If you can get a chance, check out the washington/dallas game. That was an epic game. John wall is going to be the next superstar. The miami game wasn't too entertaining. Lebron put on a show in the first quarter, and chris bosh put the icing on the cake in 3rd/4th. Dwayde fans can skip it as he didn't play any minutes because of his injury.
You know what really pissed me off last night? Every broadcaster in Ontario anyway, dismissed the Raptors versus Suns almost completely. They showed one highlight of a dunk on Sports Center and that was IT. They put most of their focus on the no hitter good ol' Doc made the other day, MLB post-season and the Randy Moss trade. Like seriously? The managers of all the post-season MLB teams got more air-time than anyone else.
Sure, its only preseason, but the fact is Stern even said they left Vancouver prematurely and the place was sold out to see Nash play against Toronto. The score was ridiculous and there were tons of highlights in the game. ._.
I'm used to it already. Basketball has always played second fiddle to the Leafs I don't expect that to change. The thing is they show one highlight and that is it on the top ten plays of the day. Are you serious? They didn't even do a 30 second snip bit of the game when it was a fairly lopsided affair with a lot of entertaining plays. I don't know about you, but yes its a preseason tune-up. Here's the catch, no one expected the Raptors to even be able to compete but here they are winning a 129-73 game (yes preseason once again) with players firing on all cylinders. If you are a broadcaster perhaps you should highlight the fact, "Hey Toronto, perhaps things won't be so bad after all." There is plenty of story there and considering almost every sports channel didn't show anything from it is mind-boggling.
On October 08 2010 01:51 StarStruck wrote: I'm used to it already. Basketball has always played second fiddle to the Leafs I don't expect that to change. The thing is they show one highlight and that is it on the top ten plays of the day. Are you serious? They didn't even do a 30 second snip bit of the game when it was a fairly lopsided affair with a lot of entertaining plays. I don't know about you, but yes its a preseason tune-up. Here's the catch, no one expected the Raptors to even be able to compete but here they are winning a 129-73 game (yes preseason once again) with players firing on all cylinders. If you are a broadcaster perhaps you should highlight the fact, "Hey Toronto, perhaps things won't be so bad after all." There is plenty of story there and considering almost every sports channel didn't show anything from it is mind-boggling.
it's not mind-boggling. people didn't care about the raptors WITH bosh
Maybe they should move the nets to BC. So much for their 'rebuilding', and after the abyssal last season I dont think anyone is going to be going this year ...
Iggy is exciting for his one breakaway dunk and his D when he's inspired everything else he does is kinda meh ridiculous athlete, can't quite put it all together
Well he's the only person on the team he can only do so much. When you're putting up good rebounding/assist/steal/blocks at your position as he is he's still a stud. Only thing he can't do is score efficiently but he's a clear perfect number 2 guy.
On October 08 2010 23:51 Ace wrote: Well he's the only person on the team he can only do so much. When you're putting up good rebounding/assist/steal/blocks at your position as he is he's still a stud. Only thing he can't do is score efficiently but he's a clear perfect number 2 guy.
it's really a shame that elton brand ended up sucking major balls. I got so excited when they signed him to that contract, good god was that a mistake
As for Iggy, he's getting paid like a #1, but he's clearly a #2...I mean it's not his fault that he was the best guy on the team at the time, and he got paid like a #1, but I just wish.....we had someone better lol
Evan Turner, He is a winner, you can tell by his demeanour, hopefully it transcends to the NBA, shall see in a couple months.
Jrue Holiday, should hold the starting position with Evan Turner beside him, and Lou Will coming behind him, if the floor is spaced enough by these two players and Iggy then he should be able to perform a bit better and put up the numbers he did around the end of the season last year.
Of course Igoudala, with his excellent performance at FIBA, only second to Durant, and a new head coach, Doug Collins, the sky is the limit for how well he performs, of course he may simply go out there and run the course if he feels he is still top dog in the neighbourhood.
No big men though, so clearly a low end team even if they have an advantage at SF almost every night.
On October 09 2010 01:39 Holcan wrote: Players on the 76ers worth paying attention to
Evan Turner, He is a winner, you can tell by his demeanour, hopefully it transcends to the NBA, shall see in a couple months.
Jrue Holiday, should hold the starting position with Evan Turner beside him, and Lou Will coming behind him, if the floor is spaced enough by these two players and Iggy then he should be able to perform a bit better and put up the numbers he did around the end of the season last year.
Of course Igoudala, with his excellent performance at FIBA, only second to Durant, and a new head coach, Doug Collins, the sky is the limit for how well he performs, of course he may simply go out there and run the course if he feels he is still top dog in the neighbourhood.
