sources that deep sleep is important for health, growth and recovery. Let me know how it turns out, though. Assuming no physical and mental health implications, an extra 6 hours a day would be awesome, I could easily work around the social inconveniences.

Artosis

United States2140 Posts

March 23 2009 08:56 GMT

#36

i've actually done polyphasic sleep patterns in the past when practicing for WCG really hardcore in like 2004/2005. i doubt its very healthy, although at the time i felt totally fine on some weird "30 hour days" thing where i took 3 rotating naps of 3 hours a piece every 30 hours or so. i didnt do it exactly to a schedual, thats just what it worked out to. regardless i think you need to sleep the normal way to be really healthy.

ask nony though hes a sleep expert.

Marradron

Netherlands1586 Posts

March 23 2009 12:24 GMT

#37

I have mixed feelings about polyphasic sleep itself. On the one hand theres all these claims of you need this sleep you need that sleep. But on the other hand there are reports of people using this rythem succesfully for years. Maybe it just depends on the individuals and it is not suited for most of the people.

Also i believe many studys take conclusions to quickly after looking at it for the first few weeks. But i believe in these weeks the body and mind is still addapting to the change.

I dont believe there is really strong evidence it can be used succesfully for years. But i also believe there is a strong bias against it preventing any proper research.

For my class i made the assumption that it is actually healthy and i was more looking at why wouldnt it be the standard. is it:

a- the schedule doesnt fit in the timetables of people ?
b- People lack the discipline and or willpower to follow the pattern?
c- people dont know about the method or dont believe its a usable (healthy) pattern?

The course isnt to foccused on finding the right answer or even having the right problem. It is just about teaching use how to thread a real problem in a scientific way.

PS i study mechanical engeneering.

Nightmarjoo

United States3360 Posts

March 23 2009 12:49 GMT

#38

I didn't read most of the comments, but I assume that the reason behind humans following monophasic sleep has to do with aggriculture, that people slept when it was dark because farm work couldn't be done then; an archaic left-over in culture much like how in most(?) American schools we get a long summer break, because when it was first setup kids would go work on the farm during summer etc. However, since the whole world follows monophasic sleep, the whole world works within a schedule which assumes a monophasic sleep pattern. So I guess retired and homeless people could try this out, but I dunno about everyone else.

Personally I hate naps. When I sleep without needing to get up at a certain time I usually sleep 10-12 hours at once, which is pretty wasteful, but I don't want to limit myself from sleeping if I need the sleep, and presumably(?) I need that much sleep if that's how long I sleep unbothered?