On June 21 2013 10:54 Elegy wrote: God, stop blaming genetics.
Look at the historical trend of obesity.
People are getting fat because they eat like shit, and the few who suffer from actual hormonal and medical disorders get overshadowed by people who have poor diet and exercise regimens.
Even if the higher caloric intake of the general population has exacerbated particular genetic tendencies towards obesity, it's not an excuse and it's probably the fault of the individual. Yeah, poor people often can only afford high carb largely unhealthy diets as a result of their poverty, but that is a shitty explanation for the massive trend of obesity.
If you're super fat, it's not genetic, it's not hormonal. Or rather, it's highly unlikely. Stop eating like a fucking troll and go walking every morning. If that doesn't work, go see a doctor and find out what's wrong with you. Because operating at a reasonable caloric deficit over an extended period of time will make you lose weight.
Yeah, it really is amazing how fast people's genetics have changed in 30 years! Look at this "disease" sweep the nation, guess it's contagious.
Isn't obesity more of an addiction? I would consider it more similar to alcoholism or drug addiction than a disease. Its not like obesity can just start from nowhere unless you have a medical condition that leads to it.
Edit: As an obese person myself, I feel like I have the capacity to change my body and lifestyle, but it is quite easy to fall back into old habits at times (like someone who cant get rid of their addiction to alcohol during hard times, or someone who cant go another day without a cigarette).
On June 21 2013 13:10 Takasu wrote: Isn't obesity more of an addiction? I would consider it more similar to alcoholism or drug addiction than a disease. Its not like obesity can just start from nowhere unless you have a medical condition that leads to it.
Some people are definitely addicted to food. However the fools at the AMA have also classified addictions as a disease.
Which South Park lampooned beautifully.
I'd love someone who is an alcoholic or an obese tub tell someone dying of brain cancer "Hey, I've got a disease too!"
I'm thinking the FDA and the AMA continuously put out new drugs and food additives to increase revenue by getting people to eat garbage artificial food which in turn gives them diabetes, cancer or obesity in this case; then they put out new drugs too "combat" these diseases running rampant but in most cases these drugs such as dietary pills and chemotherapy like treatment end up worsening the problem or just hiding symptoms. It's all a super greedy corporate agenda to make mass amounts of money while controlling the population (concealing and banning cures to cancer and such things, or not allowing further research). I'm sure there are a lot of officials with a good soul and actually want to help people but the ones at the very top do not give a fuck. My 2 cents feel free to debate, i'm probably just another crazy conspiracy theorist.
On June 21 2013 11:10 Aveng3r wrote: some things to consider 1. Im generalizing here, but this community is made up of people who are still relatively young. (cut me a break on this assumption, I dont know nearly as many 40+ year old video game players as I do teen/twentysomethings) Metabolisms have not slowed down yet, so it is easier to keep weight off. 2. A group of people who has time to participate in a video game community is probably on the higher end of the socioeconomic spectrum- healthy food is easier to come by. 3. seriously. Eating healthy is a lot more expensive and time consuming than cheap, fast food. Keep these things in mind when talking about a general population that has a harder time acquiring and preparing healthy food than you do.
Bread and water is cheap.
It's simple, fat people are inevitably lazy or undisciplined. I do not know a single fat person who works out regularly and doesn't eat like an idiot. Not one. They either do not stay active to a reasonable level, or they eat improperly all the time.
On June 21 2013 13:14 SergioCQH wrote: It's funny how a bunch of TL posters think they know the definition of disease better than a preeminent professional organization of physicians.
Really absurd, but that's the Internet right? Where a bunch of dorks with computers turn into experts.
I don't know...
I find it kind of funny how you could take this seriously.
I mean, come on, eating too much and having poor self-discipline is now a DISEASE? Really?
Rofl, this is pretty pathetic. I'm sure that there are some people who watch an add for fast food and can't help themselves but eat it, but the vast majority of people are just being lazy/stupid/indulgent or a combination. When I see people have to get lifted out of their houses because they were too fat when they died, I don't feel too good knowing that my tax dollars have to go towards that sort of excess.
But you know, whenever someone argues personal responsibility in pretty much anything they get shut down. Don't want to be blaming the victim after all.
I was obese once. Then I started exercising and stopped eating poorly. Now, I'm not longer obese. I had the obese disease and I cured myself.
Perhaps there are individuals who are obese and who, if they undertook actions similar to mine, might be forever obese. For them, perhaps, it makes sense to call it a "disease".
On June 21 2013 13:14 SergioCQH wrote: It's funny how a bunch of TL posters think they know the definition of disease better than a preeminent professional organization of physicians.
Really absurd, but that's the Internet right? Where a bunch of dorks with computers turn into experts.
I don't know...
I find it kind of funny how you could take this seriously.
I mean, come on, eating too much and having poor self-discipline is now a DISEASE? Really?
The science is showing that it is not as simple as saying someone is eating too much or having poor willpower etc though. I struggle with the semantics of it, but understand they are likening it to addiction. Don't really care what they call it if it advances understanding of it though.
On June 21 2013 13:14 SergioCQH wrote: It's funny how a bunch of TL posters think they know the definition of disease better than a preeminent professional organization of physicians.
Really absurd, but that's the Internet right? Where a bunch of dorks with computers turn into experts.
I don't know...
I find it kind of funny how you could take this seriously.