No big men though, so clearly a low end team even if they have an advantage at SF almost every night.
Turner has turned out to be a disappointment this far. Looked out of place in the summer league, is ineffective without the ball in his hands, doesn't play well next to Jrue (who the Sixers are committed to and very excited about), and may not even be the first perimeter player off the bench once the season starts. Still a lot of time to see if he realizes what the Sixers saw in him when he was drafted, but there have been nothing but bad signs from him thus far.
Iggy is definitely more suited to a #2, Pippen type of role next to a true superstar. Unfortunately, he'll still be their #1 option and playing out of position at SG this season (as opposed to his natural SF) due to Turner not panning out and Collins wanting to get his "best players" on the floor.
Brand is supposed to be in better condition this season than he has been since he got to PHI, and Collins has been saying that he'll feature largely in what the team does. I'm not expecting a return to his Clippers form, but we may see some bounceback this season from him. Hawes looked promising until he started missing time due to injuries again. If he doesn't heal up quick, he may just end up losing all his PT to Speights.
The team will still struggle this season for the same reasons as they have in recent years, no 3pt shooting or effective low-post offensive threat. Teams will just pack it in against them and the Sixers will have to rely on a gambling-style defense to create offense with steals and fast breaks.
I was watching the Knicks/Celtics preseason, mostly to see Amare vs Garnett. Then Amare gets a technical for shaking his arms, and Garnett got two immediately after, apparently for laughing. Then there were about 2 more technicals. It is not watching basketball, it is watching egotistical refs insert themselves. -__- Not sure how the NBA continues to be so retarded, and even gets worse, on one of their longest standing problems.
On October 14 2010 09:39 Servolisk wrote: I was watching the Knicks/Celtics preseason, mostly to see Amare vs Garnett. Then Amare gets a technical for shaking his arms, and Garnett got two immediately after, apparently for laughing. Then there were about 2 more technicals. It is not watching basketball, it is watching egotistical refs insert themselves. -__- Not sure how the NBA continues to be so retarded, and even gets worse, on one of their longest standing problems.
umpires tends to be more overzealous during the preseason. it'll settle out once the season starts.
Ray Allen just drove into Turiaf and hit him in the balls, which caused a lot of extended, visible unhappiness by Turiaf but he escaped getting technicals somehow.
I'm watching this Raptors-Sixers game(I'm a Raptors' fan) and Turner has been very impressive thus far, great body control and finishing ability. He still needs to work on his jumper and defense still though.
Also, I love Jrue Holiday. I wish my Raptors could have drafted both him and Derozan.
I have to admit I'm excited about the Heat this year. It will be equally as entertaining if they dominate, or just perform well (which would be akin to crashing and burning in the media due to all the hype they've made).
The Knicks/Celtics game was pretty interesting for a preseason game. Pierce/Allen/Rondo stayed in major minutes to try to win by one possession against the NY bench.
Amare really destroyed the Celtics with KG out, lol, it was hilarious. The funny thing was he was driving from just inside the 3 point line. They were putting Rondo and Marquis Daniels on him when he caught the ball in iso far away from the basket, I guess to try to keep him away since he was blowing by all the big men with drives, but he still drove by them. He is quick as **** -__-. So much for being nothing but a dunker catching passes from Nash. I'm predicting career best numbers from Amare now that he is going to get a lot more touches.
Also NY looks like a good team. They have good players although some of them are raw. Never heard of most of them before. Mozgov, 7'1 center from Russia, is very good but he doesn't know the NBA game much yet. Great role players like some guy I also never heard of Landry Fields. NY had very good defense all of a sudden.
I predict a healthy NY team to get into the second and third rounds of the playoffs. ^_^
I'm liking Barbosa and Jarrett Jack right now, especially the way they played against the Sixers. DeRozan was a bit disappointing in that game though. Hope he picks it up a bit.
On October 15 2010 05:01 jtype wrote: I'm liking Barbosa and Jarrett Jack right now, especially the way they played against the Sixers. DeRozan was a bit disappointing in that game though. Hope he picks it up a bit.
Bargnani is playing terrible atm, what erks me about him watching the preseason is that, he's still clueless on help defense. I don't see any improvements from him defensively after watching the same issues occur for the last 5 years.
I agree that Jack and Barbosa played well last night. Barbosa has been excellent in all of the preseason games so far.
DeRozan was solid last night, except for some missed defensive assignments and missed free throws.
On October 15 2010 05:01 jtype wrote: I'm liking Barbosa and Jarrett Jack right now, especially the way they played against the Sixers. DeRozan was a bit disappointing in that game though. Hope he picks it up a bit.
