On July 12 2011 15:55 Aterons_toss wrote: ppl only called me 3 things by now: - faggot... and meh, i kind play fagish in those games usually so... good for them, i still won ;d -nigger... it doesn't seem like an insult to me, its just saying that i am less likely to develop skin cancer and that my dicx is bigger then the avg on this planet -jew... which again doesn't seem like an insult... more like a compliment considering how much the Jewish ppl achieved and how much they helped at shaping the world as we know it.
If you get offended that bad by this kind of insults as to make a post on tl ( a post that is kind of rageish, no offense ) then you might lack 2 certain objects in between your legs. Also why is this general OT ? Its related to sc2/gaming.
Yeah yeah, sticks and stones...i get it and i agree. Words online are among the most ignorable things in the world.
But if you think those insults are insignificant, then I know for a fact that you arent gay, black, or jewish. You are probably yet another white guy who has no idea what its like to have people telling you that you are inferior because of the way you were born. And the fact that you attack someones manhood because of your utter ignorance is just classless
getting tired of people talking down about my race just because my grandparents weren't slaves.. Fuck your words!
Some white people are born ugly, or stupid, or unusually smart, or ginger and these people all get put down all their life because they aren't "normal" But people learn to deal with it.
"I'm offended"... okay... be offended? it's not that bad..
If you get offended by something someone says on the internet then i suggest you become Amish or at least get rid of your computer, you're always going to get someone who will offend you it's a part of life - if you're offended nothing actually happens...
- watch that, it pretty much sums up being offended...
People need to grow some thick skin in my honest opinion because i don't know how they expect to go through life without someone saying something upsetting or offensive and them not being able to cope with it, honestly when i read these posts i just think "grow up for crying out loud its only words"
The problem with calling somebody a "faggot" in game isn't so much that the person could feel offended by it, as it is that it's implicitely associating "homosexual" to "being bad at something".
No, by calling somebody a faggot you are associating homosexuality with intelligence, honesty, red hair, siamese cats, and spaghetti.
Do you see the flaw in your argument now? You can fill in the blank with anything because you aren't actually associating homosexual with anything other than your opponent.
There are no flaws in my arguments
You don't say "you fag" when you compliment somebody on their test results. You say it negatively, or at least that's the cultural norm.
And I hope when you call your opponent a fag it's because you think he played bad, and not just because you think he's a homosexual. Or else it becomes plain ridiculous, "you banshee rushed me, you must like other men! Not that there's anything wrong with it" as Seinfeld would say.
very strange.. one of my friends used the phrase "grats on your results ya fag!" and gave me a big hug, after our exams a few years ago.. ya fag!
The problem with calling somebody a "faggot" in game isn't so much that the person could feel offended by it, as it is that it's implicitely associating "homosexual" to "being bad at something".
No, by calling somebody a faggot you are associating homosexuality with intelligence, honesty, red hair, siamese cats, and spaghetti.
Do you see the flaw in your argument now? You can fill in the blank with anything because you aren't actually associating homosexual with anything other than your opponent.
There are no flaws in my arguments
You don't say "you fag" when you compliment somebody on their test results. You say it negatively, or at least that's the cultural norm.
And I hope when you call your opponent a fag it's because you think he played bad, and not just because you think he's a homosexual. Or else it becomes plain ridiculous, "you banshee rushed me, you must like other men! Not that there's anything wrong with it" as Seinfeld would say.
very strange.. one of my friends used the phrase "grats on your results ya fag!" and gave me a big hug, after our exams a few years ago.. ya fag!
Then big hearts to your friend!
If everybody used the word that way, the word would be a much better place. We should set a trend, from now on after every game put "gg, wp you beautiful fag <3"
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
The problem with calling somebody a "faggot" in game isn't so much that the person could feel offended by it, as it is that it's implicitely associating "homosexual" to "being bad at something".
No, by calling somebody a faggot you are associating homosexuality with intelligence, honesty, red hair, siamese cats, and spaghetti.
Do you see the flaw in your argument now? You can fill in the blank with anything because you aren't actually associating homosexual with anything other than your opponent.
There are no flaws in my arguments
You don't say "you fag" when you compliment somebody on their test results. You say it negatively, or at least that's the cultural norm.
And I hope when you call your opponent a fag it's because you think he played bad, and not just because you think he's a homosexual. Or else it becomes plain ridiculous, "you banshee rushed me, you must like other men! Not that there's anything wrong with it" as Seinfeld would say.
very strange.. one of my friends used the phrase "grats on your results ya fag!" and gave me a big hug, after our exams a few years ago.. ya fag!
Then big hearts to your friend!