I mean, come on, eating too much and having poor self-discipline is now a DISEASE? Really?
The science is showing that it is not as simple as saying someone is eating too much or having poor willpower etc though. I struggle with the semantics of it, but understand they are likening it to addiction. Don't really care what they call it if it advances understanding of it though.
Ugh...I don't want to get into it, because it will cause an inevitable derail, but in a nutshell:
Not caring for the specificity of the wording, or having the meaning of words clearly defined and thus subject to change is very dangerous for a field of study. Be precise. Be concise. Say what you mean to say. Don't call addiction a disease, call it addiction.
Purposeful linguistic obfuscation is a tell-tale sign of intentions (purposeful or otherwise) to influence the thought processes regarding the subject.
Aka: peoples feelings>scientific and academic rigor=sign of faltering scientific institutions. The AMA should be called on their bullshit, and hard.
Wow, that's pretty surprising that they would call it a disease O.o... what's more surprising is the percentage of obese people, I never realized we had so many :O.
On June 21 2013 13:18 Hyperbola wrote: I'm not sure how this ruling will pan out, but on the topic of fat acceptance... I believe Scooby says it best: http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=ilubYTOM1ls
On June 21 2013 13:14 SergioCQH wrote: It's funny how a bunch of TL posters think they know the definition of disease better than a preeminent professional organization of physicians.
Really absurd, but that's the Internet right? Where a bunch of dorks with computers turn into experts.
I don't know...
I find it kind of funny how you could take this seriously.
I mean, come on, eating too much and having poor self-discipline is now a DISEASE? Really?
The science is showing that it is not as simple as saying someone is eating too much or having poor willpower etc though. I struggle with the semantics of it, but understand they are likening it to addiction. Don't really care what they call it if it advances understanding of it though.
Ugh...I don't want to get into it, because it will cause an inevitable derail, but in a nutshell:
Not caring for the specificity of the wording, or having the meaning of words clearly defined and thus subject to change is very dangerous for a field of study. Be precise. Be concise. Say what you mean to say. Don't call addiction a disease, call it addiction.
Purposeful linguistic obfuscation is a tell-tale sign of intentions (purposeful or otherwise) to influence the thought processes regarding the subject.
Aka: peoples feelings>scientific and academic rigor=sign of faltering scientific institutions. The AMA should be called on their bullshit, and hard.
I actually don't disagree with you on that. As I see it, there's probably two paths to take from here. Create new medication to "treat" this "disease" (most likely) or make fundamental changes to the food industry regulating sugars and fructose (very unlikely). You make a fair point.
On June 21 2013 03:57 codonbyte wrote: To be honest I don't see this having any real effect on how much treatment patients get for obesity. Doctors already know that being obese is unhealthy, and I'm pretty sure most people who are fat already know it's unhealthy but are unable to lose weight for one reason or another (self-discipline, succumbing to temptation, slower metabolism, etc.). I don't see how classifying obesity as a disease is going to deal with any of those issues.
On June 21 2013 03:45 Lycaeus wrote: "It's not my fault I'm fat, I have a DISEASE"
Yes, I know we all love to call out fat people for their often-times poor eating habits and lack of self-discipline. However, I don't think that's really all that fair.
Sure, having a lack of self discipline may be what ultimately causes obesity many times, however genetics determines how much any individual person is punished for a lack of self-discipline.
I'll use myself as an example. I was blessed with a ridonkulously fast metabolism. I have never had to worry about my weight, no matter how poor my eating habits. I'll often eat an entire box of oreos or 2 (big) bags of jelly beans after a long day of work. Last night I ate an entire gallon of ice cream.
Yet I am never punished for these poor eating habits in the slightest, simply because of my genes, while some other person with poor eating habits may be getting obese, even if their eating habits are better than mine (not great, but still better than mine).
I suspect that a lot of skinny people are thin for the same reason that I am: genetics. And therefore it's never quite sat right with me to go around labeling fat people as being lazy and having no self-control.
Edit: With that rant out of the way I would like to say that I think this decision is ridiculous because it's confusing the causes with their symptoms (i.e. a obesity is a symptom of something, either poor lifestyle or a medical condition, etc.). I made another post in this thread that goes into that more.
The problem with your argument is that most people in most countries in the world are not obese, so it certainly isn't genetics for almost all cases of obesity. The cause is laziness and not just poor diet, but extremely poor diet.
It took me a summer of drinking at least a few beers a day and eating tons of pork and pistachios (both high in fat) to gain 10-15 lbs. Of course, I was working out pretty heavily as well, so a good amount of that weight gain isn't fat, and mind you, lifting isn't like cardio when it comes to burning calories, so my "exercise" wasn't as helpful as one would think when it comes to losing weight. That diet was really bad, so it surprises even me that there is much, much worse dietary behaviors that millions of Americans are into. Seriously, something needs to be done about it. 80+ million people aren't the result of "genetics." Mexico has the same issue with super fatty food, while no other Latin American country has anywhere near the obesity problems that Mexico has.
EDIT: I saw someone mention Scooby. That guy is awesome, and he's absolutely right. I came home after my summer internship with a noticeable beer gut. I accepted I fucked up, and got to getting rid of it, and I did. Scooby really puts in the effort to teach people who to be fit and eat right. Great guy.
EPT![[image loading]](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/35/BRFSS_obesity_1985-2006.gif)
