On February 20 2011 21:42 Dox wrote: It's amazing what some people can interpret from stalking someone on the internet for a few hours.
It's amazing how some people can excuse everything ... probably in the name of freedom and tolerance.
If Tasteless is making bad jokes on his Twitter he should be slapped for stupidity, but then his "fighting name" IS Tasteless ... if one thing is wrong it isnt an excuse to accept another of those same bad things if you can prevent it.
On February 20 2011 21:41 HoldenR wrote: The difference between Tasteless making dick and porn jokes on his twitter is that they're jokes. While I don't mind the nazi meme myself(although good lord, being a person in the public eye and still using 4chan garbage really speaks volumes about her professionalism.), we should point out there is a difference between "dirty jokes" and "emo, self centered posts" about her love life, "deep" dark poems about her feelings, and how she considers herself a queen.
None of that is humor. It's narcissism. If she makes dirty jokes, who cares, they're jokes. When all she does is talk about herself, that's extremely off putting behavior.
Not everything is excuseable because it is a joke. As long as you are on an "open medium" like Twitter you are responsible for what you do. Giving bad examples is inacceptable, because it gives our kids a bad example of how to behave in public. If Tasteless tells stupid jokes to his nerd buddy Artosis in private that is fine, but he better not do it where any kids might see them. It is the same for EVERYONE of us grown ups ... we are responsible for our behaviour in public, because we show any nearby children how to behave. If people screw up and run across a busy street while dodging cars and some children see that who do you think is responsible for their injuries if they do it themselves? The parents who did not fix that ball and chain to the kids ankles or the bad example? Freedom has its limitations and they end where you infringe upon the freedom of others. So in that sense bad behaviour is ALWAYS a reason for complaints.
...You're going to be a horrible parent one day if you stick to this attitude and refuse to accept blame for your children's actions.
But that is completely off topic and you haven't addressed a damn thing.
You idiots do realise that what X posts on their Facebook/Twitter/homepage/whatever has absolutely nothing to do with their employer right? People keep dragging shit out of context and it's stupid.
On February 20 2011 22:00 Teddyman wrote: If you put something someone else said in quotes, it better be literally what they said. One of your examples wasn't from her at all and the other one is quite opposite from what she said. You should probably look at the quotes first and then think about what you should infer from them instead of choosing your interpretation and then editing the quotes to match it.
Please correct me if you found anything being incorrect. If you want to correct someone, do come with a correction.
On February 20 2011 21:42 Dox wrote: It's amazing what some people can interpret from stalking someone on the internet for a few hours.
It's amazing how some people can excuse everything ... probably in the name of freedom and tolerance.
If Tasteless is making bad jokes on his Twitter he should be slapped for stupidity, but then his "fighting name" IS Tasteless ... if one thing is wrong it isnt an excuse to accept another of those same bad things if you can prevent it.
On February 20 2011 21:41 HoldenR wrote: The difference between Tasteless making dick and porn jokes on his twitter is that they're jokes. While I don't mind the nazi meme myself(although good lord, being a person in the public eye and still using 4chan garbage really speaks volumes about her professionalism.), we should point out there is a difference between "dirty jokes" and "emo, self centered posts" about her love life, "deep" dark poems about her feelings, and how she considers herself a queen.
None of that is humor. It's narcissism. If she makes dirty jokes, who cares, they're jokes. When all she does is talk about herself, that's extremely off putting behavior.
Not everything is excuseable because it is a joke. As long as you are on an "open medium" like Twitter you are responsible for what you do. Giving bad examples is inacceptable, because it gives our kids a bad example of how to behave in public. If Tasteless tells stupid jokes to his nerd buddy Artosis in private that is fine, but he better not do it where any kids might see them. It is the same for EVERYONE of us grown ups ... we are responsible for our behaviour in public, because we show any nearby children how to behave. If people screw up and run across a busy street while dodging cars and some children see that who do you think is responsible for their injuries if they do it themselves? The parents who did not fix that ball and chain to the kids ankles or the bad example? Freedom has its limitations and they end where you infringe upon the freedom of others. So in that sense bad behaviour is ALWAYS a reason for complaints.
