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On May 29 2025 01:08 Billyboy wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2025 22:59 Introvert wrote:On May 28 2025 22:45 Billyboy wrote:
@introvert you have always been the most reasonable of the proudly Republican posters. But your take on Musk's clear Nazi salute, he did twice to make sure people know what it was, is not reasonable at all. If you wanted to try to say that he wasn't a nazi but was making it to troll the libs and look cool on 4 chan, that is at least somewhat possible (but I think i t is more likely he did both to pwn the libs and because he agrees with lots of what the nazi's stood for).
Saying it is not a nazi salute means you are starting to fall down the rabbit hole mate, watch yourself and ground yourself. That was option B) in my original post, although maybe not worded that way exactly. It's the action of a defiant child who doesn't like being told to do (or not to do) something. But it could be that, yes. Sorry, I must have missed that and jumped into the discussion part way through. Any positive look at the Musk situation is hard for me because of all his actions. I think if you were to switch hats for a second and think about how Republicans would feel if George Saros donated 250m, was going around bribing people to vote certain ways, became one of the most powerful people in the government, had a personal team going into all the offices and working on the databases, being in every meeting, having a undefined but clearly powerful roll. You would be at least as concerned as the people that are not on your team has. This is simply not a democratic solution, no long term good can come from people being able to buy their way into power so directly. Even if you agree with Musk, how do you feel about this door being opened for people you donèt agree with buying their way to thatÉ (donèt know whats up with keyboard lol) And if he was actually just doing the salute to troll, then he is not a serious enough individual to run the country. It is an embarrassment that TONS of adults think he is cool. He is a loser 12 year old boy trying way to hard. He and Trump are such an embarrassment to your country (along with many of the other appointments). The Republicans are winning short term, but globally we think so much less of you. Anytime we read a Trump tweet with random words capitalized, or someone prints the transcript of his speech, or plays clips of the stupid shit he says (like inventing the word equalize) it is hard to not feel embarrassed and cringe. If any Ivy league school should be attacked it is whatever Trump graduated from, he would fail a junior high English class. Your problem is not the immigrants getting it, it is the rich spoiled brats that do not know shit and are so entitled that they are not willing ot learn.
Musk's money was overrated, Dems have been out fundraising and out spending (or being even) with Republicans for years now. Clinton raised and spent WAY more than Trump did in 2016. What made Musk more influential is his cultural status, he's the electric car guy, he's the space guy! He had moderately progressive views not that long ago. He was not "supposed" to turn to the right at all. Part of it is a question of cause and effect though, is the same thing that turned so many people off to dems this time around part of what moved Musk? How many vote did he move vs just being a sign of what was happening? Trump was far more "acceptable" in 2024 than he was in 2016 or 2020. It's an open question if that's more about what Trump has come to represent or if it was just frustration with things like inflation under Biden.
But the center-left/left already runs our institutions and as I've ben saying has been losing their credibility while doing so. That's why most people are pretty mute or even supportive of what Musk was trying to do. Republican administrations already have opposition inside the tent or in academia, or whevere, anyways. "Welcome to our world."
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On May 29 2025 10:59 decafchicken wrote:
I just kinda skimmed the last 5-10 pages, was it just a bunch of senseless arguing about the finer points of naziism or was there anything worthwhile
Nope that was pretty much it.
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On May 29 2025 10:59 decafchicken wrote:
I just kinda skimmed the last 5-10 pages, was it just a bunch of senseless arguing about the finer points of naziism or was there anything worthwhile
If I posted in the time fame, it was freaking awesome! But you nailed the rest.
