EPTEdit: I didn't make it clear enough that I am not trying to make any argument with this post. As I said, the only reason I posted this thread is to see what people think. The quotes are there because I found them interesting. They do not necessarily reflect my opinion in any way.
It seems very real, disturbing trends are developing in the USA that can potentially lead to the government having near total control. Three of the biggest dangers are mass media, data mining, and citizens who not only do little to halt progressions in government control, but unwittingly feed into them. It is common knowledge almost everyone has a cell phone that can be tracked and closely monitored. Likewise, many people have Facebook which can reveal a disturbing amount of information about them. Both of these give us the ability to do things we never could before the rise of electronics, but both can also be used to undermine our freedom. Technological innovation should be at the service of men, and allow men to live better lives, but it can be used against them.
Now, what are some of the primary interests of government? To expand its power? To safeguard itself and its citizens? To control?
What are the primary interests of citizens? To keep government power in check? To protect their rights and liberties?
What happens when the equilibrium shifts in favor of government and it obtains too much power over its citizens, taking protection to the extreme by infringing their rights and liberties little by little in favor of mass control and surveillance? Is the government currently working towards this each and every day? Finally, is this consistent with the USA's interventionist foreign policies and actions, where it feels the need to act as world police?
Below are some intriguing comments to the following article that I feel are apt to include in this thread. (http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/08/08/planting-vegetable-gardens.aspx):
"The freedoms we have enjoyed up until now, have been legislated to be violated continually. I base this statement on having read the actual texts of post-911 bills, scanned the congressional voting records, and more. Our media is blacking out the truth. The violations are very dictatorship-like and are legislated to be much worse. Police can break into our homes and obtain a warrant after they are gone, dubbing people "terrorists" based on mere free speech/activism and I am not kidding. This is the Patriot Act at work. The Center for Constitutional Rights and ACLU insist that their clients are unremittingly peaceful activists, nothing like those who smash windows et al. The Patriot Act defines the word "terrorist" in such an "over-broad" way (as agreed unanimously by the CCR, ACLU, National Lawyers Guild, Nat'l Rifle Association, American Freedom agenda, and 12 entities of all stripes/colors joining the ACLU's fight against the Patriot Act) that free speech can be, and is clamped down on.
Again we are kept in the dark, no thanks to our media's black-out of the subject, itself an act which only occurs in dictatorships, as does all the brainwashing et al.
Worse yet, we can be shot by the President's own unilateral decree, without any court trial or any legal counsel, based on being DUBBED as terrorists (how convenient) by the Pres himself. Doubt it? go to the ACLU's website and read about extra-judicial killing. It's not a joke and if you think we are a free country, please research further. The ACLU's website is the best political education on the web, check it out.
Our media has us thinking nothing is going on. Because of the gag orders (that's right) in the Patriot Act, FBI and police crackdowns are so secret that even Congress knows nothing about it, let alone the media, which is agenda-based and blacking things out anyway."
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"As long as we are on the subject, there is even more.
Yes about the face recognition technology, but it gets deeper than that. According to the ACLU of Northern California, the cameras mounted atop phone poles on the highways, can scan and recognize your pupils at freeway speeds.
For the rest, the Military Comissions Act (torture bill) requires that the tortured person have no day in court, the "trial" is held in their absence, they get no legal counsel, no visits or connection with family/friends. US Citizenship is revoked under the Act...and thus, it is guaranteed that an innocent person can be tortured. Just because a newspaper photo exists, we gullibly believe it! In fact, writes Marjorie Cohn, president of the National Lawyers Guild, the Act is written in such a way that Americans can ourselves be tortured. (I won't defend a real terrorist fyi, never. But the ACLU, Red Cross,many more have protested the innocence of 90+% of the Guantanamo detainees, of whom about 50% were PROVEN innocent in court. The rest slipped through the cracks. Only a few are guilty).