If everybody used the word that way, the word would be a much better place. We should set a trend, from now on after every game put "gg, wp you beautiful fag <3"
I don't have a problem with people calling me a nigger, a faggot or a jew. These are just plain insults that you hear everyday. There is nothing bad in being black, gay or jewish, so I don't get offended by it. The same goes for other insults like nerd, commie, etc. I either just block them or enjoy them raging around (if they're raging around at not just insulting me for no reason)
I do however make sure that people calling me a nazi get punished in some way, because that is more than just a plain insult.
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
Sure when you use the word "fag" you don't mean to bash on a certain group of people, just on your opponent. And it would be fine if that was an objective way to see it.
Thing is words aren't neutral, they have a history, and the reason "gay" is used as an insult has a pretty bad history. Maybe not for you, but why would you want to hurt somebody who has had to live through discrimination for being gay?
There are litteraly hundreds of words you can use to evacuate your frustration, why use those that bear a difficult past for some groups of people? It's easy to change.
Sure everyone is an individual, but everyone is also capable of empathy. Why offend people when you can chose not to do so?
Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
Sure when you use the word "fag" you don't mean to bash on a certain group of people, just on your opponent. And it would be fine if that was an objective way to see it.
Thing is words aren't neutral, they have a history, and the reason "gay" is used as an insult has a pretty bad history. Maybe not for you, but why would you want to hurt somebody who has had to live through discrimination for being gay?
There are litteraly hundreds of words you can use to evacuate your frustration, why use those that bear a difficult past for some groups of people? It's easy to change.
Sure everyone is an individual, but everyone is also capable of empathy. Why offend people when you can chose not to do so?
Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
The Nazi's did something terribly terribly wrong. The gays didnt. It's coooooooooommmmmmmmmpletely different
On July 12 2011 18:36 Malyce wrote: Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
No, that's not the problem, because I'm actually gay. Although this could be more of a cultural problem, because there's not that lot of discrimination against gays in Germany, as it is in other countries.
But my point was that there is nothing bad in being gay, while there is something more than bad in being a nazi.
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
Sure when you use the word "fag" you don't mean to bash on a certain group of people, just on your opponent. And it would be fine if that was an objective way to see it.
Thing is words aren't neutral, they have a history, and the reason "gay" is used as an insult has a pretty bad history. Maybe not for you, but why would you want to hurt somebody who has had to live through discrimination for being gay?
There are litteraly hundreds of words you can use to evacuate your frustration, why use those that bear a difficult past for some groups of people? It's easy to change.
Sure everyone is an individual, but everyone is also capable of empathy. Why offend people when you can chose not to do so?
Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
The Nazi's did something terribly terribly wrong. The gays didnt. It's coooooooooommmmmmmmmpletely different
It's similar in the fact that when somebody calls you a nazi, he's not actually calling you a nazi, just using it as an insult. When someone calls you faggot, he's not actually calling you gay, it's used as an insult. What makes people uneasy is the history of the actual word, not the intended meaning by the insulter.
Glad you see my point though =)
Zetter: ya guess you're lucky to have grown up in that environment
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
Sure when you use the word "fag" you don't mean to bash on a certain group of people, just on your opponent. And it would be fine if that was an objective way to see it.
Thing is words aren't neutral, they have a history, and the reason "gay" is used as an insult has a pretty bad history. Maybe not for you, but why would you want to hurt somebody who has had to live through discrimination for being gay?
There are litteraly hundreds of words you can use to evacuate your frustration, why use those that bear a difficult past for some groups of people? It's easy to change.
Sure everyone is an individual, but everyone is also capable of empathy. Why offend people when you can chose not to do so?
You are right that words hold a cultural collective meaning. But guess what. It's not the words that are the problem. If we didn't have the words to insult people with. Do you think the discrimination would not exist?
Do you not think that maybe that you are not going to be able to convince the world(or this forum) to change their habits in regards to what words they use to insult people?
No, hell no.(<-Christians offended right here)
But u know what, I love homosexuals, I love Negros, I love Christians. Doesn't make me want to stop using words like gay.
Look if you want to change, just do as you say. And be the change you wish to see in others.
On July 12 2011 18:36 Malyce wrote: Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
No, that's not the problem, because I'm actually gay. Although this could be more of a cultural problem, because there's not that lot of discrimination against gays in Germany, as it is in other countries.
But my point was that there is nothing bad in being gay, while there is something more than bad in being a nazi.
I'm glad you're smiling and happy right now, sir. I agree with you. There is nothing wrong with being happy and there shouldn't be a reason for it.