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On May 28 2025 23:43 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
Ooof, that is such a weak doge I almost can't even think of a reply that is appropreate. What dodge? Did I issue a pardon for someone and refused to let you hold me accountable for why? I have no obligation to care about something you care about. Your level of hysteria does not engender any such obligation, either. You apparently think I should care about something. That's fine. You've done a pretty bad job convincing. Show nested quote +On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
I'd say that maybe, given how much you are concerned on Abrego Garcia's problems with law and how that makes him an appropriate target for extrajudicial deportation to a gulag you might have an issue with the president who's such a huge fan you are doing blatant corruption and bailing out people who stole from "the people". I'm not particularly concerned about Abrego Garcia's accidental-yet-everything-worked-out-for-the-best deportation, either. You have brought it up apropos of nothing. Show nested quote +On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
I guess your concern for criminality only goes for people who aren't white, who would have thunk it. Look, mom! Race baiting! Show nested quote +On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
On the other hand, since you are so worried about deficit and national debt I would think you might have a problem with the millions that these pieces of shit now don't have to pay in restitution which reduces the federal income. Restitution goes to victims. But quick quiz: How many orders of magnitude are there between a million and a trillion? Which one of those two is bigger? Finally, what can we conclude about the effectiveness of using fines against... one pardoned millionaire... as the backbone of a fiscal policy to pay back the national debt? Show nested quote +On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
Of course, all of this would assume that you have any semblance of consistency and human decency. Better start punching me in the face until that appears. Show nested quote +On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
The fact that you refer to his assassination attempt as a reason why he and his cronies get to do crime is, well, I don't know, retarded I guess? What's the criminal statute that says you can't make a meme coin, be inaugurated president, and hold it? It doesn't exist, right? The fact he got shot doesn't mean he gets to do crime. The fact he got shot means I no longer even pay obvious wolf-criers the benefit of the doubt to look for evidence on the offchance they're correct before assuming they're wrong. The gist of everything I'm reading is "rich am bad and more rich am more bad." This resonates if you're already a class warfighter. I'm not. You're telling me a MILLIONAIRE got PARDONED for WHITE COLLAR CRIMES, right? I got it. My question is: And?I get it, the goal is "LoOK BoOtLicKEr oBlaDe neVeR SaY DruMpF WrONG!" It's transparent, it's not clever, it's obnoxious, but most luckily, it's simply wrong. Like I explicitly spelled out the Big Beautiful Bill is trillions in the same old deficit spending and instead of using a brain cell to notice that, you're ranting incoherently like a dropout from communist clown school triggered by the pardon of some random millionaire I don't fucking know or care anything about while my country is headed towards fiscal disaster. We have different priorities. Yours personally are not the "default." In fact, as a foreigner yours have no general constraint to even be rational, because the country's future isn't your future. It doesn't affect you, it's entertainment that you use for a quick emotional fix to satisfy an addiction. But let me just clarify so you know I'm not dodging. Any pardon that hits my desk from now on, I vow not to approve it.
Funny how you have no attack these straw man, but yeah, you are a bootlicker and you can't even use your usual faux legalistic and long winded "argument" style to understand that it's pretty fucking problematic that your president:
1. Very clearly accepted a 1 million bribe in the form of donation from the daughter of these pieces of shit to pardon them as well as to rob American taxpayers of a few million
2. Has a very clear avenue of bribery that's even less transparent then that in his crypto coin, there were already news about random Chinese companies buying it, guys buying it and having their court cases dropped etc.
The bill is definitely not just "same old deficit spending", just like the first Trump tax cut wasn't, it's a huge hole in the budget used to lower taxes on the people who already have the most money while leaving the tax cuts that regular Americans will feel to expire just after the next election, it's another lever of political influence by Trump and it's another favor to his rich buddies.
Given that I live in Europe, your vote and your country's failings and the potential collapse of world economy because you voted for a fucking moron who bankrupts businesses constantly have a very big influence on my life, we live in a globalized economy and I've spent a lot of time working for and with Americans, I work for an AWS reseller and if Europe is forced to tax the services (only logical move) in order to play hardball against Trump's imbecilic tariffs me and my company will suffer.
As a side note, you said that Tucker "a demon raped me in my sleep and also earth is 6000 years old" Carlson does amazing interviews and the only thing better then that is his writing really explains a lot.
I'm sorry for thinking your idol is Trump, it's obviously that bloviating moron and it really, really shows, i feel stupid for not noticing it before.
A fake self made man who speaks in a way that makes morons like you feel smart and feel like victims.
You really are a great reflection of the 33 % of your country that I despise.
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Arguing with right-wing voters about corruption cases has an extremely long track record of going absolutely nowhere. They don’t care. When they reply with a flat “and?”, it’s not sarcasm, it’s honesty. They genuinely don’t care, and it’s not because they think corruption is good; it’s because they’ve completely normalized it. In their eyes, everyone is corrupt. Every party, every politician, every institutio, it’s all rotten. So why bother pretending otherwise?
And sure, to some extent, they’re right. Corruption exists across the board. But what they actively ignore or simply refuse to acknowledge, is the scale and severity of corruption. It’s not all the same. There’s a difference between occasional mismanagement and systemic looting. But when you’re fully immersed in the idea that “they all do it,” those distinctions get blurred. That’s how you end up defending the indefensible.
What’s even more frustrating is that they won’t apply the same standard to the opposition. They’ll obsess over minor scandals from the other side while completely brushing off major, well-documented corruption from their own. It’s not about ethics or accountability, it’s about scoring points. It's a game to them. Not because they don’t understand what’s happening, but because they don’t see any moral weight behind it anymore. It’s just team loyalty. It’s about owning the libs or dunking on the left, not improving anything.