...You're going to be a horrible parent one day if you stick to this attitude and refuse to accept blame for your children's actions.
But that is completely off topic and you haven't addressed a damn thing.
I am just saying that the parent (and the school) is not solely responsible. I am taking my nieces to school and back and a lot of the other parents which do it are giving very bad examples like not turning off the engine of their car while waiting for their kids for 15 minutes or creating a traffic jam at the bus stop so the bus can not stop there. Do you think only their own kids see that kind of behaviour? No. Every child sees it and children learn by immitating us grown ups.
So everyone of us is responsible for how the children of our society turn out to be ... to a certain degree. This includes the "new media" like Twitter and is especially important for "kids idols" like Tasteless and Artosis.
On February 20 2011 22:00 Teddyman wrote: If you put something someone else said in quotes, it better be literally what they said. One of your examples wasn't from her at all and the other one is quite opposite from what she said. You should probably look at the quotes first and then think about what you should infer from them instead of choosing your interpretation and then editing the quotes to match it.
Please correct me if you found anything being incorrect. If you want to correct someone, do come with a correction.
Ok, here we go:
I promise to work very hard, not to prove haters wrong, but to show people who support me that I will improve tenfold. Godspeed <3
You changed "not to prove haters wrong" to "Im gonna prove those trolls I can cast".
@kellymilkies Go for it. Haters gon' hate, because they can't do anything else.
On February 20 2011 22:00 Teddyman wrote: If you put something someone else said in quotes, it better be literally what they said. One of your examples wasn't from her at all and the other one is quite opposite from what she said. You should probably look at the quotes first and then think about what you should infer from them instead of choosing your interpretation and then editing the quotes to match it.
Please correct me if you found anything being incorrect. If you want to correct someone, do come with a correction.
@kellymilkies Go for it. Haters gon' hate, because they can't do anything else.
TotalBiscuit quote that you presented as Kelly's.
I honestly only quoted what I read on the first thread. Either way those quotes had nothing whatsoever to do with my main point, so if you wanna hone in on what's rather irrelevant, be my guest. I edited away the part you didn't like. I'd like you to rather comment to what's left.
On February 20 2011 22:00 Teddyman wrote: If you put something someone else said in quotes, it better be literally what they said. One of your examples wasn't from her at all and the other one is quite opposite from what she said. You should probably look at the quotes first and then think about what you should infer from them instead of choosing your interpretation and then editing the quotes to match it.
Please correct me if you found anything being incorrect. If you want to correct someone, do come with a correction.
Ok, here we go:
I promise to work very hard, not to prove haters wrong, but to show people who support me that I will improve tenfold. Godspeed <3
You changed "not to prove haters wrong" to "Im gonna prove those trolls I can cast".
@kellymilkies Go for it. Haters gon' hate, because they can't do anything else.
TotalBiscuit quote that you presented as Kelly's.
I honestly only quoted what I read on the first thread. Either way those quotes had nothing whatsoever to do with my main point, so if you wanna hone in on what's rather irrelevant, be my guest. I edited away the part you didn't like. I'd like you to rather comment to what's left.
What's left seems to be arguments that she has an annoying voice, is hard to understand and doesn't have a lot of knowledge of the game. The voice and understanding are entirely subjective and also a matter of getting used to it. People with these have still ended up being respected casters (if there is such a thing on TL) like SDM with his thick Korean accent or Ipp who has a speech impediment but still often gets over a thousand viewers. Game knowledge is just something she'll have to improve on or leave to her co-caster. Just asking the correct questions from your co-caster can often be enough.
