What happened in Paris is incomprehensible. Using religion as a shield and an excuse to murder 11 people for exercising their freedom of speech and press is immature, to say the least. I don't know when this radicalism will be over, but I hope to god that this ends soon.
On January 07 2015 23:17 SatedSC2 wrote: I bloody hate religion.
I truly do.
You have your right to do so, but this is not religion. Do not make the terrible mistake of putting everyone in the same basket.
This is the first step towards even more violence and hatred.
It wasnt a mistake, those bloody action forced by a specific religion.
Breivik.
Once a decade? Century? It was an exception. And how many things we had due to religion terrorists in last 10 years?
And do u remember, who was attacked by him? Don't u see the real reason was mainly cultural differences, which mainly comes from RELIGION.
the death tolls of unreligious regimes like china, soviet russia, nazi germany or north korea are by far much much higher than anything religion has done.
Not this stupid argument again. We're talking about people being killed in the name of religion.
It's not clear if Hitler really was an atheist, officially he was Roman Catholic, but neither Stalin nor Hitler nor Mao killed in the name of their atheism. Even if you could prove beyond a doubt that Hitler was Roman Catholic, you wouldn't blame religion, because his motives weren't religious.
This attitude of 'this isn't too bad, worse things happen elsewhere' is extremely disrespectful to the victims and those left behind.
On January 08 2015 02:05 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: This should fuel the far right even more in Europe.
I hope it does. I'm about as socialist as it gets, but this moral relativism bullshit that has infected Europe will continue to allow for this kind of stuff to happen. You can't just label this as another perspective and move on, patting yourself on the back for being tolerant. France did just fine prior to their influx of immigration. If this is how they are rewarded for their generosity, than I can't imagine them continuing to be. It's sad to realize people will still insist Islam has nothing to do with this. What the fuck is France supposed to do? They are under attack.
On January 08 2015 02:12 SoSexy wrote:
On January 08 2015 02:10 Grettin wrote:
On January 08 2015 02:09 pretender58 wrote:
On January 08 2015 02:05 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: This should fuel the far right even more in Europe.
Sadly. e.g. "Pegida" in Germany but especially the already strong "Front National" in France
Wasn't the 'head' of National Front supposed to speak or release a statement to the public hours ago? Is it available somewhere..
I would greatly appreciate a translation.
And I greatly appreciate your post.
Last time I said this I was banned for two weeks, but you can't just pretend this has nothing to do with Islam. Yes, these acts are perpetrated by extremists, but at the same time, this is exactly what the religious manifest of three billion people dictates.
The fact that most of these three billion people are sane, non-violent and decent people changes nothing about the fact that subversion, violence and suppression against non-Muslims are exactly what the Quran dictates.
I have never read the Quran, but from hearing from others, actions like this are highly frowned upon.
The only reason ISIS gets any support in the region is that ISIS government, whilst ruling by fear, is at least more stable than what Iraq and Syria used to be.
Muslims all over the world condemn this kind of behavior and I'm pretty sure the Quran says nothing about slaughtering innocent people for not believing in the Islam. Islam is a lot more familiar to Christianity/Judism than we usually think.
Also the 3 billion stat is pulled out of your arse.
Actions like what? Killing over Muhammad drawings? Because when the originals were first published, there were riots (of regular Muslims) all over the world and 200+ innocents were killed. Or you mean that the Quran in itself frowns on those actions? Because if the Quran doesn't call for a punishment for depicting muhammad, it (much like every other religious book) does for a lot of pretty mild stuff. You might think that Muslims don't take those commands literally or don't want it to be applied as law but you would be wrong. This is an article using polls about sharia and Islam in general in the general population of Islamic countries:
As you can see for example in Egypt, 74% think the Sharia should be the law of the land and be applied to muslim and non muslim alike, 81% think stoning is the adequate punishment for adultery and 86% think death should be applied for anyone leaving Islam.
The idea that Muslims all over the world are mostly the same as the rest of us and only the extremists view the world in such a distorted way is unfortunately wrong.
User was temp banned for this post.
Why ban? seemed pretty civil.
Saying that most Muslims view the world the same way blood-thirsty extremists do is not very civil.
People hating on religion often extoll the virtues of science but is it not science that has created the deadliest and most horrifying weapons in the history of mankind? Yeah, thought so.