You can present all the facts, all the documentation, even outright confessions and it won’t matter. They’re not operating on logic or principle. They’re operating on tribalism, and tribalism doesn’t care about right or wrong. It only cares about “us” versus “them.”
Yelling at them for not caring won’t help either. You’re shouting into a void that’s already decided there’s no such thing as justice, just sides. You’re demanding outrage from someone who has long since burned out their outrage meter. For them, this is just how politics works. You win by any means necessary. And if your guy breaks the rules and gets away with it? That’s not a problem that’s a win.
This is the core of the problem. It’s not ignorance. It’s resignation. It's not that they don’t see the corruption; it’s that they’ve decided it’s inevitable, so why not support the side that at least fights for them (or so they believe)? And trying to cut through that with moral arguments is like trying to fix a broken compass by pointing north harder.
So yeah, you can keep pointing out the hypocrisy, the crimes, the lies but if they’ve already decided none of that matters, then you’re not debating ideas. You’re talking to someone who thinks the game is rigged and is just rooting for their team to cheat better.
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On May 29 2025 18:28 Godwrath wrote:
Arguing with right-wing voters about corruption cases has an extremely long track record of going absolutely nowhere. They don’t care. When they reply with a flat “and?”, it’s not sarcasm, it’s honesty. They genuinely don’t care, and it’s not because they think corruption is good; it’s because they’ve completely normalized it. In their eyes, everyone is corrupt. Every party, every politician, every institutio, it’s all rotten. So why bother pretending otherwise?
And sure, to some extent, they’re right. Corruption exists across the board. But what they actively ignore or simply refuse to acknowledge, is the scale and severity of corruption. It’s not all the same. There’s a difference between occasional mismanagement and systemic looting. But when you’re fully immersed in the idea that “they all do it,” those distinctions get blurred. That’s how you end up defending the indefensible.
What’s even more frustrating is that they won’t apply the same standard to the opposition. They’ll obsess over minor scandals from the other side while completely brushing off major, well-documented corruption from their own. It’s not about ethics or accountability, it’s about scoring points. It's a game to them. Not because they don’t understand what’s happening, but because they don’t see any moral weight behind it anymore. It’s just team loyalty. It’s about owning the libs or dunking on the left, not improving anything.
You can present all the facts, all the documentation, even outright confessions and it won’t matter. They’re not operating on logic or principle. They’re operating on tribalism, and tribalism doesn’t care about right or wrong. It only cares about “us” versus “them.”
Yelling at them for not caring won’t help either. You’re shouting into a void that’s already decided there’s no such thing as justice, just sides. You’re demanding outrage from someone who has long since burned out their outrage meter. For them, this is just how politics works. You win by any means necessary. And if your guy breaks the rules and gets away with it? That’s not a problem that’s a win.
This is the core of the problem. It’s not ignorance. It’s resignation. It's not that they don’t see the corruption; it’s that they’ve decided it’s inevitable, so why not support the side that at least fights for them (or so they believe)? And trying to cut through that with moral arguments is like trying to fix a broken compass by pointing north harder.
So yeah, you can keep pointing out the hypocrisy, the crimes, the lies but if they’ve already decided none of that matters, then you’re not debating ideas. You’re talking to someone who thinks the game is rigged and is just rooting for their team to cheat better.
I think you have explained very well why this is so fucking exhausting. How do you talk to someone who doesn't have any principles and doesn't care about anything besides their side winning? There is just no point to it.
But at the same time, they are also making the world worse for all of us, so you can't just ignore them either.
So you are stuck. Talking doesn't help, ignoring doesn't work either. So we cling to the desperate hope that this next obvious problem will get them to reconsider. Surely they cannot just ignore this next horrible insanity, this next obvious corruption, this next breaking of proclaimed principles they hold dear. But they never do.
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I mean, I'm not trying to argue with the guy, I'm replying to his idiotic "he gets to do corruption because he was grazed by a bullet" screed + some personal attacks.
I know how it works, it's the oldest trick in the book, in my country the party in power has been in power for 85 % of the time we have been a democracy and despite our courts stating that they are a criminal organization they stay in power by convincing the general populace that other parties are as well.
However, these fuckers are also being closely monitored by EU and their only interest is not to rock the boat too much so they can keep stealing, so we get a pretty chill governance, no big swings, no intense attacks on "the others", just gaslighting how they are running things perfectly and what else do we want, and with that, they are kind of right, but we as a country have insane advantages that we can't even see because no one with good intentions and competency is allowed close to power.
