Although this thread does not function under the same strict guidelines as the USPMT, it is still a general practice on TL to provide a source with an explanation on why it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion. Failure to do so will result in a mod action.
A policeman who was outside Cologne station during the New Year's Eve trouble told the city's Express news website that he had detained eight suspects. "They were all asylum seekers, carrying copies of their residence certificates," he said. However, there was no official confirmation that asylum seekers had been involved in the violence. Commentators in Germany were quick to urge people not to jump to conclusions.
Well, seems smart enough to encourage people not to jump to conclusions, but I'm afraid it won't help a lot.
quite the culture shock for those people, they are used to living in a patriarchy and that the dress code of western women is quite the appetizer. not even talking about being on the road for months and months with a homogenous group you could call a sausage fest.
don't mistake my meaning, all of the perpetrators are on the shitlist now and should be persecuted by the full extent of the law - even deportation should be on the table. could send a strong signal for the others that some lines, you just don't fuck with them - literally. or they will fuck with you.
On January 05 2016 23:24 Velr wrote: Yeah, all i read was about "sexual assault", nothing about (group) rapes.
Disgusting (and shamefull for the german Police) nontheless.
I did not think about that angle, "shameful for the police" indeed. didn't we also have a huge terrorist attack scare as well on new years eve? was all over the news and in vienna and other cities in austria(lol) for example there was a lot of police afaik.
Nothing is clear at the moment, the media are still really careful... One case of rape in cologne and Germany wide 90 cases of sexual harassment/theft have been reported to the authorities so far, said the latest main stream media report i watched (most of them in Cologne. Hamburg, Stuttgart and Munich were mentioned as well). The Involvement of gang like groups of "north african looking males" is consensus in the reports. Numbers how many registered/unregistered refugees, asylum seekers, migration-background-germans/locals, just-north-african-looking-males are completey unclear at the moment.
Pegida and other Anti Immigration parties and organisations will be unbearable over the next days. Main stream media and polititians don't have the balls to present facts and will get a deserved beating. Their over carefulness is another perfect example for the popular "Lügenpresse" belief. This already went so bad...
And it happened 4 days ago. With all the camera surveillance (supposedly cologne main station and every train/subway) and good police work, there should have been a lot of arrests.
I'm really liberal, but i think, we need to change quite a lot of our rules and behavior. We got to and will be tougher in the future. My agenda changed with Charlie Hebdo... I still think Nationalism is nothing worth pursuing.
Sadly I can't say I'm very surprised. I suppose this is the kind of thing Germany will have to get more used to, similar to Sweden, because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
As much as it's our duty to help asylum seeker our government should have taken a realistic rather than idealistic approach to all this. Oh how I remember the press mocking municipal administrations for trying to teach refugees "traditional" German values and behaviour.
That actually should be the only option on the table.
Simple one-strike policy. Doesn't matter if refugee or immigrant.
because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
Not just press/merkel. Just look at the people here from Lala-Land, arguing that we have unlimited capacities as long as we want to do it. It's ridiculous.
Man, what was your police doing that day, holy shit. I'm assuming they had reinforced shifts that day and im gonna assume there were at least several calls on 112 considering how wide spread this was based on todays media report and there was no adequate reaction from em? What the fuck.
Here's the statement from Cologne's mayor and police superintendent. German only, sorry. n_n
They are very carefully trying to avoid blaming refugees, by resorting to a technical/legal definition of suspect. Something like "Yeah, we checked IDs of the people there, lot's of refugees, however our investigation hasn't advanced to the point of naming suspects yet, therefore no refugees are suspects."
because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
Not just press/merkel. Just look at the people here from Lala-Land, arguing that we have unlimited capacities as long as we want to do it. It's ridiculous.
Where do you deport a Syrian criminal? Can't send him back to Syria, can't send him to transit countries in Europe because he'll just come back in a few weeks unless you close the borders and I doubt Turkey or Lebanon will want him.
because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
Not just press/merkel. Just look at the people here from Lala-Land, arguing that we have unlimited capacities as long as we want to do it. It's ridiculous.
m4ini informs the public: Sexual harrasment is fine, as long as it doesn't target german women
That actually should be the only option on the table.
Simple one-strike policy. Doesn't matter if refugee or immigrant.
because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
Not just press/merkel. Just look at the people here from Lala-Land, arguing that we have unlimited capacities as long as we want to do it. It's ridiculous.
Where do you deport a Syrian criminal? Can't send him back to Syria, can't send him to transit countries in Europe because he'll just come back in a few weeks unless you close the borders and I doubt Turkey or Lebanon will want him.
That actually should be the only option on the table.
Simple one-strike policy. Doesn't matter if refugee or immigrant.
because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
Not just press/merkel. Just look at the people here from Lala-Land, arguing that we have unlimited capacities as long as we want to do it. It's ridiculous.
Where do you deport a Syrian criminal? Can't send him back to Syria, can't send him to transit countries in Europe because he'll just come back in a few weeks unless you close the borders and I doubt Turkey or Lebanon will want him.
