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The Games Industry And ATVI - Page 43

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jgfjjfghjfgh
Profile Joined April 2021
5 Posts
April 26 2021 15:10 GMT
#841
--- Nuked ---
jgfjjfghjfgh
Profile Joined April 2021
5 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-04-26 15:11:49
April 26 2021 15:11 GMT
#842
--- Nuked ---
jghhghgfdf
Profile Joined April 2021
1 Post
April 26 2021 15:21 GMT
#843
--- Nuked ---
pioupiouiuoi
Profile Joined April 2021
1 Post
April 26 2021 15:59 GMT
#844
--- Nuked ---
JimmyJRaynor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada16674 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-04-26 16:16:43
April 26 2021 16:05 GMT
#845
really interesting article by teh CBC regarding FIFA '21 and EA milking every $1 they can from loot boxes//card packs
https://www.cbc.ca/news/gopublic/fifa21-loot-boxes-electronic-arts-1.5996912

The larger internal document says targeted messaging within the game will "funnel players towards [FIFA Ultimate Team] from other modes."


kudos to the CBC and the authors... nice work.

TL;DR GamesIndustry.biz summarizes it nicely.
https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2021-04-26-leaked-ea-document-says-fifa-21-is-driving-people-to-loot-boxes
On April 26 2021 10:41 Jealous wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2021 10:14 cha0 wrote:
On April 26 2021 08:00 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Classy move by ATVI to waive any kind of NDA to let Frost Giant make RTS games. I suspect Frost Giant is not permitted to make anything that competes with WoW, CoD, Overwatch, etc etc.


Not sure what you mean here, an NDA wouldn't have any effect on Frost Giant making games, and Frost Giant can definitely make any game they please.

He's probably thinking of a non-compete, though even if that's the case it's ultimately just a JJR post, don't try too hard to understand it.

meh, i think my posts are fine.
Ray Kassar To David Crane : "you're no more important to Atari than the factory workers assembling the cartridges"
ProMeTheus112
Profile Joined December 2009
France2027 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-04-26 22:07:41
April 26 2021 18:01 GMT
#846
On April 26 2021 22:10 Manit0u wrote:With CS you have to take into account where it's most popular (hint, it's not US) and you'll see why 1.6 has bigger numbers. It's mostly inflated by oldschool Russian internet cafes where they're playing it a lot.

wait WHAT? 1.6 has bigger numbers??? how do you know 0_0?? i want to see
ah nvm it seems this shows it it's not the case https://steamcharts.com/search/?q=counter strike
would have found that awesome tbh lul
i pretty much prefer 1.6 but it doesn't have matchmaking (or a ladder system), CS:GO been winning due to matchmaking imo (well and i suppose maybe proleagues and graphics). 1.6 more played than source though indeed couldnt see conv
Archeon
Profile Joined May 2011
3253 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-04-26 19:38:35
April 26 2021 19:35 GMT
#847
^Maybe higher numbers than CS:Source?
On April 26 2021 22:36 deacon.frost wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2021 22:22 Archeon wrote:
On April 26 2021 22:01 Harris1st wrote:
On April 26 2021 17:25 deacon.frost wrote:
On April 26 2021 10:14 cha0 wrote:
On April 26 2021 08:00 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Classy move by ATVI to waive any kind of NDA to let Frost Giant make RTS games. I suspect Frost Giant is not permitted to make anything that competes with WoW, CoD, Overwatch, etc etc.


Not sure what you mean here, an NDA wouldn't have any effect on Frost Giant making games, and Frost Giant can definitely make any game they please.

I believe he originally thought about the stay out of business clause and not NDA

On April 26 2021 16:56 Harris1st wrote:
RTS can be the next lottery win as well as any genre. The thing that viewers love besides flashy actions is decisionmaking and strategic thinking.

I'm not sure what arcade games are played in sc2 right now but I'm sure there are 2-3 concepts who would sell pretty good if a game was made around it


According to Monk the coop is being more played than 1v1. So people like RTS and if you find the right recipe you can win.


This is my impression as well. Team games are more appreciated these days than 1v1.
I'm thinking some sort of Moba with base building. I would play it

I think DoW3 tried to hit that middle ground and failed miserably. But DoW3 also had a terrible map pool, mediocre campaign and was brutally punishing, so large grain of salt.

I think most RTS devs underestimate how many RTS people prefer PvE. Coop is imo more successful because you have a challenge you need to overcome instead of getting balanced by MMR to loose exactly 50% of your games. Many players play RTS to build a pretty city and control a large and powerful army, not because they need to compete in matches where 2 seconds of paying attention to the wrong corner of the map often end a 30 minute game.