That is mahoma at worst and a normal muslim at best. Thats asking for trouble. Im not defending the terrorist. what im saying is thta objectibly, both did wrong things (one of course a way way worse thing). And that this trajedy could have been prevented, and sadly the statirist got the worst part by paying the ultimate price.
But as I said before, my condolences to the families, and i hope the terrorist get punished for what they did.
A few months ago a french politician said that a terrorist act in France wasn't a matter of "if" but "when" after the threats of ISIS. Sadly I do not believe it's the last to come.
A very sad day for my country and freedom Hope they can find them...
On January 08 2015 02:05 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: This should fuel the far right even more in Europe.
I hope it does. I'm about as socialist as it gets, but this moral relativism bullshit that has infected Europe will continue to allow for this kind of stuff to happen. You can't just label this as another perspective and move on, patting yourself on the back for being tolerant. France did just fine prior to their influx of immigration. If this is how they are rewarded for their generosity, than I can't imagine them continuing to be. It's sad to realize people will still insist Islam has nothing to do with this. What the fuck is France supposed to do? They are under attack.
On January 08 2015 02:12 SoSexy wrote:
On January 08 2015 02:10 Grettin wrote:
On January 08 2015 02:09 pretender58 wrote: [quote] Sadly. e.g. "Pegida" in Germany but especially the already strong "Front National" in France
Wasn't the 'head' of National Front supposed to speak or release a statement to the public hours ago? Is it available somewhere..
Last time I said this I was banned for two weeks, but you can't just pretend this has nothing to do with Islam. Yes, these acts are perpetrated by extremists, but at the same time, this is exactly what the religious manifest of three billion people dictates.
The fact that most of these three billion people are sane, non-violent and decent people changes nothing about the fact that subversion, violence and suppression against non-Muslims are exactly what the Quran dictates.
I have never read the Quran, but from hearing from others, actions like this are highly frowned upon.
The only reason ISIS gets any support in the region is that ISIS government, whilst ruling by fear, is at least more stable than what Iraq and Syria used to be.
Muslims all over the world condemn this kind of behavior and I'm pretty sure the Quran says nothing about slaughtering innocent people for not believing in the Islam. Islam is a lot more familiar to Christianity/Judism than we usually think.
Also the 3 billion stat is pulled out of your arse.
Actions like what? Killing over Muhammad drawings? Because when the originals were first published, there were riots (of regular Muslims) all over the world and 200+ innocents were killed. Or you mean that the Quran in itself frowns on those actions? Because if the Quran doesn't call for a punishment for depicting muhammad, it (much like every other religious book) does for a lot of pretty mild stuff. You might think that Muslims don't take those commands literally or don't want it to be applied as law but you would be wrong. This is an article using polls about sharia and Islam in general in the general population of Islamic countries:
As you can see for example in Egypt, 74% think the Sharia should be the law of the land and be applied to muslim and non muslim alike, 81% think stoning is the adequate punishment for adultery and 86% think death should be applied for anyone leaving Islam.
The idea that Muslims all over the world are mostly the same as the rest of us and only the extremists view the world in such a distorted way is unfortunately wrong.
User was temp banned for this post.
Why ban? seemed pretty civil.
Saying that most Muslims view the world the same way blood-thirsty extremists do is not very civil.
It's in french obviously but the people are mostly saying "Hahaha you had it coming it was deserved" Edit: Sc2 toastie has the whole translation of the same picture.
On January 08 2015 04:52 johnbongham wrote: People hating on religion often extoll the virtues of science but is it not science that has created the deadliest and most horrifying weapons in the history of mankind? Yeah, thought so.
On January 08 2015 04:52 johnbongham wrote: People hating on religion often extoll the virtues of science but is it not science that has created the deadliest and most horrifying weapons in the history of mankind? Yeah, thought so.
Wow really? Science can (and has) created deadly technologies, but people have to use them in despicable ways for it to matter. Your point is completely irrelevant to the issue at hand, which is extremists killing in the name of religion. Would you rather blame the individuals misinterpreting their religion or the science that created the guns?
On January 08 2015 03:34 Pino wrote: I was in Toulouse, several thousands of peoples were there. It was so quiet at times you could hear the subway. It was sad and heartwarming at the same time ...
On January 08 2015 04:52 johnbongham wrote: People hating on religion often extoll the virtues of science but is it not science that has created the deadliest and most horrifying weapons in the history of mankind? Yeah, thought so.
