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Shootings and Casualties in Central Paris - Page 19

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Keep the discussion ON TOPIC. This thread is for discussing the terror attacks in Paris.
Faust852
Profile Joined February 2012
Luxembourg4004 Posts
November 13 2015 23:48 GMT
#361
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Definitly a french guy

"When you'll see this picture on BFM, it will be too late"
Djzapz
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada10681 Posts
November 13 2015 23:48 GMT
#362
On November 14 2015 08:46 Erasme wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2015 08:41 Djzapz wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:36 Erasme wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:30 Djzapz wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:23 Erasme wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:21 Djzapz wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:20 Erasme wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:04 Erasme wrote:
Wow, i'm so glad Merkel decided to welcome all refugees in Germany, then when she realized she couldn't, she basically forced the rest of the EU to welcome them.
I'm also so glad we should, as the EU, follow the economic german model. You know, the one with no minimal wages and legal slaves. Oh, and their states totally work, especially when it doesn't, but we should follow it ahahha
lets all be dumbs ahaha

im sorry guys ahah i clearly overreacted see i fixed it teehee

Do you think this is a reasonable reaction to tens of deaths?

I already sent messages to my friends who heard gunshots right down their houses thanks internet warrior clueless of economy and politics

I know a lot about those topics, I teach one of them in a university and I'm decently versed in the other... I'm just not fond of "Merkel is responsible of this" with no context, no explanation, a very absolute statement too which shows a lack of actual understanding of the issues. Anyone with half a brain would be skeptical of the BS spouted by someone like you - single-cause explanation of a complicated issue.

Good to hear that you've sent messages though.

Anyone with half a brain wouldn't need explainations on those statements. Or do you, as a teacher, believe that the German model work ? Or that Merkel and the rest of the EU didn't go overboard with their promises on the syrian crisis ?
The answer can be simplified by : No it doesn't work, yes they did go overboard. The world is in an economic crisis right now, do you think that countries like France, Spain, Italy with a weakened economy can take tens thousands of refugees ?

Those are all questions which could be handled in hundreds of pages and the general population have a very basic understanding of them and their implications. To say "merkel" is responsible for this is extremely reductive. Now, I'll admit that I'm not an expert on this topic, but I don't need to be an expect to point out that the point you made is outright bad.

If you think Merkel's policies played a role in this (or is ENTIRELY responsible for this, as you suggested before), then explain why. I can't stand these kinds of assertions, never assume that people know what you mean. We live in a world where people have agendas. Most people who blame Hollande for this, most people who blame Merkel for this, they're just angry assholes who don't understand shit. If you think you're anything more than an angry asshole with a beef against a politician in particular, prove it by explaining your ideas.

I read those hundred pages, wrote a couple of paper on it. I don't have the time to rewrite it here. I explained it enough in my last post. My teachers might be biased, however i am not entirely wrong. I love Germany so much I want two.

Then forgive me for not believing your word outright.
"My incompetence with power tools had been increasing exponentially over the course of 20 years spent inhaling experimental oven cleaners"
m4ini
Profile Joined February 2014
4215 Posts
November 13 2015 23:49 GMT
#363
Is that confirmed?
On track to MA1950A.
RouaF
Profile Joined October 2010
France4121 Posts
November 13 2015 23:49 GMT
#364
Assault given, terrorists killed.
KlaCkoN
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1661 Posts
November 13 2015 23:49 GMT
#365
On November 14 2015 08:38 Simberto wrote:
Yeah, i am quite confused what any of this has to do with refugees. As far as i know in this case it isn't clear yet, but usually these things tend to be done by people of the nation they blow up. I fully expect it to turn out that the terrorists are french, and not some people who snuck into france through german refugee camps.

I am also ashamed to see terrorists so obviously succeeding in breeding mistrusts and xenophobia in western society. We should be better than this, but it seems that increasingly every time something happens the "all muslims are backwards barbarians" fraction gets louder and louder.

Of course they are going to turn out to be french. And people like erasme desperately trying to blame someone other than france for the failures of french society is beyond pathetic.

