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On September 27 2012 22:16 k1w1 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2012 12:14 TheYango wrote:On September 27 2012 11:42 PatouPower wrote:
The reason I see for people putting him on the hard lane is the fact that he's still decent at staying alive (not as much as WR though), doesn't require you to pick another solo, but is one of the most OP hero mid/late game due to his wall/vacuum combo. So only being in the game, even poor, makes him a really useful hero. Dark Seer's ability to stay alive on hard lane far exceed's Windrunner's. His base survivability is just way higher than hers--he has almost 150 more HP at level 1, 4 more base armor, and is melee and thereby benefits from the full damage block of a Stout Shield. Windrun gives 100% evasion, but also doesn't give her 522 MS until after she has boots, and has a prohibitively high mana cost for using repeatedly (whereas Surge costs almost nothing). The difference though is that WR is much better at setting up ganks in a 1v2 lane. Windrun to initiate with shackle (if placed right) can really be a good opener, especially around level 5 or 6 when you're getting 2 points into it. And the obvious advantage of ranged harass. Also another points to DS, with surge you really don't need boots until your team is pushing t2's or the other team is playing 5 man dota. You can just surge everywhere if you need to go D Mid or TP if there's a gank bot. If I'm going tanky build with vanguard/aghs/pipe I'll usually get my boots after I finish vanguard.
Unless you max out surge before shell/vac, you're only running at max speed 3 seconds out of every 12. And there's that annoying 0.4 second cast time so you're not actually moving fast. Darkseer still needs boots pretty early.
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depending on what the lane is that can be enough. if the lane is a double stun, you'll want boots first cause then you at least have a chance to dodge stuns. if it's someone with good chase then you'll wanna get boots, but if it's a lane with unreliable stuns and slow chase then you don't need boots early and can focus on other items. Even so unless you're super far out of position 3 seconds should be enough to get you out of range. But against someone like an AM/WR/QoP who can track you down you'll want more levels in it.
At the end of the day it's definitely situational and preferential, but I like to not get boots first if I can and get up a vanguard or hood first.
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Pros:
Easy farming if you get 2 ion shells up on your melee creeps
Strong escape skill with decent ward vision
One of the strongest anti-carry skills in the game (wall)
Skill that increases the damage output and cc effectiveness of aoe heroes in your lineup
Cons:
Really needs to get levels (level 3/4 vacuum, level 3/4 ion shell, level 2-3 surge, +ult) to be effective
cf. Windrunner (effective damage/cc at level 5+) Beastmaster (best disable in the game at level 6 and hawk at level 3+) Furion (global ganking at 3+)
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Ds is a really strong solo in my opinion and he is exceptionally good at disrupting melee carries farm ( especially in lower levels of play). But, as was showcased in the intrenational, leshrac by himself, is a very good counter to him, because level 1 edict still does more damage than a level 1 ion shell if used properly. And another reason he gets picked so frequently is because everyone loves naga right now, and it is one of the few spells that still works while the enemy team is being slept.
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Why is dark seer good(as solo offlane)?
Because ion shell makes it extremely hard to hold the lane equilibrium. Good dual and tri lanes(ofc safelane) will try to hold the creepwave at the mid point (close to their tower, far away from yours) every single wave.
Ion shell pushes a lot, and by pushing just a bit into their tower, the next creep wave meets in their tower, obliterating your wave so the lane gets pushed closer to your tower. In a way creep waves behave like a tennis ball on a rubber band. The harder you throw it away, the stronger it comes back to you.
The other strength of DS is that he actually only needs levels. Vacuum lvl 4 has a huge area, illusion wall is one of the best non-stunning ultimate for teamfights. Surge is a very versatile spell. Ion shell is so-so in teamfights, good in the jungle and absolutely awesome on lane.
So in short, he only needs levels and has a much better chance to get them in the hard lane than most other heroes.
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EPT
