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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
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On March 23 2019 09:51 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 09:41 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:28 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 08:23 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 08:17 IgnE wrote:On March 23 2019 07:15 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 07:11 NewSunshine wrote:On March 23 2019 07:08 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 07:02 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 06:53 Excludos wrote:
[quote]
I love how certain you are before you have seen anything resembling contents of the report. This is pretty telling to how you treat every subject here: You've already made up your mind on what the truth is, despite no evidence to suggest that your view is correct. The rest of us sit here cautiously optimistic, while you sit there already planning your victory party. Do you not see how this is a very bad way to tackle problems in your life? What else can you not imagine the possibility of being wrong on that people around you might both disagree and know more about? Oh please. You and many others have been wildly proclaiming that Trump, his family, and his team were all going to be prosecuted for colluding with Russians for two years. Did he? Did he really? What about the others? Did they do that too? Or is this another case of you making broad, sweeping statements in an effort to paint people into a corner in an argument? Also, is he trying to bullshit us, or himself, when he thinks that this is "the end of the line"? This is not the only investigation being done into Trump and his dealings, and it isn't the totality of the criminal investigation either. This is just another stage in the process and anyone predicting to be sure of the outcome is very silly, to say the least.. unless they are correct, right? just have patience before saying xdaunt is wrong. then when they release the incriminating report and you find out he’s wrong for sure he’ll have to eat a hat, right? or is this a case of “the lady doth protest too much” You are right. If their speculation turns out to be correct, they will be vindicated. Dauntless’s flavor of condescending speculation included. Edit: but if we are predicting things, mine is that Trump leaves office in 2020 at the earliest, no matter how bad that report is. There was never going to be enough evidence to push the needle to the point where the senate would vote to remove him. Small hint: there isn’t a lot of speculation on my part. There has been ample information to work off of for many months, a lot of which I have cited to in this thread and the blog. It just has been ignored by mainstream outlets for the usual political reasons. Long story short, anyone who has been paying attention to the details is entirely unsurprised by Mueller’s nothingburger. It's been two years, so I'm content to wait a few days, but it's been fun watching the Andrew McCarthy pieces I've been posting turn out to be true, when twitter and thread experts said that, no, Mueller was building his collusion case! Since at least December 2017 things looked like they would turn out this way... just a few more days... If there really is nothing besides "firing Comey was shady" then there should be many victory laps and the people who pushed this should be reminded of that again and again. To squander the first two years of a presidency on this is a huge scandal. So I think I will wait just a few more days... I wouldn't say it was squandered if the information gleaned is worth it.
The only information worth it is collusion, some sort of conspiracy to unfairly win an election. That's what this was about. Getting a few dirty operators at the cost of presidential legitimacy and time (taking so much oxygen out of the room) is certainly not worth it. But that will be one line of the defense. It doesn't matter where the goalposts move, to be honest, just that they are mobile. That fact should be repeated endlessly.
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It's incredible that the exact same posters that wouldn't stop talking about Benghazi years later and still bring up Hilary's emails every week are calling this a nothingburger waste of time. I'm sure if an investigation of the Obama admin had led to his personal lawyer, a former chief of staff, and some of his advisers being sentenced to prison before even disclosing the degree of his personal involvement in this hypothetical, it would be a waste of time that you'd totally not shove down this forum's throat for a decade.
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Lol with the way Danglers, Introvert, and xDaunt are talking you'd think that it had already been announced that Mueller not only didn't find a single incriminating fact about Trump or any of his family members, but that he in fact found evidence which DISPROVES every negative public story about Trump (funny enough this would have to include evidence which disproves Trumps own on the record statements and acts).
Hell, why stop there! I bet Mueller actually found incriminating evidence that Hillary was the one conspiring with Russia! Genius!
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Goes both ways, wouldn't you say? Unwitting collusion would be laughable, but par for such an addled brained president. I'll wait to read what is released, but I do expect some choice nuggets to fall. Either way, the day of reckoning of the investigation is nigh.
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On March 23 2019 10:00 On_Slaught wrote:
Lol with the way Danglers, Introvert, and xDaunt are talking you'd think that it had already been announced that Mueller not only didn't find a single incriminating fact about Trump or any of his family members, but that he in fact found evidence which DISPROVES every negative public story about Trump (funny enough this would have to include evidence which disproves Trumps own on the record statements and acts).