Despite all that we have steady growth, we are paying down our debts and we have nice things like social nets and relatively good and free healthcare.
Occasionally, when I see a news item like the one about the bribed pardon I want to see if our resident partisan hack will find a way to excuse it, this time, and I can't tell I've seen this before he doesn't even want to engage on it, he doesn't make excuses, he just says that he's fine with it because he doesn't care and Trump got shoot so I guess that's it.
It's fun to see him squirm and go against his whole "law and order" shtick and I don't find it exhausting, I find it funny when he outs himself for what he is, a pathetic, weird little guy who probably stood up in his basement to clap when he saw the live stream of Tucker saying how daddy Trump is going to come home and spank the US for being bad.
I'm not a big believer in violence but I firmly believe that making fun of these little morons is the best way to go about engaging with them, point out how utterly ridiculous and inconsistent their world view is, it might not help to snap them out of it but it might be worth for others to notice that all of these moronic takes are just regurgitated Tucker Carlson monologues and that these people who love to go on about law and justice don't really give a fuck about it as long as their daddy does it.
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On May 29 2025 17:06 Jankisa wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2025 23:43 oBlade wrote:On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
Ooof, that is such a weak doge I almost can't even think of a reply that is appropreate. What dodge? Did I issue a pardon for someone and refused to let you hold me accountable for why? I have no obligation to care about something you care about. Your level of hysteria does not engender any such obligation, either. You apparently think I should care about something. That's fine. You've done a pretty bad job convincing. On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
I'd say that maybe, given how much you are concerned on Abrego Garcia's problems with law and how that makes him an appropriate target for extrajudicial deportation to a gulag you might have an issue with the president who's such a huge fan you are doing blatant corruption and bailing out people who stole from "the people". I'm not particularly concerned about Abrego Garcia's accidental-yet-everything-worked-out-for-the-best deportation, either. You have brought it up apropos of nothing. On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
I guess your concern for criminality only goes for people who aren't white, who would have thunk it. Look, mom! Race baiting! On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
On the other hand, since you are so worried about deficit and national debt I would think you might have a problem with the millions that these pieces of shit now don't have to pay in restitution which reduces the federal income. Restitution goes to victims. But quick quiz: How many orders of magnitude are there between a million and a trillion? Which one of those two is bigger? Finally, what can we conclude about the effectiveness of using fines against... one pardoned millionaire... as the backbone of a fiscal policy to pay back the national debt? On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
Of course, all of this would assume that you have any semblance of consistency and human decency. Better start punching me in the face until that appears. On May 28 2025 21:44 Jankisa wrote:
The fact that you refer to his assassination attempt as a reason why he and his cronies get to do crime is, well, I don't know, retarded I guess? What's the criminal statute that says you can't make a meme coin, be inaugurated president, and hold it? It doesn't exist, right? The fact he got shot doesn't mean he gets to do crime. The fact he got shot means I no longer even pay obvious wolf-criers the benefit of the doubt to look for evidence on the offchance they're correct before assuming they're wrong. The gist of everything I'm reading is "rich am bad and more rich am more bad." This resonates if you're already a class warfighter. I'm not. You're telling me a MILLIONAIRE got PARDONED for WHITE COLLAR CRIMES, right? I got it. My question is: And?I get it, the goal is "LoOK BoOtLicKEr oBlaDe neVeR SaY DruMpF WrONG!" It's transparent, it's not clever, it's obnoxious, but most luckily, it's simply wrong. Like I explicitly spelled out the Big Beautiful Bill is trillions in the same old deficit spending and instead of using a brain cell to notice that, you're ranting incoherently like a dropout from communist clown school triggered by the pardon of some random millionaire I don't fucking know or care anything about while my country is headed towards fiscal disaster. We have different priorities. Yours personally are not the "default." In fact, as a foreigner yours have no general constraint to even be rational, because the country's future isn't your future. It doesn't affect you, it's entertainment that you use for a quick emotional fix to satisfy an addiction. But let me just clarify so you know I'm not dodging. Any pardon that hits my desk from now on, I vow not to approve it. Funny how you have no attack these straw man, but yeah, you are a bootlicker and you can't even use your usual faux legalistic and long winded "argument" style to understand that it's pretty fucking problematic that your president: 1. Very clearly accepted a 1 million bribe in the form of donation from the daughter of these pieces of shit to pardon them as well as to rob American taxpayers of a few million
You keep posting about some pardon like everyone has read your mind.
You aren't getting it. All I see here is a guy, I have no idea who you are, with no self control, called me every name in the book, and also call some random people he still hasn't named or identified and I don't know who they are "pieces of shit" and it really just makes it super easy to conclude "okay cool now I know who probably also isn't a piece of shit."
