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Nude body scans at airports - Page 15

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mrgoochio
Profile Joined April 2009
United States557 Posts
November 19 2010 01:11 GMT
#281
dont mind at all.. theyd probably have males in 1 line with male security and female + female anyways.

if u find out where i can purchase one for my own personal testing, thats a different story
chengysogood
SharkSpider
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada606 Posts
November 19 2010 01:14 GMT
#282
On November 19 2010 09:54 Romantic wrote:
I don't know if you know this, but at one point income taxes were, "Just going to be a few percent on the wealthy" and, "Metal detectors are a hassle but now we are all safe so don't worry".

Hundreds were leaked, so I don't know what you are talking about when you say people are unduly concerned. It is the typical authoritarian line that you don't have any reason to worry and it will never happen. No, it really isn't a strawman, even if it hadn't happened, it is a legitimate concern, albeit minor in the opposition to the scanners.

I am glad you are fine with the scanners. May you enjoy going through the Testicle Squeezing Administration's new checkpoints ^_________^

Yeah, I'll try to make sure I enjoy it next time I'm at the airport. As long as the security guy doesn't look like he's enjoying it I think I'll be fine ^^. Either way, the leak that did happen was from a breach in security protocols, and I'm sure there are plenty of people cursing at themselves and working to make sure they don't have that happen again, because if it does, the people arguing against the imaging will be given more ammunition.

Either way, yes, there is escalation in government, that's what it does. The fact is that there's no problem with some of that. Sure, income taxes may have seemed crazy back then, but now we accept them as being fairly normal, and that's not always a bad thing. It's a matter of not denying the premise. If you're okay with 1% of your income going to government, then it's a matter of finding out how much you're okay with giving up. Likewise, we're all willing to give up some privacy in the interest of being safer on planes. Again, this is another measure of figuring out how heavy security measures can get. In my opinion, it's fine. People in North America are way to squeamish about that stuff. You go to the beach looking way more revealed than any of these imaging machines, and if someone snapped a picture it could go online with your face on it. Hell, in europe it's pretty socially acceptable to go to nude beaches and the like. Roll back a bit, and people used to bathe in public areas as well. No big deal.
FindingPride
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States1001 Posts
November 19 2010 01:19 GMT
#283
They are an invasion of privacy and send harmful radiation to the body. get rid of em. There are tons of ways to get bombs to go off at an airport. They aren't going to prevent every instance. No 1 is ever truly safe. EVER
timmeh
Profile Joined September 2009
Austria177 Posts
November 19 2010 01:23 GMT
#284
Couldn't care less about the privacy issue here. More concerned of the health risks as a frequent flyer.
;o
Ferrose
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States11378 Posts
November 19 2010 01:23 GMT
#285
On November 19 2010 10:19 FindingPride wrote:
They are an invasion of privacy and send harmful radiation to the body. get rid of em. There are tons of ways to get bombs to go off at an airport. They aren't going to prevent every instance. No 1 is ever truly safe. EVER


I've gotten hundreds of chest x-rays and CT scans, and even radiation therapy. And I'm totally fine.

Trust me, going through this once isn't going to do shit.
@113candlemagic Office lady by day, lonely woman at night. | Official lolicon of thread 94273
Zealotdriver
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States1557 Posts
November 19 2010 01:24 GMT
#286
At some point, the terrorists will figure out that they can just bomb the line waiting to go through security. Then what will we do?
Turn off the radio
FindingPride
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States1001 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-19 01:29:51
November 19 2010 01:29 GMT
#287
On November 19 2010 10:23 Ferrose wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 19 2010 10:19 FindingPride wrote:
They are an invasion of privacy and send harmful radiation to the body. get rid of em. There are tons of ways to get bombs to go off at an airport. They aren't going to prevent every instance. No 1 is ever truly safe. EVER


I've gotten hundreds of chest x-rays and CT scans, and even radiation therapy. And I'm totally fine.

Trust me, going through this once isn't going to do shit.

