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On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making every sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis...
Edit: typo
I'd prefer a socioeconomic system where people get rich for having better ideas than you. You can implement all your wonderful ideas in the system we have. Automate away, make products for cheaper than your competitors, save people money, make the world a better place, and get rich doing it. What's stopping you?
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On April 20 2012 06:12 Cattivik wrote:
They should fix things on earth first.
Projects like this are like skyscrapers built on sand.The guys on top will touch the sky and those below will get buried.
More money spent for the wealth of few.
Most of the problems on earth have technical solutions. We produce enough food to end world hunger easily, yet those living in extreme poverty typically do not have access to infrastructure or distribution of that food. The lack of that infrastructure is not the result of a lack of funds or technology but rather the result of corrupt regimes and war. You can't throw money at those kinds of problems and make them go away.
Compared to solving the problems caused by human wickedness and frailty, expanding into space is much more cost effective.
On April 20 2012 06:13 smokeyhoodoo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making every sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis...
Edit: typo I'd prefer a socioeconomic system where people get rich for having better ideas than you. You can implement all your wonderful ideas in the system we have. Automate away, make products for cheaper than your competitors, save people money, make the world a better place, and get rich doing it. What's stopping you?
What's stopping him is what's stopping most potentially world-changing initiatives:
1.) Lack of capital
2.) Lack of know-how
3.) Lack of a market.
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On April 20 2012 04:45 kollin wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 04:42 Ostby wrote:
I have a theory. They could bring an asteroid to earth orbit, make a mining/research/fueling station on it. Interesting idea, though it would be incredibly costly. They would either have to push it which would use an enormous amount of energy, or get a sufficiently big space ship that it gets pulled into the space ships orbit, which is more effort than its worth.
Actually, it just takes a while. You just have to get mass hauler to an asteroid, and for fuel it can just accelerate the asteroid material using a magnetic catapult powered by solar power. It would take awhile obviously, but over a year or two you could move the asteroid into Earth Orbit.
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On April 20 2012 05:30 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
The issues with anything in space, is that your body was made to handle (through billions of years of evolution) 1 G of pressure at all times through gravity... Yet you will be handling MUCH MUCH less, and thus your body will weaken drastically, this is very common with people who fly on the international space station.
It's only a problem if you want to come back to earth. Right now, of course, most miners will want to return, but in 50 years with a solid infrastructure in space, who says people won't be living there permanently?
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Well...this makes me so happy. I can actually look forward to the future now. There's going to be something interesting happening in my lifetime. I'm so thankful to these wonderful people deciding on this space venture! Also I think rather than pulling an asteroid belt to act as a mining platform, its more likely that they would construct a space station from the materials they mine. Yes...it will have a habitation ring, a commercial deck, a science wing, administrative... :D. Aah the future never looked so glorious.
I do hope that problems in Africa, and the middle east are fixed. But you can't throw money at the problem. With time as social awareness grows we'll be thinking less in terms of "our country" vs "their country" and more as our world. Just like the each state operates under the united states of america, I think its only inevitable that a world government is formed. Hopefully its not hopelessly complicated and bureaucratic 
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On April 20 2012 06:12 Cattivik wrote:
They should fix things on earth first.
Projects like this are like skyscrapers built on sand.The guys on top will touch the sky and those below will get buried.
More money spent for the wealth of few.
And here we have a very good illustration of the problem with the human race
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On April 20 2012 03:53 sirachman wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis... Humanity is capable of more than one venture at once. There will always be ways to improve culture and socioeconomic conditions. Staring at the ground under us until we reach some far off utopia will only lead us to the same end as the dinosaurs as the far unknowns destroy us with what lies in our ignorance.
My point is we should eliminate the profit system before dealing with space as everything is going to end up being privatized just like here on earth. In the system I advocate (resource based economy), we would have way more involvement in space as projects wouldn't be limited by money.
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Reminded me of this which I saved from a chat on twitch.tv
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/cVkxR.png)
If this is real though, I'm glad people are thinking about this now and not in X years when things might look more dire.
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On April 20 2012 06:31 WoodenSpider wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 04:45 kollin wrote:On April 20 2012 04:42 Ostby wrote:
I have a theory. They could bring an asteroid to earth orbit, make a mining/research/fueling station on it. Interesting idea, though it would be incredibly costly. They would either have to push it which would use an enormous amount of energy, or get a sufficiently big space ship that it gets pulled into the space ships orbit, which is more effort than its worth. Actually, it just takes a while. You just have to get mass hauler to an asteroid, and for fuel it can just accelerate the asteroid material using a magnetic catapult powered by solar power. It would take awhile obviously, but over a year or two you could move the asteroid into Earth Orbit.
How about controlled explosions (nuclear) to nudge one into an earth orbit?
Obviously this is not the sort of thing you want to cock up. I think we should stick to artificial satellites for a while.
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On April 20 2012 06:26 Gummy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 06:12 Cattivik wrote:
They should fix things on earth first.