Bargnani is playing terrible atm, what erks me about him watching the preseason is that, he's still clueless on help defense.
The worst thing for me, I think, is that I know he can do so much better. He showed some flair, once or twice, but no consistency whatsoever, nor any defensive capability, as you said.
The next 2 spots are a toss up but I think Indiana is going to make it for sure barring a major injury bug. The Nets are better than the Knicks. Bobcats are better than both of them. Going to be hard for the Knicks to get in the playoffs, and then make it to round 2? lol.
I wouldn't consider the Bulls, Hawks and Bucks very sure things at all. Last season the Bulls barely got into the playoffs, and their new addition just broke his hand... The Bucks will be missing Bogut for a while and may have overachieved last season. The Bucks' roster is not so solid that I would be sure for them to simply maintain their earlier position, or improve, especially with their best player injured. The Hawks are a decent regular season team who probably looked better than they were last year with a weaker Eastern conference. Bibby is older. They almost got beaten by a Bogut-less Milwaukee. I think they are vulnerable for a lot of the ECF teams which improved.
I would say even the top teams of the ECF are vulnerable. The Magic are too capable of underperforming again. The Celtics of course have age and injury worries. Miami is scary but not invincible. I feel there isn't much of a set hierachy in the East this year.
Chicago, Atlanta and Milwaukee are the next tier of teams. The Bulls barely made it because Noah, their budding All-Star center was out for what, 20 games or something? Even without Boozer they are a lock for top 5, probably even 4th. Everyone is high on them because they have the potential to be a Finals contender in a few years.
Milwaukee was always good. Always had some brutal schedules and still managed to be one of the best defensive teams in the league. Honestly it was only a matter of time for them and once they got Jennings and Salmons they almost made it to the second round. That Eryan Ilyasova dude is also pretty good (misspelled his name I'm sure).
Atlanta is Atlanta. Won't be making it out of the first round this year unless Joe Johnson gets better.
Now how do the Knicks even compare to these dudes? Amare and Gallinari are the best players on their team. No way is that enough to even be THINKING about second round. They need to make it to a 4th seed to even get a matchup that won't result in them getting swept. Not happening. They'll barely make it as of the current roster.
I don't think Chicago has proven anything, especially being a Finals contender in a few years. It depends on if Rose turns into a MVP player or not, and I don't think it is likely. Noah and Boozer are good, but I don't think they have enough out of their top 3 guys to be a finals contender. I wonder if the coaching change will cause an improvement by itself now that they have a defensive guru, who is also a rookie head coach.
I don't think Milwaukee is a great defense. TBH I did not watch a great deal of them, but I never saw anyone struggle vs. them. I just looked up their defensive ranking and they were 19th last season. But I can accept what you say about Milwaukee but I still don't get how even those things you mentioned make them a distinctive team. And keep in mind Bogut is not back yet and he is going to be limited all season. I can easily see Milwaukee getting passed by a number of teams that were bad last year (Indiana, Detroit, NY, and others).
As for NY, Amare is kind of a big deal (IMO best PF in the game). I don't think Gallinari is their 2nd best player. I don't think Gallinari is very good now, but he can be a good role player and is a useful mismatch for them. NY is now full of good role players, some of whom are still raw, but have bright futures in the short term future. They have good chemistry and intangibles too. If I had to bet on them at this point of the season beating Milwaukee or Atlanta in a 7 game series, I would. Would not be surprised if they beat Chicago either. Lots of potential on their team.
I think before 2010 people underrated the Bucks, I think they're better than the teams fighting for 8th seed in the east, but there have been tons of scrappy teams in the playoffs, most of which don't pan out later.
They're going to have to do a lot more before they're a lock to be a contender in the east, or even a team to be afraid of.
As for NY, Amare is kind of a big deal (IMO best PF in the game)..
Really?
Homerism much? A guy that plays zero defense is the best PF in the league? One of the best offensively?, sure he's top 3-4, I think Dirk, Bosh and ironically, Lee are better. I'll have to wait and see what he does without Nash this year before I even consider him a top 3 PF.
Stoudemire doesn't really have an amazing overall games compared to other elite PFs. He also can be pretty inconsistent sometimes with his production. He's still definitely good and when he is ON he's pretty nuts.
Everyone knows Amare is good, his ability to finish at the rim is 2nd best in the league behind Lebron, but everyone knows that Steve Nash makes people better, we dont really know how much better he makes the flow of the game go for Amare, yet.
