• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 03:32
CEST 09:32
KST 16:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection4Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview5[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)7
Community News
[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June0Weekly Cups (May 25-31): Clem doubles, 2v2 circuit heads toward finale0StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th151Weekly Cups (May 18-24): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League6
StarCraft 2
General
SCFusion - WoL, HotS & LotV Build Order Optimizer TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection TL Poll: How do you feel about the 5.0.16 PTR balance changes? My starcraft 2 changes StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 528 Infection Detected Welcome to the External Content forum Mutation # 527 Hell Train
Brood War
General
14k games analyzed: Cross Spawn Nexus first good? Tesagi Viewer - A new era of replay watching FlaSh's ASL S21 Finals Review BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ VPN experiences
Tourneys
[ASL21] Grand Finals [BSL22] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CEST [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Path of Exile ZeroSpace Megathread
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread How cold is too cold to be outdoors? Dating: How's your luck?
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
Esportsmanship: How to NOT B…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7302 users

The Big Programming Thread - Page 700

Forum Index > General Forum
Post a Reply
Prev 1 698 699 700 701 702 1032 Next
Thread Rules
1. This is not a "do my homework for me" thread. If you have specific questions, ask, but don't post an assignment or homework problem and expect an exact solution.
2. No recruiting for your cockamamie projects (you won't replace facebook with 3 dudes you found on the internet and $20)
3. If you can't articulate why a language is bad, don't start slinging shit about it. Just remember that nothing is worse than making CSS IE6 compatible.
4. Use [code] tags to format code blocks.
RoyGBiv_13
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States1275 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-07 22:32:50
January 07 2016 22:32 GMT
#13981
On January 08 2016 07:15 emperorchampion wrote:

- Try to replace loops with indexing, much faster and easier, loops should be the last option imo, built in functions or index are the way to go


If you ignore all other advice, heed this. In the short run, it will merely make your code shorter and easier to read. In the long run, MATLAB functions tend to start taking days or weeks after the scope starts getting out of control, so thinking in terms of speed of computation early means you do not have to relearn MATLAB at a later point.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic
solidbebe
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Netherlands4921 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-07 23:48:47
January 07 2016 23:48 GMT
#13982
Another +1 for avoiding loops. Almost anytime you are tempted to use a loop in matlab, theres some matrix operation which is 1000x faster, is cleaner code, and makes you look more pro.
That's the 2nd time in a week I've seen someone sig a quote from this GD and I have never witnessed a sig quote happen in my TL history ever before. -Najda
tofucake
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Hyrule19217 Posts
January 08 2016 01:04 GMT
#13983
On January 08 2016 07:02 Manit0u wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 08 2016 06:36 travis wrote:
I already read that. I think I get a grasp of how it works, for the most part. And why, for the most part. I just don't see the advantage of doing it this way instead of just having a keyword. It actually seems like it's making it more complicated instead of less, which is something I haven't seen in python so far.

Maybe this is a question I will need to ask myself in 6 months.


You think this is complicated? PHP has both self and this. And in JavaScript you often see stuff like that:


var self = this;


Try figuring those out

Edit:
Not for the faint of heart: http://alistapart.com/article/getoutbindingsituations

self for static and this for objective

bam
Liquipediaasante sana squash banana
Deleted User 3420
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
24492 Posts
January 08 2016 15:43 GMT
#13984
here's a question
why do people bother with programs like bootstrap
why is that better than just writing your html/css yourself? Or is there something more that it does ?
solidbebe
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Netherlands4921 Posts
January 08 2016 15:49 GMT
#13985
Usually just provides a lot of out of the box functionality without having to do much work, it'll get you results faster than figuring everything out yourself.
That's the 2nd time in a week I've seen someone sig a quote from this GD and I have never witnessed a sig quote happen in my TL history ever before. -Najda
tofucake
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Hyrule19217 Posts
January 08 2016 16:16 GMT
#13986
We use bootstrap at my work because it let's us do styling well but quickly, and we can spend more time on the actual business logic and implementing new functionality.
Liquipediaasante sana squash banana
Deleted User 3420
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
24492 Posts
January 08 2016 16:44 GMT
#13987
I have read several posts that say that unless you put in the extra work to customize the code, "all bootstrap sites look the same". Is there any truth to that?
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17756 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-08 17:16:29
January 08 2016 16:49 GMT
#13988
Things like bootstrap and jQuery are useful because of many reasons:

1. Uniform way of styling/scripting across projects.
2. Lots of help available online.
3. Lets you avoid a lot of tarpits (mainly cross-browser functionality and legacy browser support). Also, since they're so popular they've been tested extensively and already fixed stuff you didn't even know could be a problem.
4. Easier to find new people for the project (higher chance of finding someone who has already worked with those frameworks than someone who'll pick up your own stuff quickly enough without applying additional burden to the rest of the team).
5. Huge number of "out-of-the-box" features.