They are billions is built on PvE, isn't? I don't get this 1v1 obsession of many people around here either - e.g. Artosis

I think Artosis, as well as many others love BW as a game they played when they were a teen that blew their mind. I think most of us have just a few games they played when they were young which they would wish would just get more and more content or games in the same vein.

I just think that 1v1 RTS has a large discrepancy between player enjoyment and viewer enjoyment that MobAs don't. The majority of the RTS playerbase actually prefers singleplayer according to what I read, which makes it really hard to develop a AA/AAA RTS game because the likelihood that you get your investment back without hoping to get some mp money from other genres is fairly low.
low gravity, yes-yes!
deacon.frost
Profile Joined February 2013
Czech Republic12129 Posts
April 26 2021 20:04 GMT
#848
On April 27 2021 04:35 Archeon wrote:
^Maybe higher numbers than CS:Source?
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2021 22:36 deacon.frost wrote:
On April 26 2021 22:22 Archeon wrote:
On April 26 2021 22:01 Harris1st wrote:
On April 26 2021 17:25 deacon.frost wrote:
On April 26 2021 10:14 cha0 wrote:
On April 26 2021 08:00 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Classy move by ATVI to waive any kind of NDA to let Frost Giant make RTS games. I suspect Frost Giant is not permitted to make anything that competes with WoW, CoD, Overwatch, etc etc.


Not sure what you mean here, an NDA wouldn't have any effect on Frost Giant making games, and Frost Giant can definitely make any game they please.

I believe he originally thought about the stay out of business clause and not NDA

On April 26 2021 16:56 Harris1st wrote:
RTS can be the next lottery win as well as any genre. The thing that viewers love besides flashy actions is decisionmaking and strategic thinking.

I'm not sure what arcade games are played in sc2 right now but I'm sure there are 2-3 concepts who would sell pretty good if a game was made around it


According to Monk the coop is being more played than 1v1. So people like RTS and if you find the right recipe you can win.


This is my impression as well. Team games are more appreciated these days than 1v1.
I'm thinking some sort of Moba with base building. I would play it

I think DoW3 tried to hit that middle ground and failed miserably. But DoW3 also had a terrible map pool, mediocre campaign and was brutally punishing, so large grain of salt.

I think most RTS devs underestimate how many RTS people prefer PvE. Coop is imo more successful because you have a challenge you need to overcome instead of getting balanced by MMR to loose exactly 50% of your games. Many players play RTS to build a pretty city and control a large and powerful army, not because they need to compete in matches where 2 seconds of paying attention to the wrong corner of the map often end a 30 minute game.

They are billions is built on PvE, isn't? I don't get this 1v1 obsession of many people around here either - e.g. Artosis

I think Artosis, as well as many others love BW as a game they played when they were a teen that blew their mind. I think most of us have just a few games they played when they were young which they would wish would just get more and more content or games in the same vein.

I just think that 1v1 RTS has a large discrepancy between player enjoyment and viewer enjoyment that MobAs don't. The majority of the RTS playerbase actually prefers singleplayer according to what I read, which makes it really hard to develop a AA/AAA RTS game because the likelihood that you get your investment back without hoping to get some mp money from other genres is fairly low.

What I meant was mostly the fact, that several prominent sc2 figures(and some nonprominent around here ) are bashing every RTS, because it has poor or nonexistent 1v1. While it can have great PvE. And this obsession with 1v1 isn't IMO good for the genre, because when the important people bash on everything, then you have an issue, right? If you check both Pylon shows where they discuss the new teams, they focus on 1v1 while ignoring the fact, that WoL sold so many copies, but only a fraction of the playerbase went on the ladder.

If I were a developer and heard that every RTS in the last 10 years or so was a fail, I wouldn't go into it either. While this is not true, people like RTS, people are not obsessed with the 1v1 as some of our followed people are.

And it's not just Artosis, you can see it on this web too when random "SC2 is dead, RTS is dead" posts start to appear in some wild threads.

It's like when people say, that the WCS system was a fail, because plenty of B-tier Koreans were playing online the WCS and not living in the region. Which is true for NA, but is a complete fail for the European WCS (and yes, this was said by some NA personalities as a general fact)
I imagine France should be able to take this unless Lilbow is busy practicing for Starcraft III. | KadaverBB is my fairy ban mother.
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland25013 Posts
April 27 2021 01:06 GMT
#849
On April 27 2021 04:35 Archeon wrote:
^Maybe higher numbers than CS:Source?
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2021 22:36 deacon.frost wrote:
On April 26 2021 22:22 Archeon wrote:
On April 26 2021 22:01 Harris1st wrote:
On April 26 2021 17:25 deacon.frost wrote:
On April 26 2021 10:14 cha0 wrote:
On April 26 2021 08:00 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Classy move by ATVI to waive any kind of NDA to let Frost Giant make RTS games. I suspect Frost Giant is not permitted to make anything that competes with WoW, CoD, Overwatch, etc etc.