.
....................................... The reason this shit happens is cause of people like you
Romantic
Profile Joined January 2010
United States1844 Posts
November 19 2010 01:29 GMT
#288
On November 19 2010 10:14 SharkSpider wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 19 2010 09:54 Romantic wrote:
I don't know if you know this, but at one point income taxes were, "Just going to be a few percent on the wealthy" and, "Metal detectors are a hassle but now we are all safe so don't worry".

Hundreds were leaked, so I don't know what you are talking about when you say people are unduly concerned. It is the typical authoritarian line that you don't have any reason to worry and it will never happen. No, it really isn't a strawman, even if it hadn't happened, it is a legitimate concern, albeit minor in the opposition to the scanners.

I am glad you are fine with the scanners. May you enjoy going through the Testicle Squeezing Administration's new checkpoints ^_________^

Yeah, I'll try to make sure I enjoy it next time I'm at the airport. As long as the security guy doesn't look like he's enjoying it I think I'll be fine ^^. Either way, the leak that did happen was from a breach in security protocols, and I'm sure there are plenty of people cursing at themselves and working to make sure they don't have that happen again, because if it does, the people arguing against the imaging will be given more ammunition.

Either way, yes, there is escalation in government, that's what it does. The fact is that there's no problem with some of that. Sure, income taxes may have seemed crazy back then, but now we accept them as being fairly normal, and that's not always a bad thing. It's a matter of not denying the premise. If you're okay with 1% of your income going to government, then it's a matter of finding out how much you're okay with giving up. Likewise, we're all willing to give up some privacy in the interest of being safer on planes. Again, this is another measure of figuring out how heavy security measures can get. In my opinion, it's fine. People in North America are way to squeamish about that stuff. You go to the beach looking way more revealed than any of these imaging machines, and if someone snapped a picture it could go online with your face on it. Hell, in europe it's pretty socially acceptable to go to nude beaches and the like. Roll back a bit, and people used to bathe in public areas as well. No big deal.

If you roll back a little bit people used to be ok with a lot of things that are abhorrent or not something they did out of desire but necessity. Don't think I really need to give any obvious examples. Principles apply generally not specifically.

The whole foundation behind massive airport security expenditures is made of sand to begin with, but yes people will accept some measures of security. These decisions should be made by travelers and airlines, not an unaccountable and unelected TSA desk jockey whose agency regularly fails bomb check tests even with the scanners, indicating that the only reason planes aren't falling out of the sky is that nobody is trying to make them.
funnybananaman
Profile Joined April 2009
United States830 Posts
November 19 2010 01:31 GMT
#289
i don't think its that big of a deal, i mean the same thing happens at the doctor and just like this its for a good reason.
synapse
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
China13814 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-19 01:35:11
November 19 2010 01:34 GMT
#290
The radiation dosage is negligible, there's really nothing to worry about there. What is troubling is that these TSA workers are making a lot of Americans feel uncomfortable (as in, physically and mentally uncomfortable when merely boarding a plane) because of the possibility of a terrorist attack.
Terrorists 1 - 0 America.
:)
Romantic
Profile Joined January 2010
United States1844 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-19 01:36:35
November 19 2010 01:35 GMT
#291
On November 19 2010 10:31 funnybananaman wrote:
i don't think its that big of a deal, i mean the same thing happens at the doctor and just like this its for a good reason.

But, uh, Bananaman, nobody forces me to get X-Rays at the doctor's office.

You are also trying to make the dangers seem equal, which is laughable. Your chances of getting cancer from the machine or raging because you missed your flight due to security and crashing your car are probably much higher than the chances of being hijacked.

No bananaman, it is not for a good reason. It is for FUD purposes.

