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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
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On February 22 2025 13:40 oBlade wrote:
A man publicly calls Musk a liar and then Musk publicly calls him a retard. So the man is an angel and Musk is the devil. My name has nothing to do with the particular bias you choose to interpret their dispute through. Do not incorporate me into your worldview.
Do you really want people in charge who can't accept somebody being smarter or more knowledgable existing?
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On February 22 2025 16:48 Hat Trick of Today wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 16:40 oBlade wrote:
I'm smarter and more correct than one of the most successful entrepreneurs in history because I tweeted he lied and he responded in kind with a tweet instead of a proper PhD dissertation! You are basically saying Musk’s theory about poor Protoss performance in professional Starcraft would be valid because he’s a successful entrepreneur. Most CEOs don’t talk because they know they know doodle about the technicalities and shouldn’t need to know about it in deep detail. But it’s curious one man constantly needs to prove he’s number 1 at everything.
The "deep technicalities" of knowing whether he offered the administration to return the Starliner astronauts earlier or not? Why would Astronaut Doe have any direct knowledge of that? You can use Astronaut Doe as a primary source too but obviously Musk is a clear primary source and witness to these events and doesn't need to write a book about it when you don't hold Astronaut Doe to the same standard with their tweet.
On February 22 2025 16:48 Hat Trick of Today wrote:
Edit: Also you are so purposefully stupid. You do know Russia is lobbing missiles and drones into Ukraine and clearly does not care about civilian casualties? Tell me how you hold a fair election in such an environment without putting Ukrainian citizens at risk.
I am saying holding elections is preferable to not holding elections, it becomes particularly noteworthy when you are specifically supposed to be fighting for democracy against a country that doesn't have valid elections. The fact that if you hold election X, it might have a different result than if you held election Y, is not in general an argument not to hold election X because the point of elections is you hold them regardless of what the result might be and whether it's liked or not.
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How the fuck do you hold an election when a country has proven that they are willing to shoot rockets and send drones at any spot people would gather.
Spend a single second to think what you are asking Ukraine right now. Do you know how stupid you sound right now. If there was a legitimate years long wave of mass terror attacks across the USA by Antifa specifically targeting civilians, does the USA still hold elections? We don’t know because it has never happened but the government would absolutely think twice.
Also regarding the CEO and not speaking about technicalities, I was talking in general. Something Musk refuses to do about anything in his life, he has to pretend to be the biggest man in the room at all times. Which you would know if you spent a second looking at his track record and actually admit that the world isn’t a meritocracy. Idiots strike big all the time, I did and I bought a house in an overinflated housing bubble. Zuckerberg did and he’s still blowing billions on some metaverse that is worse than VRChat or Second Life. Zaslav did and who knows what he is even doing at Warner Brothers besides making everything shittier.
If people say that the astronauts weren’t stranded, including an actual astronaut who no doubt knows these people, I wouldn’t assume that President Biden wants astronauts to die because he hates SpaceX or some other political reason. Think about what you are defending here. But you won’t because why wouldn’t the world’s most successful entrepreneur ever be wrong about anything. And if he is wrong, like you dodging Falling’s questions, it’s because you don’t know enough to say either way (so you don’t have to admit that he’s talking out of his ass).
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On February 22 2025 17:08 Hat Trick of Today wrote:
How the fuck do you hold an election when a country has proven that they are willing to shoot rockets and send drones at any spot people would gather.
Universal mail-in ballots.
On February 22 2025 17:08 Hat Trick of Today wrote:
Spend a single second to think what you are asking Ukraine right now. Do you know how stupid you sound right now. If there was a legitimate years long wave of mass terror attacks across the USA by Antifa specifically targeting civilians, does the USA still hold elections? We don’t know because it has never happened but the government would absolutely think twice.
We don't know, we only have the Civil War and War of 1812 but clearly an election would be preferable to the lack of one.
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Rofl oBlade you are so full of shit you could be one of Trumps man-diapers.
Ukraine's constitution says: No election in wartimes.
No russian narrative changes that.
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It looks like the pro-Russia/pro-Putin Donald Trump is once again trying to extort Ukraine. Last time Trump did this, it was when he was trying to rig the 2020 election against Biden, and Trump was impeached for it. This time he can't be impeached though, because Congress is controlled by feckless Republicans.
Volodymyr Zelensky’s refusal to sign away nearly half of his country’s rare earth minerals for very few future guarantees is one of many reasons why Trump has been driven into a rage at his counterpart in Kyiv.