Pardons can absolutely be problematic, they are also very legal and serve a valuable function in the criminal justice system.
I am obviously not participating in a "You have to apologize for Drumpf and say he's poopy" game. Like I told Falling, you have me confused for the White House Press Secretary. If you don't like his use of constitutional powers, write him a letter or find him online, he's active on X and Truth Social. I continue to have no idea about the pardons you're talking about because you don't share your opinion in a legible way, and you give me no motivation whatsoever to try and look up and figure out what you're talking about.
Look. Certain things are moral goods. Curing a painful disease. Certain things are moral evils. Like shooting people in the head on a lottery based on their birthday. Certain things are morally nothing, like reading the newspaper or sipping coffee. You have some issue X that you think is an evil. It's on your radar. To me it's nothing. You presume if I don't know about it and say it's evil, which you think it is, I must believe it's good. The truth is simply that through your total lack of any communication skills whatsoever, you've failed to move the issue even an inch away from being nothing to me.
On May 29 2025 17:06 Jankisa wrote:
2. Has a very clear avenue of bribery that's even less transparent then that in his crypto coin, there were already news about random Chinese companies buying it, guys buying it and having their court cases dropped etc.
Thanks for being specific again about the cases. Really helps us get to the bottom of things. This is the China he started a tariff war with, right?
On May 29 2025 17:06 Jankisa wrote:
The bill is definitely not just "same old deficit spending", just like the first Trump tax cut wasn't, it's a huge hole in the budget used to lower taxes on the people who already have the most money while leaving the tax cuts that regular Americans will feel to expire just after the next election, it's another lever of political influence by Trump and it's another favor to his rich buddies.
Dear God... the President of the United States is engaged in political influence? Save yourselves!
Trump wants to raise taxes on the top bracket but unfortunately legislators are not his automatons and Congress has their own will in drafting bills.
The deficit as expected is business as usual for Washington. Here's deficit vs. GDP.
+ Show Spoiler +
Here's deficit in nominal dollars.
+ Show Spoiler +
2025 is projected down $1.9 trillion at 6.2% GDP and 2026 down $1.7 trillion at 5.5% GDP. Par for the course, my Old World colleague.
On May 29 2025 17:06 Jankisa wrote:
Given that I live in Europe, your vote and your country's failings and the potential collapse of world economy because you voted for a fucking moron who bankrupts businesses constantly have a very big influence on my life, we live in a globalized economy and I've spent a lot of time working for and with Americans, I work for an AWS reseller and if Europe is forced to tax the services (only logical move) in order to play hardball against Trump's imbecilic tariffs me and my company will suffer.
The fact that you may or may not personally suffer from some tariffs of a sovereign foreign nation does not by itself give you a valid seat that your situation deserves any consideration by anyone in that nation. If you posted with even a modicum of self control you might elicit some sympathy. In fact, where before I wanted fair trade with Europe, I now personally want you and your entire company to go bankrupt and Amazon broken up by antitrust if they aren't completely obliterated by a Chinese tariff war first.
On May 29 2025 17:06 Jankisa wrote:
As a side note, you said that Tucker "a demon raped me in my sleep and also earth is 6000 years old" Carlson does amazing interviews and the only thing better then that is his writing really explains a lot.
I'm sorry for thinking your idol is Trump, it's obviously that bloviating moron and it really, really shows, i feel stupid for not noticing it before.
I don't have idols. You're probably confusing the fact I don't share your demons with them being my idols. Tucker is not only a good interviewer, he's more intelligent than you. Your extent of knowledge of him is probably the guy who got BTFO by Jon Stewart while wearing a bowtie and stared at the camera for millions of dollars at Fox. You have never read a Carlson essay, or probably even a book. By any author. But name a better interviewer from the right so WombaT can watch.
On May 29 2025 17:06 Jankisa wrote:
A fake self made man who speaks in a way that makes morons like you feel smart and feel like victims.
You really are a great reflection of the 33 % of your country that I despise.
You need to touch grass, buddy.
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Yeah, buddy, you are very obviously terminally online and you "have no idea what pardon we are talking about" despite me sharing details about who these people are, how it was paid for by a 1 million donation at a dinner etc.
Just because you are shoulder deep up Trump's ass doesn't mean that you get to pretend like you aren't aware of things that are absolutely all over the news. That is a very, very weak excuse that no one in the world is buying.
You can proceed to make yourself even more of a clown then you already are by pretending you don't know what I'm talking about tho, I don't really care, I will, however, reserve the right to point out how much of a dishonest bootlicking idiot you are for even attempting to.