On October 15 2010 13:06 d_so wrote: amare's good but he's definitely replaceable; don't forget how easily diaw and co filled in for amare when he was gone several years ago
and who would you replace? he is much more versatile now so when the man is hot he cant be stopp
On October 15 2010 11:57 Servolisk wrote: I don't think Chicago has proven anything, especially being a Finals contender in a few years. It depends on if Rose turns into a MVP player or not, and I don't think it is likely. Noah and Boozer are good, but I don't think they have enough out of their top 3 guys to be a finals contender. I wonder if the coaching change will cause an improvement by itself now that they have a defensive guru, who is also a rookie head coach.
I don't think Milwaukee is a great defense. TBH I did not watch a great deal of them, but I never saw anyone struggle vs. them. I just looked up their defensive ranking and they were 19th last season. But I can accept what you say about Milwaukee but I still don't get how even those things you mentioned make them a distinctive team. And keep in mind Bogut is not back yet and he is going to be limited all season. I can easily see Milwaukee getting passed by a number of teams that were bad last year (Indiana, Detroit, NY, and others).
As for NY, Amare is kind of a big deal (IMO best PF in the game). I don't think Gallinari is their 2nd best player. I don't think Gallinari is very good now, but he can be a good role player and is a useful mismatch for them. NY is now full of good role players, some of whom are still raw, but have bright futures in the short term future. They have good chemistry and intangibles too. If I had to bet on them at this point of the season beating Milwaukee or Atlanta in a 7 game series, I would. Would not be surprised if they beat Chicago either. Lots of potential on their team.
Chicago seems like a strong contender because of their talented core of Rose, Noah and Boozer (maybe include Deng there depending on how you see him). Despite having a shit coach for two seasons in Del Negro (yay Clippers!), the Bulls managed to make it into the playoffs and put up some stiff competition against some elite teams. Rose and Noah have improved each season they've been in the league, and are amongst the best at what they do (scoring and creating offense for Rose, and rebounding and defense for Noah), so just the expectation of their continued growth should place them in the playoffs. Boozer may be out now, but he'll be back soon enough and they've got a promising coach in Thibodeau who could turn an already solid defensive team into a juggernaut on that end of the floor. I'm not as high on them as some others, but I don't think you can doubt that they'll make the playoffs based on what you can see now.
As for Milwaukee, I'm not sure where you looked up your rankings and stats, but my research has them as one of the top defensive teams in the league last season. Hollinger's defensive efficiency stat places them in 3rd overall, and basketball-reference places them 7th in PTS allowed, 10th in FG% allowed, 2nd in defensive rating, 8th in EFG% allowed, and 4th in opponent TO%. It's not surprising as it's Skiles' MO to walk in and immediately make drastic improvements to a team's defense. I think they have a good shot at making the playoffs with that defense, a rising star in Jennings, Bogut (who will be limited, but I expect still quite effective), and a solid roster around them (Salmons, Delfino, Maggette, Ilyasova, etc.).
I have my doubts about NY because D'Antoni's system appears to need an elite PG to make it work, and Felton is far from that. Amare is the only Allstar-level talent they have on their roster, and he's not exactly known for playing defense or making his teammates better. One of the best finishers and scorers in the league for certain, but he hasn't shown any indication of being able to lead a team thus far. The rest of the team is a lot of unrealized potential (Gallinari, Randolph, Douglas, etc.) and I don't see (and haven't read anything that would suggest) the chemistry and intangibles that you referenced. They'd have a puncher's chance of beating a team in a 7-game series with their offensive potential alone, but the lack of any defense prevents them from being taken seriously. Nothing is set there except that Amare is the best player and #1 option and everything else is still being figured out as they play. They're far from hopeless, but I don't see evidence to support the enthusiasm.
On October 15 2010 11:57 Servolisk wrote: I don't think Chicago has proven anything, especially being a Finals contender in a few years. It depends on if Rose turns into a MVP player or not, and I don't think it is likely. Noah and Boozer are good, but I don't think they have enough out of their top 3 guys to be a finals contender. I wonder if the coaching change will cause an improvement by itself now that they have a defensive guru, who is also a rookie head coach.
I don't think Milwaukee is a great defense. TBH I did not watch a great deal of them, but I never saw anyone struggle vs. them. I just looked up their defensive ranking and they were 19th last season. But I can accept what you say about Milwaukee but I still don't get how even those things you mentioned make them a distinctive team. And keep in mind Bogut is not back yet and he is going to be limited all season. I can easily see Milwaukee getting passed by a number of teams that were bad last year (Indiana, Detroit, NY, and others).