The Ukrainian president has made clear that exploiting his country’s precious geographical and energy resources will be one way to rebuild its economy and cities after the eventual end of the war. But the offer tendered by Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent, while being lauded by US officials as a generous ladder to prosperity for Ukraine, is not really a “deal” at all.
However, it provides insights into Trump’s view of foreign policy and his perception of the war after he reversed, rhetorically at least, the Biden administration’s support for the invaded party and threw his weight behind the invader. ... His pressure on Ukraine, the victim in the conflict, is also a hardline effort to take advantage of a nation in its darkest hour. While Putin has carved off large chunks of its territory, Trump seeks a large slice of its mineral wealth at a knockdown price. The “deal” looks rather like a form of extortion that Trump tried on Zelensky once before — floating military aid as an incentive for him to announce an investigation into Joe Biden, which led to Trump’s first impeachment. https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/21/politics/trump-ukraine-mineral-deal-analysis/index.html
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On February 22 2025 20:51 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:It looks like the pro-Russia/pro-Putin Donald Trump is once again trying to extort Ukraine. Last time Trump did this, it was when he was trying to rig the 2020 election against Biden, and Trump was impeached for it. This time he can't be impeached though, because Congress is controlled by feckless Republicans. Show nested quote +Volodymyr Zelensky’s refusal to sign away nearly half of his country’s rare earth minerals for very few future guarantees is one of many reasons why Trump has been driven into a rage at his counterpart in Kyiv.
The Ukrainian president has made clear that exploiting his country’s precious geographical and energy resources will be one way to rebuild its economy and cities after the eventual end of the war. But the offer tendered by Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent, while being lauded by US officials as a generous ladder to prosperity for Ukraine, is not really a “deal” at all.
However, it provides insights into Trump’s view of foreign policy and his perception of the war after he reversed, rhetorically at least, the Biden administration’s support for the invaded party and threw his weight behind the invader. ... His pressure on Ukraine, the victim in the conflict, is also a hardline effort to take advantage of a nation in its darkest hour. While Putin has carved off large chunks of its territory, Trump seeks a large slice of its mineral wealth at a knockdown price. The “deal” looks rather like a form of extortion that Trump tried on Zelensky once before — floating military aid as an incentive for him to announce an investigation into Joe Biden, which led to Trump’s first impeachment. https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/21/politics/trump-ukraine-mineral-deal-analysis/index.html
Don't really have much to do with each other though, do they? In the first case, he was trying to leverage his position for personal gain: it was basically Watergate again, using the government apparatus to aid in reelection. The latter is the move of a scummy unethical bag of shit, but not actually illegal. At least not more illegal than invading Iraq and letting Haliburton get the oil was, which has apparently been deemed completely 100% okay.
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On February 22 2025 21:30 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 20:51 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:It looks like the pro-Russia/pro-Putin Donald Trump is once again trying to extort Ukraine. Last time Trump did this, it was when he was trying to rig the 2020 election against Biden, and Trump was impeached for it. This time he can't be impeached though, because Congress is controlled by feckless Republicans. Volodymyr Zelensky’s refusal to sign away nearly half of his country’s rare earth minerals for very few future guarantees is one of many reasons why Trump has been driven into a rage at his counterpart in Kyiv.
The Ukrainian president has made clear that exploiting his country’s precious geographical and energy resources will be one way to rebuild its economy and cities after the eventual end of the war. But the offer tendered by Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent, while being lauded by US officials as a generous ladder to prosperity for Ukraine, is not really a “deal” at all.
However, it provides insights into Trump’s view of foreign policy and his perception of the war after he reversed, rhetorically at least, the Biden administration’s support for the invaded party and threw his weight behind the invader. ... His pressure on Ukraine, the victim in the conflict, is also a hardline effort to take advantage of a nation in its darkest hour. While Putin has carved off large chunks of its territory, Trump seeks a large slice of its mineral wealth at a knockdown price. The “deal” looks rather like a form of extortion that Trump tried on Zelensky once before — floating military aid as an incentive for him to announce an investigation into Joe Biden, which led to Trump’s first impeachment. https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/21/politics/trump-ukraine-mineral-deal-analysis/index.html Don't really have much to do with each other though, do they? In the first case, he was trying to leverage his position for personal gain: it was basically Watergate again, using the government apparatus to aid in reelection. The latter is the move of a scummy unethical bag of shit, but not actually illegal. At least not more illegal than invading Iraq and letting Haliburton get the oil was, which has apparently been deemed completely 100% okay.
Pointing out that it's not as bad as invading Iraq is a really low bar though.
