• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 20:38
CET 02:38
KST 10:38
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners9Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting12[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11
Community News
Starcraft, SC2, HoTS, WC3, returning to Blizzcon!33$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship6[BSL21] RO32 Group Stage4Weekly Cups (Oct 26-Nov 2): Liquid, Clem, Solar win; LAN in Philly2Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win10
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" 5.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8) Starcraft, SC2, HoTS, WC3, returning to Blizzcon!
Tourneys
$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace
Brood War
General
[ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions BW General Discussion [BSL21] RO32 Group Stage BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ SnOw's ASL S20 Finals Review
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Grand Finals [BSL21] RO32 Group B - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO32 Group A - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Current Meta PvZ map balance How to stay on top of macro? Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread Dating: How's your luck?
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Why we need SC3
Hildegard
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Our Last Hope in th…
KrillinFromwales
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1488 users

What Are You Reading 2016 - Page 18

Forum Index > Media & Entertainment
Post a Reply
Prev 1 16 17 18 All
123Gurke
Profile Joined January 2005
France154 Posts
December 31 2016 21:01 GMT
#341
+ Show Spoiler +
He builds up this whole "new gods versus old gods battle" story line and then all of this is just a plot by Wednesday and Loki and finally the whole thing does not even happen. I was beyond annoyed when I finished this. Also the whole horror missing children thing. He builds up the tension really well, and then the main character just leaves the village for a few hundred pages and finally it was the damn Hinzelmann? And he killed one child each year for more than a hundred years and no one thought that there was something fishy going on?

Don't get me wrong: I really like the buildup of most of the story lines, but the conclusion is beyond overwhelming for all of them.
"No," she said, "but sometimes I like to watch."
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-12-31 21:46:12
December 31 2016 21:45 GMT
#342
I actually read this book earlier this year for a book club. I wrote up some preliminary thoughts on it a couple months ago that I will paste here if you are interested. It was difficult for me to really think about the book without wanting to pull my hair out because of what I think are its many failings, but foremost among those is an incoherence that goes beyond mere inconsistency. I suppose it could be my failing, but it put me off reading anything else by Neil Gaiman. The following borrows heavily from Zizek's On Belief so if you hate Zizek you've been warned. It is what it is.

+ Show Spoiler +
Old Gods, New Gods, but no Christ
Within the first couple hundred pages or so American Gods seems to be pretty straightforward: the new gods (internet, money, tv, media) are displacing the old gods in America. The obvious metaphor being that crass consumerism is driving out religion, and perhaps a sense of the sacred, in the land of the free. Gaiman is somewhat ambivalent on whether this might amount to an agnosticism, but he stretches the major conceit a bit thin in suggesting that technology, like the internet, or the acne-ridden "technical boy," actually functions as a god alongside the host of attention-siphoning technologies and media that have been gamely anthropomorphized for us. How technology might be the same kind of thing as Jesus Christ is maybe superficially interesting, but I think the analogy breaks down upon scrutiny. In the appendix of my version of the book the editor included an apocryphal chapter featuring Jesus, who plays a rather muted role throughout the whole thing despite being the preeminent American god.

Gaiman says:

I'd been looking forward to writing the meeting of Shadow and Jesus for most of the book: I couldn't write about America without mentioning Jesus, after all. He's part of the warp and the weft of the country. And then I wrote their first scene together in chapter fifteen, and it didn't work for me; I felt like I was alluding to something that I couldn't simply mention in passing and then move on from. It was too big. So I took it out again. I nearly put it back in, assembling this author's preferred text. Actually, I did put it back in. And then I took it out again, and put it here. You can read it. I'm just not sure that it's necessarily part of American Gods.


The appendix here is a good indication that Gaiman doesn't really care about making the anology work, or about having a consistent ontology of belief. The mechanics of how belief functions in this world aren't clearly explained. The selection of gods for inclusion in the story is arbitrary. If anything, belief seems to be functioning more like attention than any of the more commonly understood categories of belief.

