EPTBut I don't go to the theatres to see 6.5 films. I either see it because I think it's going to be great, or else it might not be great, but it'll do something interesting within my wheelhouse. Rise looks like neither. Furthermore, TLJ was actually a really bad experience for me- I've never watched something in threatres and hated seeing it, though I've laughed through incompetent films (Eragon and Seventh Son). So I won't pay for another (I doubt for me it would be a 6.5).
Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker SPOILERS ALLOWED - Page 16
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Falling
Canada11571 Posts
But I don't go to the theatres to see 6.5 films. I either see it because I think it's going to be great, or else it might not be great, but it'll do something interesting within my wheelhouse. Rise looks like neither. Furthermore, TLJ was actually a really bad experience for me- I've never watched something in threatres and hated seeing it, though I've laughed through incompetent films (Eragon and Seventh Son). So I won't pay for another (I doubt for me it would be a 6.5). | ||
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Sermokala
United States14152 Posts
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Manit0u
Poland17776 Posts
On January 15 2020 18:05 Malinor wrote: Just some general comments, for whom it may concern: I enjoyed episode 7. To me it was a nice SF-action movie with acceptable story and writing. I did not mind that it basically was e remake of episode 4. So I watched episode 8. There is nothing good about that movie, not a single redeeming quality. It is episode 1 level bad. And therefore, I did not watch episode 9. Exactly as I did not watch episode 2 and 3. After seeing episode 1, there really was no need to spend any money to support this mess. If you complain that the movies are shit and Disney is all about the money, maybe you should consider not going to the cinema and giving Disney your money. Because if you go and complain afterwards, there is no incentive for anything to change. That is your power as a customer, exercise it. If you go to the cinema again and again and again, regardless of how many terrible movies they create, that is on you. The obvious result is: they will continue to create terrible movies. Well, you missed out dude. Ep 2 and 3 were actually better than ep 1 (ep 3 for sure). The thing that's different between the prequels and this is that in the prequels, regardless of how silly some of it was, how bad was the writing, you still got a Star Wars story with some gems sprinkled here and there and some characters that were actually good. In this new trilogy, the only thing that reminds you of Star Wars really is the music and some effects. The characters are just crap and story is not really interesting. With all that it's hard to find an argument for seeing this last movie - even if it was the best shit ever, it's the last film and you don't care about any of the characters so it's inconsequential since nothing further will be done with it. | ||
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Archeon
3267 Posts
I also fail to see how Ep 2 is better than 1 by any margin, the only thing it does better is less Jar Jar. In return the Anakin+Padme lovestory is extremely cringy and boring and the main-cast is extremely wooden. I think 3 is decent if you turn your brain mostly off, at least the action is nice and never stops. Christiansen also plays a bit better and McGregor has more scenes. | ||
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Sent.
Poland9316 Posts
I find it hard to sell the prequels characters over the sequels. Prequels had better villains, didn't they? Both triologies had Palpatine, but Maul, Dooku and Grievious were cooler than Snoke and... Hux? Does Captain Phasma even count? Kylo was also a pretty bad villain, though I guess that was intentional in episode 7. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On January 20 2020 06:20 Archeon wrote: I also fail to see how Ep 2 is better than 1 by any margin, the only thing it does better is less Jar Jar. In return the Anakin+Padme lovestory is extremely cringy and boring and the main-cast is extremely wooden. It does have its really questionable parts, but at least a few things that Ep 2 had that were of worth, that could perhaps put it above Ep 1: 1. No kid Anakin. Easily the worst character of the prequels. 2. Dooku is a pretty interesting villain. Not that Maul is too bad, but Dooku is overall probably a step up. 3. Generally better action scenes and battles. The Geonosis battle was much better than the Naboo one overall. 4. The seismic charge sound effect. Probably one of the few things about Ep 2 that is almost universally seen as pretty cool regardless of the perception of the rest of the movie. My personal ranking is 1<2<3, as far as the prequels go. 2<1<3 is also fairly common, though - really just depends on whether the gems of Ep 1 or of Ep 2 appeal to you more. For me, the heavy focus of Ep 1 on kid Anakin pushes that movie solidly into the bottom of the list, despite the flaws the rest of the prequels. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17677 Posts