I hope the storming of the theater goes well, people dying is always awful.
"Voice or no voice the people can always be brought to the bidding of their leaders ... All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger."
Cele
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Germany4016 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-13 23:50:40
November 13 2015 23:50 GMT
#366
recent studies have shown that the influx of refugees in germany did not have any influx on criminality rate. So, i don't think there's a valid connection. Most likely (as in the past) the terrorists have a french passport. I think we, as european society, have to be careful not to bring xenophobia into the discsussion.
Broodwar for life!
Half the Sky
Profile Joined May 2014
Germany9029 Posts
November 13 2015 23:50 GMT
#367
On November 14 2015 08:46 m4ini wrote:
Hm.. Raid going for more than 15 minutes apparently now (if you judge by news source times) - how long does a raid like that take, generally? Honest question, never really checked up on that.


Best guess? Depends on the size of the place, what is known about the place (like are there a lot of rooms to clear, seal off exits), number of known people in the building, etc. The more complex, obviously, then longer.
The phoenix must burn to emerge. - Janet Fitch
dmnum
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Brazil6910 Posts
November 13 2015 23:50 GMT
#368
On November 14 2015 08:48 Faust852 wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Definitly a french guy

"When you'll see this picture on BFM, it will be too late"
That could be a photo of another person...better not to post those things until we know for sure who did it, I guess.
DeepElemBlues
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States5079 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-13 23:54:16
November 13 2015 23:50 GMT
#369
On November 14 2015 08:45 _vk_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2015 08:25 zeo wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:22 KwarK wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:19 Rocket-Bear wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:16 KwarK wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:11 ahswtini wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:09 KwarK wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:07 ahswtini wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:06 KwarK wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:04 ahswtini wrote:
[quote]
how about looking after our own first? shit sucks, u cant help everyone in the world, but ultimately france should put the safety of its own people first

You a Loyalist by any chance?

i'm a realist

Do you remember that time the English decided the IRA were too much effort and left the Nirish on their own? I don't. I recall terrorism being accepted as the price of a necessary fight to protect the rights of the people.

how is this relevant? northern ireland = part of the uk. the people of northern ireland are british. of course the british government can't abandon them. how is this related to european countries being obliged to help refugees at the expense of their own security?


We're all people. The difference between English and Nirish is not so much less than between French and Syrian.

Are you actually serious?

There are bigger core value differences. And you know the part that Syria is a muslim country

And for being a "religion of peace" they sure tend to end up in a lot of wars

I didn't mean in terms of core values or culture although it is interesting to note that a large number of people in Northern Ireland were passionately anti English to the point of bombings and so forth and were also very passionately of a different religion to the English majority.

But I was more talking in terms of "people are people everywhere". Christians seem to get into a fair few wars too. Do we have an atheist control group to check if it's not just a thing that people do?

Atheist control groups are called communists, I'm sure atheists have caused a fair few more deaths then religious people over the last century.


Granted, the Soviet state was atheistic in a technical sense.

But as a system Soviet Communism was a state religious thought control system, complete with their own holy figures and relic. (Lenin being an example of both.) The parallels between it and standard monoteistic religions like Christianity and Islam are really clear, it just wasn't as good at it as they are.

Not surprising considering they aimed at the same wetware. (Human brains.)


That is so inaccurate and simply wrong. The Soviet Union was not technically atheist. It was officially, militantly, and proudly atheist and killed tens of thousands of people for being religious. Pointing out general similarities in all universal belief systems (that is, they claim to explain all aspects of human life and nature and promise a utopia either on earth or after death if their strictures are followed) does not suddenly make the Soviet Union only technically atheist.
no place i'd rather be than the satellite of love
Weryeery
Profile Joined June 2008
288 Posts
November 13 2015 23:50 GMT
#370
assault finished at bataclan. terrorists killed
m4ini
Profile Joined February 2014
4215 Posts
November 13 2015 23:51 GMT
#371
Sky News now confirming, one bomb on Exit J of the stadium.

How is that even possible? In germany, you have to jump through hoops to get into a stadium, including bomb searching dogs and whatnot - how can they smuggle a bomb in there?
On track to MA1950A.
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
November 13 2015 23:51 GMT
#372
On November 14 2015 08:50 Weryeery wrote:
assault finished at bataclan. terrorists killed

how many casulties?
WriterXiao8~~
_vk_
Profile Joined April 2010
219 Posts
November 13 2015 23:51 GMT
#373
On November 14 2015 08:46 m4ini wrote:
Hm.. Raid going for more than 15 minutes apparently now (if you judge by news source times) - how long does a raid like that take, generally? Honest question, never really checked up on that.

Tens of minutes is typical IIRC.