@Synapse, the danger of dying in a hijacking are also negligible.
Ferrose
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States11378 Posts
November 19 2010 01:35 GMT
#292
On November 19 2010 10:29 FindingPride wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 19 2010 10:23 Ferrose wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:19 FindingPride wrote:
They are an invasion of privacy and send harmful radiation to the body. get rid of em. There are tons of ways to get bombs to go off at an airport. They aren't going to prevent every instance. No 1 is ever truly safe. EVER


I've gotten hundreds of chest x-rays and CT scans, and even radiation therapy. And I'm totally fine.

Trust me, going through this once isn't going to do shit.

.
....................................... The reason this shit happens is cause of people like you


What's that supposed to mean?
@113candlemagic Office lady by day, lonely woman at night. | Official lolicon of thread 94273
FindingPride
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States1001 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-19 01:58:41
November 19 2010 01:37 GMT
#293
On November 19 2010 10:35 Ferrose wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 19 2010 10:29 FindingPride wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:23 Ferrose wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:19 FindingPride wrote:
They are an invasion of privacy and send harmful radiation to the body. get rid of em. There are tons of ways to get bombs to go off at an airport. They aren't going to prevent every instance. No 1 is ever truly safe. EVER


I've gotten hundreds of chest x-rays and CT scans, and even radiation therapy. And I'm totally fine.

Trust me, going through this once isn't going to do shit.

.
....................................... The reason this shit happens is cause of people like you


What's that supposed to mean?

Any Radiation is bad for you.
NyuNyu
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada146 Posts
November 19 2010 01:43 GMT
#294
I wouldn't mind this I think its a great idea :/ you are all way to uncomfortable with your bodies. It can save lives come on people.
1800~ Random Diamond, C+ ICCup 2008 - "Flying is learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Romantic
Profile Joined January 2010
United States1844 Posts
November 19 2010 01:45 GMT
#295
On November 19 2010 10:43 NyuNyu wrote:
I wouldn't mind this I think its a great idea :/ you are all way to uncomfortable with your bodies. It can save lives come on people.

So can scanners at the grocery store. Principles apply generally not specifically.
JeeJee
Profile Blog Joined July 2003
Canada5652 Posts
November 19 2010 02:07 GMT
#296
the only thing that i find ridiculous is if you refuse the search, and don't want to get on the airplane, you get fined 20k? is that a joke or did i misread that?
i can't imagine how that makes any sense whatsoever
(\o/)  If you want it, you find a way. Otherwise you find excuses. No exceptions.
 /_\   aka Shinbi (requesting a name change since 27/05/09 ☺)
shaunnn
Profile Joined October 2010
Ireland1230 Posts
November 19 2010 02:20 GMT
#297
On November 19 2010 10:37 FindingPride wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 19 2010 10:35 Ferrose wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:29 FindingPride wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:23 Ferrose wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:19 FindingPride wrote:
They are an invasion of privacy and send harmful radiation to the body. get rid of em. There are tons of ways to get bombs to go off at an airport. They aren't going to prevent every instance. No 1 is ever truly safe. EVER


I've gotten hundreds of chest x-rays and CT scans, and even radiation therapy. And I'm totally fine.

Trust me, going through this once isn't going to do shit.

.
....................................... The reason this shit happens is cause of people like you


What's that supposed to mean?

Any Radiation is bad for you.


No its not
The naniwa - Unit of protoss skill, defined as the number of gates you build off of one base
Zealotdriver
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States1557 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-19 03:34:32
November 19 2010 03:28 GMT
#298
On November 19 2010 10:37 FindingPride wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 19 2010 10:35 Ferrose wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:29 FindingPride wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:23 Ferrose wrote:
On November 19 2010 10:19 FindingPride wrote:
They are an invasion of privacy and send harmful radiation to the body. get rid of em. There are tons of ways to get bombs to go off at an airport. They aren't going to prevent every instance. No 1 is ever truly safe. EVER


I've gotten hundreds of chest x-rays and CT scans, and even radiation therapy. And I'm totally fine.

Trust me, going through this once isn't going to do shit.

.
....................................... The reason this shit happens is cause of people like you


What's that supposed to mean?

Any Radiation is bad for you.

