EPTIraq & Syrian Civil Wars - Page 425
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Please guys, stay on topic. This thread is about the situation in Iraq and Syria. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3943 Posts
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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Biff The Understudy
France7992 Posts
On October 27 2019 17:00 RvB wrote: www.reuters.com Looks like Al baghdadi has finally been killed. Hopefully this will be the end of IS as well although I doubt it. It might be, the problem is what will come after. No one could predict that after Al Qaeda was weakened, something like ISIS would emerge. I think both the geopolitical situation in middle east and the crisis of islam will create more of those monsters until the region gets stabilized - and that includes us western powers stopping to fuck with it constantly - AND the islamic world takes a hard look at itself and reforms in depth. Not holding my breath for either to happen. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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Biff The Understudy
France7992 Posts
On October 28 2019 22:28 Dangermousecatdog wrote: There is no "Islamic world". It'll be akin to claiming that the "Western world" needs to look at itself and reform in depth for meddling with the region. There are three regional powers of Turkey, Saudia Arabia and Iran (and Isreal but they can hardly be described as Islamic). Along with the 3 regional powers are Russia and USA, 2 nuclear powers battling for regional supremacy by proxies, though USA has recently given away northern Syria to partly Turkey, but mostly to Russia/Syrian Army. On the other hand the US president announced that the US Army is now mercenaries for hire for Saudia Arabia. All 3 regiuonal powers have 3 different govements with different influence of theocratic Islam on them, 2 major different types of Islam, and then there are places like Malaysia which a majority of the population are Islamic, with their own problems, but are very far away from the problems of the Middle East. But there is. And islam, as a religion, and a social force, is going through a deep, deep crisis that needs to be addressed, and frankly, isn't at the moment. I don't see what is controversial in that statement. As for the West having to look at itself too, I'm fine with that. We have our set of issues that we refuse to deal with or even acknowledge, there is no question about that. But it's unrelated. | ||
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Godwrath
Spain10139 Posts
On October 29 2019 00:04 Biff The Understudy wrote: But there is. And islam, as a religion, and a social force, is going through a deep, deep crisis that needs to be addressed, and frankly, isn't at the moment. I don't see what is controversial in that statement. As for the West having to look at itself too, I'm fine with that. We have our set of issues that we refuse to deal with or even acknowledge, there is no question about that. But it's unrelated. Pretty sure that if I throw you off a cliff, it's not your fault that you are not able to grow wings. | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7992 Posts
On October 29 2019 19:36 Godwrath wrote: Pretty sure that if I throw you off a cliff, it's not your fault that you are not able to grow wings. I think the notion that everything going badly in arab countries is due solely to external influences is just as patronizing as the argument that the west has no bearing of responsibility in the situation. Here is the text philosopher Abdennour Bidar wrote in the wake of the rise of Daesh, in 2014. I think it's nuanced and beautifully written, so if you have the patience, I invite you to read it: https://www.resetdoc.org/story/open-letter-to-the-muslim-world/ | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
On October 29 2019 00:04 Biff The Understudy wrote: Islamic social force isn't the reason why Turkey decided to instantly attack the Syrian Kurds as soon as USA gave the green light for them to do so. Saudi Arabia isn't in Yemen because of Islamic social force. The Syrian Civil War didn't occur due to Islamic social force. USA did not invade Iraq due to Islamic social force. Lebanon has just as many Christians as Muslims. ISIS can be said to be influenced by Islam for obvious reasons, but the reason why they were able to take large tracts of Iraq had nothing to do with some notion of religion and social force going through a crisis. Is Islam going through a crisis? Can a religion ever go through a crisis and from whose perspective? Is that related to the Middle East that is going through warfare? There is a crisis, for different peoples, who may be Muslims, but that does not make an Islamic religious or social crisis. There are many different actors, many powerful state actors both foreign and local. It is complex and cannot be distilled to some sort of simplistic, false view and categorisation about an "Islamic world" going through some sort of crisis. Most of the so called Islamic world in fact is not.But there is. And islam, as a religion, and a social force, is going through a deep, deep crisis that needs to be addressed, and frankly, isn't at the moment. I don't see what is controversial in that statement. As for the West having to look at itself too, I'm fine with that. We have our set of issues that we refuse to deal with or even acknowledge, there is no question about that. But it's unrelated. | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7992 Posts