On January 17 2020 01:35 Falling wrote: But I don't go to the theatres to see 6.5 films..... So I won't pay for another (I doubt for me it would be a 6.5). Fair enough. FWIW, I don't think it was worth the $15 to go see it. I went because a few other people I knew were enraged in furious debates about it... so i just had to see it for myself. I am impressed at what Disney tried to do to dig their way out of the mess caused by Rian Johnson and Episode 8 though. I'm also impressed by how Jedi Fallen Order was an attempt at digging EA/Disney out of the disaster of Battlefront 2. Disney's crisis management is really good. Of course, they caused the crisis.. so ya.  On January 20 2020 10:52 LegalLord wrote: My personal ranking is 1<2<3, that's my ranking as well. I really liked 3. | ||
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palexhur
Colombia730 Posts
On January 20 2020 06:20 Archeon wrote: I find it hard to sell the prequels characters over the sequels. Characters is imo the one thing the sequels did well, while the characters in the prequels suffered from terrible dialogue, mostly bad acting and very flat development. The only likeable character in all prequels is Obi Wan and he like every character but Anakin (who's arc is entirely unbelievable) has basically no character development. I also fail to see how Ep 2 is better than 1 by any margin, the only thing it does better is less Jar Jar. In return the Anakin+Padme lovestory is extremely cringy and boring and the main-cast is extremely wooden. I think 3 is decent if you turn your brain mostly off, at least the action is nice and never stops. Christiansen also plays a bit better and McGregor has more scenes. Which Character is for you likeble in the sequels? I think the only good character was Snoke, and not because his development but because the mistery around him. Mary Rey: this character not only makes the sequels bad but you cant make new SW movies with the force involved as the main factor, the Force is too op now. Kylo: what a horrible meme of a villain (insert Hux here too) Poe; never was developed well after TFA, Finn; I think the actor wanted this suffering to end fast, uninteresting in all levels in all three movies. | ||
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TheTenthDoc
United States9561 Posts
On January 20 2020 07:09 Sent. wrote: Prequels had better villains, didn't they? Both triologies had Palpatine, but Maul, Dooku and Grievious were cooler than Snoke and... Hux? Does Captain Phasma even count? Kylo was also a pretty bad villain, though I guess that was intentional in episode 7. Eh, I honestly think Palpatine is the only interesting villain through the prequels. Maul is a hollow shell with a neat lightsaber who does nothing but fight the heroes once after menacing them, Grievious is a hollow shell with four neat lightsabers who does nothing but fight one of the heroes once after menacing them, and Dooku just makes no sense whatsoever as a character (I guess he's supposed to be one of those "heroes on both sides" in the episode 3 crawl, but he sure doesn't show it, and his final moments belong in a comedy film). You could strip Maul (and the rest of episode 1) out and let Dooku replace Grievious in RotS and there's a slim chance you could have made a good character out of him, I guess. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27072 Posts
On January 20 2020 15:34 TheTenthDoc wrote: Eh, I honestly think Palpatine is the only interesting villain through the prequels. Maul is a hollow shell with a neat lightsaber who does nothing but fight the heroes once after menacing them, Grievious is a hollow shell with four neat lightsabers who does nothing but fight one of the heroes once after menacing them, and Dooku just makes no sense whatsoever as a character (I guess he's supposed to be one of those "heroes on both sides" in the episode 3 crawl, but he sure doesn't show it, and his final moments belong in a comedy film). You could strip Maul (and the rest of episode 1) out and let Dooku replace Grievious in RotS and there's a slim chance you could have made a good character out of him, I guess. I’m not sure how you’re meant to establish 3 secondary villains with different characteristics around a shadowy main villain and a political intrigue plot that’s already messy. They’re way better done in the Clone Wars and have some interesting angles, but they don’t do a huge amount here. Dooku could have been an interesting bridge for Anakin’s fall if they’d used him in a different capacity. As that more morally grey character, or actually used him visible as a ‘hero on both sides’ way. You have a character who’s a fallen Jedi who Mace Windu is confident wouldn’t do certain things because it’s not in his nature apparently, and Anakin who is getting frustrated about the Jedi and yet you don’t really have much of Dooku and Anakin interacting around that. I’m not even changing much here theme wise, Lucas sprinkled them in but didn’t really arrange the pieces properly at all, feels a complete waste of Christopher Lee. Perhaps even in Episode 2 when him and Anakin would hypothetically be forming some connection and the seeds are getting laid we maybe even get to like or sympathise with Dooku, which would make the scene later where Palpatine orders Anakin to kill him actually have some emotional resonance and conflict. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27072 Posts
On January 20 2020 11:21 palexhur wrote: Which Character is for you likeble in the sequels? I think the only good character was Snoke, and not because his development but because the mistery around him. Mary Rey: this character not only makes the sequels bad but you cant make new SW movies with the force involved as the main factor, the Force is too op now. Kylo: what a horrible meme of a villain (insert Hux here too) Poe; never was developed well after TFA, Finn; I think the actor wanted this suffering to end fast, uninteresting in all levels in all three movies. Likeability and being a good character isn’t the same thing necessarily, ideally you have both of course. Most characters in the prequels behave like unrelatable monks or robots most of the times, indeed some of the robots have more recognisable human foibles. I don’t think they really did a good job on giving the new trilogy characters good arcs and development, but they’re baseline pretty likeable and the performances are all pretty good. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10910 Posts
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Sermokala
United States14152 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + A first order mutiny alongside shenanigans with the crew that poe left makes the whole thing intersting. And then the gigantic twist when everyone's sacrifices were pointless when holo reveals her plan. | ||
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Archeon
3267 Posts
On January 20 2020 07:09 Sent. wrote: Prequels had better villains, didn't they? Both triologies had Palpatine, but Maul, Dooku and Grievious were cooler than Snoke and... Hux? Does Captain Phasma even count? Kylo was also a pretty bad villain, though I guess that was intentional in episode 7. Depends on how you define good villains imo. Are they generally more threatening? Yes. Do they have clear motivations, goals and are developing characters? Definitely not. Kylo has more character depth and growth than every prequel villain, prequel villains are mostly just there and evil. Maul looks cool, but his only lines are "yes master" and "it will be done". He's a plot device rather than a character. Dooku and Palpatine are cool characters in the prequels and Dooku even leaves you guessing about his motivation. But instead of developing Dooku in 3 they killed him off and put Grievous in his place, who is again a cardboard villain. I think Grievous is battling Hux for my least favorite villain in Star Wars and Grievous in difference to Hux is supposed to be threatening. He's just there, he taunts people and then gets killed by a blaster. But I agree that the villain cast outside of Kylo Ren is very weak in the sequels, in no small part due to episode 8 killing the BBE. That being said I don't think the difference is as large as the difference between the sequels good cast vs the prequels good cast. I generally like the prequels more than the sequels, but characters and dialogues is where they fall really short. On January 20 2020 10:52 LegalLord wrote: It does have its really questionable parts, but at least a few things that Ep 2 had that were of worth, that could perhaps put it above Ep 1: 1. No kid Anakin. Easily the worst character of the prequels. 2. Dooku is a pretty interesting villain. Not that Maul is too bad, but Dooku is overall probably a step up. 3. Generally better action scenes and battles. The Geonosis battle was much better than the Naboo one overall. 