Obviously ridiculous. The damage caused by radiation depends on wavelength, amplitude, proximity, and time exposed.

Certain key bands, like the x-rays used in these scanners and ultraviolet light emitted from sterilization lamps, are mutagens that damage your DNA. Other radiation that can hurt you comes from high temperature objects (burns) or high intensity visible light (blindness).

Edit: Basically, these scanners directly cause bodily harm in the form of DNA damage. Usually, this damage is insignificant and cells with faulty DNA either still function OK or are removed from the body. However, since these machines do nothing to enhance security and in fact create a false sense of confidence, they are not worth the health risk and monetary cost.
Turn off the radio
Excomm
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States152 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-19 03:54:22
November 19 2010 03:51 GMT
#299
On November 19 2010 10:37 FindingPride wrote:
Any Radiation is bad for you.


You should be aware that almost everything emits radiation and that there are many different types of radiation including both harmful and benign types. People are routinely subjected to X-rays for diagnosis like broken bones. The radiation used for these scans must be powerful enough to pass through the body.

Think about this in relation to the power of radiation needed when it does not pass through the body. The amount of radiation is much less and there is no evidence of prolonged exposure to this low level of radiation being harmful over time (granted this type of imaging has been less studied that exposure to diagnostic X-ray). Furthermore, only these "back-scatter" imaging machines use radiation for detection. The newer, more expensive MRI-like machines used only magnetic imaging, which is not harmful to the body.

As for the images being an invasion of privacy, the argument is ridiculous. The image generated is simply the outline generated by your skin. I doubt that a positive identification of a person from these images is possible. Someone who gets aroused from looking at these images is going to be aroused by looking at your shirt or at your crotch anyway, so stop kidding yourself. Besides, if you have the body it is unlikely that you are hiding it (people who get offended when they get attention when they wear close fitting clothes make me angry). If you don't have a body that you are proud of, maybe you should do something to improve your physical fitness. If you are too physically ill to exercise then you shouldn't ride on an airplane anyway. I hope these systems actually encourage people to work out, and they pose no health threat to you personally so unless you support the right to bring weapons on planes, then I have no idea why you would oppose this imaging.

**@zealotdriver - The radiation from these scanners does not even pass your skin and therefore does no DNA damage.
SharkSpider
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada606 Posts
November 19 2010 03:51 GMT
#300
On November 19 2010 12:28 Zealotdriver wrote:
Edit: Basically, these scanners directly cause bodily harm in the form of DNA damage. Usually, this damage is insignificant and cells with faulty DNA either still function OK or are removed from the body. However, since these machines do nothing to enhance security and in fact create a false sense of confidence, they are not worth the health risk and monetary cost.

Mind supporting your claim that they don't increase security? There was an attempt to bring the chemicals required to build a bomb on to a plane last december, that would not have worked if the passenger had taken one of these scans. (Source if you don't remember: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2009/12/26/white-house-failed-airline-bombing-attempted-act-terrorism/) Though the passenger didn't manage to actually make it all work out, this sparked the concern over having non-metallic explosives stuck on your body, in places that regular protocol wouldn't get. Theoretically, a very large person could use the fat on their chest to conceal more than enough explosives to blow up a plane, and this wouldn't even be caught by a regular patdown. That's why the enhanced patdowns include the area between the breasts for women, and the area between the legs for men. If you're going to argue about the swallowing/up butt solution, there's limited space, and getting the critical amount of explosives in such a small area would necessitate high quality refined ingredients to even make a dent in an airplane.

If you have a better solution to that specific problem, I'm sure the TSA would love to hear it (well, not really), but I doubt they'd have done this if they had a solution that worked this well without any of the privacy invasion stuff, because they're not too stupid to know that this would cause a shitstorm.

The real question is why this solution wasn't implemented before someone almost blew up a plane last winter. Anyways, your claim that these machines do nothing to enhance security is demonstrably false, because it tightens a loophole that was actually used.
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