"I don't have idols" and "he's more intelligent then you" in the same sentence, that's pretty great buddy.
The guy is a nepo baby propagandist, he has less then 0 principles and has admitted in court documents that he hates Trump, he thinks he's basically antichrist and he still, because he loves money more then anything works for him.
The fact that this is someone you admire is really telling.
I would absolutely rather poke my eyes out, slowly, with rolled up and compressed pages of Capital then read a "Carlson essay".
Even if he was as intelligent as you like to imagine to make yourself feel better over being a fanboy, he's an absolute void of morality who would sell their own mother for a dollar and I find it rich that you have the audacity to talk about morals while simping for two of the least moral pathological lairs in assistance, but given your opening of feigned willful ignorance it, once again, makes a lot of sense.
To answer your question, even Pierce Morgan is a better journalist and a better interviewer, not that the bar is high, all he needed to avoid is screeching at bread prices in Russian supermarkets to clear that difficult bar and putting the effort not to have the worse fake laugh imaginable.
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Oh god a Piers Morgan fanboy. Now it makes total sense.
On May 29 2025 21:12 Jankisa wrote:
"I don't have idols" and "he's more intelligent then you" in the same sentence, that's pretty great buddy.
You believe you are the smartest person on the planet and anyone exceeding you must be some kind of transcendent idol people worship irrationally. Okay.
On May 29 2025 21:12 Jankisa wrote:
The guy is a nepo baby propagandist, he has less then 0 principles and has admitted in court documents that he hates Trump, he thinks he's basically antichrist and he still, because he loves money more then anything works for him.
Not 100% clear on Carlson working for Blumpf. But I'm glad you agree with him on something.
On May 29 2025 21:12 Jankisa wrote:
The fact that this is someone you admire is really telling.
I don't. He produces interesting interviews and printed content.
On May 29 2025 21:12 Jankisa wrote:
I would absolutely rather poke my eyes out, slowly, with rolled up and compressed pages of Capital then read a "Carlson essay".
I think the order here is wrong. If you really wanted a glimpse of the conservative Zeitgeist, it would make more sense to read Carlson first before poking your eyes out.
On May 29 2025 21:12 Jankisa wrote:
To answer your question, even Pierce Morgan is a better journalist and a better interviewer, not that the bar is high, all he needed to avoid is screeching at bread prices in Russian supermarkets to clear that difficult bar and putting the effort not to have the worse fake laugh imaginable.
Putting Piers Morgan under right wing is definitely stretching categories.
It's just lucky for him in his long career he never said any single thing that was blusteringly stupid or wrong that would tarnish the rest of his entire oeuvre. Not to mention his lack of annoying vocal habits. That's the Piers Morgan I know.
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I am as far away form a Piers Morgan fanboy imaginable, the guy is a proper cunt, but as an interviewer he's leaps and bound better then captain bad faith fake laugh Carlson.
Carlson was giving speeches at Trump rallies during 2024 campaign, his whole online presence is dedicated to spreading right wing propaganda and glazing Trump, he might not work directly for him but he's part of the establishment.
You can, just like you keep dodging and pretending like you aren't aware of the pardon shitshow pretend like you don't admire Carlson, despite spending the last page of writing praising and defending him, once again, I don't think anyone's buying it but you can keep on trucking buddy.
I don't want a glimpse of conservative Zeitgeist for the same reason I don't want to read "Mein Kampf", it's dumb, badly written and racist.
I would never defend Piers Morgan, he's a self important grifter piece of shit, he is still a much better interviewer then Tucker Carlson, which was the question.
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Every time Trump supporters put forward some infuriatingly stupid talking point about why they shouldn't care about corruption or tax cuts for billionaires, point out to them that Trump ordered the NIH to cut research for children's cancer. Make them defend it. Make them own it. Literally just bring it up over and over again until they get bored and walk away. If you want to see a lot of "I'm no longer interested in politics" Facebook posts from your Gen X/Boomer family members, this strategy needs to be deployed on a massive scale.
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Northern Ireland24665 Posts
On May 29 2025 11:29 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2025 01:08 Billyboy wrote:On May 28 2025 22:59 Introvert wrote:On May 28 2025 22:45 Billyboy wrote:
@introvert you have always been the most reasonable of the proudly Republican posters. But your take on Musk's clear Nazi salute, he did twice to make sure people know what it was, is not reasonable at all. If you wanted to try to say that he wasn't a nazi but was making it to troll the libs and look cool on 4 chan, that is at least somewhat possible (but I think i t is more likely he did both to pwn the libs and because he agrees with lots of what the nazi's stood for).