Just to name a few.

Although we're currently debating switching from bootstrap to foundation all of the above still applies.

Here's a brief tutorial on how grid frameworks work (and why people use them to develop front-end fast across mobile and desktop):

Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
tofucake
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Hyrule19217 Posts
January 08 2016 18:06 GMT
#13989
On January 09 2016 01:44 travis wrote:
I have read several posts that say that unless you put in the extra work to customize the code, "all bootstrap sites look the same". Is there any truth to that?

Yeah, basic bootstrap sites have very common appearances, but it's really simple to customize too.
Liquipediaasante sana squash banana
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17756 Posts
January 08 2016 18:33 GMT
#13990
On January 09 2016 03:06 tofucake wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2016 01:44 travis wrote:
I have read several posts that say that unless you put in the extra work to customize the code, "all bootstrap sites look the same". Is there any truth to that?

Yeah, basic bootstrap sites have very common appearances, but it's really simple to customize too.


There's actually nothing wrong with that. The design is simple yet good looking so even the sites with basic bootstrap look well. Also, it's good for the UX since the users get accustomed to the elements, don't have to look for things and instantly know what's what.

Anyway, like it was mentioned, it's really easy to customize bootstrap to suit your needs (you can even do it on their website and download already modified code). You can get all the matching colors and proper stuff here and use it to make a really nice looking layout with bootstrap.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
myRZeth
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany1047 Posts
January 08 2016 18:37 GMT
#13991
Is there anyone in here who programs in Racket?

I'd appreciate a PM if yes.

Thanks, awesome community.
Deleted User 101379
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
4849 Posts
January 09 2016 07:12 GMT
#13992
Might be a bit off topic or at least tangential, but does anyone have any ideas about marketing a website to letsplayers and letsplay viewers?

I've launched my private project LetsPlayDB into essentially open beta yesterday, but I'm still unsure on how to get the initial boost I need to take off. Without letsplayers, people won't bother to search. Without people to search, letsplayers won't sign up. I've posted it to /r/letsplay and got a few channels to sign up, but by far not enough.

For those interested, the website is done in Node.JS using Express - my first ever Node.JS project. Backend is MongoDB, also a first for me. Frontend is of course using bootstrap, since I'm not a webdesigner, and a tiny bit of AngularJS - not a huge fan of AngularJS so far, it seems to be the same as jquery ui widgets, just with added syntax, but it seems to do it's job.
sabas123
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands3122 Posts
January 10 2016 19:44 GMT
#13993
After a full weekend of learning openGL my brain is fried after trying to understand how all of this works.
The harder it becomes, the more you should focus on the basics.
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17756 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-10 21:25:22
January 10 2016 21:24 GMT
#13994
On January 09 2016 16:12 Morfildur wrote:
Might be a bit off topic or at least tangential, but does anyone have any ideas about marketing a website to letsplayers and letsplay viewers?

I've launched my private project LetsPlayDB into essentially open beta yesterday, but I'm still unsure on how to get the initial boost I need to take off. Without letsplayers, people won't bother to search. Without people to search, letsplayers won't sign up. I've posted it to /r/letsplay and got a few channels to sign up, but by far not enough.

For those interested, the website is done in Node.JS using Express - my first ever Node.JS project. Backend is MongoDB, also a first for me. Frontend is of course using bootstrap, since I'm not a webdesigner, and a tiny bit of AngularJS - not a huge fan of AngularJS so far, it seems to be the same as jquery ui widgets, just with added syntax, but it seems to do it's job.


Angular starts to shine when you have a 2-system setup. Where one system has the primary db and does all the heavy lifting but doesn't really have a front and the other one only has db containing some user data and very basic controllers and is nothing more than a front where you use angular to display stuff you get from the other system.

This is actually pretty neat for front/back-end separation and it much reduces the load on your system (since the back-end stuff is set up to only receive json and only from ip's where your front-facing systems reside). All the front-facing systems really do is send request to the back-end system, get json in response and use angular to display it. Additional security is nice too.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
tofucake
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Hyrule19217 Posts
January 12 2016 01:59 GMT
#13995
So last week we got the green light to start fresh with the new version of our website, and today we had a database design meeting. I'm excited that we are moving from a heavily modded and unupgradable CakePHP 1.something, weird ajax, some sort of Symfony, bootstrap AND random SASS, jQuery, and PHP 5.3 all run on composer and compass to Symfony 3, PHP7, AdminLTE/Bootstrap, bower/gulp, and maybe nginx.

The admin section of prod alone is a nightmare to debug, as the way it's setup is such that all debugging is a pain (tail -F /var/log/httpd/error_log) and called pages cannot execute JS, which means all the control JS needs to be in the calling document, not the return result. It's so dumb how it's currently done.

