EPTStormgate/Frost Giant Megathread - Page 86
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Manit0u
Poland17374 Posts
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Harris1st
Germany6972 Posts
On February 22 2024 22:26 JimmyJRaynor wrote: Frost Giant is raising investment money via a new company called "StartEngine". A small word of caution about this organization. They claim the founder of StartENgine, Howard Marks, co-founded Activision. Uhhh, that is a lie. I am an avid video game historian. I know all about the start of Activision and I've known about it for 20+ years. Howard Marks and Citibank's high yield Debt Program have nothing to do with the start and founding of Activision. I align politlcally with Kevin O'leary in a great many ways. Unfortunately, Kevin O'Leary is lying. When called on this lie I have no doubt O'Leary will claim he didn't know. Anyhow, Activision was founded by Pitfall! maker David Crane, RoboTank designer Alan Miller, Chess on the Atari 2600 designer Bob Whitehead, and money man Larry Kaplan. Howard Marks was managing high yield DEBT for a bank. Larry Kaplan got the 1 million to start Activision from Sutter Hill Ventures. They quickly paid it back and were 100% independent of any outside money orgs or venture capital people. Pitfall! was an absolute, off-the-charts smash hit. Activision didn't need any outside money. If they are now going to re-write history ... I'm calling BS. I've been following Kevin O'Leary for over 20 years. He will very, very occasionally bullshit. Unfortunately, this is one of those times. I really want SG to succeed but I was already cautious with the Kickstarter because it was too vague so I'm sure as hell not gonna buy in this StartEngine stuff now | ||
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gingerfluffmuffnr2
107 Posts
I suspect that's the case. But the executive team (Tim Morten, Tim Campbell and Cara LaForge) have collectively worked on 4 failed startups prior to this one, including 2 in the RTS genre. So you'd think they'd be familiar with startup economics by now. Command & Conquer, an RTS F2P reboot of C&C that never launched - Tim Morten was Director Guardians of Atlas, RTS/MOBA thingy, that failed after its first open beta - Cara LaForge was partner/manager in Day9's company that did the design. Tim Campbell's FireForge, a company he founded, had had two MOBA projects 'Atlas' and 'Zeus' not get to launch. Then they started to make a high profile Ghostbusters game which failed, then the company folded and he became a fill-in director on the in-progress Wasteland 3 before founding Frost Giant with Morten. Credit to u/TertButoxide- for digging up the above. --------------------------- Also Cara LaForge being Tasteless/Day9s mum. Projects looking more doomed by the minute. | ||
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AmericanUmlaut
Germany2578 Posts
 . Never was the delta greater between how much I wanted a thing to succeed and how thoroughly it landed on its face. All the talk early on of the fully native in-browser engine seemed so promising, and Day[9] being involved with all his ideas around what makes an RTS fun, and then when it came out there was just nothing there. I wish there'd been a detailed post-mortem of that project; I'd be fascinated to learn in greater detail how it went so terribly awry. | ||
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Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On February 22 2024 00:50 JimmyJRaynor wrote: News of Frost Giant starting an investment drive on StartEngine spread far and wide. Numerous giant video game news sites and even GamesIndustry.biz reported on it. And yet, we have many big name Stormgate streamers who have not commented a single word on this. The silence is deafening. I have a hunch ZombieGrub is going to have something to say about it though. I will be watching the next broadcast of "Real Talk Strategy".  On the humourous side of things we have this... https://old.reddit.com/r/Stormgate/comments/1aw5akb/a_professionals_guide_to_fundraising_and_a/ Grubby also did a critical video on it. Not a Stormgate streamer but certainly a relevant name. | ||
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_Spartak_
Turkey419 Posts
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_Spartak_
Turkey419 Posts