As for NY, Amare is kind of a big deal (IMO best PF in the game). I don't think Gallinari is their 2nd best player. I don't think Gallinari is very good now, but he can be a good role player and is a useful mismatch for them. NY is now full of good role players, some of whom are still raw, but have bright futures in the short term future. They have good chemistry and intangibles too. If I had to bet on them at this point of the season beating Milwaukee or Atlanta in a 7 game series, I would. Would not be surprised if they beat Chicago either. Lots of potential on their team.
Chicago seems like a strong contender because of their talented core of Rose, Noah and Boozer (maybe include Deng there depending on how you see him). Despite having a shit coach for two seasons in Del Negro (yay Clippers!), the Bulls managed to make it into the playoffs and put up some stiff competition against some elite teams. Rose and Noah have improved each season they've been in the league, and are amongst the best at what they do (scoring and creating offense for Rose, and rebounding and defense for Noah), so just the expectation of their continued growth should place them in the playoffs. Boozer may be out now, but he'll be back soon enough and they've got a promising coach in Thibodeau who could turn an already solid defensive team into a juggernaut on that end of the floor. I'm not as high on them as some others, but I don't think you can doubt that they'll make the playoffs based on what you can see now.
As for Milwaukee, I'm not sure where you looked up your rankings and stats, but my research has them as one of the top defensive teams in the league last season. Hollinger's defensive efficiency stat places them in 3rd overall, and basketball-reference places them 7th in PTS allowed, 10th in FG% allowed, 2nd in defensive rating, 8th in EFG% allowed, and 4th in opponent TO%. It's not surprising as it's Skiles' MO to walk in and immediately make drastic improvements to a team's defense. I think they have a good shot at making the playoffs with that defense, a rising star in Jennings, Bogut (who will be limited, but I expect still quite effective), and a solid roster around them (Salmons, Delfino, Maggette, Ilyasova, etc.).
I have my doubts about NY because D'Antoni's system appears to need an elite PG to make it work, and Felton is far from that. Amare is the only Allstar-level talent they have on their roster, and he's not exactly known for playing defense or making his teammates better. One of the best finishers and scorers in the league for certain, but he hasn't shown any indication of being able to lead a team thus far. The rest of the team is a lot of unrealized potential (Gallinari, Randolph, Douglas, etc.) and I don't see (and haven't read anything that would suggest) the chemistry and intangibles that you referenced. They'd have a puncher's chance of beating a team in a 7-game series with their offensive potential alone, but the lack of any defense prevents them from being taken seriously. Nothing is set there except that Amare is the best player and #1 option and everything else is still being figured out as they play. They're far from hopeless, but I don't see evidence to support the enthusiasm.
To make a briefer argument about Chicago expectations, compare them to previous years Jazz teams, and assume Boozer is the same as he was on those teams. I'm not at all certain Rose will be better than Deron was (though I love Rose and hope so). The rest of the Jazz team outweighs the Bulls', IMO. That Jazz team also had one of the greatest coaches. Still, they never became a contender.
My stats on Milwaukee were probably wrong, I guess it was a points allowed rating. I don't follow advanced stats at all -__- :o Anyway, we'll see how they do.
For NY, I'll continue my brief argument via comparison style and compare their potential to Orlando. If you take out Amare and Dwight from both of those teams, the Magic is currently better, but I think NY will be better very soon, once their players are not so raw. They have some similarities in their roster too, in terms of hustling role players, and role players who make mismatches. That comparison would have failed if Rashard Lewis did not degrade so much last season, but he seems to have dropped off after his steroids suspension. Of course, most people will think it is not relevant if NY is roughly the same in role players, as most people think Dwight >>> Amare. I however think Amare >= Dwight. :O
For Amare doubters, please stand by your Amare doubting when he is in the ECF after a 28/10 season.
Even if Amare averaged 40 a game the Knicks wouldn't make it to the ECF.
Look Kevin Durant averaged 30ppg, had a solid #2 in Westbrook, had a good head coach, and got solid D out of their team...and didn't make it past the Lakers.
Who is the #2 option in NY?
How are the Knicks going anywhere past the 1st round if they make it when the East is so top heavy? If they run into Boston, Miami, or Orlando they will get swept easily. Did you watch any Knicks games last year? If the Thunder lost, a vastly better team than NY in a conference with the Lakers as the only lock to make it to the NBA Finals, in what universe are the Knicks making it past the 3 favorites in the East?
Really you'd have to prove that Amar'e is worth so many wins on a team that was:
1.)17th in the league in Offense and 27th in the league in Defense.