Saying it is not a nazi salute means you are starting to fall down the rabbit hole mate, watch yourself and ground yourself. That was option B) in my original post, although maybe not worded that way exactly. It's the action of a defiant child who doesn't like being told to do (or not to do) something. But it could be that, yes. Sorry, I must have missed that and jumped into the discussion part way through. Any positive look at the Musk situation is hard for me because of all his actions. I think if you were to switch hats for a second and think about how Republicans would feel if George Saros donated 250m, was going around bribing people to vote certain ways, became one of the most powerful people in the government, had a personal team going into all the offices and working on the databases, being in every meeting, having a undefined but clearly powerful roll. You would be at least as concerned as the people that are not on your team has. This is simply not a democratic solution, no long term good can come from people being able to buy their way into power so directly. Even if you agree with Musk, how do you feel about this door being opened for people you donèt agree with buying their way to thatÉ (donèt know whats up with keyboard lol) And if he was actually just doing the salute to troll, then he is not a serious enough individual to run the country. It is an embarrassment that TONS of adults think he is cool. He is a loser 12 year old boy trying way to hard. He and Trump are such an embarrassment to your country (along with many of the other appointments). The Republicans are winning short term, but globally we think so much less of you. Anytime we read a Trump tweet with random words capitalized, or someone prints the transcript of his speech, or plays clips of the stupid shit he says (like inventing the word equalize) it is hard to not feel embarrassed and cringe. If any Ivy league school should be attacked it is whatever Trump graduated from, he would fail a junior high English class. Your problem is not the immigrants getting it, it is the rich spoiled brats that do not know shit and are so entitled that they are not willing ot learn. Musk's money was overrated, Dems have been out fundraising and out spending (or being even) with Republicans for years now. Clinton raised and spent WAY more than Trump did in 2016. What made Musk more influential is his cultural status, he's the electric car guy, he's the space guy! He had moderately progressive views not that long ago. He was not "supposed" to turn to the right at all. Part of it is a question of cause and effect though, is the same thing that turned so many people off to dems this time around part of what moved Musk? How many vote did he move vs just being a sign of what was happening? Trump was far more "acceptable" in 2024 than he was in 2016 or 2020. It's an open question if that's more about what Trump has come to represent or if it was just frustration with things like inflation under Biden. But the center-left/left already runs our institutions and as I've ben saying has been losing their credibility while doing so. That's why most people are pretty mute or even supportive of what Musk was trying to do. Republican administrations already have opposition inside the tent or in academia, or whevere, anyways. "Welcome to our world."
Even if he wasn’t, the whole principle isn’t exactly great.
I think you are somewhat correct, there is that cultural element with Musk too, but that identity is almost somewhat inextricable from the billionaire part.
Correct on general spending, indeed if I took a silver lining from Trump 2016 it was that you could still win despite that hurdle. That was a good thing, Sanders did it to a lesser degree of success. I thought after Citizens United that wasn’t something that could realistically happen.
Another thing from then, there’s a certain plausibility that people bought the ‘Drain the swamp’ rhetoric.
In 2025 it’s rather eminently clear that corruption isn’t part of that equation for many. What draining is desirous is purging institutions along more ideological lines.
The Democratic Party do certainly benefit from the funding game, although I’d argue that’s detached from the desires of many people on the left, and indeed probably the right too.
I’m under no illusions about some squeaky-clean system existing prior or anything, but Trump’s setting new and as usual undesirous precedents, least in modern times.
You could buy access and influence before, now you can buy a role in the cabinet, for a job that didn’t exist before.
You can directly buy pardons now, with all that entails.
These are nae good developments.
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On May 29 2025 22:36 Jankisa wrote:
You can, just like you keep dodging and pretending like you aren't aware of the pardon shitshow pretend like you don't admire Carlson, despite spending the last page of writing praising and defending him, once again, I don't think anyone's buying it but you can keep on trucking buddy.
That was the exact same post I said I watch TYT, Einstein. I was not "defending" him. You just haven't followed the thread. Tucker Carlson does not need my or anyone else's "defense." Tucker Carlson is not a criminal, you are not a prosecutor, and I am not the stand-in lawyer for everyone and everything you hate. The last of those 3 especially you need to disabuse yourself of.
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On May 29 2025 22:57 LightSpectra wrote:
Every time Trump supporters put forward some infuriatingly stupid talking point about why they shouldn't care about corruption or tax cuts for billionaires, point out to them that Trump ordered the NIH to cut research for children's cancer. Make them defend it. Make them own it. Literally just bring it up over and over again until they get bored and walk away. If you want to see a lot of "I'm no longer interested in politics" Facebook posts from your Gen X/Boomer family members, this strategy needs to be deployed on a massive scale.