For anyone interested, please see the list of those spied on by the FBI, many among them dubbed terrorists, being represented by the ACLU, You won't believe it. It includes the Nobel Peace Prize-winning Quaker anti-war group, the American Friends Service Committee, and so many more that will shock you into awareness. Check this out, and then talk to me thereafter and let me know if going to the ballot box will be enough to straighten things out this year. Further, this is just the tip of the iceberg. See above, and mark my words, they are sterling accurate. If you doubt me, google the facts (ACLU, National Lawyers Guild, Center for Constitutional Rights, American Freedom agenda all have legal analyses) and then, see the texts of the bills, for yourself.
ACLU client list here, FBI spyfiles: www.aclu.org/national-security/fbi-spy-files-project-aclu-client-list"
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"How strange is the USA. Here in Europe we can grow what we wish on our own land, front or back gardens - excepting for illegal drugs! In France the French take pride in their vegetable areas, potageres - as indeed do I. I have my own currant bushes and own potagere. I should so loathe to live in America, in fact, I don't want to even visit the place - it seems like a total police state, not too far removed from Stalinism, controlled by mindless robots in the thrall of big pharma and the the agri business like Monsanto. You guys are welcome to the whole plateful of s..t. Sad beginning of the end of what might have been a great and forward nation. Sigh. "
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"What on earth is happening to your great country, land of the free? In the UK, where we are desperately short of land on which to grow food, there are ten year waiting lists in cities for allotments on which to grow fruit and vegetables. ''Grow your own' is a national pastime. In the war we were all encouraged to dig up our gardens and plant vegetables and fruit - 'Grow for Victory' it was called. If anyone tried to stop us growing veggies in our front or back gardens there would be howls of laughter (not to mention rage) from citizens everywhere. The only problem with growing veggies in your front garden in Britain is that they are likely to be stolen - people are so desperate for food at the moment.
Objecting to citizens growing their own veg in their own gardens is bureaucracy gone mad. This is suppression of individualism and of all the countries in the world the USA is the flag waver for individualism. I know you will all stand up for yourselves against this madness, I just want you to know that this British gardener is right behind you!"
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"The majority didn't believe the evidence of their own eyes, on the 9/11 incident.It is more difficult for them to recognize the reason behind the "false flag" principle which was at work, IN SPITE of the evidence you accurately point out.It worked for the WW2 (the bombing of the German Parliament..blamed on The Jews), and the Vietnam War.
Mind you, many also believe that the walls of Jericho could "come tumbling down" as the result of some 'cool' horn playing....although sound weapons do now exist.
The "mindlessness" is definitely linked. The "power boys" know that...and perpetuate it.
The truth sets you free, the opposite is at work in current times."
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"Zizzie123, thank you for your kind and insightful message. You nailed it on the head, it is, as you said, "bureaucracy gone mad".
Where it comes from in this particular instance, as described by Dr Mercola's article, is not from Monsanto per se (though I am not contesting their huge and organized efforts to take away the freedom of something so basic as eating and yes, growing your own, too).
Instead, in this particular instance, what's the key influence is visuals and petty neighbors pecking away at each other like little pecking hens. The towns/cities take the ball from there, passing Ordinances which allow this, forbid that, etc....creating ever more strictures and controls....all in the name of pleasing their tax payers and "doing good". Some of this "good-doing" comes from necessities like fire control et al. The problem is, that human freedom is then impinged.
We Americans are so innocent based on centuries of freedom, that many just don't "Get it". As you can see, many on this forum do understand, but alas so many just don't. Ignorance is not always bliss, and where we are headed is something awful. Americans are going to have the nastiest wakeup call, and by then it will be too late!
As it is, our deliberately censored and truncated media (since 9-11-01) is brainwashing people into nationalism, terrorism paranoia, fight fight go go ra ra, "protect yourself from those evil terrorists over there" and so we are all brainwashed and blinded. The media is not reporting things that would wake so many people up and create a civil war, trust me Americans would be up in arms about many things, if they knew all that was happening!
Others remain silent and complacent because they/we feel disempowered against our government. And others, out of ignorance, remain silent. They don't see what's coming. Once again, centuries of freedom have caused a blissful ignorance...which will become our misery, and very soon too."