Projects like this are like skyscrapers built on sand.The guys on top will touch the sky and those below will get buried.
More money spent for the wealth of few. Most of the problems on earth have technical solutions. We produce enough food to end world hunger easily, yet those living in extreme poverty typically do not have access to infrastructure or distribution of that food. The lack of that infrastructure is not the result of a lack of funds or technology but rather the result of corrupt regimes and war. You can't throw money at those kinds of problems and make them go away. Compared to solving the problems caused by human wickedness and frailty, expanding into space is much more cost effective. Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 06:13 smokeyhoodoo wrote:On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making every sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis...
Edit: typo I'd prefer a socioeconomic system where people get rich for having better ideas than you. You can implement all your wonderful ideas in the system we have. Automate away, make products for cheaper than your competitors, save people money, make the world a better place, and get rich doing it. What's stopping you? What's stopping him is what's stopping most potentially world-changing initiatives: 1.) Lack of capital 2.) Lack of know-how 3.) Lack of a market.
1.) Lack of capital:
There is plenty of capital out there. How else do you think people start businesses? This is a barrier, not something stopping him.
2.) Lack of know-how:
Something he must acquire to implement his idea. This is a barrier, not something stopping him.
3.) Lack of a market:
Then its neither a good idea, nor is it going to be world-changing. Unless of course its market is yet to come, but then the idea is premature. For example, it can be unwise to automate certain processes when labor is cheap. It could be a good idea in the future but for now is simply an inefficient placement of resources.
Do you think he should be given capital, despite not having know how and there not being a market? Let him succeed on his own. Darwinian selection in the market place will determine who has good world changing ideas, and who doesn't.
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On April 20 2012 06:38 xeo1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 03:53 sirachman wrote:On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis... Humanity is capable of more than one venture at once. There will always be ways to improve culture and socioeconomic conditions. Staring at the ground under us until we reach some far off utopia will only lead us to the same end as the dinosaurs as the far unknowns destroy us with what lies in our ignorance. My point is we should eliminate the profit system before dealing with space as everything is going to end up being privatized just like here on earth. In the system I advocate (resource based economy), we would have way more involvement in space as projects wouldn't be limited by money.
I just ROTFL
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On April 20 2012 04:59 jmack wrote:
Does no one else feel like we should be fixing this planet before exploring others?
Hear me out, we have how many people dying from starvation by the minute? How many suicides per minute? How many people who's entire life potential is completely wasted because our social structures place favor on a select few?
How about we feed and regulate our own population, by actually harnessing and distributing our knowledge and technology in EFFICIENT ways before we chase pipe dreams....
Just feels backwards...
( I'm all for space exploration, I just don't think it's our ticket out of the shit world we've created )
Right on the spot.
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On April 20 2012 06:38 xeo1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 03:53 sirachman wrote:On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis... Humanity is capable of more than one venture at once. There will always be ways to improve culture and socioeconomic conditions. Staring at the ground under us until we reach some far off utopia will only lead us to the same end as the dinosaurs as the far unknowns destroy us with what lies in our ignorance. My point is we should eliminate the profit system before dealing with space as everything is going to end up being privatized just like here on earth. In the system I advocate (resource based economy), we would have way more involvement in space as projects wouldn't be limited by money.
Maybe you should study economics before falling hook, line, and sinker into that nonsense. Limited by money? Yes, its money, and not resources, that limits projects, of course. Resources (and don't restrict that to mean physical resources) are limited, and if you think you and a bunch of bureaucrats can distribute and implement them more efficiently than successful businessmen then you're simply arrogant. If you think you can do it better then prove it! Nothing is stopping you!
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On April 20 2012 06:26 Gummy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 06:12 Cattivik wrote:
They should fix things on earth first.
Projects like this are like skyscrapers built on sand.The guys on top will touch the sky and those below will get buried.
More money spent for the wealth of few. Most of the problems on earth have technical solutions. We produce enough food to end world hunger easily, yet those living in extreme poverty typically do not have access to infrastructure or distribution of that food. The lack of that infrastructure is not the result of a lack of funds or technology but rather the result of corrupt regimes and war. You can't throw money at those kinds of problems and make them go away. Compared to solving the problems caused by human wickedness and frailty, expanding into space is much more cost effective. Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 06:13 smokeyhoodoo wrote:On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making every sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis...
Edit: typo I'd prefer a socioeconomic system where people get rich for having better ideas than you. You can implement all your wonderful ideas in the system we have. Automate away, make products for cheaper than your competitors, save people money, make the world a better place, and get rich doing it. What's stopping you? What's stopping him is what's stopping most potentially world-changing initiatives: 1.) Lack of capital 2.) Lack of know-how 3.) Lack of a market.
Exactly.. And these technical solutions aren't put into place because the main incentive is profit. It wouldn't be profitable to build an infrastructure in a place where the people have no purchasing power.