On February 23 2024 19:06 gingerfluffmuffnr2 wrote: Generals 2 was a startup project? Found on reddit (u/Conscious_River_4964) I suspect that's the case. But the executive team (Tim Morten, Tim Campbell and Cara LaForge) have collectively worked on 4 failed startups prior to this one, including 2 in the RTS genre. So you'd think they'd be familiar with startup economics by now. Command & Conquer, an RTS F2P reboot of C&C that never launched - Tim Morten was Director Guardians of Atlas, RTS/MOBA thingy, that failed after its first open beta - Cara LaForge was partner/manager in Day9's company that did the design. Tim Campbell's FireForge, a company he founded, had had two MOBA projects 'Atlas' and 'Zeus' not get to launch. Then they started to make a high profile Ghostbusters game which failed, then the company folded and he became a fill-in director on the in-progress Wasteland 3 before founding Frost Giant with Morten. Credit to u/TertButoxide- for digging up the above. --------------------------- Also Cara LaForge being Tasteless/Day9s mum. Projects looking more doomed by the minute. Also, I don't think Cara LaForge was involved in Guardians of Atlas. | ||
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Harris1st
Germany6972 Posts
On February 23 2024 20:21 _Spartak_ wrote: Generals 2 was a startup project? Also, I don't think Cara LaForge was involved in Guardians of Atlas. She is listed as a Blizzard employee or freelancing for Blizzard between 2014 and 2018. World of WarCraft: Battle for Azeroth (2018, Windows) Global Esports Team StarCraft: Remastered (2017, Windows) Global Esports Team StarCraft II: Nova Covert Ops - Mission Pack 3 (2016, Windows) Business Operations World of WarCraft: Legion (2016, Windows) Global Esports Team StarCraft II: Legacy of the Void (2015, Windows) Business Operations Heroes of the Storm (2015, Windows) Development Team World of WarCraft: Warlords of Draenor (2014, Windows) Blizzard Development Family | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16859 Posts
On February 23 2024 20:21 _Spartak_ wrote: Generals 2 was a startup project? Also, I don't think Cara LaForge was involved in Guardians of Atlas. Victory Games was a new studio. Westwood/EALA got nuked by EA after C&C4 did poorly in 2010. Jon Van Canegham founded and owned Victory Games. Tim Morten was his #1 creative. I wonder if there was any competition for RTS players in 2010 guys? How could C&C4 fail in 2010? On February 23 2024 19:38 Redox wrote: Grubby also did a critical video on it. Not a Stormgate streamer but certainly a relevant name. https://youtu.be/lXNa_2Tds68?si=Eypr5Zn5nl6R_9k3 I like the research he did on their funding. IMO, Grubby is a first class human AND a certified bad ass. He did some nice research in this video. I love Grubby's #1 rule of gaming: "when you start to get bored ... do something else". Although I do not recommend investing in Frost Giant I do recommend giving the game a chance. It'll be free. It can't hurt to try it. | ||
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gTank
Austria2584 Posts
On February 23 2024 22:08 JimmyJRaynor wrote: Victory Games was a new studio. Westwood/EALA got nuked by EA after C&C4 did poorly in 2010. Jon Van Canegham founded and owned Victory Games. Tim Morten was his #1 creative. I wonder if there was any competition for RTS players in 2010 guys? How could C&C4 fail in 2010? Because c&c4 was a really bad game most probably. | ||
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KingzTig
155 Posts
On February 22 2024 01:00 moomin22 wrote: ZombieGrub has had integrity on stormgate right from the start. I have a lot of respect for her because of that. If stormgate fails they can't say we didn't try. The negative feedback on the game they presented has been LOUD from day 1. They choose to ignore it. Same. Honestly I feel like many influencers/streamers are just riding that stormgate initial hype viewer count and trying to ignore the whole drama. SG at open beta looked downright poor, complete lack of texture on terrain, a barebone put together coop and still missing t3 and third race, Gameplay wise, sure it's responsive but what good is it if Unit design are so boring. Who came up with the brute and split mechanics? It makes engagements with them always a complete mess. They want to sell microtransaction even when so many screamed at them right at the beginning on the art style? Artosis was saying how the game visual shouldn't be compared to sc2, sure but SG is going up against SC2 as is. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16859 Posts