2.) Lost 3 of their 4 best players from last year: David Lee, Al Harrington and Nate Robinson. Even with 2 of those 3 being there all season look how terrible the team overall was. With all of them gone the team is pretty much a bunch of bench warmers and role players. Their best player after Amar'e is Danilo Galinari who only has 1 year of playing in the NBA and has to develop. If you are expecting a duo of Amar'e and Galinari to lead the Knicks into the playoffs, much less the ECF I'd really like the mushrooms you are chewing on
3.) They finished 3rd in the Atlantic Division, a whopping 11 wins behind the Raptors who also didn't even make the playoffs. You are asking for the Knicks to leap at least 11 wins to make an 8th seed when their only major free agent signing is Amar'e when they've lost 3 of their 4 best players from last season? Extremely tough task.
4.) Speaking of Amar'e, for the Knicks to make it to the playoffs with all things being equal from last season Amar'e would have to be worth at the minimum 11 wins to get them at least an 8th seed. Now the Raptors are clearly worse and so is Cleveland. Miami was already good so that leaves space for the Knicks to make it as only 7 of the teams from the Eastern Conference Playoffs last year are probably a lock. The Knicks would have to be better than NJ, Philly, Indiana and Washington to make the 8th seed. OF those I think only Indiana has a shot. So they might make it. However here's the catch and I really hate using advanced stats in some cases but just to illustrate how daunting of a task this is look at:
Offensive Win Shares. Like I said before, all things being equal Amar'e would need to be worth at the minimum 11 wins for the Knicks to make it to the 8th seed. It's actually more because the team has lost David Lee and Al Harrington. Either way Amar'e's best seasons, 2004-2005 and 2007-2008 have him at 11.3 and 10.9 win shares. Even assuming Amar'e returns to the beastly form he was at during those years that's barely covering what's needed for 8th seed in the East. That would bring them to a 40-42 record. The only team that has a shot of the remaining Eastern Teams to make up that many wins are the Pacers who had a 32-50 record last season. Even losing Troy Murphy they've now got a healthy Granger and an impressive Darren Collison. The Knicks have Amar'e and Galinari.
Bottom line the Knicks need to worry about just making the playoffs period before even THINKING about talking ECF. And if they make it to the playoffs they'd get swept by any of the top 3 teams in the East because that's exactly who they'd be playing in the first round.
And for extra kicks, Amare has never averaged 10 rebounds a game or ever been close to 28ppg. His best is 26.0. Really you are expecting this guy to take a MAJOR leap and become so dominant that he is the clear cut #1 PF in the NBA.
The Jazz without Boozer may be fundamentally a different team in the paint, but jefferson has been the star of the team for this preseason. I don't even know where someone would get an idea that the jazz are noncontenders, they've made playoffs for the past 4 years. yes, they still cant overcome kobe. but A.J might add the pts they need to win those games.
Look Kevin Durant averaged 30ppg, had a solid #2 in Westbrook, had a good head coach, and got solid D out of their team...and didn't make it past the Lakers.
you make it sound they should've easily beaten the lakers :p
Didn't mean to make it sound like that. Just trying to illustrate how hard it is for a guy that scored 30ppg (more than Amar'e) couldn't beat a top tier team in the league, while having better help and a better team than Amar'e will.
On October 16 2010 04:17 Ace wrote: I am really, really, really getting tired of John Hollinger on ESPN. Seriously why the fuck is this ass clown still allowed to write? Just ridiculous.
Amare getting 28 and 10 on a crappy NY team, playing with no legitimate star next to him in the D'Antoni system wouldn't impress me at all. If he did it while leading the Knicks into a better than 8th seed position in the East, and weren't simply swept in the first series, then I'd be impressed. I'd also have to see him demonstrate improvement on defense, as simply being the best finisher in the NBA is not enough to compensate for being a sieve on defense.
Even then, I don't think you could call him the best PF in the league as I believe Dirk is still better than him in every statistical measure and in accomplishments. Gasol can also legitimately be considered a PF, since he plays in that position whenever Bynum is healthy. I don't think you can even hold the fact that Gasol plays Center a lot, as Amare has done the same throughout a significant portion of his career (including some of his best seasons).
Advanced statistics also have Bosh ranked above Amare, despite Amare having Nash setting him up and Bosh having to create all his offense on his own. Bosh has also shown himself to be a better defender, as he played excellent defense for Team USA (when he didn't have to carry his team's offense), whereas Amare has never demonstrated any interest or proficiency on that end of the floor. In fact, I believe that both Dirk and Gasol are also better defenders than Amare while being as effective (if not more) on the offensive end in any area except finishing.
On October 15 2010 11:57 Servolisk wrote: I don't think Chicago has proven anything, especially being a Finals contender in a few years. It depends on if Rose turns into a MVP player or not, and I don't think it is likely. Noah and Boozer are good, but I don't think they have enough out of their top 3 guys to be a finals contender. I wonder if the coaching change will cause an improvement by itself now that they have a defensive guru, who is also a rookie head coach.