Add to that the fact that we outsourced the development of the mobile site to another company and they royally fucked it up, and what we get is a very happy team of developers. Going through the DB today and saying "yes we can axe this 13gb table" was awesome.
Liquipediaasante sana squash banana
Manit0u
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
Poland17756 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-12 04:57:59
January 12 2016 04:57 GMT
#13996
On January 12 2016 10:59 tofucake wrote:
So last week we got the green light to start fresh with the new version of our website, and today we had a database design meeting. I'm excited that we are moving from a heavily modded and unupgradable CakePHP 1.something, weird ajax, some sort of Symfony, bootstrap AND random SASS, jQuery, and PHP 5.3 all run on composer and compass to Symfony 3, PHP7, AdminLTE/Bootstrap, bower/gulp, and maybe nginx.

The admin section of prod alone is a nightmare to debug, as the way it's setup is such that all debugging is a pain (tail -F /var/log/httpd/error_log) and called pages cannot execute JS, which means all the control JS needs to be in the calling document, not the return result. It's so dumb how it's currently done.

Add to that the fact that we outsourced the development of the mobile site to another company and they royally fucked it up, and what we get is a very happy team of developers. Going through the DB today and saying "yes we can axe this 13gb table" was awesome.


That's cool. Let me know if you need any help with Symfony. For a year now most of the projects our company is doing are in Symfony 2.7+ and PHP 5.5+. It's a pleasure to work with it.
Time is precious. Waste it wisely.
coolprogrammingstuff
Profile Joined December 2015
906 Posts
January 12 2016 09:18 GMT
#13997
On January 08 2016 05:50 travis wrote:
I have a couple questions about the commonly seen "self" parameter in python

It seems to have the same purpose as "this" in java. except from what I read, self isn't actually a keyword, so it can be anything

so a couple questions I have - is this parameter required in all methods you write in python?
is this parameter basically just saying "from now on this is how this method can refer to itself"
and finally - why? why not just use "this" like in java?


It is convention. You can use "this" all you like, but it'd be bad practice in python.

Python didn't just use "self" to be cool to distinguish itself from java -some OO languages use this, others self. This deviates all the way back to two of the first OO programming languages - Simula (this), smalltalk (self). A bit more complicated than that, and I'm not too knowledgable about it either, but yeah!
Deleted User 101379
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
4849 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-01-12 10:39:18
January 12 2016 10:38 GMT
#13998
On January 12 2016 10:59 tofucake wrote:
So last week we got the green light to start fresh with the new version of our website, and today we had a database design meeting. I'm excited that we are moving from a heavily modded and unupgradable CakePHP 1.something, weird ajax, some sort of Symfony, bootstrap AND random SASS, jQuery, and PHP 5.3 all run on composer and compass to Symfony 3, PHP7, AdminLTE/Bootstrap, bower/gulp, and maybe nginx.

The admin section of prod alone is a nightmare to debug, as the way it's setup is such that all debugging is a pain (tail -F /var/log/httpd/error_log) and called pages cannot execute JS, which means all the control JS needs to be in the calling document, not the return result. It's so dumb how it's currently done.

Add to that the fact that we outsourced the development of the mobile site to another company and they royally fucked it up, and what we get is a very happy team of developers. Going through the DB today and saying "yes we can axe this 13gb table" was awesome.


Been there, done that. End product was worse than the previous product.

In my previous company we wanted to move away from the old frontend, which was essentially entirely custom made. The new project was supposed to be all OOP, SOA, TDD and stuff. I was only involved in the latter parts of the rework, but essentially the new website was slow as hell, the structure was even more confusing since everything was configurable and the UI that was supposed to be identical to the old ended up much less userfriendly. The rework too 6 developers about a full year, if not a bit more, and for me the final product was unacceptable with page loading speeds in the range of one second for the simpler pages - after the extended 10 person team, the part where I got involved, spent two weeks optimizing everything, apart from the underlying Kohana framework which we weren't allowed to fix as to maintain compatibility to future updates.

I switched to my current company, for which I worked a few years back, on the promise of scrapping the old websites and creating something new. The old pages were basically procedural with all the functions in a file literally called functions.php. I came in when the one developer plus two student assistants already laid most of the foundation and I mostly had to add some of the more complex stuff like payment connectors and such. The new product is using zend framework 2 running on the azure cloud with lots of factories and stuff - and it's ugly, slow (page loading speed of 2s and more) and big parts of the code are huge messes. Launch is on the first of February and I wouldn't use the product in it's current state even if the stuff we're selling was free.