Hell, why stop there! I bet Mueller actually found incriminating evidence that Hillary was the one conspiring with Russia! Genius!
With how you're describing mild, jovial ribbing, you'd think the only permissible sentiment at the end is sadness! Can you imagine your side of the aisle if indictments were announced together with the announced ending of the Mueller report?
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I'm still waiting. But I've been consistent since day one. Collusion or bust. Literally nothing else in the report matters. This is all because a certain party lost a presidential election and was certain the president cheated to win. If he didn't cheat, that's that. End of story. "Trump Tower Moscow" ain't gonna cut it.
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On March 23 2019 09:59 Dan HH wrote:
It's incredible that the exact same posters that wouldn't stop talking about Benghazi years later and still bring up Hilary's emails every week are calling this a nothingburger waste of time. I'm sure if an investigation of the Obama admin had led to his personal lawyer, a former chief of staff, and some of his advisers being sentenced to prison before even disclosing the degree of his personal involvement in this hypothetical, it would be a waste of time that you'd totally not shove down this forum's throat for a decade.
No one with real prosecutorial authority seriously investigated Benghazi. No special counsel. Certainly not Obama’s DOJ. In fact, it should be obvious now that Obama’s DOJ was highly politicized if not outright corrupt. Just look at Strzok’s testimony (highlighted by Danglars earlier this week) about all of the special deals that were agreed to by Loretta Lynch’s crew that insulated Hillary and the Clintons from any fallout from the e-mail scandal. And I don’t think that it is coincidental that many of the players involved in that were appointed to Mueller’s team. Well, time is up for them now. Time for Horowitz to get to work.
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United States42649 Posts
On March 23 2019 09:57 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 09:51 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On March 23 2019 09:41 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:28 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 08:23 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 08:17 IgnE wrote:On March 23 2019 07:15 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 07:11 NewSunshine wrote:On March 23 2019 07:08 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 07:02 xDaunt wrote:
[quote]
Oh please. You and many others have been wildly proclaiming that Trump, his family, and his team were all going to be prosecuted for colluding with Russians for two years. Did he? Did he really? What about the others? Did they do that too? Or is this another case of you making broad, sweeping statements in an effort to paint people into a corner in an argument? Also, is he trying to bullshit us, or himself, when he thinks that this is "the end of the line"? This is not the only investigation being done into Trump and his dealings, and it isn't the totality of the criminal investigation either. This is just another stage in the process and anyone predicting to be sure of the outcome is very silly, to say the least.. unless they are correct, right? just have patience before saying xdaunt is wrong. then when they release the incriminating report and you find out he’s wrong for sure he’ll have to eat a hat, right? or is this a case of “the lady doth protest too much” You are right. If their speculation turns out to be correct, they will be vindicated. Dauntless’s flavor of condescending speculation included. Edit: but if we are predicting things, mine is that Trump leaves office in 2020 at the earliest, no matter how bad that report is. There was never going to be enough evidence to push the needle to the point where the senate would vote to remove him. Small hint: there isn’t a lot of speculation on my part. There has been ample information to work off of for many months, a lot of which I have cited to in this thread and the blog. It just has been ignored by mainstream outlets for the usual political reasons. Long story short, anyone who has been paying attention to the details is entirely unsurprised by Mueller’s nothingburger. It's been two years, so I'm content to wait a few days, but it's been fun watching the Andrew McCarthy pieces I've been posting turn out to be true, when twitter and thread experts said that, no, Mueller was building his collusion case! Since at least December 2017 things looked like they would turn out this way... just a few more days... If there really is nothing besides "firing Comey was shady" then there should be many victory laps and the people who pushed this should be reminded of that again and again. To squander the first two years of a presidency on this is a huge scandal. So I think I will wait just a few more days... I wouldn't say it was squandered if the information gleaned is worth it. The only information worth it is collusion, some sort of conspiracy to unfairly win an election. That's what this was about. Getting a few dirty operators at the cost of presidential legitimacy and time (taking so much oxygen out of the room) is certainly not worth it. But that will be one line of the defense. It doesn't matter where the goalposts move, to be honest, just that they are mobile. That fact should be repeated endlessly.
But we already have Trump Jr conspiring to get hacked emails. If that’s your benchmark we’ve already passed it.