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"So we are forced to buy auto insurance and in order to help minimize payouts for the insurance companies who help write the laws that their police enforcers are told to write tickets for, then we're further taxed and penalized if we fail to obey the letter of the drivers license contract and "buckle up" because we're putting the PROFITS OF THE INSURANCE COMPANIES AT RISK Of course the MONEY is all those at the top care about, along with the laughing joke that they're controlling us and forcing us to obey these petty laws all the while they laugh as they force extortion money out of us via insurance premiums, driving taxes called tickets and more.
Dean Clifford - 1 (part 1 of 6) - You, Your Rights, The Trust, Courts, Law and More
www.youtube.com/watch
LAW AND GOVERNMENT DRIVERS LICENSE FRAUD TAJ TARIK BEY PT.1/16
www.youtube.com/watch
It's ALL about control, for those in power are ABSOLUTE CONTROL FREAKS that GET OFF on telling you what to do on your own land, though you don't really own it, you just pay rent in the form of Feudal property taxes. Of course preventing you from growing your own FOOD IS all part of their agenda because they don't want ANYONE to be self sufficient at ALL. That is why they're cracking down on this more and more.
Here are more examples of this control and LIES too.
The Real Reason Hemp Is Illegal
The real reason Cannabis has been outlawed has nothing to do with its effects on the mind and body.
MARIJUANA is NOT DANGEROUS. Pot is NOT harmful to the human body or mind. Marijuana does NOT pose a threat to the general public. Marijuana is very much a danger to the oil companies, alcohol, tobacco industries and a large number of chemical corporations. Various big businesses, with plenty of dollars and influence, have suppressed the truth from the people. The truth is if marijuana was utilized for its vast array of commercial products, it would create an industrial atomic bomb! Entrepreneurs have not been educated on the product potential of pot. The super rich have conspired to spread misinformation about an extremely versatile plant that, if used properly, would ruin their companies.
Where did the word 'marijuana' come from? In the mid 1930s, the M-word was created to tarnish the good image and phenomenal history of the hemp plant...as you will read. The facts cited here, with references, are generally verifiable in the Encyclopedia Britannica which was printed on hemp paper for 150 years:
All schoolbooks were made from hemp or flax paper until the 1880s; Hemp Paper Reconsidered, Jack Frazier, 1974. It was LEGAL TO PAY TAXES WITH HEMP in America from 1631 until the early 1800s; LA Times, Aug. 12, 1981. REFUSING TO GROW HEMP in America during the 17th and 18th Centuries WAS AGAINST THE LAW! You could be jailed in Virginia for refusing to grow hemp from 1763 to 1769; Hemp in Colonial Virginia, G. M. Herdon.
George Washington, Thomas Jefferson and other founding fathers GREW HEMP; Washington and Jefferson Diaries. Jefferson smuggled hemp seeds from China to France then to America. Benjamin Franklin owned one of the first paper mills in America and it processed hemp. Also, the War of 1812 was fought over hemp. Emperor Wears No Clothes, Jack Herer. For thousands of years, 90% all ships' sails and rope were made from hemp. The word 'canvas' is Dutch for cannabis; Webster's New World Dictionary.
80% all textiles, fabrics, clothes, linen, drapes, bed sheets, etc. were made from hemp until the 1820s with the introduction of the cotton gin. Oldest known records of hemp farming go back 5000 years in China, although hemp industrialization probably goes back to ancient Egypt. www.420magazine.com/forums/hemp-facts-information/69780-real-reason-he.."
etc. etc. etc.
Poll: Will the USA ever become a totalitarian state?
Seems likely. (202)
46%
Ha! Yea right... (77)
18%
Doubt it. (64)
15%
You betcha! (56)
13%
Possibly, who knows??? (41)
9%
440 total votes
Ha! Yea right... (77)
Doubt it. (64)
You betcha! (56)
Possibly, who knows??? (41)
440 total votes
Your vote: Will the USA ever become a totalitarian state?
(Vote): You betcha!
(Vote): Seems likely.
(Vote): Possibly, who knows???
(Vote): Doubt it.
(Vote): Ha! Yea right...
Thoughts?