I think scrapping old stuff and creating it anew is overrated.
It's fun though, I do it with my private projects all the time, which is one reason why 99% of them never see the light of day.
berated-
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
United States1134 Posts
January 12 2016 16:19 GMT
#13999
On January 12 2016 19:38 Morfildur wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 12 2016 10:59 tofucake wrote:
So last week we got the green light to start fresh with the new version of our website, and today we had a database design meeting. I'm excited that we are moving from a heavily modded and unupgradable CakePHP 1.something, weird ajax, some sort of Symfony, bootstrap AND random SASS, jQuery, and PHP 5.3 all run on composer and compass to Symfony 3, PHP7, AdminLTE/Bootstrap, bower/gulp, and maybe nginx.

The admin section of prod alone is a nightmare to debug, as the way it's setup is such that all debugging is a pain (tail -F /var/log/httpd/error_log) and called pages cannot execute JS, which means all the control JS needs to be in the calling document, not the return result. It's so dumb how it's currently done.

Add to that the fact that we outsourced the development of the mobile site to another company and they royally fucked it up, and what we get is a very happy team of developers. Going through the DB today and saying "yes we can axe this 13gb table" was awesome.


Been there, done that. End product was worse than the previous product.

In my previous company we wanted to move away from the old frontend, which was essentially entirely custom made. The new project was supposed to be all OOP, SOA, TDD and stuff. I was only involved in the latter parts of the rework, but essentially the new website was slow as hell, the structure was even more confusing since everything was configurable and the UI that was supposed to be identical to the old ended up much less userfriendly. The rework too 6 developers about a full year, if not a bit more, and for me the final product was unacceptable with page loading speeds in the range of one second for the simpler pages - after the extended 10 person team, the part where I got involved, spent two weeks optimizing everything, apart from the underlying Kohana framework which we weren't allowed to fix as to maintain compatibility to future updates.

I switched to my current company, for which I worked a few years back, on the promise of scrapping the old websites and creating something new. The old pages were basically procedural with all the functions in a file literally called functions.php. I came in when the one developer plus two student assistants already laid most of the foundation and I mostly had to add some of the more complex stuff like payment connectors and such. The new product is using zend framework 2 running on the azure cloud with lots of factories and stuff - and it's ugly, slow (page loading speed of 2s and more) and big parts of the code are huge messes. Launch is on the first of February and I wouldn't use the product in it's current state even if the stuff we're selling was free.

I think scrapping old stuff and creating it anew is overrated.
It's fun though, I do it with my private projects all the time, which is one reason why 99% of them never see the light of day.


+1 - rewrites are definitely.. interesting.

The problem I have with them most of the time is the fallacy that it will be easier to understand, combined with the failure to understand the current product. If you can't dive in and figure out the current one, I've never been quite certain how one thinks they will rewrite it and get it correct.
mTwRINE
Profile Joined February 2006
Germany318 Posts
January 12 2016 17:25 GMT
#14000
On January 09 2016 16:12 Morfildur wrote:
For those interested, the website is done in Node.JS using Express - my first ever Node.JS project. Backend is MongoDB, also a first for me. Frontend is of course using bootstrap, since I'm not a webdesigner, and a tiny bit of AngularJS - not a huge fan of AngularJS so far, it seems to be the same as jquery ui widgets, just with added syntax, but it seems to do it's job.


You are not using any Angular features (directives like ng-repeat, ng-model for example). Right now its just a container for standard jQuery. See “Thinking in AngularJS” if I have a jQuery background?
As you said it does its job, but if you want some input on how to get there, I could give you some pointers.
Prev 1 698 699 700 701 702 1032 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
The PiG Daily
21:30
GSL Ro8 Group B Replay Cast
Maru vs SHIN
Rogue vs Zoun
PiGStarcraft793
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 130
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 7042
BeSt 145
Soma 85
Mong 71
Leta 44
NaDa 27
yabsab 23
Movie 6
Bale 6
League of Legends
JimRising 647
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K1632
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King89
Other Games
PiGStarcraft793
C9.Mang0338
RuFF_SC258
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick810
BasetradeTV175
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH360
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis1913
• Rush1274
• Stunt495
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
1h 28m
Solar vs Classic
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
7h 28m
Grudge Match
8h 28m
FlaShFTW vs A.Alm
OSC
13h 28m
MaxPax vs YoungYakov
Krystianer vs Shameless
GgMaChine vs Creature
LetaleX vs MiniZergUA
ReBellioN vs TBD
ArT vs HiGhDrA
Nicoract vs Azura
GSL
1d
herO vs Rogue
Maru vs Cure
Patches Events
1d 5h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 7h
BSL
1d 11h
OSC
1d 16h
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
Maestros of the Game
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

KK 2v2 League Season 1
RSL Revival: Season 5
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
2026 GSL S2
Murky Cup 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Heroes Pulsing #3
Heroes Pulsing #2
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.