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On March 23 2019 10:09 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 09:57 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:51 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On March 23 2019 09:41 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:28 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 08:23 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 08:17 IgnE wrote:On March 23 2019 07:15 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 07:11 NewSunshine wrote:On March 23 2019 07:08 Plansix wrote:
[quote]
Did he? Did he really? What about the others? Did they do that too? Or is this another case of you making broad, sweeping statements in an effort to paint people into a corner in an argument? Also, is he trying to bullshit us, or himself, when he thinks that this is "the end of the line"? This is not the only investigation being done into Trump and his dealings, and it isn't the totality of the criminal investigation either. This is just another stage in the process and anyone predicting to be sure of the outcome is very silly, to say the least.. unless they are correct, right? just have patience before saying xdaunt is wrong. then when they release the incriminating report and you find out he’s wrong for sure he’ll have to eat a hat, right? or is this a case of “the lady doth protest too much” You are right. If their speculation turns out to be correct, they will be vindicated. Dauntless’s flavor of condescending speculation included. Edit: but if we are predicting things, mine is that Trump leaves office in 2020 at the earliest, no matter how bad that report is. There was never going to be enough evidence to push the needle to the point where the senate would vote to remove him. Small hint: there isn’t a lot of speculation on my part. There has been ample information to work off of for many months, a lot of which I have cited to in this thread and the blog. It just has been ignored by mainstream outlets for the usual political reasons. Long story short, anyone who has been paying attention to the details is entirely unsurprised by Mueller’s nothingburger. It's been two years, so I'm content to wait a few days, but it's been fun watching the Andrew McCarthy pieces I've been posting turn out to be true, when twitter and thread experts said that, no, Mueller was building his collusion case! Since at least December 2017 things looked like they would turn out this way... just a few more days... If there really is nothing besides "firing Comey was shady" then there should be many victory laps and the people who pushed this should be reminded of that again and again. To squander the first two years of a presidency on this is a huge scandal. So I think I will wait just a few more days... I wouldn't say it was squandered if the information gleaned is worth it. The only information worth it is collusion, some sort of conspiracy to unfairly win an election. That's what this was about. Getting a few dirty operators at the cost of presidential legitimacy and time (taking so much oxygen out of the room) is certainly not worth it. But that will be one line of the defense. It doesn't matter where the goalposts move, to be honest, just that they are mobile. That fact should be repeated endlessly. But we already have Trump Jr conspiring to get hacked emails. If that’s your benchmark we’ve already passed it.
And we already know Trump asked for Russia to leak Hillarys emails publically. And we know that Russia executed a misinformation campaign with the ultimate and specific goal of electing Trump. And that Trump has been particularly kind/soft on Russia (despite the best efforts of Congress). I mean hell, did yall watch Helsinki?
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On March 23 2019 10:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:
Goes both ways, wouldn't you say? Unwitting collusion would be laughable, but par for such an addled brained president. I'll wait to read what is released, but I do expect some choice nuggets to fall. Either way, the day of reckoning of the investigation is nigh. We're passed unwitting collusion considering Trump has said that Jr. went to the meeting in Trump tower knowing they were offering dirt on Hillary.
We're solidly into wilful collusion since some time last year.
There is no question whether 'collusion' happened since the Trumps have admitted to doing it. The only question is if they get away with it on what would likely be a technicality.