The appendix only makes things murkier. In the lost chapter with Jesus talking to Shadow on the tree he mentions "The god of the guns. The god of bombs. All the [new] gods of ignorance and intolerance, of self-righteousness, idiocy, and blame." Admittedly, this is somewhat ambiguous. It is possible Gaiman is referring to the technological gods that have already been discussed: things, networks, ideas that pull attention from mortals (and in the process profanes the old world gods). The technical boy is ignorant, and arguably idiotic. But the more natural rendering of this apocryphal fragment is that "ignorance" or "self-righteousness" themselves, the abstract ideas, function as gods. How this would work is beyond me. Jesus further mystifies the situation when he says, regarding his success, "It has a cost [. . .] Like I said. You have to be all things to all people. Pretty soon, you're spread so thin you're hardly there at all. It's not good." So apparently not all attention is good attention, and maybe not all belief is good belief?

The Role of Belief

It is interesting here to consider the distinction Slavoj Zizek makes between "belief" and "faith." Faith is a "symbolic pact" between two parties, a binding engagement with a dimension beyond simple "belief in." One can believe in ghosts or spirits or demons without having faith in those things. Likewise, the converse of that is that one can have faith in something (i.e. "believe") without actually believing in something. This is the role of the Big Other: we do not have to believe in it in order to believe it. It exerts a powerful pull on us because it structures the symbolic order that we, as subjective human beings, live in.

This way of looking at belief presents a new angle on the apparent conflict within the novel, and perhaps clears up some plausibility hurdles along the way. The "old gods" represent a fading symbolic order that is being displaced by the "new gods" which have reoriented Americans' minds in deep and lasting ways. It's not a simple belief in technology as god. It's a changing of ways of life, values, sensibilities; it's a changing of the set of givens that structures our very thought. When looked at this way, the preposterousness of anyone believing in Odin becomes a non-issue (despite inconsistencies within the narrative, where Gaiman decides he needs to find someone who believes in Odin. In fact, the kind of belief I've been talking about above operates in precisely the opposite fashion: belief is always displaced onto a fictitious subject "supposed to belief," as Zizek would say. There is no need to find some crazy Odin worshiper in North Dakota).

So what to make of the plot twist? The most straight-forward manner of interpreting Odin's/Loki's conspiracy is that they are just bringing about a neo-Ragnarok, fulfilling their role in the cycles of history, and refreshing the symbolic order that they represent. One thing to note is that the book was written right after the dot-com crash of the late 90s and right before 9/11. So the fundamentalist version of belief, terrorism, and the much-discussed "clash of cultures" narrative that have dominated media discourse since 9/11 are mostly absent. There is, further, a relation between the techno-utopianism or trans-humanism beginning to surface at the end of the 20th century in America and gnostic heresy (i.e. the belief in two opposed divinities, secret knowledge, etc.). Increasing immersion into cyberspace and hopes of transcending our natural bodies echo gnostic beliefs in the sacred immaterial soul woefully trapped in abject, fleshy bodies.

And so you get the straightforward metaphor: orthodoxy struggling to eliminate the techno-heresy. But what to make of the Buffalo man and the thunderbirds? What to make of Shadow/Baldr thwarting Odin/Loki? Seen in the light of the dot-com crash, does not Odin, god of fire, gallows lord, and all-father resemble the embodiment of American Capitalism, refreshing the flames of faith through creative destruction? And is not The Land the anthropomorphized pre-capitalist, First-Nations' spirit that Gaiman opposes to it?

Baldr - Love, Peace, Justice

Shadow is eventually revealed to be Baldr, the son of Odin, the god of Love, Peace, and Justice (at least according to wikipedia). He, in the end, comes to oppose the naked aggrandizement of Odin/Loki. The neo-Ragnarok that Odin/Loki have set in motion can be seen as the bloody bottom of a bear market as the new gods of Pets.com and Yahoo wrestle with the old, hopefully leading to a "back to basics" restructuring of the economy and disillusionment with the "new gods". Wednesday and the old gods are Old World intruders on American lands, bringing with them the entrepreneurial spirit and industry of Europe, and function as symbols of a particular way of life. Their plot can be seen as a reaction to the disruptive effects that technology has on modernity, even as America turns away from the Protestant work ethic and towards fetishistic emblems like Western Buddhism and New Age nostrums.
The inconsistent story that Gaiman has been telling about belief, about the battle of the old and the new, is further wrinkled by the introduction of the Land as pseudo-god in its own right. When we first encounter the Buffalo man he "smelled like wet cow" and tells Shadow that, "If you are to survive, you must believe." Believe what? "Everything," roared the Buffalo man.