Not sure what you mean here, an NDA wouldn't have any effect on Frost Giant making games, and Frost Giant can definitely make any game they please.

I believe he originally thought about the stay out of business clause and not NDA

On April 26 2021 16:56 Harris1st wrote:
RTS can be the next lottery win as well as any genre. The thing that viewers love besides flashy actions is decisionmaking and strategic thinking.

I'm not sure what arcade games are played in sc2 right now but I'm sure there are 2-3 concepts who would sell pretty good if a game was made around it


According to Monk the coop is being more played than 1v1. So people like RTS and if you find the right recipe you can win.


This is my impression as well. Team games are more appreciated these days than 1v1.
I'm thinking some sort of Moba with base building. I would play it

I think DoW3 tried to hit that middle ground and failed miserably. But DoW3 also had a terrible map pool, mediocre campaign and was brutally punishing, so large grain of salt.

I think most RTS devs underestimate how many RTS people prefer PvE. Coop is imo more successful because you have a challenge you need to overcome instead of getting balanced by MMR to loose exactly 50% of your games. Many players play RTS to build a pretty city and control a large and powerful army, not because they need to compete in matches where 2 seconds of paying attention to the wrong corner of the map often end a 30 minute game.

They are billions is built on PvE, isn't? I don't get this 1v1 obsession of many people around here either - e.g. Artosis

I think Artosis, as well as many others love BW as a game they played when they were a teen that blew their mind. I think most of us have just a few games they played when they were young which they would wish would just get more and more content or games in the same vein.

I just think that 1v1 RTS has a large discrepancy between player enjoyment and viewer enjoyment that MobAs don't. The majority of the RTS playerbase actually prefers singleplayer according to what I read, which makes it really hard to develop a AA/AAA RTS game because the likelihood that you get your investment back without hoping to get some mp money from other genres is fairly low.

I'm sure they exist, and those that probably did manage it didn't gain the traction they deserved, I've located or heard of few RTS games that really, really nailed team play.

It may well be that doing so is indeed the future of revitalising the genre but it seems exceedingly hard to do. A PvE focused team RTS could conceivably do very well, but I imagine it would be difficult to design a game around PvE while keeping a compelling competitive mode, so you're of potentially splitting your market.

If you're making a PvP focused game that is built around teams it becomes a difficult balancing act in keeping distinct and varied factions, and particular combinations of them not being totally broken. Too many unique attributes to factions and in team scenarios where factions cover each other's weaknesses or exaggerate strengths. Not enough variety and the game is pretty homogenous and lacking in flavour.

I'd absolutely be open to either if they're executed flawlessly, I don't think anyone has cracked the magic formula, or at least had their just reward in playerbase and much monies for doing so.

RTS must be an absolute nightmare to develop and innovate within. There's usually some kind of tradeoff that has to be made that will annoy one segment or another of the RTS market.
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17242 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-04-27 02:10:09
April 27 2021 02:00 GMT
#850
On April 27 2021 03:01 ProMeTheus112 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 26 2021 22:10 Manit0u wrote:With CS you have to take into account where it's most popular (hint, it's not US) and you'll see why 1.6 has bigger numbers. It's mostly inflated by oldschool Russian internet cafes where they're playing it a lot.

wait WHAT? 1.6 has bigger numbers??? how do you know 0_0?? i want to see
ah nvm it seems this shows it it's not the case https://steamcharts.com/search/?q=counter strike
would have found that awesome tbh lul
i pretty much prefer 1.6 but it doesn't have matchmaking (or a ladder system), CS:GO been winning due to matchmaking imo (well and i suppose maybe proleagues and graphics). 1.6 more played than source though indeed couldnt see conv


I have phrased my post about CS wrongly. It's still funny to see the clear 45 degree division of the world between CS and CoD. If you made a backslash from NW to SE on the world map in the middle this would pretty much reflect where each series is more popular - US, EUW, AUS for CoD and EUE, Scandinavia, Russia for CS.

CS 1.6 is 2x more popular than CoD in Russia and CS:GO is 1.5x more popular than CS 1.6. In US CoD is 10x more popular than CS:GO and CS:GO is 3x more popular than CS 1.6. Between the countries CoD is 3x more popular in US while CS:GO is 10x and CS 1.6 16x more popular in Russia.