In the end I think 80% of the enjoyment of a dual cast comes from the interaction and synergy between the casters, which we have yet to see. She will have to prove that she can work as a part of a casting team. If her casts with Nick/Dan are awkward and don't end up working well I'm sure Gom will replace her for the next season if there's a suitable alternative. Just don't expect top American casters to fly over for 9 days of casting each month and probably spend half their salary on just the plane tickets.
On February 20 2011 22:00 Teddyman wrote: If you put something someone else said in quotes, it better be literally what they said. One of your examples wasn't from her at all and the other one is quite opposite from what she said. You should probably look at the quotes first and then think about what you should infer from them instead of choosing your interpretation and then editing the quotes to match it.
Please correct me if you found anything being incorrect. If you want to correct someone, do come with a correction.
Ok, here we go:
I promise to work very hard, not to prove haters wrong, but to show people who support me that I will improve tenfold. Godspeed <3
You changed "not to prove haters wrong" to "Im gonna prove those trolls I can cast".
@kellymilkies Go for it. Haters gon' hate, because they can't do anything else.
TotalBiscuit quote that you presented as Kelly's.
I honestly only quoted what I read on the first thread. Either way those quotes had nothing whatsoever to do with my main point, so if you wanna hone in on what's rather irrelevant, be my guest. I edited away the part you didn't like. I'd like you to rather comment to what's left.
What's left seems to be arguments that she has an annoying voice, is hard to understand and doesn't have a lot of knowledge of the game. The voice and understanding are entirely subjective and also a matter of getting used to it. People with these have still ended up being respected casters (if there is such a thing on TL) like SDM with his thick Korean accent or Ipp who has a speech impediment but still often gets over a thousand viewers. Game knowledge is just something she'll have to improve on or leave to her co-caster. Just asking the correct questions from your co-caster can often be enough.
In the end I think 80% of the enjoyment of a dual cast comes from the interaction and synergy between the casters, which we have yet to see. She will have to prove that she can work as a part of a casting team. If her casts with Nick/Dan are awkward and don't end up working well I'm sure Gom will replace her for the next season if there's a suitable alternative. Just don't expect top American casters to fly over for 9 days of casting each month and probably spend half their salary on just the plane tickets.
Shrugging things off such as being able to understand her as being subjective (and thus unimportant?) isn't very constructive, as the whole casting experience is entirely subjective. Bashing on the TL community for being bad mannered to casters is nonsensical, as tasteless, artosis and day9 are the most beloved characters on TL. Why not expect American casters to fly over? The best two casters are already there? wtf? If game knowledge is so easely attainable, why not throw in some American unemployed, homeless person that we'll atleast be able to clearly understand?
Edit: I'm pretty sure tastosis earn more money than most pro gamers.
It's harsh criticism she gets. But c'mon guys in the end we're the customers and she wants to cast. From all the impressions i got so far she's a bad choice. As customers and fans who care about the sport and plan to enjoy watching it in the future, we have to point that out. The interview didn't change my opinion one bit btw. It doesn't make her a better caster, does it?
Well i'll give her a chance, though i can absolutely unterstand when people won't. My main concerns are:
Language/Understandability: I can deal with the english, but have to concentrate to really get what she wants to tell in the heat of battle. She compares herself to Rotterdam accent wise. Is that a joke? Never had any problem understanding anything he says. Well I am also a CET non native speaker and far away from perfect english so thats a factor, but still. (had to lol about the "shackle"/"shag her", so true)
I have to complain about the voice. Not very pleasant to listen to. And having to focus on that voice to understand everything, makes her a very bad casting choice for me personally. I don't think I'll be able to stand it for a longer period of time.
Casting Style/Game Knowledge. Screaming gibberish over the voice of your co-caster is a horrible attribute. Also please cut all this "my favorite unit"/"cute stuff". Artosis and Tasteless should be good teachers. Hopefully she'll take their criticism better than the one from all the TL-trolls.
Well she promised to improve infinetely, let's see about that. Maybe she should've improved a good bunch before she started casting GSL. But that's not her fault, it's GOM's fault, selecting her.