It is questionable of course whether Shadow can do anything other than believe, given that he is confronted with the existence of gods walking through extra-dimensional planescapes, and that he seems to sleepwalk like a robot on default throughout most of the story, but what the Buffalo man, who says, "I am the land," seems to be telling Shadow is that he must be the "subject supposed to belief." Shadow is the one who "believes in" these anthropomorphized gods that Americans have faith in without necessarily "believing in". He exists as the symbol (god) upon which the rest of the symbolic order hangs. It is a fitting role for the god of justice to occupy, "For it is never reason that decides on the justification of means and the justness of ends: fate-imposed violence decides on the former, and God on the latter."

Because Shadow is the hinge upon which belief is built in the book he has to fulfill a certain destiny. Fate calls to him to complete the cycle and he can only obey:

I don't really believe, Shadow thought. I don't believe any of this. Maybe I'm still fifteen. [. . .] And yet he could not believe that either. All we have to believe with is our senses: the tools we use to perceive the world, our sight, our touch, our memory. If they lie to us, then nothing can be trusted. And even if we do not believe, then still we cannot travel in any other way than the road our senses show us; and we must walk that road to the end.


The story is just rife with this kind of hapless submission, including his willingness to return to the Slavic god of darkness to have his head smashed in. The parallels to the mythological Baldr, bound and passive as the gods hurled axes, spears, and mistletoe at him, are clear. He's all too ready to work as Wednesday's henchman, climb the world tree as a man sentenced to death, and doesn't even end up thwarting the bad guys: Laura (who is a bit of an engima) ends up killing Loki herself.

The Land as Site of Resistance

So Shadow ends up as a cog in what turns out to be an elaborate Rube-Goldberg Machine. A machine that was seemingly constructed not by the allfather, but by the Land. How do they relate? Wednesday knew about Shadow's dreams, and that should have tipped him off that something outside of his Thought and Memory might be happening, but apparently he missed it. The quote above Chapter Twelve can provide some clues:

America has invested her religion as well as her morality in sound income-paying securities. She has adopted the unassailable position of a nation blessed because it deserves to be blessed; and her sons, whatever other theologies they may affect or disregard, subscribe unreservedly to this national creed.
-Agnes Repplier, Times and Tendencies

America's religion hasn't invested in sound income-paying securities. It is a religion with belief in sound income-paying securities. And Wednesday is here to refresh the fire when the markets slump. Schumpeter's famous maxim, that the "gale of creative destruction" describes the "process of industrial mutation that incessantly revolutionizes the economic structure from within, incessantly destroying the old one, incessantly creating a new one" seems also to describe precisely what is at play in the neo-Ragnarok of the novel. Loki (who has taken the pseudonym Mr. World perhaps as a nod towards increasing globalism) and Odin aim to (re)institute a new symbolic order, a reconsolidation of American belief in the American Dream itself.

The Land opposes this because Wednesday seeks a reconsolidation around the core American religion: income-paying securities. The dot-com boom and the subsequent jobless recovery required a restructuring of the economy. Americans at the turn of the millennium increasingly turned to the gnostic beliefs of the cyberspace heresy, or Eastern "mindfulness" practices that convinced them that as long as they focused on what was "really important" that they were not simply reproducing an exploitative system that left them unsatisfied. The faith in the American Dream was waning, and Odin/Loki's power with it. When looked at this way, the Land becomes a site of resistance to this reconsolidation around a failing mythos. The dreams Baldr experiences are the cracks that betray the Real under the shimmering surface of the symbolic imaginary that structures our thoughts. The Land wants Shadow to believe in everything, and that paradoxically includes challenging the hegemonic position of the gods themselves.