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On March 23 2019 10:09 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 09:57 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:51 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On March 23 2019 09:41 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:28 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 08:23 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 08:17 IgnE wrote:On March 23 2019 07:15 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 07:11 NewSunshine wrote:On March 23 2019 07:08 Plansix wrote:
[quote]
Did he? Did he really? What about the others? Did they do that too? Or is this another case of you making broad, sweeping statements in an effort to paint people into a corner in an argument? Also, is he trying to bullshit us, or himself, when he thinks that this is "the end of the line"? This is not the only investigation being done into Trump and his dealings, and it isn't the totality of the criminal investigation either. This is just another stage in the process and anyone predicting to be sure of the outcome is very silly, to say the least.. unless they are correct, right? just have patience before saying xdaunt is wrong. then when they release the incriminating report and you find out he’s wrong for sure he’ll have to eat a hat, right? or is this a case of “the lady doth protest too much” You are right. If their speculation turns out to be correct, they will be vindicated. Dauntless’s flavor of condescending speculation included. Edit: but if we are predicting things, mine is that Trump leaves office in 2020 at the earliest, no matter how bad that report is. There was never going to be enough evidence to push the needle to the point where the senate would vote to remove him. Small hint: there isn’t a lot of speculation on my part. There has been ample information to work off of for many months, a lot of which I have cited to in this thread and the blog. It just has been ignored by mainstream outlets for the usual political reasons. Long story short, anyone who has been paying attention to the details is entirely unsurprised by Mueller’s nothingburger. It's been two years, so I'm content to wait a few days, but it's been fun watching the Andrew McCarthy pieces I've been posting turn out to be true, when twitter and thread experts said that, no, Mueller was building his collusion case! Since at least December 2017 things looked like they would turn out this way... just a few more days... If there really is nothing besides "firing Comey was shady" then there should be many victory laps and the people who pushed this should be reminded of that again and again. To squander the first two years of a presidency on this is a huge scandal. So I think I will wait just a few more days... I wouldn't say it was squandered if the information gleaned is worth it. The only information worth it is collusion, some sort of conspiracy to unfairly win an election. That's what this was about. Getting a few dirty operators at the cost of presidential legitimacy and time (taking so much oxygen out of the room) is certainly not worth it. But that will be one line of the defense. It doesn't matter where the goalposts move, to be honest, just that they are mobile. That fact should be repeated endlessly. But we already have Trump Jr conspiring to get hacked emails. If that’s your benchmark we’ve already passed it.
And what came of that? Nothing. I know you have your pet theory on that meeting, but I've already given you a plausible explanation for it. Besides, I've acknowledged the Don Jr. thing was the closest we've come... and nothing. All this talk of back channels, Trump working with the Russians on the hacking itself, or a corrupt quid pro quo. Seems like that will all amount to a big, fat zero.
And so much for that funky charge about jr being in trouble for trying to obtain a "thing of value" in the form of the emails, lol.
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On March 23 2019 10:07 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 09:59 Dan HH wrote:
It's incredible that the exact same posters that wouldn't stop talking about Benghazi years later and still bring up Hilary's emails every week are calling this a nothingburger waste of time. I'm sure if an investigation of the Obama admin had led to his personal lawyer, a former chief of staff, and some of his advisers being sentenced to prison before even disclosing the degree of his personal involvement in this hypothetical, it would be a waste of time that you'd totally not shove down this forum's throat for a decade. No one with real prosecutorial authority seriously investigated Benghazi. No special counsel. Certainly not Obama’s DOJ. In fact, it should be obvious now that Obama’s DOJ was highly politicized if not outright corrupt. Just look at Strzok’s testimony (highlighted by Danglars earlier this week) about all of the special deals that were agreed to by Loretta Lynch’s crew that insulated Hillary and the Clintons from any fallout from the e-mail scandal. And I don’t think that it is coincidental that many of the players involved in that were appointed to Mueller’s team. Well, time is up for them now. Time for Horowitz to get to work.
If the issue was just a corrupt DOJ and inept congressional investigations, then what are they waiting for now? The last 2 years they have controlled every branch of govt and the DOJ.
Ofc NOW it is coming up again for Republicans now that they lost the house and Trump is under fire. Could it be that the whole thing is just a political football Republicans throw out to appease/distract their base when needed? I'm thinking yes.
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On March 23 2019 10:07 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 09:59 Dan HH wrote:
It's incredible that the exact same posters that wouldn't stop talking about Benghazi years later and still bring up Hilary's emails every week are calling this a nothingburger waste of time. I'm sure if an investigation of the Obama admin had led to his personal lawyer, a former chief of staff, and some of his advisers being sentenced to prison before even disclosing the degree of his personal involvement in this hypothetical, it would be a waste of time that you'd totally not shove down this forum's throat for a decade. No one with real prosecutorial authority seriously investigated Benghazi. No special counsel. Certainly not Obama’s DOJ. In fact, it should be obvious now that Obama’s DOJ was highly politicized if not outright corrupt. Just look at Strzok’s testimony (highlighted by Danglars earlier this week) about all of the special deals that were agreed to by Loretta Lynch’s crew that insulated Hillary and the Clintons from any fallout from the e-mail scandal. And I don’t think that it is coincidental that many of the players involved in that were appointed to Mueller’s team. Well, time is up for them now. Time for Horowitz to get to work.
