4th is just a diferent game. It didn't "dumb it down". It was more based on fighting.

The first editions had a lot a less stuff than the 3rd and variants and was more "hardcore" for example.

Plansix

United States60190 Posts

July 02 2015 18:36 GMT

#49530

4th was a totally weird game that really added way to many bells on to the system. It was modeled after a lot of MMOs and tried to give new "powers" per level. It was mostly a mess.

3rd and Pathfinder(basically updated 3rd with more stuff) are my favorites to date. 2nd and 1st are so dated with old systems that are just counter intuitive. Haven't tried 5th, but I heard good things from the test.

SKC

Brazil18828 Posts

July 02 2015 18:41 GMT

#49531

The real issue with 3rd and variants is that it invites optimization and is terrible at handling opmized characters. And that didn't change in 3.5, pathfinder, etc.

Its like playing Dota and having to force yourself not to buy boots because boots break the game. And then someone in your party buys boots and fucks the game. And some heroes are just forbidden from buying boots.

Plansix

United States60190 Posts

July 02 2015 18:43 GMT

#49532

Power gaming is always a threat in every table top game. The key to stop your players from doing that by saying "no". Its like running a super hero game and someone wants mind control. You just stop them because it won't be fun to work around that every session.

Kupon3ss

時の回廊10066 Posts

July 02 2015 18:43 GMT

#49533

3.5 is basically dota, everything is broken

4e is basically superiorsuperiormoba

5e is superiormoba

intotheheart

Canada33091 Posts

July 02 2015 18:47 GMT

#49534

On July 03 2015 03:43 Kupon3ss wrote:
3.5 is basically dota, everything is broken

4e is basically superiorsuperiormoba

5e is superiormoba

In DotA, we have the time-honoured expression "get good."
Does that apply for 3.5, or is it not quite the same thing?

SKC

Brazil18828 Posts

July 02 2015 18:49 GMT

#49535

Sure, you can always ban boots from Dota. But that still sucks. And you still have the guy that picked Wizard and the guy that picked monk.

Plansix

United States60190 Posts

July 02 2015 18:49 GMT

#49536

On July 03 2015 03:47 IntoTheheart wrote:

Show nested quote +

In DotA, we have the time-honoured expression "get good."
Does that apply for 3.5, or is it not quite the same thing?

Yes, but its when you build a totally reasonable character and your party member makes some broken pile of trash. Then they kill everything or the sessions are to hard for you to deal with. And when you complain, they say "build a better character next time".

Edit: Wizards have always sucked and then become gods. D&D has been the worst with them. They are slightly better in Pathfinder.

Kupon3ss

時の回廊10066 Posts

July 02 2015 18:50 GMT

#49537

literally 'l2p'

Kupon3ss

時の回廊10066 Posts

July 02 2015 18:51 GMT

#49538

pathfinder is basically playing limited heroes in dota

Plansix

United States60190 Posts

July 02 2015 18:52 GMT

#49539

I've never had a problem with systems that can be broken. Super hero games like Mutants and Master Minds are legendary for it. You just tell people "no, you can't bring that broken pile of twink into my game and ruin it for the other 3 people."

SKC

Brazil18828 Posts

July 02 2015 18:54 GMT

#49540

There is a diference in games that can be broken and in games that naturally get broken by regular play.

If you could only break characters in 3rd by making those OP prestige class combinations, extra books, certain items, etc. that would be one thing. But the game has balance issues with people just picking a class they like and taking the obvious path.