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On February 22 2025 16:58 Jockmcplop wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 16:52 Slydie wrote:On February 22 2025 16:48 Hat Trick of Today wrote:On February 22 2025 16:40 oBlade wrote:
I'm smarter and more correct than one of the most successful entrepreneurs in history because I tweeted he lied and he responded in kind with a tweet instead of a proper PhD dissertation! You are basically saying Musk’s theory about poor Protoss performance in professional Starcraft would be valid because he’s a successful entrepreneur. Most CEOs don’t talk because they know they know doodle about the technicalities and shouldn’t need to know about it in deep detail. But it’s curious one man constantly needs to prove he’s number 1 at everything. He never started a single business, though. He is a salesman and tech influencer. How much someone is worth when their assets are stocks is also highly debatable. You use the latest sold stock to determine assess the value of all of them, but that is never what you get for them if you sell them, and not what you need to pay to buy all of them either. Musk is richer than you, you have no place talking about money. The only person rich enough to know how much Musk is worth is Musk himself. Come back when you're a trillionaire.
I hope you are trolling. Being rich does not say anything about what you know about anything.
Musk's account team knows way more about what he is actually worth than Musk himself.
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On February 22 2025 23:33 Slydie wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 16:58 Jockmcplop wrote:On February 22 2025 16:52 Slydie wrote:On February 22 2025 16:48 Hat Trick of Today wrote:On February 22 2025 16:40 oBlade wrote:
I'm smarter and more correct than one of the most successful entrepreneurs in history because I tweeted he lied and he responded in kind with a tweet instead of a proper PhD dissertation! You are basically saying Musk’s theory about poor Protoss performance in professional Starcraft would be valid because he’s a successful entrepreneur. Most CEOs don’t talk because they know they know doodle about the technicalities and shouldn’t need to know about it in deep detail. But it’s curious one man constantly needs to prove he’s number 1 at everything. He never started a single business, though. He is a salesman and tech influencer. How much someone is worth when their assets are stocks is also highly debatable. You use the latest sold stock to determine assess the value of all of them, but that is never what you get for them if you sell them, and not what you need to pay to buy all of them either. Musk is richer than you, you have no place talking about money. The only person rich enough to know how much Musk is worth is Musk himself. Come back when you're a trillionaire. I hope you are trolling. Being rich does not say anything about what you know about anything. Musk's account team knows way more about what he is actually worth than Musk himself.
Yeah sorry that was sarcastic.
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On February 22 2025 20:01 KT_Elwood wrote:
Rofl oBlade you are so full of shit you could be one of Trumps man-diapers.
Ukraine's constitution says: No election in wartimes.
No russian narrative changes that.
It stipulates no elections under martial law. Martial law was a decision by the leader. If there's a war, you can have martial law or not. You can have martial law without a war, ex. mass disasters.
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On February 22 2025 23:46 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 20:01 KT_Elwood wrote:
Rofl oBlade you are so full of shit you could be one of Trumps man-diapers.
Ukraine's constitution says: No election in wartimes.
No russian narrative changes that.
It stipulates no elections under martial law. Martial law was a decision by the leader. If there's a war, you can have martial law or not. You can have martial law without a war, ex. mass disasters.
The martial law can only be introduced only with the approval of the parliament. Also, more than 70% of Ukrainians are against holding elections. That's even higher than Zelensky's approval ratings, so it's not like it's only his supporters.
Do you have anything to say about Trump trying to rig the 2020 elections or Putin regularly rigging elections in Russia? Or are you only concerned about politicians staying in power legally, and doing so illegally is fine by you?
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On February 22 2025 23:33 Slydie wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 16:58 Jockmcplop wrote:On February 22 2025 16:52 Slydie wrote:On February 22 2025 16:48 Hat Trick of Today wrote:On February 22 2025 16:40 oBlade wrote:
I'm smarter and more correct than one of the most successful entrepreneurs in history because I tweeted he lied and he responded in kind with a tweet instead of a proper PhD dissertation! You are basically saying Musk’s theory about poor Protoss performance in professional Starcraft would be valid because he’s a successful entrepreneur. Most CEOs don’t talk because they know they know doodle about the technicalities and shouldn’t need to know about it in deep detail. But it’s curious one man constantly needs to prove he’s number 1 at everything. He never started a single business, though. He is a salesman and tech influencer. How much someone is worth when their assets are stocks is also highly debatable. You use the latest sold stock to determine assess the value of all of them, but that is never what you get for them if you sell them, and not what you need to pay to buy all of them either. Musk is richer than you, you have no place talking about money. The only person rich enough to know how much Musk is worth is Musk himself. Come back when you're a trillionaire. I hope you are trolling. Being rich does not say anything about what you know about anything. Musk's account team knows way more about what he is actually worth than Musk himself.