Maybe she'll prove us all wrong. But I don't think so, sorry. GL anyway Girl.
Just for my sake, I'm giving her a chance. I truly feel she doesn't have the required experience as a player to be casting/commentating games of such caliber.
In the end, the views, and money will reflect what people think of her. I would to be upset with the choice, but Artostis or Tasteless will still be there. Overall, I wish her luck, but some things just aren't meant to be.
On February 20 2011 23:16 v3chr0 wrote: Just for my sake, I'm giving her a chance. I truly feel she doesn't have the required experience as a player to be casting/commentating games of such caliber.
In the end, the views, and money will reflect what people think of her. I would to be upset with the choice, but Artostis or Tasteless will still be there. Overall, I wish her luck, but some things just aren't meant to be.
Considering the stacked code A season we've got ahead of us, with so many foreigner favourites, and so many team MVPs, I doubt views will reflect the decrease of quality casting.
I've heard a handful of her recent attempts at casting in SC2, and I honestly just can't watch her casts through. I converse with people who have strong accents on a regular basis and I have female friends; these have no bearing on why I can't pay attention to her.
I don't care about anything other than the description of the game state, and Kelly seems frequently confused. If you close your eyes or look away during the match, you will have no idea what is going on.
On February 20 2011 05:02 prairieoys7er wrote: I wasn't really familiar with her so I read a few responses of the people here, watched some of her replays and checked out her twitter page. I can honestly say that she's a terrible choice and here's why:
First off, she has a lack of knowledge of the game. If your going to be casting games with Artosis and Tasteless, guys who live eat breath starcraft, then you should be able to have a vast knowledge of the game and it's inner mechanisms as well. She's hard to understand at times and casters need to be articulative at all times. The audience will stop watching or press mute on the TV if there is an annoying person talking.
Digging deeper, I know why she bothers so many of us here.
Looking at her twitter page and some of her FB posts screenshots, her attitude/personality are a big turn off. She's arrogant when she shouldn't be about anything and thinks people should grovel at her feet.
*Pro-tip* Kelly - Buying expensive clothes doesn't make you more desirable. It just shows that your materialistic. This tips on the house but the next one will cost ya.
She's an attention seeker, taking mulitiple self-pics of herself and posting them. People who do this have self-esteem issues about themselves.
I can tell she thinks shes floating on air since she's surrounded herself by people with the stereotypes of being bad with girls (eg - the lonely gamer). Sorry, this isn't true.
When I see someone start talking about "the haters" it signals "prude" to me. If you really cared about this game Kelly, you'd take the criticism and learn from it. You just block it out, very unprofessional. Your not who you think you are. We don't want a "wannabe-socialite/diva" representing us.
The only guys this girl attracts are ones that don't play Sc, and she can have them. No one here cares.
She needs to take her trashy prude attitude back to wherever she came from. She's using the Sc2 platform as a stepping stone. The guys who let her cast with them should politely brush her off when she returns.
To sum up,if the Sc2 community wants a girl to represent them at GSL, she's a terrible choice. I'm positive that there are girls involved in this game who could do so much better (press heart to continue could kick ass at this if she wanted too).
I don't think I was over the top so hopefully this post won't get deleted.
True Story, Great Post, Well Done SIR!
On the other hand, looking at the GSL March Schedule... Great stuff, it's not 1 group Code A and 1 group Code S. It's 2 groups Code A and 2 groups Code S on SEPERATE days. Great, we can skip and choose days to watch!
I think giving her psychological profiles based on her face/twitter is over the top. All I care about her is if she can give knowledgable and entertaining casting for code A, and besides that she could be a narcissistic drama queen bent on world domination and I wouldn't care.
I'll admit her knowledge of starcraft 2 and her ability to be understood can be questioned, but after a casting with tastosis I'm sure she'll pick up the experience she needs. And if kelly can just speak slowly and clearly I'm sure everyone will be able to understand her.