Really interesting distributions

It's mostly funny because it looks like there's the iron curtain all over again with socialist PC master race in the east and capitalist console pleb in the west.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
ProMeTheus112
Profile Joined December 2009
France2027 Posts
April 27 2021 20:17 GMT
#851
i have noticed this with like for example Heroes of Might and Magic 3 seems quite highly popular in eastern europe/russia even today
Simberto
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany11479 Posts
April 27 2021 20:24 GMT
#852
Some of it might simply be affordability. I would guess that if you are living in a country with lower average income, it is a lot more likely that you are able to afford a PC capable of running CS 1.6 and Heroes 3 rather than the newest CoD.

On the other hand, i also still regularly play Heroes 3. It is simply a good game.
ProMeTheus112
Profile Joined December 2009
France2027 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-04-28 00:35:47
April 27 2021 21:14 GMT
#853
yeah i mean HOMM3 seriously is such a high quality game in its genre maybe they overall mind less playing older games idk
and same with CS 1.6 i think, if you look at the gameplay mechanics there is definitely room for prefering it over CS:GO or source i think realism included hahaha (because of fixed full auto patterns in CS:GO making full auto unrealisticly and more simplisticly powerful)
that said i would love to see a new game with realistic (modern) weapon accuracy (+ i suppose ADS stuff) AND bullet velocity ala pubg
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17242 Posts
April 27 2021 22:11 GMT
#854
On April 28 2021 06:14 ProMeTheus112 wrote:
yeah i mean HOMM3 seriously is such a high quality game in its genre maybe they overall mind less playing older games idk
and same with CS 1.6 i think, if you look at the gameplay mechanics there is definitely room for prefering it over CS:GO or source i think realism included hahaha (because of fixed full auto patterns in CS:GO making full auto unrealisticly and more simplisticly powerful)
that said i would love to see a new game with realistic (modern) weapon accuracy + i suppose ADS stuff AND bullet velocity ala pubg


Hehe, I remember how arrows in Age of Conan MMO were actual mesh objects.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
Blitzkrieg0
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States13132 Posts
April 27 2021 22:44 GMT
#855
On April 28 2021 06:14 ProMeTheus112 wrote:
yeah i mean HOMM3 seriously is such a high quality game in its genre maybe they overall mind less playing older games idk


HoMM 3 popularity is largely due to community modding. Horn of the abyss is old now I guess, but it isn't 20 years old like the game.
I'll always be your shadow and veil your eyes from states of ain soph aur.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17242 Posts
April 28 2021 12:07 GMT
#856
HoMM is another great example of a franchise ground to dust. There are 7 games in the series, yet people still prefer to play HoMM3 over any subsequent title. Ubisoft really dropped the ball on this one.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
Simberto
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany11479 Posts
April 28 2021 13:04 GMT
#857
5 was pretty nice, too, and i also spend a reasonable amount of time in 4.

I recently rediscovered 6, which i bought years ago, and it seems actually nice to play. However, sadly it has the utterly horrific Ubisoft account linked to it. Ubisofts paranoid always on DRM ruins that game.

I just want to play it. I don't want to log into your online service, and i especially don't want to be kicked without saving in the middle of whatever is going on, from a single player game i play on my personal computer, because it lost contact to a paranoid server that i don't actually need to play that game.

I am currently honestly thinking about getting some pirated version of the game i own, simply to get rid of that shit. And i obviously won't buy 7, since that almost certainly has the same shit going on.

As you said, i think this is a very clear case of company policy ruining a game franchise, even if the games are still actually fun to play.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17242 Posts
Last Edited: 2021-04-28 14:39:07
April 28 2021 14:37 GMT
#858
7 is fun too but it's also always-online and other bullshit. It's not that the games past 3 weren't good but they either strayed too far from the formula (4 had great skill system and different build paths but pretty terrible everything else) or are just unwieldy. I love 5 too but it just feels super slow.

I think they should go back to the roots and do something like a remake of 3 but with 2d graphics as those age much better.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
ProMeTheus112
Profile Joined December 2009
France2027 Posts
April 28 2021 15:51 GMT
#859
a lot of things about 5 are good yeah if you compare with 3 for overall balance not sure but i think 5 is quite good but slow yeah needed bit more polish probably
deacon.frost
Profile Joined February 2013
Czech Republic12129 Posts
April 28 2021 21:00 GMT
#860
When I randomly encountered HoMaM 3 youtube videos, I couldnt believe my eyes how many views and how active the people on Youtube are. And I love that. I don't play much, but I love the fact people are still hyped about the game.
I imagine France should be able to take this unless Lilbow is busy practicing for Starcraft III. | KadaverBB is my fairy ban mother.
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