On February 23 2024 22:12 gTank wrote: Because c&c4 was a really bad game most probably. it was weird and MID. it was half-moba//half-rts. all the good people left EALA right after RA3 and did not stick around for C&C4. they knew SC2 was coming. A name people might be familiar with , Greg Black, was a big part of Red Alert 3. He found something else to do and left the C&C team. He saw the Starcraft train coming down the track. LOL. I think Greg Black is a damn good game designer. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16859 Posts
On February 23 2024 22:21 KingzTig wrote: Artosis was saying how the game visual shouldn't be compared to sc2, sure but SG is going up against SC2 as is. They made lofty promises like "The Future of RTS". They did 20 minute interviews where they go into detail about how they're going to replace every aspect of SC2 by making "The 4 C's: Campaign, Co-op, Competitive..." and 1 other C i can't recall. LOL. This felt more like a fund raising drive than a realistic development plan. In the last few days someone at Frost Giant is quoted to say "the game will be years in development". So that is a realistic statement. It appears the fund raising phase is over and we're moving into realistic territory. It is great to see solid guys like Wardi ignore this and continue to pull off really cool SC2 events and broadcasts. EDIT: the 4th C is Custom games. LOL. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21870 Posts
On February 23 2024 22:21 KingzTig wrote: The graphics and UI was something that could be fixed given time, have a barebones version now to get people playing and gather data and then 5-6 years of progress later you get something great.Same. Honestly I feel like many influencers/streamers are just riding that stormgate initial hype viewer count and trying to ignore the whole drama. SG at open beta looked downright poor, complete lack of texture on terrain, a barebone put together coop and still missing t3 and third race, Gameplay wise, sure it's responsive but what good is it if Unit design are so boring. Who came up with the brute and split mechanics? It makes engagements with them always a complete mess. They want to sell microtransaction even when so many screamed at them right at the beginning on the art style? Artosis was saying how the game visual shouldn't be compared to sc2, sure but SG is going up against SC2 as is. But that rested on the notion that they were 'funded to release' 5-6 years from now, which we now know is false. Going into early access with these graphics and hoping to get the money to keep production going is a death sentence. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18086 Posts
On February 23 2024 22:36 Gorsameth wrote: The graphics and UI was something that could be fixed given time, have a barebones version now to get people playing and gather data and then 5-6 years of progress later you get something great. But that rested on the notion that they were 'funded to release' 5-6 years from now, which we now know is false. Going into early access with these graphics and hoping to get the money to keep production going is a death sentence. It's particularly weird, because the graphics engine is unreal 5, which is effing excellent. You just need a few decent designers to make your models and skins. There's one-man studios who have made prettier games than SG on Steam. | ||
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Harris1st
Germany6972 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain18086 Posts
On February 23 2024 22:50 Harris1st wrote: Still not sure what everyones problem with the visual is btw. It's an art style. I like SG much more than ZS visuals. It's purely subjective (as long as you can see whats going on that is) isn't it? I'm not comparing it to ZS visuals, but to SC2. Compared to SC2 it is both bland, and hard to make out what is happening. | ||
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gTank
Austria2584 Posts
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Shinokuki
United States923 Posts
On February 23 2024 22:53 Acrofales wrote: I'm not comparing it to ZS visuals, but to SC2. Compared to SC2 it is both bland, and hard to make out what is happening. True. Artwork seems so bland and uninspiring. It doesn't leave a good taste | ||
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MeSaber
Sweden1235 Posts
On February 23 2024 23:31 gTank wrote: Not easy to watch it, also looks worse than Warcraft 3 to me. Was a pain to play it in 4k even. Also, not fun enough mechanics imo, though there are no Tier 3 units yet. Some say there arent many units left adding. Vanguard complete and infernal maybe a t3 unit. Info from famous SG streamers. | ||
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