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
Sure when you use the word "fag" you don't mean to bash on a certain group of people, just on your opponent. And it would be fine if that was an objective way to see it.
Thing is words aren't neutral, they have a history, and the reason "gay" is used as an insult has a pretty bad history. Maybe not for you, but why would you want to hurt somebody who has had to live through discrimination for being gay?
There are litteraly hundreds of words you can use to evacuate your frustration, why use those that bear a difficult past for some groups of people? It's easy to change.
Sure everyone is an individual, but everyone is also capable of empathy. Why offend people when you can chose not to do so?
Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
Do you honestly think that a 16 year old playing a game of Starcraft, get's a bit annoyed by his 7th 6pooling opponent is going to think "my opponent might actually be gay" before lashing out with the word fag? There's no more depth in the thought process other than "that's a funny word to use" when a gamer insults someone...
Once again it's people overthinking and using their hypersensitivity to try and censor the population... grow up and grow some thick skin like the rest of us had too...
To quote Steve Hughes - "You want to live in a democracy, but you never want to be offended again...?"
I am not affected in the slightest by rudeness from other players - I really couldn't care less what baseless BS someone I have never met (and will never meet) has to say about me. I'm well aware I'm not the best player on the planet and my ego is not involved; I even frequently ask my opponents for their opinion of my play and where they thought I was weak or could improve, and I don't particularly care wether I receive that feedback politely or through "lol you NOOB you hardly attacked me at all" etc.
-HOWEVER-, I also believe behaving like an ass is completely unacceptable, and I am aware that even though these people do not bother ME, the same may not be true of others they may meet. Just because the environment is anonymous does not somehow excuse or make that kind of behaviour "ok", and I want to play games in an environment with pleasant people, not jackasses. I simply report anyone that is behaving like a dickhead and carry on with my day.
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
Sure when you use the word "fag" you don't mean to bash on a certain group of people, just on your opponent. And it would be fine if that was an objective way to see it.
Thing is words aren't neutral, they have a history, and the reason "gay" is used as an insult has a pretty bad history. Maybe not for you, but why would you want to hurt somebody who has had to live through discrimination for being gay?
There are litteraly hundreds of words you can use to evacuate your frustration, why use those that bear a difficult past for some groups of people? It's easy to change.
Sure everyone is an individual, but everyone is also capable of empathy. Why offend people when you can chose not to do so?
Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
Do you honestly think that a 16 year old playing a game of Starcraft, get's a bit annoyed by his 7th 6pooling opponent is going to think "my opponent might actually be gay" before lashing out with the word fag? There's no more depth in the thought process other than "that's a funny word to use" when a gamer insults someone...
Once again it's people overthinking and using their hypersensitivity to try and censor the population... grow up and grow some thick skin like the rest of us had too...
To quote Steve Hughes - "You want to live in a democracy, but you never want to be offended again...?"
Not the issue.
The point isn't if you are actually referring to gay people or not. The point is that words have a meaning beyond the one you're willing to give them.
You can offend someone unintentionnaly, hell most of the people you offend you probably do so unintentionnaly (at least I hope for your sake). Is it still a reason to do it? If somebody tells you "please don't use the word fag in front of me, it offends me", would you then stop using it? Do you really need to be told?
Democracy means respect for people as equals. Discrimination is not a part of democracy. You can dislike me because you think I'm stupid, arrogant or hypersensitive. Not because I have blue eyes. It's that simple.
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
Sure when you use the word "fag" you don't mean to bash on a certain group of people, just on your opponent. And it would be fine if that was an objective way to see it.
Thing is words aren't neutral, they have a history, and the reason "gay" is used as an insult has a pretty bad history. Maybe not for you, but why would you want to hurt somebody who has had to live through discrimination for being gay?
There are litteraly hundreds of words you can use to evacuate your frustration, why use those that bear a difficult past for some groups of people? It's easy to change.
Sure everyone is an individual, but everyone is also capable of empathy. Why offend people when you can chose not to do so?
Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
Do you honestly think that a 16 year old playing a game of Starcraft, get's a bit annoyed by his 7th 6pooling opponent is going to think "my opponent might actually be gay" before lashing out with the word fag? There's no more depth in the thought process other than "that's a funny word to use" when a gamer insults someone...
Once again it's people overthinking and using their hypersensitivity to try and censor the population... grow up and grow some thick skin like the rest of us had too...
To quote Steve Hughes - "You want to live in a democracy, but you never want to be offended again...?"
Not the issue.
The point isn't if you are actually referring to gay people or not. The point is that words have a meaning beyond the one you're willing to give them.