I don't think Milwaukee is a great defense. TBH I did not watch a great deal of them, but I never saw anyone struggle vs. them. I just looked up their defensive ranking and they were 19th last season. But I can accept what you say about Milwaukee but I still don't get how even those things you mentioned make them a distinctive team. And keep in mind Bogut is not back yet and he is going to be limited all season. I can easily see Milwaukee getting passed by a number of teams that were bad last year (Indiana, Detroit, NY, and others).
As for NY, Amare is kind of a big deal (IMO best PF in the game). I don't think Gallinari is their 2nd best player. I don't think Gallinari is very good now, but he can be a good role player and is a useful mismatch for them. NY is now full of good role players, some of whom are still raw, but have bright futures in the short term future. They have good chemistry and intangibles too. If I had to bet on them at this point of the season beating Milwaukee or Atlanta in a 7 game series, I would. Would not be surprised if they beat Chicago either. Lots of potential on their team.
Chicago seems like a strong contender because of their talented core of Rose, Noah and Boozer (maybe include Deng there depending on how you see him). Despite having a shit coach for two seasons in Del Negro (yay Clippers!), the Bulls managed to make it into the playoffs and put up some stiff competition against some elite teams. Rose and Noah have improved each season they've been in the league, and are amongst the best at what they do (scoring and creating offense for Rose, and rebounding and defense for Noah), so just the expectation of their continued growth should place them in the playoffs. Boozer may be out now, but he'll be back soon enough and they've got a promising coach in Thibodeau who could turn an already solid defensive team into a juggernaut on that end of the floor. I'm not as high on them as some others, but I don't think you can doubt that they'll make the playoffs based on what you can see now.
As for Milwaukee, I'm not sure where you looked up your rankings and stats, but my research has them as one of the top defensive teams in the league last season. Hollinger's defensive efficiency stat places them in 3rd overall, and basketball-reference places them 7th in PTS allowed, 10th in FG% allowed, 2nd in defensive rating, 8th in EFG% allowed, and 4th in opponent TO%. It's not surprising as it's Skiles' MO to walk in and immediately make drastic improvements to a team's defense. I think they have a good shot at making the playoffs with that defense, a rising star in Jennings, Bogut (who will be limited, but I expect still quite effective), and a solid roster around them (Salmons, Delfino, Maggette, Ilyasova, etc.).
I have my doubts about NY because D'Antoni's system appears to need an elite PG to make it work, and Felton is far from that. Amare is the only Allstar-level talent they have on their roster, and he's not exactly known for playing defense or making his teammates better. One of the best finishers and scorers in the league for certain, but he hasn't shown any indication of being able to lead a team thus far. The rest of the team is a lot of unrealized potential (Gallinari, Randolph, Douglas, etc.) and I don't see (and haven't read anything that would suggest) the chemistry and intangibles that you referenced. They'd have a puncher's chance of beating a team in a 7-game series with their offensive potential alone, but the lack of any defense prevents them from being taken seriously. Nothing is set there except that Amare is the best player and #1 option and everything else is still being figured out as they play. They're far from hopeless, but I don't see evidence to support the enthusiasm.
To make a briefer argument about Chicago expectations, compare them to previous years Jazz teams, and assume Boozer is the same as he was on those teams. I'm not at all certain Rose will be better than Deron was (though I love Rose and hope so). The rest of the Jazz team outweighs the Bulls', IMO. That Jazz team also had one of the greatest coaches. Still, they never became a contender.
Haaaa, wait. The Jazz had a Center that held a candle to Noah? No. Don't think so. Try again.
On October 16 2010 11:00 Servolisk wrote:For NY, I'll continue my brief argument via comparison style and compare their potential to Orlando. If you take out Amare and Dwight from both of those teams, the Magic is currently better, but I think NY will be better very soon, once their players are not so raw. They have some similarities in their roster too, in terms of hustling role players, and role players who make mismatches. That comparison would have failed if Rashard Lewis did not degrade so much last season, but he seems to have dropped off after his steroids suspension. Of course, most people will think it is not relevant if NY is roughly the same in role players, as most people think Dwight >>> Amare. I however think Amare >= Dwight. :O
Nelson vs. Felton - Nelson is the better scorer, was chosen to be on an Allstar team (missed b/c of injury); Felton is very inefficient on offense and has no real accomplishments in the NBA to speak of; both are a bit undersized and not great on defense as a result
Carter vs. Chandler - Say what you want about Vince, but Chandler is nowhere near the same caliber player at this point in his career, and seems unlikely to ever reach that level
Pietrus/Barnes vs. Gallinari - I think most people would consider Gallinari to be far more talented than Pietrus and Barnes, but the latter two are role players who do what they're told quite well (defend make open 3s). Gallinari, on the other hand, is the 2nd best player in NY, and that's not a good thing
Lewis vs. Mozgov/Turiaf - If you take out Dwight and Amare, then the only comparison left is cross-positional matchups, and Shard definitely takes the cake in this one. Again, former allstar vs. TL.net staff icons .