4. The seismic charge sound effect. Probably one of the few things about Ep 2 that is almost universally seen as pretty cool regardless of the perception of the rest of the movie. My personal ranking is 1<2<3, as far as the prequels go. 2<1<3 is also fairly common, though - really just depends on whether the gems of Ep 1 or of Ep 2 appeal to you more. For me, the heavy focus of Ep 1 on kid Anakin pushes that movie solidly into the bottom of the list, despite the flaws the rest of the prequels. I mean if we are counting cool scenes than 8 is a good movie because it has a bunch of really cool scenes. It just has a really bad and unsatisfying plot that isn't going anywhere, a badly written love story full of clichés and the good guys choosing constantly the worst option available. Also lots and lots of plot devices to make them still win in the end. To top it of Episode 2 has the worst dialogue in the entire saga (and Lucas really struggles with that) and Hayden Christiansen plays so wooden that he's almost rivaling the child actor of episode 1 (he somewhat redeems himself in 3). Dooku could have been a good villain if they developed his motivation a bit in 3 instead of killing him. But I agree that he's a better character than Maul and has potential in 2. I really like Kamino and the bountyhunter-chase, I like most of the aliens in episode 2. But I think that 80% of the scenes once the love story starts are bad, the romance is terrible, goes over into a video game followed by a really dumb Jedi invasion which doesn't fit the Jedi either and then goes to clones vs robots, where giant lasers shoot floating balls. Episode 1 on the other hand is very childish, has confusing motivations and 2 terrible characters in child Anakin and Jar Jar. But imo the trio of Portman + McGregor + Neeson works much better than Portman + Christiansen + McGregor at least in 2. It also has a imo the best worldbuilding of all SWs, has a more goal oriented plot than 3 and despite the bad large battle on Naboo I enjoy the fight with Maul and the takeover of the throne room more. The setup for the finale is better, the finale is more conclusive, the soundtrack is imo better and overall it feels more like an adventure with a connected plot, while episode 2 is a bunch of guys trying to find out what's happening. The only thing I can give to two is that it tries less hard to appeal to a very young audience, so we don't get a terrible child actor with lots of screentime and infantile humor in Jar Jar. | ||
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Turbovolver
Australia2414 Posts
I haven't seen the movie yet, but I did look up the "Hello there!" scene from episode III on a whim because of the meme, and sorry but anyone who's defending the prequels as good movies I just cannot understand you. Holy hell. | ||
TaardadAiel
Bulgaria750 Posts
What the prequels lacked most was dialogue - the Anakin/Padme romance was extremely cringey; a decent comic relief character (Jar Jar MIGHT have done the job if he was portrayed as the worthless guy he is and not given any responsibility AT ALL); and, unpopular opinion, they had way too much lightsaber choreography. It felt all over the place. Yoda jumping around in TCA was utterly ridiculous. Why break the image of the frail but wise and powerful ancient master? The Mustafar duel in RotS was exceedingly long, it felt pointless. The Jedi killed by Palpatine felt like training dummies. The only likable lightsaber action sequence was actually in episode I, I felt genuinely worried about the Jedi against Maul and the force fields were a great addition. But most of the characters, at least the protagonists, were relatable to one degree or another. I wanted to smack Anakin in the mouth half the time, but I cared for him. I cared about Obi-Wan, Yoda, I even cared about Padme and was wondering why was she such a mindless chit when she's supposedly able to govern a damn planet. But I cared. And episode three had a great dark atmosphere. I don't give a damn about neither Ray nor Poe. Finn I repeatedly forget about. Leia was hardly believable after her surviving in hard vacuum stunt. Holdo felt wooden. The only protagonist I somewhat related to was the bitter version of Luke. And Poe... Poe was the biggest disappointment of them all, since we had damn Wedge and we got this clown. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17677 Posts
Hiring is never 100%. Errors always get made... the mistake was not the hiring Kathleen Kennedy. Mistakes in hiring are always possible. The mistake was keeping her around when it was clear she was in over her head. | ||
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hexhaven
Finland964 Posts
https://www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2020/02/new-concept-art-colin-trevorrow-star-wars-episode-ix-duel-of-the-fates.html | ||
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KelianQatar
303 Posts
The Mandalorian’ Announces October Release Date ![[image loading]](https://nerdbot.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/mandalorian-baby-yoda.jpeg) | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27072 Posts
On February 04 2020 23:13 hexhaven wrote: Lots more (alleged) concept art from Colin Trevorrow's ultimately canned Episode X version, Duel of the Fates https://www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2020/02/new-concept-art-colin-trevorrow-star-wars-episode-ix-duel-of-the-fates.html Looked pretty promising, between that and the plot synopsis I just read having been previously unfamiliar that it changed quite that much. | ||
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