I think Jock's sarcastic remark was mainly to parody oBlade's defensiveness of Musk.
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Northern Ireland26005 Posts
On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 23:46 oBlade wrote:On February 22 2025 20:01 KT_Elwood wrote:
Rofl oBlade you are so full of shit you could be one of Trumps man-diapers.
Ukraine's constitution says: No election in wartimes.
No russian narrative changes that.
It stipulates no elections under martial law. Martial law was a decision by the leader. If there's a war, you can have martial law or not. You can have martial law without a war, ex. mass disasters. The martial law can only be introduced only with the approval of the parliament. Also, more than 70% of Ukrainians are against holding elections. That's even higher than Zelensky's approval ratings, so it's not like it's only his supporters. Do you have anything to say about Trump trying to rig the 2020 elections or Putin regularly rigging elections in Russia? Or are you only concerned about politicians staying in power legally, and doing so illegally is fine by you?
Maybe he does, I can’t peek into the souls of men, or women for that matter.
A lot of this sentiment though more broadly strikes me as as concrete example of concern trolling as you can conceivably get. It’s so unbelievably transparent it’s in that category you can just disregard it almost out of hand.
It’s just utter, utter bollocks. It also completely sidesteps what Ukrainians feel and want.
Be it in a parallel universe, or perhaps the future of this one, if you get to a stage where Ukrainian morale breaks and the sentiment flips to ‘look we gave it a shot, we can’t collectively stomach more war’ then yeah you gotta respect that.
In that scenario, maintaining the war and martial law etc, sure that becomes increasingly untenable as a proposition. We’re not there yet.
It’s a confusing one to me. I don’t agree personally, I can at least understand a ‘not our problem’ attitude towards Ukraine. I just don’t understand Joe or Jane public being happy to be useful idiots for Russia, I really don’t. It’s just thoroughly bizarre to me
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On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 23:46 oBlade wrote:On February 22 2025 20:01 KT_Elwood wrote:
Rofl oBlade you are so full of shit you could be one of Trumps man-diapers.
Ukraine's constitution says: No election in wartimes.
No russian narrative changes that.
It stipulates no elections under martial law. Martial law was a decision by the leader. If there's a war, you can have martial law or not. You can have martial law without a war, ex. mass disasters. The martial law can only be introduced only with the approval of the parliament. Also, more than 70% of Ukrainians are against holding elections. That's even higher than Zelensky's approval ratings, so it's not like it's only his supporters.
Interesting to use polls to oppose elections. Can you explain how I can trust those polls if they're a justification for my country to support another country while that country sidelines democracy for the time being? How long does the grace run out? Like how many years of the poll-supported government not making peace constrain the peace-supporting American administration to just let the status quo continue? Is there no restriction or what does he get? 5 years of not making peace before we make it for him? 10 years? What if the country changes their mind but he and his parliament don't feel like giving up their spots? What if they ban more opposition parties to maintain an edge?
On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:
Do you have anything to say about Trump trying to rig the 2020 elections
I fully commit to going on a hunger strike until he stops his efforts to rig the 2020 elections.
On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:
or Putin regularly rigging elections in Russia? Or are you only concerned about politicians staying in power legally, and doing so illegally is fine by you?
By asking me about Putin now, we see you haven't even read this single page all the way through. That's fine, it's a lot to ask. Let me be unequivocal here. I am officially calling out Putin, as well as the last 4 administrations that sent aid to him despite him not having elections. This is the last straw, Vladimir. Feel the pressure.
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Trying to compare the 1814 congressional (not presidential) election and the civil war when the north was winning across the board to the Russian invasion of Ukraine is really werid. Do not listen to Trump they did not have airports back then nor did they have missiles they could accuratly fire into people waiting at polling stations. Trying to preempt people doing bad things and justifying you doing something "because it might happen" is delusional. They have a very clear constitution to follow, thats how democracies work. I know going against the constitution when it doesn't suit you is very on brand for republicans but thats not how being pro-democracy works.
Also can we dig into why they think that Haliburton "got the oil"? I don't know who told you that but thats not how that works. Iraq has nationalized its oil fields back in the 70's and they've maintained control over it ever sense.
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Northern Ireland26005 Posts
On February 23 2025 00:55 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:On February 22 2025 23:46 oBlade wrote:On February 22 2025 20:01 KT_Elwood wrote:
Rofl oBlade you are so full of shit you could be one of Trumps man-diapers.
Ukraine's constitution says: No election in wartimes.
No russian narrative changes that.