Why would a prosecutor investigate something that wasn’t a crime?
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On March 23 2019 10:23 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 10:09 KwarK wrote:On March 23 2019 09:57 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:51 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On March 23 2019 09:41 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:28 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 08:23 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 08:17 IgnE wrote:On March 23 2019 07:15 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 07:11 NewSunshine wrote:
[quote]
Also, is he trying to bullshit us, or himself, when he thinks that this is "the end of the line"? This is not the only investigation being done into Trump and his dealings, and it isn't the totality of the criminal investigation either. This is just another stage in the process and anyone predicting to be sure of the outcome is very silly, to say the least.. unless they are correct, right? just have patience before saying xdaunt is wrong. then when they release the incriminating report and you find out he’s wrong for sure he’ll have to eat a hat, right? or is this a case of “the lady doth protest too much” You are right. If their speculation turns out to be correct, they will be vindicated. Dauntless’s flavor of condescending speculation included. Edit: but if we are predicting things, mine is that Trump leaves office in 2020 at the earliest, no matter how bad that report is. There was never going to be enough evidence to push the needle to the point where the senate would vote to remove him. Small hint: there isn’t a lot of speculation on my part. There has been ample information to work off of for many months, a lot of which I have cited to in this thread and the blog. It just has been ignored by mainstream outlets for the usual political reasons. Long story short, anyone who has been paying attention to the details is entirely unsurprised by Mueller’s nothingburger. It's been two years, so I'm content to wait a few days, but it's been fun watching the Andrew McCarthy pieces I've been posting turn out to be true, when twitter and thread experts said that, no, Mueller was building his collusion case! Since at least December 2017 things looked like they would turn out this way... just a few more days... If there really is nothing besides "firing Comey was shady" then there should be many victory laps and the people who pushed this should be reminded of that again and again. To squander the first two years of a presidency on this is a huge scandal. So I think I will wait just a few more days... I wouldn't say it was squandered if the information gleaned is worth it. The only information worth it is collusion, some sort of conspiracy to unfairly win an election. That's what this was about. Getting a few dirty operators at the cost of presidential legitimacy and time (taking so much oxygen out of the room) is certainly not worth it. But that will be one line of the defense. It doesn't matter where the goalposts move, to be honest, just that they are mobile. That fact should be repeated endlessly. But we already have Trump Jr conspiring to get hacked emails. If that’s your benchmark we’ve already passed it. And what came of that? Nothing. I know you have your pet theory on that meeting, but I've already given you a plausible explanation for it. Besides, I've acknowledged the Don Jr. thing was the closest we've come... and nothing. All this talk of back channels, Trump working with the Russians on the hacking itself, or a corrupt quid pro quo. Seems like that will all amount to a big, fat zero. And so much for that funky charge about jr being in trouble for trying to obtain a "thing of value" in the form of the emails, lol.
How do you know nothing came from the meeting when it is an undisputed fact (except by Trump himself ofc) that the Russians subsequently DID IN FACT TRY TO HELP TRUMP GET ELECTED?
I just dont get the willful blindness here. There literally was a quid and a quo. Just because Mueller doesnt find the smoking gun pro (email or w/e) doesnt mean it didnt happen; it just means it isnt indictable.
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United States42649 Posts
The bizarre thing is Trump isn’t disputing anything but that specific promises of policy were made in exchange for Russian aid. He’s not disputing the Russian aid, or the willful acceptance of that aid by his campaign. He’s not disputing that Stone worked with Russian intelligence. He’s not disputing that he asked for Russia to release the emails. And yet his defenders seem to dispute those.
It’s like some kind of car theft case where the accused testified that he took the car with the permission of the owner while his lawyer tries to convince the jury that he wasn’t even there and couldn’t possibly have stolen it.