The raid on Osama, for example:


The raid was intended to take 40 minutes. All told, the time between the team's entry in and exit from the compound was 38 minutes.[55] According to the Associated Press, the military offensive aspect of the raid was completed in the first 15 minutes.[73]


(WIkipedia.)
"Everyone has weaknesses. For most people it's that they're bad at the game. " -- IdrA
Sent.
Profile Joined June 2012
Poland9299 Posts
November 13 2015 23:51 GMT
#374
Btw, did they catch or kill all terrorists responsible for Charlie Hebdo attack?
You're now breathing manually
crms
Profile Joined February 2010
United States11933 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-13 23:55:22
November 13 2015 23:51 GMT
#375
On November 14 2015 08:45 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2015 08:43 ahswtini wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:40 KwarK wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:36 crms wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:34 KwarK wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:31 crms wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:27 KwarK wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:22 Maluk wrote:
On November 14 2015 08:16 KwarK wrote:
Is the difference between English and Nirish so much greater than that between French and Syrian?.

What.

My point was that people are people everywhere. That was essentially what I was getting at. That the only real difference between a Syrian infant and a French infant is geography.


Infants aren't yet indoctrinated into barbaric, backwards, belief systems.

And neither is every Syrian.

Of course not, but you're being intellectually dishonest with your infant analogy as it pertains to the immigration issue overall.

My original argument was with a Northern Irish person who was claiming that one group of people have no obligation to assist another group of people if the price is the risk of terrorism. I found this particularly striking given the history of the English enduring and fighting terrorism on behalf of the Northern Irish. When I explained this to him he went with "that's different though". My point with him was that the Syrians may be a different people but differences sure as hell didn't matter to him back when it was his homeland in danger and he needed the help of the English. He was happy enough to focus on what he had in common with the English and the English, for their part, did the right thing in standing up to the terrorism of the IRA.

Now I'm no longer arguing directly with him we're a long way past relevance but my core point was that whenever you do the right thing people who disagree with it are going to be cunts. That doesn't make the right thing less worth doing.

how can u compare the british defending its citizens on its soverign soil to europe letting in refugees?

Quite easily. As I said, I feel no kinship with you just because we share a passport. Nor do I have any special relationship with the soil you stand on just because it's north of the border with the Republic of Ireland. Soil is soil. Blood is blood.

I agree with this sentiment, and I am not 'patriotic', I don't think anyone should have an inherent right to live somewhere over someone else simply because they by pure chance, were born there. However, I can't turn a blind eye to destructive, sexist and complete disregard for modern society woven within archaic religious beliefs. I feel bad for the EU and Syrians, and I don't pretend to have an answer but Islamic beliefs are an issue, just as Christian bigotry has been an issue in the USA.

I find it worrisome when the political climate gets so extreme you cannot begin to criticize the ;ideas; or ;beliefs; (even avoiding speaking about individual people) in religion without being labeled a nazi or a racist.
http://i.imgur.com/fAUOr2c.png | Fighting games are great
jalstar
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States8198 Posts
November 13 2015 23:51 GMT
#376
On November 14 2015 08:50 dmnum wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 14 2015 08:48 Faust852 wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Definitly a french guy

"When you'll see this picture on BFM, it will be too late"
That could be a photo of another person...better not to post those things until we know for sure who did it, I guess.


agreed, the reddit stuff where they identified a guy who killed himself as the boston bomber was shameful.
ref4
Profile Joined March 2012
2933 Posts
November 13 2015 23:51 GMT
#377
so.....how easy is it to smuggle in so many weapons into France?
Rels
Profile Joined August 2008
France13467 Posts
November 13 2015 23:51 GMT
#378
On November 14 2015 08:48 Faust852 wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Definitly a french guy

"When you'll see this picture on BFM, it will be too late"

Fuck him if its true
WhiteDog
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France8650 Posts
November 13 2015 23:52 GMT
#379
The Bataclan can contain 1500 people, and apparently the terrorist attacked with grenades, it is a carnage.
"every time WhiteDog overuses the word "seriously" in a comment I can make an observation on his fragile emotional state." MoltkeWarding
ahswtini
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Northern Ireland22212 Posts
November 13 2015 23:52 GMT
#380
On November 14 2015 08:51 ref4 wrote:
so.....how easy is it to smuggle in so many weapons into France?

open borders, pick them up somewhere else and just drive thru europe with them
"As I've said, balance isn't about strategies or counters, it's about probability and statistics." - paralleluniverse
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