On October 29 2019 23:15 Dangermousecatdog wrote: Islamic social force isn't the reason why Turkey decided to instantly attack the Syrian Kurds as soon as USA gave the green light for them to do so. Saudi Arabia isn't in Yemen because of Islamic social force. The Syrian Civil War didn't occur due to Islamic social force. USA did not invade Iraq due to Islamic social force. Lebanon has just as many Christians as Muslims. ISIS can be said to be influenced by Islam for obvious reasons, but the reason why they were able to take large tracts of Iraq had nothing to do with some notion of religion and social force going through a crisis. Is Islam going through a crisis? Can a religion ever go through a crisis and from whose perspective? Is that related to the Middle East that is going through warfare? There is a crisis, for different peoples, who may be Muslims, but that does not make an Islamic religious or social crisis. There are many different actors, many powerful state actors both foreign and local. It is complex and cannot be distilled to some sort of simplistic, false view and categorisation about an "Islamic world" going through some sort of crisis. Most of the so called Islamic world in fact is not. Yeah and we talk about completely different things. All I am saying is that Al Qaeda, now Isis and tomorrow who knows what other monster comes out masquarading the face of islam is not only the result of geopolitics, but also of a crisis within islam itself. And I invite you to read that very good text I linked before answering. It's not very long and it sums up what I am trying to say better than I will ever do. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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Biff The Understudy
France7992 Posts
On October 31 2019 23:42 Dangermousecatdog wrote: What about your link? I read it before I replied. It's just a random emotive plea to another audience who isn't me. I honestly expected better from you than a "read this link, because I can't be bothered to explain myself". The fact that it's emotive doesn't make it one bit less reflected. And it's you who chose not to be the audience, really. This text is obviously for everyone. If you can't get anything out if a text because it has some kind of literary form, it's on you. I think i explained myself all right, and I thought that going through point by point on why islam is in a crisis when it's explained very well and very clearly in that text would be a waste of time; I can recap it for you in a non emotional way and without any literary address to an audience that is not you if that's needed, but anyway, sincerely, it feels like you want to argue for the sake of it. | ||
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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AssyrianKing
Australia2116 Posts
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raga4ka
Bulgaria5679 Posts
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/nov/13/donald-trump-syria-oil-us-troops-isis-turkey | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23691 Posts
On November 14 2019 23:13 raga4ka wrote: Trump admits the real reason why the US is in Syria and if anyone didn't guess it's oil. Of course other agendas such as toppling Assad and helping regional allies like Israel, Saudi and the Kurds push forward their geopolitical goals, were also goals of the Obama administration back before Russia got involved. Lastly there is ISiS which to me is the main excuse for the US to be in Syria in the first place. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/nov/13/donald-trump-syria-oil-us-troops-isis-turkey I think you spelled "freedom and democracy" wrong /s | ||
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ImFromPortugal
Portugal1368 Posts
Are we back ? https://www.reddit.com/r/syriancivilwar/comments/1h2lkmh/historic_moment_as_syrian_rebels_enter_aleppo/ Rebels (HTS) the guys that changed names at least 4 times since this thread's inception, from Al-Nusra to Hayat Tharir Al-Sham are advancing towards Aleppo City.. some reports are saying they are already inside the city center. Other rebel factions supported by Turkey are advancing as well and joining the offensive. Syrian rebels enter Aleppo for first time in eight years during shock offensive https://edition.cnn.com/2024/11/29/world/syria-rebels-aleppo-war-intl/index.html | ||
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RvB
Netherlands6269 Posts
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Sermokala
United States14104 Posts
I didn't want to be the first to say something so I didn't get hooked by some NCD meme a friend sent me but I think this is a real massive development. If aleppo falls what response is there? Hezbolah can't help beacuse they were just shredded by isreal and are on their shitlist, Russia is in triple didget days of their war in Ukraine. Is Iran willing to escalate against turkyie and solidify an Isreali-turkish axis in the middle east? | ||
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Kreuger
Sweden839 Posts
Would expect reinforcements to stabilize during the next few days, but either way its a huge loss and I have doubts they have the capacity to reverse it. Also interessting will be to see how Erdogan plays his cards, might make a move on SDF if the russians and SAA withdraws from the north to help put against HTS | ||
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Billyboy
1521 Posts
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