Oh and I disagree that Amare >= Dwight. Dwight is a monster on defense, and is steadily improving on the offense side. Amare, on the other hand, is just hoping there
But they have an extremely stingy defense, and a steady inside out offense. D'Antoni might be a good coach, but he's not going to make his players have that affect.
Have you guys checked the poll on nba.com today (Saturday)? Serious poll rigging or stupid blunder by their technicians. No way Jordan can score 100+ in his prime.
On October 16 2010 04:17 Ace wrote: I am really, really, really getting tired of John Hollinger on ESPN. Seriously why the fuck is this ass clown still allowed to write? Just ridiculous.
Yeah I wrote a disgruntled response to his latest article on espn.com. I'm against the use of sabermetrics in basketball to begin with, but this is completely over the top.
On October 17 2010 05:22 LunarDestiny wrote: Have you guys checked the poll on nba.com today (Saturday)? Serious poll rigging or stupid blunder by their technicians. No way Jordan can score 100+ in his prime.
In the current league setup I'd say he could do it at least once. The thing is, like Kobe all those outburst of massive points came in games when the competition forced him to go off.
The 81 point game that Kobe had, the Lakers were getting slaughtered. Kobe was playing in his "I'm not losing no matter what" mode. Same with Jordan vs the Cavs in the playoffs.
I don't think either of them go into a game thinking they will drop 100 points. It's when they have that indomitable will that you see these "o shit" games. With Jordan's level of talent, will power and vindictive persona even worse than Kobe you're looking at a guy that would do it in his prime if enough was at stake.
On October 16 2010 04:17 Ace wrote: I am really, really, really getting tired of John Hollinger on ESPN. Seriously why the fuck is this ass clown still allowed to write? Just ridiculous.
Yeah I wrote a disgruntled response to his latest article on espn.com. I'm against the use of sabermetrics in basketball to begin with, but this is completely over the top.
The worst part about it is that they've been pushing it for what, 4 years now? No one outside of ESPN really cares about PER and half the shit this guy comes up with.
I wouldn't make the common mistake of attributing your own personal opinions to everyone, though it's a great way to marginalize what someone else said. PER, offensive win and defensive win shares, they're all useful things to know, compared to, how many points did he score and highlight reels.
The big problem with Hollinger's argument: It doesn't matter what Jordan's usage rate was. I don't think Jordan was saying he'd average 100 points a game, he just has to hog just about all the possessions for one game. On paper, it's a huge statistical abberation, but not in reality. Now given that Jordan has almost all his teams possessions, the question is what is the chance he averages enough points per shot to get 100 points? Given that Jordan had a significantly higher field goal percentage than Kobe, it's possible he can get "hotter" than Kobe in his 81 point game. Is that enough? Well, it really depends on the numbers.
Second problem: the pace argument. While it's certainly valid, it's again an argument about the average. If you're playing the Knicks, Suns, or "D-league player record" Warriors, you're going to have a ton of possessions. Given that Brandon Jennings scored 55 on them... Well Michael or Kobe aren't scoring 100 on the Celtics, or even 50 (oh wait a second), those big games are about picking on those poor defenseless teams.
On October 17 2010 13:16 igotmyown wrote: I wouldn't make the common mistake of attributing your own personal opinions to everyone, though it's a great way to marginalize what someone else said. PER, offensive win and defensive win shares, they're all useful things to know, compared to, how many points did he score and highlight reels.
Since you're obviously a member of the basketball illuminati, please educate us common folk on the myriad useful things about PER.
Sasha Vujacic engaged to Maria Sharapova. Really? Does she even watch basketball?
Even if she's only into europeans, there's Dirk Nowitzki (single since crazy girlfriend), or even on the same team, Pau Gasol... Pick a winner at least. This makes me want to throw up
Here's your stud in action, Maria
Here's what's going to happen when Maria tries to console her future hubby
Last I checked 2 is a greater number than 0, maybe thats why she choose Sasha over Dirk. Also she is from Russia, it makes since she is interested in someone from Eastern Europe instead of a German or Spanish player.
EPT