Wow really? Science can (and has) created deadly technologies, but people have to use them in despicable ways for it to matter. Your point is completely irrelevant to the issue at hand, which is extremists killing in the name of religion. Would you rather blame the individuals misinterpreting their religion or the science that created the guns?
So ass-backwards...
Don't get baited into arguing with someone making a comment so stupid. They're not intelligent enough to reason with.
It's in french obviously but the people are mostly saying "Hahaha you had it coming it was deserved"
Edit: Sc2 toastie has the whole translation of the same picture.
It really is terrible that some people can believe this. I can only hope most of them eventually change their minds and realise how terrible all of this really is.
I can understand thinking that the cartoonists did something wrong and some of what they've drawn is in really poor taste, but that doesn't justify their deaths. Nor does any of it justify support for the shooters.
Does anyone have any updated news on the manhunt? I am really hoping that they find those responsible, otherwise its going to be very scary few days in France.
On January 08 2015 02:05 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: This should fuel the far right even more in Europe.
I hope it does. I'm about as socialist as it gets, but this moral relativism bullshit that has infected Europe will continue to allow for this kind of stuff to happen. You can't just label this as another perspective and move on, patting yourself on the back for being tolerant. France did just fine prior to their influx of immigration. If this is how they are rewarded for their generosity, than I can't imagine them continuing to be. It's sad to realize people will still insist Islam has nothing to do with this. What the fuck is France supposed to do? They are under attack.
On January 08 2015 02:12 SoSexy wrote:
On January 08 2015 02:10 Grettin wrote: [quote]
Wasn't the 'head' of National Front supposed to speak or release a statement to the public hours ago? Is it available somewhere..
Last time I said this I was banned for two weeks, but you can't just pretend this has nothing to do with Islam. Yes, these acts are perpetrated by extremists, but at the same time, this is exactly what the religious manifest of three billion people dictates.
The fact that most of these three billion people are sane, non-violent and decent people changes nothing about the fact that subversion, violence and suppression against non-Muslims are exactly what the Quran dictates.
I have never read the Quran, but from hearing from others, actions like this are highly frowned upon.
The only reason ISIS gets any support in the region is that ISIS government, whilst ruling by fear, is at least more stable than what Iraq and Syria used to be.
Muslims all over the world condemn this kind of behavior and I'm pretty sure the Quran says nothing about slaughtering innocent people for not believing in the Islam. Islam is a lot more familiar to Christianity/Judism than we usually think.
Also the 3 billion stat is pulled out of your arse.
Actions like what? Killing over Muhammad drawings? Because when the originals were first published, there were riots (of regular Muslims) all over the world and 200+ innocents were killed. Or you mean that the Quran in itself frowns on those actions? Because if the Quran doesn't call for a punishment for depicting muhammad, it (much like every other religious book) does for a lot of pretty mild stuff. You might think that Muslims don't take those commands literally or don't want it to be applied as law but you would be wrong. This is an article using polls about sharia and Islam in general in the general population of Islamic countries:
As you can see for example in Egypt, 74% think the Sharia should be the law of the land and be applied to muslim and non muslim alike, 81% think stoning is the adequate punishment for adultery and 86% think death should be applied for anyone leaving Islam.
The idea that Muslims all over the world are mostly the same as the rest of us and only the extremists view the world in such a distorted way is unfortunately wrong.
User was temp banned for this post.
Why ban? seemed pretty civil.
Saying that most Muslims view the world the same way blood-thirsty extremists do is not very civil.
You guys don't seem to understand the concept of derailing a thread.
Religion will be religion. Leave it at that. It's caused blood shed before, and it will again.
Then what is the purpose of this thread? What else is there to discuss? How this incident will affect French and European politics? Pretty sure someone got all angry early on in this thread and said it's none of our business what happens in his country.
No, really, what is there left to discuss about this, if you take this away?
It's in french obviously but the people are mostly saying "Hahaha you had it coming it was deserved"
Edit: Sc2 toastie has the whole translation of the same picture.
It really is terrible that some people can believe this. I can only hope most of them eventually change their minds and realise how terrible all of this really is.
I can understand thinking that the cartoonists did something wrong and some of what they've drawn is in really poor taste, but that doesn't justify their deaths. Nor does any of it justify support for the shooters.
Does anyone have any updated news on the manhunt? I am really hoping that they find those responsible, otherwise its going to be very scary few days in France.
DGSI is going to find them i'm not worrying for that.
EPT
Hope they can find them...
![[image loading]](http://i.4cdn.org/b/1420637064534.png)