Why, exactly, cannot he return to Syria?
Because sending people into a war zone would violate basic human rights. Which even apply to criminals.
However, if we are talking nationalities for these cologne incidents, I've read that the the attackers were predominantly of tunisian or moroccan origin. Which might be a different story (I'm not up to date about these countries).
About the stuttgart/Hamburg incidents: From what is known so far, they seem to be "normal" incidents, in the sense that while they are still crimes, it appears to me that they wouldnt have received any particular attention if it wasnt for the context of what happened in cologne.
What happened in Cologne is horrible - but more horrible are the people who (after police press conference etc) say 'let's not jump to conclusions' even before expressing empathy towards victims. Politically correctness is really the new totalitarism
That actually should be the only option on the table.
Simple one-strike policy. Doesn't matter if refugee or immigrant.
because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
Not just press/merkel. Just look at the people here from Lala-Land, arguing that we have unlimited capacities as long as we want to do it. It's ridiculous.
m4ini informs the public: Sexual harrasment is fine, as long as it doesn't target german women
Reading comprehension. That is not what he meant I am 99% sure.
Sucks for the victims of the crimes but you reap what you saw. Oh and nothing will come out of it, german law is rather lenient when it comes to offences involving bodily harm and sexual assault. The pick pockets will face the biggest consequences atleast if put into relation to the crime committed.
On January 06 2016 03:23 SoSexy wrote: What happened in Cologne is horrible - but more horrible are the people who (after police press conference etc) say 'let's not jump to conclusions' even before expressing empathy towards victims. Politically correctness is really the new totalitarism
Those 2 things aren't mutually exclusive. You can feel empathy for the victims and you can await the investigation.
On January 06 2016 04:14 Tien wrote: Germany is too afraid to just publicly say this unlimited refugee PR stunt was a massive mistake.
it was anything but a PR stunt... it was probably the only thing merkel ever did before asking the base and/or relying on polls. ironically it is also the only thing she gets her feet held under the fire in her party and by the public.
what would have been the alternative other than letting a good portion of this massive wave of migrants in? letting them die on the border? on the sea? in the truck of a human trafficker like we had in austria?
we are still doing that, but we also showed faith and humanity by letting a shit ton of people in. what happens next is the important thing. schengen yes/no? going full hungary? finally reach some agreement in syria and the like and give more funds to make it liveable there in a refugee camp?
those are damn hard questions and only solvable on the EU level. on the other hand the EU seems like the least appropriate institution to be able to reach feasible solutions lol.
That actually should be the only option on the table.
Simple one-strike policy. Doesn't matter if refugee or immigrant.
because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
Not just press/merkel. Just look at the people here from Lala-Land, arguing that we have unlimited capacities as long as we want to do it. It's ridiculous.
Where do you deport a Syrian criminal? Can't send him back to Syria, can't send him to transit countries in Europe because he'll just come back in a few weeks unless you close the borders and I doubt Turkey or Lebanon will want him.
On January 06 2016 04:14 Tien wrote: Germany is too afraid to just publicly say this unlimited refugee PR stunt was a massive mistake.
it was anything but a PR stunt... it was probably the only thing merkel ever did before asking the base and/or relying on polls. ironically it is also the only thing she gets her feet held under the fire in the by the public.
what would have been the alternative other than letting a good portion of this massive wave of migrants in? letting them die on the border? on the sea? in the truck of a human trafficker like we had in austria?
we are still doing that, but we also showed faith and humanity by letting a shit ton of people in. what happens next is the important thing. schengen yes/no? going full hungary? finally reach some agreement in syria and the like and give more funds to make it liveable there in a refugee camp?
those are damn hard questions and only solvable on the EU level. on the other hand the EU seems like the least appropriate institution to be able to reach feasible solutions lol.
Its entirely plausible that Merkel thought this would be a good PR move, since probably all her friends at cocktail parties and state dinners said thing like "Ooo won't we look so much better than the rest of the countries with their brutish, racist, citizens." I find that very likely because politicians seem to have a massive, systemic, blindspot on immigration.
That actually should be the only option on the table.
Simple one-strike policy. Doesn't matter if refugee or immigrant.
because Merkel and a lot of the mainstream press have chosen to be "Gutmenschen".
Not just press/merkel. Just look at the people here from Lala-Land, arguing that we have unlimited capacities as long as we want to do it. It's ridiculous.
Where do you deport a Syrian criminal? Can't send him back to Syria, can't send him to transit countries in Europe because he'll just come back in a few weeks unless you close the borders and I doubt Turkey or Lebanon will want him.
Why, exactly, cannot he return to Syria?
Are you seriously asking this?
Surely after serving a prison sentence for rape or other serious crimes warranting deportation (I assume at least 5 years) Syria will have reestablished itself quite a bit. Of course, that government will likely be Assad, or a successor to Assad that is similar in nature, at which point I'm sure many will argue returning people to a country run by a dictator violates some human rights as well (but then aren't we really obliged to accept every person from every country in the Middle East?).
EPT