Freedoms and Propensities

We are given a Shadow without a history; he comes out of jail with a dead wife and sparse memories and is set on a path. We don't really know who Shadow is until much of the novel has passed. Shadow, on autopilot, manages to fulfill his function while being led by the nose the whole way, and we aren't given much insight into why he is the way he is.

F.W.J. Schelling's notion of the "primordial decision-differentiation", which is an "unconscious atemporal deed by means of which the subject chooses his/her eternal character, which afterwards, within his/her conscious-temporal life, is experienced as the inexorable necessity, as 'the way s/he always was'," is useful in explaining both Shadow's origin and the road that he "must walk [. . .] to the end." It is also useful in relating to the cyber-gnosticism elaborated above, which Gaiman places in opposition to orthodox American religions, including Christianity. To quote Zizek at length:
Does this mean that the primordial decision forever predetermines the contours of our life? Here enters the "good news" of Christianity: the miracle of faith is that it IS possible to traverse the fantasy, to undo this founding decision, to start one's life all over again, from the zero point – in short, to change Eternity itself (what we "always-already are"). Ultimately the "rebirth" of which Christianity speaks (when one joins the community of believers, one is born again) is the name for such a new Beginning. Against the pagan and/or Gnostic Wisdom which celebrates the (re)discovery of one's true Self – the return to it, the realization of its potentials or whatsoever – Christianity calls upon us to thoroughly reinvent ourselves. Kierkegaard was right: the ultimate choice is the one between the Socratic recollection and the Christian repetition: Christianity enjoins us to REPEAT the founding gesture of the primordial choice. One is almost tempted to put it in the terms of the paraphrase of Marx's "thesis 11": "Philosophers have been teaching us only how to discover (remember) our true Self, but the point is to change it." And THIS Christian legacy, often obfuscated, is today more precious than ever.
So the question of Shadow's (non)freedom becomes enmeshed in the brewing battle. He must choose a side, but there is clearly some ambiguity in the book about how much of a choice he really has in the matter. What kind of freedom he must exercise is important. Freedom is polyvalent and includes such potential meanings as "formal freedom" and "actual freedom". Formal freedoms are the typical negative freedoms of liberal thought, which most often means the freedom to play by the rules. Actual freedoms are freedoms that allow one to question the rules, to "posit the presuppositions" of one's activity. The central freedom of American liberal ideology is that increasing insecurity should be looked at as opportunities for new freedoms: the "flexibility" to change jobs often and to move to different cities, relying on short-term contracts, "lifelong learning" as skill acquisition to remain competitive in a hypercompetitive labor pool, the opportunity to choose spending more for healthcare or to take risks, etc.

While Shadow mostly acts as a pawn, it is through him that the Land, and his wife Laura, who ultimately open up possibilities of "actual" freedom, that is, freedom from the hegemonic ideology of Odin/Loki. As the Buffalo man said:
You made peace. You took our words and made them your own. They never understood that they were here—and the people who worshiped them were here—because it suits us that they are here. But we can change our minds. And perhaps we will.

This may be the crux of the conflict. The question is what degree of freedom do the rest of us have? "We can change our minds. And perhaps we will." If that "we" is understood as "we, Americans" the Land is giving voice both to the hope, and to the ambivalence, of the many. It is especially in times of crisis, when the Real itself ruptures our comfortable ways of life and calls into question the symbolic forms that structure our imaginations, that ambivalence about "the way things are" and hope about "the way things could be" present themselves.
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
123Gurke
Profile Joined January 2005
France154 Posts
January 01 2017 13:13 GMT
#343
Thank you for your thoughts on American Gods. Even though I do not agree with (or even understand) everything, this was very interesting. Interestingly, we seem to come away from this book with totally different ideas on what it is all about.