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On March 23 2019 10:28 On_Slaught wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 10:23 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 10:09 KwarK wrote:On March 23 2019 09:57 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:51 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On March 23 2019 09:41 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:28 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 08:23 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 08:17 IgnE wrote:On March 23 2019 07:15 Plansix wrote:
[quote]
This is just another stage in the process and anyone predicting to be sure of the outcome is very silly, to say the least.. unless they are correct, right? just have patience before saying xdaunt is wrong. then when they release the incriminating report and you find out he’s wrong for sure he’ll have to eat a hat, right? or is this a case of “the lady doth protest too much” You are right. If their speculation turns out to be correct, they will be vindicated. Dauntless’s flavor of condescending speculation included. Edit: but if we are predicting things, mine is that Trump leaves office in 2020 at the earliest, no matter how bad that report is. There was never going to be enough evidence to push the needle to the point where the senate would vote to remove him. Small hint: there isn’t a lot of speculation on my part. There has been ample information to work off of for many months, a lot of which I have cited to in this thread and the blog. It just has been ignored by mainstream outlets for the usual political reasons. Long story short, anyone who has been paying attention to the details is entirely unsurprised by Mueller’s nothingburger. It's been two years, so I'm content to wait a few days, but it's been fun watching the Andrew McCarthy pieces I've been posting turn out to be true, when twitter and thread experts said that, no, Mueller was building his collusion case! Since at least December 2017 things looked like they would turn out this way... just a few more days... If there really is nothing besides "firing Comey was shady" then there should be many victory laps and the people who pushed this should be reminded of that again and again. To squander the first two years of a presidency on this is a huge scandal. So I think I will wait just a few more days... I wouldn't say it was squandered if the information gleaned is worth it. The only information worth it is collusion, some sort of conspiracy to unfairly win an election. That's what this was about. Getting a few dirty operators at the cost of presidential legitimacy and time (taking so much oxygen out of the room) is certainly not worth it. But that will be one line of the defense. It doesn't matter where the goalposts move, to be honest, just that they are mobile. That fact should be repeated endlessly. But we already have Trump Jr conspiring to get hacked emails. If that’s your benchmark we’ve already passed it. And what came of that? Nothing. I know you have your pet theory on that meeting, but I've already given you a plausible explanation for it. Besides, I've acknowledged the Don Jr. thing was the closest we've come... and nothing. All this talk of back channels, Trump working with the Russians on the hacking itself, or a corrupt quid pro quo. Seems like that will all amount to a big, fat zero. And so much for that funky charge about jr being in trouble for trying to obtain a "thing of value" in the form of the emails, lol. How do you know nothing came from the meeting when it is an undisputed fact (except by Trump himself ofc) that the Russians subsequently DID IN FACT TRY TO HELP TRUMP GET ELECTED? I just dont get the willful blindness here. There literally was a quid and a quo. Just because Mueller doesnt find the smoking gun pro (email or w/e) doesnt mean it didnt happen; it just means it isnt indictable.
Because if that's what this was all about there would not have been a SC investigation? See, the goalposts are moving at a steady trot already. I mean, if there was something there Mueller probably would have gone after Jr. on that silly "thing of value" charge. He didn't even do that. I'm sure there will be many mean words for Trump in the report, but...
But I'll hold my tongue until we know more over the weekend. To reiterate: this was always about the legitimacy of the 2016 election. If that is intact, then this was a big nothing. That's the standard, and given how much time has been spent on it, that is the only justifiable possibility.
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I agree with waiting at this point (got to get back to Sekiro - fuck that ogre!). However, if you care about the legitimacy of the 2016 election then that ship has already sailed. Regardless of what Mueller finds it doesnt change the fact that Russian interference and Comey being a dipshit influenced that election greatly and quite possibly changed it.
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United States42649 Posts
On March 23 2019 10:35 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 10:28 On_Slaught wrote:On March 23 2019 10:23 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 10:09 KwarK wrote:On March 23 2019 09:57 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:51 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On March 23 2019 09:41 Introvert wrote:On March 23 2019 09:28 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 08:23 Plansix wrote:On March 23 2019 08:17 IgnE wrote:
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unless they are correct, right? just have patience before saying xdaunt is wrong. then when they release the incriminating report and you find out he’s wrong for sure he’ll have to eat a hat, right?