And anyway GOM picked her (with tastosis's help hopefully) so it might turn out better than people think. I really don't think she deserves all the hate that's been in this thread.
On February 20 2011 22:03 Dox wrote: You idiots do realise that what X posts on their Facebook/Twitter/homepage/whatever has absolutely nothing to do with their employer right? People keep dragging shit out of context and it's stupid.
Calling everyone idiots will get you far in life. -_-
If you weren't aware, there are tons of reports out there were people have either
a) lost their job when their bosses found out what they were up to (everything you listed is a social networking tool-- if they find anything offensive, they can use it against you and get rid of you).
b) candidate never got job after potential employer did a check on them
You would be surprised how many employers actually do this now. There's good reason to keep a low profile. If you got dirty laundry or bad character. They can find out relatively easy. Use some common sense.
On February 20 2011 21:11 Teddyman wrote: I say people are biased because they don't consider all the information available and just use the material that paints her in the worst light. It's why the DotA finals cast has been pasted countless times but the much more relevant cast (you know, being SC2 and all) with TB hasn't really appeared here. Another example might be that the posts where she uses the words "troll" or "hater" are analyzed into and taken as evidence that she doesn't intend to improve when there are other posts and even an interview where she says she will. Yet another example would be where people complain about her ladder rank but would still welcome even lower ranked casters if they just happened to be their favorites.
I will speak for myself,
My assessment was based on the following:
Watching her do 4 live casts, her VODs, reading every post with regards to the rumors and press release and the social networking tools she uses. From what I've seen and heard, that's how I made my assessment. I'm not going to repeat myself. I've made a ton of posts with regard to this. Gretech is trying to hold some accountability, but at what cost is the only question.
On February 20 2011 20:09 Teddyman wrote: I'm quite surprised that people take offense to everything she posts but are totally OK with Tasteless posting dick/porn jokes on his twitter... Actually, I'm not surprised at all that there's rampant hypocrisy in a thread where all the remaining posters are biased against her. Hell, it seems that a fucking psychological profile made just from reading her facebook posts is taken seriously.
Has there ever been anyone saying she's even suited for the job? The best reasons why to hire her has been:
She's female. She has casted before. GOM didn't have much time, so they just picked someone based off of CV.
She's had major complaints on her casting, because honestly she's not suited for it. Tasteless is, and has been a starcraft icon since the stone age, and he has the tounge in cheek kind of glow to him. He's been casting since long before the sc2 days. I'm not gonna beat around the bush here - she has an annoying voice. Most people would agree with me here, and that's basically enough to not be a caster at a major event. Even if she had an exstensive game knowledge, understandable English in tense situations and great casting skills, her voice (even in the clearest of English) would still be enough to hire someone else, and as she in public opinion has none of the above, there's gonna be complaints. I understand you're some kind of fanboy, who do understand her. But a lot of us don't. There are alot of people, maybe even the majority who don't have English as native language when watching GSL, and if you have a caster who speaks with a heavy accent it just doesn't work out. Also if you look at her other casts, she has a history of started screaming uncontrollably, and make a sound carpet over the other casters voice with her yelling that none can understand.
And you're saying "what hypocrisy! Tasteless post dick jokes on his twitter"... dude none cares.
I don't understand what she's saying here. Imagine this being HuK vs Moonglade, or any other of the foreigner favourites in coda A. It would be a disaster.
I have nothing against Kelly Milkies as a person, and I like that more girls are trying out a casting career. I think there are better options for the English stream though. As China will start playing sc2 now, it wouldn't surprise me if GOM got a huge upswing by Chinese viewes. Maybe Kelly could become the Chinese caster in the future?
I was wondering why she kept saying "SHAG HER!", till I realized she was saying "shackle"......
Omg, i literally can only understand 10% of what she's saying and English is my native language!
I really hope she does better than this, and admittedly the couple of sc2 casts i've heard from her are at least a bit better, but still difficult to understand.she said she's determined to try to improve so i'll give her a chance to do so.
EPT