You can offend someone unintentionnaly, hell most of the people you offend you probably do so unintentionnaly (at least I hope for your sake). Is it still a reason to do it? If somebody tells you "please don't use the word fag in front of me, it offends me", would you then stop using it? Do you really need to be told?
Democracy means respect for people as equals. Discrimination is not a part of democracy. You can dislike me because you think I'm stupid, arrogant or hypersensitive. Not because I have blue eyes. It's that simple.
NO it doesn't!!!!
People are allowed to dislike people with blue eyes. OMG what the hell kind of world do you think you live in??
Edit: Note I'm not saying people are allow to kill/harm others because of not liking their blue eyes. But still, I can say "I don't like you, you have blue eyes" Completely legal. Just like I can say "I don't like you, you are a fag"
It's just words dude, besides your on THE INTERNET. Stop taking stuff personally.
On July 12 2011 17:59 Malyce wrote: Words like "fag" or "gay" are primarily used to designate homosexuals. There's a reason for which these words and not others were used to designate bad players/cheesers/all-iners.
Even if it has become a slang and has been normalised doesn't mean it's still fine to use them. It's just that people don't realise that to a certain minority, the use of such language is offensive.
In other words if you are a homosexual, you cheese a dude and he calls you "fkin fag", even if he means "your play is annoying", textually it's still "you play like a gay person, in other words very bad", and as a member of the targetted community you can and probably will feel legitimately offended.
You can also see it this way. It's unfair to gay people that "gay" is used to designate bad play. Why isn't the word "hetero" used instead? Quite frankly the only reason is that the gaming community has been and to a certain extent still is homophobic and homophobic rants have normalised into everyday language.
But those "gay" people are also "full of joy or mirth" which is basically what the word means... unless you meant the slang form of it...it'd be completely different... "full of joy or mirth" at the time of origin
When people began using the word in videogames, or in general as an insult, they weren't referring to "full of joy". They were referring to the homosexuality.
Basically when we pick up these insults today, we're recycling the heritage of our homophobic forefathers. Just like the "n" word with the heritage of former slave owners. Not a heritage I'd like to pick up.
You guys are hard to argue/discuss things with. Too narrow view on how people use words. Too many assumptions.
If you think you know why people use these words. Then you highly assumptive. Just be humble and inquisitive. At least then you would be willing to learn from the world.
Tip: Everyone is an individual. 2 people can say the same thing, both with completely different reasons and emotions.
Lastly, You know not these people on the internet.
Sure when you use the word "fag" you don't mean to bash on a certain group of people, just on your opponent. And it would be fine if that was an objective way to see it.
Thing is words aren't neutral, they have a history, and the reason "gay" is used as an insult has a pretty bad history. Maybe not for you, but why would you want to hurt somebody who has had to live through discrimination for being gay?
There are litteraly hundreds of words you can use to evacuate your frustration, why use those that bear a difficult past for some groups of people? It's easy to change.
Sure everyone is an individual, but everyone is also capable of empathy. Why offend people when you can chose not to do so?
Edit Zetter: perhaps you feel particularly offended by that word because you're german? All these words offend different people, so project the feeling you get when called nazi to a gay person called faggot, it's roughly the same.
Do you honestly think that a 16 year old playing a game of Starcraft, get's a bit annoyed by his 7th 6pooling opponent is going to think "my opponent might actually be gay" before lashing out with the word fag? There's no more depth in the thought process other than "that's a funny word to use" when a gamer insults someone...
Once again it's people overthinking and using their hypersensitivity to try and censor the population... grow up and grow some thick skin like the rest of us had too...
To quote Steve Hughes - "You want to live in a democracy, but you never want to be offended again...?"
Not the issue.
The point isn't if you are actually referring to gay people or not. The point is that words have a meaning beyond the one you're willing to give them.
You can offend someone unintentionnaly, hell most of the people you offend you probably do so unintentionnaly (at least I hope for your sake). Is it still a reason to do it? If somebody tells you "please don't use the word fag in front of me, it offends me", would you then stop using it? Do you really need to be told?
Democracy means respect for people as equals. Discrimination is not a part of democracy. You can dislike me because you think I'm stupid, arrogant or hypersensitive. Not because I have blue eyes. It's that simple.
NO it doesn't!!!!
People are allowed to dislike people with blue eyes. OMG what the hell kind of world do you think you live in??
Hopefully not fascism. When you begin to treat people differently because of things like eye colour, it's no longer a democracy. Democracy means equal rights.
Let me clarify, you can dislike me for whatever you want, what I meant is that you shouldn't treat me differently because of it.
Freedom of expression is never absolute. If it were, there would be no freedom of expression, because people would deny each other's freedom of expression.
EPT
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