It stipulates no elections under martial law. Martial law was a decision by the leader. If there's a war, you can have martial law or not. You can have martial law without a war, ex. mass disasters. The martial law can only be introduced only with the approval of the parliament. Also, more than 70% of Ukrainians are against holding elections. That's even higher than Zelensky's approval ratings, so it's not like it's only his supporters. Interesting to use polls to oppose elections. Can you explain how I can trust those polls if they're a justification for my country to support another country while that country sidelines democracy for the time being? How long does the grace run out? Like how many years of the poll-supported government not making peace constrain the peace-supporting American administration to just let the status quo continue? Is there no restriction or what does he get? 5 years of not making peace before we make it for him? 10 years? What if the country changes their mind but he and his parliament don't feel like giving up their spots? What if they ban more opposition parties to maintain an edge? Show nested quote +On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:
Do you have anything to say about Trump trying to rig the 2020 elections I fully commit to going on a hunger strike until he stops his efforts to rig the 2020 elections. Show nested quote +On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:
or Putin regularly rigging elections in Russia? Or are you only concerned about politicians staying in power legally, and doing so illegally is fine by you? By asking me about Putin now, we see you haven't even read this single page all the way through. That's fine, it's a lot to ask. Let me be unequivocal here. I am officially calling out Putin, as well as the last 4 administrations that sent aid to him despite him not having elections. This is the last straw, Vladimir. Feel the pressure.
Lmao
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Why even engage with these vile takes any longer. It's so tiring.
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On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2025 23:46 oBlade wrote:On February 22 2025 20:01 KT_Elwood wrote:
Rofl oBlade you are so full of shit you could be one of Trumps man-diapers.
Ukraine's constitution says: No election in wartimes.
No russian narrative changes that.
It stipulates no elections under martial law. Martial law was a decision by the leader. If there's a war, you can have martial law or not. You can have martial law without a war, ex. mass disasters. The martial law can only be introduced only with the approval of the parliament. Also, more than 70% of Ukrainians are against holding elections. That's even higher than Zelensky's approval ratings, so it's not like it's only his supporters. Do you have anything to say about Trump trying to rig the 2020 elections or Putin regularly rigging elections in Russia? Or are you only concerned about politicians staying in power legally, and doing so illegally is fine by you?
Please stop taking the bait, he doesn't have any principles.
Cried about social media censorship until Musk started banning critics and woke words.
Cried about debt until debt is raised so that oligarchs contribute less.
Cried about migrant rapes until a rapist promised to help him with his great replacement paranoia.
Cried about Christian rights until Christians asked his rapist tyrant to be kind and got harrassed.
Cries about no elections in Ukraine until no elections or no fair elections (without being invaded) means his guys get to stay in charge forever, then it will be fine.
There's a lot of Trump voters that have been misinformed or emotionally manipulated, he isn't one of them. He's gonna be on the side with the armbands until the end.
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On February 23 2025 00:55 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:On February 22 2025 23:46 oBlade wrote:On February 22 2025 20:01 KT_Elwood wrote:
Rofl oBlade you are so full of shit you could be one of Trumps man-diapers.
Ukraine's constitution says: No election in wartimes.
No russian narrative changes that.
It stipulates no elections under martial law. Martial law was a decision by the leader. If there's a war, you can have martial law or not. You can have martial law without a war, ex. mass disasters. The martial law can only be introduced only with the approval of the parliament. Also, more than 70% of Ukrainians are against holding elections. That's even higher than Zelensky's approval ratings, so it's not like it's only his supporters. Interesting to use polls to oppose elections. Can you explain how I can trust those polls if they're a justification for my country to support another country while that country sidelines democracy for the time being? How long does the grace run out? Like how many years of the poll-supported government not making peace constrain the peace-supporting American administration to just let the status quo continue? Is there no restriction or what does he get? 5 years of not making peace before we make it for him? 10 years? What if the country changes their mind but he and his parliament don't feel like giving up their spots? What if they ban more opposition parties to maintain an edge? Show nested quote +On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:
Do you have anything to say about Trump trying to rig the 2020 elections I fully commit to going on a hunger strike until he stops his efforts to rig the 2020 elections. Show nested quote +On February 23 2025 00:08 maybenexttime wrote:
or Putin regularly rigging elections in Russia? Or are you only concerned about politicians staying in power legally, and doing so illegally is fine by you? By asking me about Putin now, we see you haven't even read this single page all the way through. That's fine, it's a lot to ask. Let me be unequivocal here. I am officially calling out Putin, as well as the last 4 administrations that sent aid to him despite him not having elections. This is the last straw, Vladimir. Feel the pressure.
You're a clown. Have you ironed your brown shirt yet?
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EPT