+ Show Spoiler +
To me the central notion of the book is that of misdirection. Essentially, it is all a cheap coin trick that the author plays on us. He points the reader to the cool things like epic battles between gods (neo-Ragnarok as you call it). But all of this is just the 5$ violin that the author sells us for 20k$ as in the end it is all a swindle. It is all just misdirection from the start. The author shows us explicitly what he is doing (coin tricks from the first few pages, Wednesday earning his life by cheap tricks/fraud, even explaining all of this to Shadow and the reader) but he makes us look in the wrong direction like a magician performing a coin trick. So in the end there is no neo-Ragnarok, there is no epic battle of old gods versus new, all there is is a cheap trick and all of the supposedly important things are completely inconsequential.

Of course, an artist is free to play such a trick on the reader. It makes total formal sense as there are these tricks on several levels of the book. But to me it was beyond frustrating: I invested several hundred pages into this just to get the equivalent of a 5$ violin. So no, I really don't like this book.
"No," she said, "but sometimes I like to watch."
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
January 01 2017 18:50 GMT
#344
Has anyone jailbreaked their kindle before? I'm trying to read a bunch of djvu files and converting them to pdf bloats the file size.
B.I.G.
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
3251 Posts
January 03 2017 17:16 GMT
#345
Wow im just 200 pages into the Eye of the World (Wheel of Time) and I already completely get the critique of how Robert Jordan has a very black and white description of the "clashes of gender". Seems like all women are infuriatingly stubborn and bossy bitches and all men are gullable or easily controlled dimwits.
Flicky
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
England2666 Posts
January 04 2017 10:38 GMT
#346
I finished Er Ist Wieder Da by Timur Vermes not long ago and I'm not hugely sure on how I felt about it. I read in German but I am not German which means a lot of the contemporary German references flew over me, but I'm not sure I'd be hugely into those anyway (I'm not a fan of easy satire). Anyway, a lot of issues I have with the book is how it goes so slowly to begin with and the lengthy Hitler monologues while not much is going on. Having Hitler talk about modern things is just too straight forward. Not to say I didn't laugh at some of these things.

For me the book became great when Hitler was portrayed as human and in his interaction with other people he cared for, and in Hitler's playing of the TV system to become famous. These parts were very enjoyable and there were points where I was hoping Hitler would work things out with his assistant. Those bits were enjoyable.

Aside from that, not a whole lot happens in the 400 pages. I'd much rather the lengthy monologues in the start were taken out or dispersed and there was more actual story, thought I'm glad they didn't go full fish out of water with it. Also, about 50 pages before the end there's an entire chapter of Hitler's thoughts on things.

Hey, decent read. Would be better if I was German.
(Ps. writing the Berlin accent phonetically is horrible to read)
Liquipedia"I was seriously looking for a black guy" - MrHoon
123Gurke
Profile Joined January 2005
France154 Posts
January 04 2017 14:58 GMT
#347
In case you missed it: It is 2017 now.
"No," she said, "but sometimes I like to watch."
Prev 1 16 17 18 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 22m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
UpATreeSC 124
ProTech17
Nina 3
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 1338
NaDa 47
Super Smash Bros
C9.Mang0462
Other Games
tarik_tv13768
summit1g10881
FrodaN203
JimRising 50
Models7
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick832
Counter-Strike
PGL121
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 85
• davetesta41
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
Korean StarCraft League
1h 22m
CranKy Ducklings
8h 22m
IPSL
16h 22m
dxtr13 vs OldBoy
Napoleon vs Doodle
LAN Event
16h 22m
BSL 21
18h 22m
Gosudark vs Kyrie
Gypsy vs Sterling
UltrA vs Radley
Dandy vs Ptak
Replay Cast
21h 22m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 8h
WardiTV Korean Royale
1d 10h
IPSL
1d 16h
JDConan vs WIZARD
WolFix vs Cross
LAN Event
1d 16h
[ Show More ]
BSL 21
1d 18h
spx vs rasowy
HBO vs KameZerg
Cross vs Razz
dxtr13 vs ZZZero
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Kung Fu Cup
4 days
Classic vs Solar
herO vs Cure
Reynor vs GuMiho
ByuN vs ShoWTimE
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Solar vs Zoun
MaxPax vs Bunny
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Classic vs Creator
Cure vs TriGGeR
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 21 Points
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual

Upcoming

SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.