They just need to make up some shit like 'we already have the cure for cancer, and if it wasn't for stuff like NIH 'research' everyone would have it by now.'
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Northern Ireland24665 Posts
On May 29 2025 22:57 LightSpectra wrote:
Every time Trump supporters put forward some infuriatingly stupid talking point about why they shouldn't care about corruption or tax cuts for billionaires, point out to them that Trump ordered the NIH to cut research for children's cancer. Make them defend it. Make them own it. Literally just bring it up over and over again until they get bored and walk away. If you want to see a lot of "I'm no longer interested in politics" Facebook posts from your Gen X/Boomer family members, this strategy needs to be deployed on a massive scale.
‘Why can’t people talk civilly about politics anymore?’ posts will also be in abundance.
I’m, believe it or not considering how prolific I pop here, perfectly happy not to discuss politics with folks IRL. If you do particularly desire to discuss something you’re supportive of that I think is asinine, I will point out the casualties of whatever you’re pushing.
Even if it’s a dickheaded position, if you at least own it that’s something.
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On May 29 2025 23:16 Jockmcplop wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2025 22:57 LightSpectra wrote:
Every time Trump supporters put forward some infuriatingly stupid talking point about why they shouldn't care about corruption or tax cuts for billionaires, point out to them that Trump ordered the NIH to cut research for children's cancer. Make them defend it. Make them own it. Literally just bring it up over and over again until they get bored and walk away. If you want to see a lot of "I'm no longer interested in politics" Facebook posts from your Gen X/Boomer family members, this strategy needs to be deployed on a massive scale. They just need to make up some shit like 'we already have the cure for cancer, and if it wasn't for stuff like NIH 'research' everyone would have it by now.'
You don't need to convince the insane. You need to expose their insanity to everyone else, especially swing voters.
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Northern Ireland24665 Posts
On May 29 2025 23:20 LightSpectra wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2025 23:16 Jockmcplop wrote:On May 29 2025 22:57 LightSpectra wrote:
Every time Trump supporters put forward some infuriatingly stupid talking point about why they shouldn't care about corruption or tax cuts for billionaires, point out to them that Trump ordered the NIH to cut research for children's cancer. Make them defend it. Make them own it. Literally just bring it up over and over again until they get bored and walk away. If you want to see a lot of "I'm no longer interested in politics" Facebook posts from your Gen X/Boomer family members, this strategy needs to be deployed on a massive scale. They just need to make up some shit like 'we already have the cure for cancer, and if it wasn't for stuff like NIH 'research' everyone would have it by now.' You don't need to convince the insane. You need to expose their insanity to everyone else, especially swing voters.
Indeedy. You’re kinda fucked if most swing voters are also insane, but I don’t think we’re quite there just yet
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Reminder that swing voters arent a serious group of people in the US and that driving the turnout of your base is significantly more important.
Do good positive things, trying to rhetorically push back on liars and charlatans has not proven to be useful, Trump won twice, and the only reason he lost once was likely because of a colossal world wide pandemic.
Talk a lot and do nothing is the losing Democrat ideology, the focus should be on building a vision of a positive future, not spending energy counteracting the lies of freaks, they will always lie faster and more than you can counteract.
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On May 29 2025 18:28 Godwrath wrote:
Arguing with right-wing voters about corruption cases has an extremely long track record of going absolutely nowhere. They don’t care. When they reply with a flat “and?”, it’s not sarcasm, it’s honesty. They genuinely don’t care, and it’s not because they think corruption is good; it’s because they’ve completely normalized it. In their eyes, everyone is corrupt. Every party, every politician, every institutio, it’s all rotten. So why bother pretending otherwise?
They do care, they wish Trump wasn't corrupt, or an imbecile, or a rapist and that they didn't have to defend him for it. But he's also the only person that ever got close to the presidency that is a true believer of great replacement theory and acting on it. To them, this is about saving civilization so anything goes. They wrote here in rare moments of sincerity that "generations of successful people" getting smaller is the greatest threat to the species. Everything else they're willing to defend, argue and do is based on that fear having top priority.
To me, they're just speeding up the fall by abandoning all values that make civilization civilization.
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EPT![[image loading]](https://www.commonfund.org/hs-fs/hubfs/img-com-chart-of-the-month-2021-05.jpg?width=800&name=img-com-chart-of-the-month-2021-05.jpg])
![[image loading]](https://www.reuters.com/graphics/USA-ECONOMY/DEFICIT/zgpoabydwpd/chart.png)