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On April 20 2012 06:46 3Form wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 06:31 WoodenSpider wrote:On April 20 2012 04:45 kollin wrote:On April 20 2012 04:42 Ostby wrote:
I have a theory. They could bring an asteroid to earth orbit, make a mining/research/fueling station on it. Interesting idea, though it would be incredibly costly. They would either have to push it which would use an enormous amount of energy, or get a sufficiently big space ship that it gets pulled into the space ships orbit, which is more effort than its worth. Actually, it just takes a while. You just have to get mass hauler to an asteroid, and for fuel it can just accelerate the asteroid material using a magnetic catapult powered by solar power. It would take awhile obviously, but over a year or two you could move the asteroid into Earth Orbit. How about controlled explosions (nuclear) to nudge one into an earth orbit? Obviously this is not the sort of thing you want to cock up. I think we should stick to artificial satellites for a while.
You can't use a nuke to nudge an asteroid if you plan on mining from it. The metals and other materials would be irradiated for a very long time.
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I don't understand all the 'fix the earth first' comments here...this is a private company looking to find a new market. We don't expect other huge companies to stop what they are doing and focus on 'fixing' the earth, why should this one?
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On April 20 2012 06:59 smokeyhoodoo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 06:38 xeo1 wrote:On April 20 2012 03:53 sirachman wrote:On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis... Humanity is capable of more than one venture at once. There will always be ways to improve culture and socioeconomic conditions. Staring at the ground under us until we reach some far off utopia will only lead us to the same end as the dinosaurs as the far unknowns destroy us with what lies in our ignorance. My point is we should eliminate the profit system before dealing with space as everything is going to end up being privatized just like here on earth. In the system I advocate (resource based economy), we would have way more involvement in space as projects wouldn't be limited by money. Maybe you should study economics before falling hook, line, and sinker into that nonsense. Limited by money? Yes, its money, and not resources, that limits projects, of course. Resources (and don't restrict that to mean physical resources) are limited, and if you think you and a bunch of bureaucrats can distribute and implement them more efficiently than successful businessmen then you're simply arrogant. If you think you can do it better then prove it! Nothing is stopping you!
Economics is flawed at its very core.. The perfect example is planned obscolecence. And yes I do think scientific decisions undistubed by the desire to profit would result in more efficient distribution and implementation than a businessman whose sheer motive is to profit.
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On April 20 2012 07:05 Xeiph wrote:
I don't understand all the 'fix the earth first' comments here...this is a private company looking to find a new market. We don't expect other huge companies to stop what they are doing and focus on 'fixing' the earth, why should this one?
Well Cameron is quoted as saying the company is "to help ensure humanity's prosperity." People are trying to gauge what is actually meant by that statement.
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On April 20 2012 07:05 Xeiph wrote:
I don't understand all the 'fix the earth first' comments here...this is a private company looking to find a new market. We don't expect other huge companies to stop what they are doing and focus on 'fixing' the earth, why should this one?
This exactly.
On April 20 2012 07:08 Dali. wrote:
Well Cameron is quoted as saying the company is "to help ensure humanity's prosperity." People are trying to gauge what is actually meant by that statement.
Helping humanity means what it says, helping humanity...
That can be done in more ways than just saving starving people.
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On April 20 2012 07:00 xeo1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2012 06:26 Gummy wrote:On April 20 2012 06:12 Cattivik wrote:
They should fix things on earth first.
Projects like this are like skyscrapers built on sand.The guys on top will touch the sky and those below will get buried.
More money spent for the wealth of few. Most of the problems on earth have technical solutions. We produce enough food to end world hunger easily, yet those living in extreme poverty typically do not have access to infrastructure or distribution of that food. The lack of that infrastructure is not the result of a lack of funds or technology but rather the result of corrupt regimes and war. You can't throw money at those kinds of problems and make them go away. Compared to solving the problems caused by human wickedness and frailty, expanding into space is much more cost effective. On April 20 2012 06:13 smokeyhoodoo wrote:On April 20 2012 03:49 xeo1 wrote:
Good concept but first the socioeconomic system here on earth should be redesigned so pointless jobs are automated and people are given the abundant necessities of life meanwhile making every sector self sustainable so no one has to rely on corporations anymore on a monthly basis...
Edit: typo I'd prefer a socioeconomic system where people get rich for having better ideas than you. You can implement all your wonderful ideas in the system we have. Automate away, make products for cheaper than your competitors, save people money, make the world a better place, and get rich doing it. What's stopping you? What's stopping him is what's stopping most potentially world-changing initiatives: 1.) Lack of capital 2.) Lack of know-how 3.) Lack of a market. Exactly.. And these technical solutions aren't put into place because the main incentive is profit. It wouldn't be profitable to build an infrastructure in a place where the people have no purchasing power.
How do you explain the unyielding growth and massive foreign investment in third world countries then?
Edit: Inappropriate word used.
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EPT