or is this a case of “the lady doth protest too much” You are right. If their speculation turns out to be correct, they will be vindicated. Dauntless’s flavor of condescending speculation included. Edit: but if we are predicting things, mine is that Trump leaves office in 2020 at the earliest, no matter how bad that report is. There was never going to be enough evidence to push the needle to the point where the senate would vote to remove him. Small hint: there isn’t a lot of speculation on my part. There has been ample information to work off of for many months, a lot of which I have cited to in this thread and the blog. It just has been ignored by mainstream outlets for the usual political reasons. Long story short, anyone who has been paying attention to the details is entirely unsurprised by Mueller’s nothingburger. It's been two years, so I'm content to wait a few days, but it's been fun watching the Andrew McCarthy pieces I've been posting turn out to be true, when twitter and thread experts said that, no, Mueller was building his collusion case! Since at least December 2017 things looked like they would turn out this way... just a few more days... If there really is nothing besides "firing Comey was shady" then there should be many victory laps and the people who pushed this should be reminded of that again and again. To squander the first two years of a presidency on this is a huge scandal. So I think I will wait just a few more days... I wouldn't say it was squandered if the information gleaned is worth it. The only information worth it is collusion, some sort of conspiracy to unfairly win an election. That's what this was about. Getting a few dirty operators at the cost of presidential legitimacy and time (taking so much oxygen out of the room) is certainly not worth it. But that will be one line of the defense. It doesn't matter where the goalposts move, to be honest, just that they are mobile. That fact should be repeated endlessly. But we already have Trump Jr conspiring to get hacked emails. If that’s your benchmark we’ve already passed it. And what came of that? Nothing. I know you have your pet theory on that meeting, but I've already given you a plausible explanation for it. Besides, I've acknowledged the Don Jr. thing was the closest we've come... and nothing. All this talk of back channels, Trump working with the Russians on the hacking itself, or a corrupt quid pro quo. Seems like that will all amount to a big, fat zero. And so much for that funky charge about jr being in trouble for trying to obtain a "thing of value" in the form of the emails, lol. How do you know nothing came from the meeting when it is an undisputed fact (except by Trump himself ofc) that the Russians subsequently DID IN FACT TRY TO HELP TRUMP GET ELECTED? I just dont get the willful blindness here. There literally was a quid and a quo. Just because Mueller doesnt find the smoking gun pro (email or w/e) doesnt mean it didnt happen; it just means it isnt indictable. Because if that's what this was all about there would not have been a SC investigation? See, the goalposts are moving at a steady trot already. I mean, if there was something there Mueller probably would have gone after Jr. on that silly "thing of value" charge. He didn't even do that. I'm sure there will be many mean words for Trump in the report, but... But I'll hold my tongue until we know more over the weekend. To reiterate: this was always about the legitimacy of the 2016 election. If that is intact, then this was a big nothing. That's the standard, and given how much time has been spent on it, that is the only justifiable possibility.
They were never going to hold a do-over and eject Trump’s appointees etc. it’s not about the legitimacy of the election, more electoral college members nominated Trump and that’s all that matters for elections. It’s not like he got the most votes in any case.
The question isn’t whether the election was legitimate, it was whether the president is a criminal.
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The big nothing ordered by Republicans at the DOJ, carriers by by a Republican form FBI head to investigate into contacts between the Trump campaign and Russia. Which they found. Did any criminal acts take place during those contacts? Maybe.
You can see people setting up their own personal goalposts right now.
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On March 23 2019 10:23 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On March 23 2019 10:07 xDaunt wrote:On March 23 2019 09:59 Dan HH wrote:
It's incredible that the exact same posters that wouldn't stop talking about Benghazi years later and still bring up Hilary's emails every week are calling this a nothingburger waste of time. I'm sure if an investigation of the Obama admin had led to his personal lawyer, a former chief of staff, and some of his advisers being sentenced to prison before even disclosing the degree of his personal involvement in this hypothetical, it would be a waste of time that you'd totally not shove down this forum's throat for a decade. No one with real prosecutorial authority seriously investigated Benghazi. No special counsel. Certainly not Obama’s DOJ. In fact, it should be obvious now that Obama’s DOJ was highly politicized if not outright corrupt. Just look at Strzok’s testimony (highlighted by Danglars earlier this week) about all of the special deals that were agreed to by Loretta Lynch’s crew that insulated Hillary and the Clintons from any fallout from the e-mail scandal. And I don’t think that it is coincidental that many of the players involved in that were appointed to Mueller’s team. Well, time is up for them now. Time for Horowitz to get to work. Why would a prosecutor investigate something that wasn’t a crime?
My point is that there was no investigation and that the Obama administration had demonstrably zero inclination to take a hard look at anything that might be embarrassing to itself or its allies.
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EPT
