Ukraine Crisis - Page 503

Pro-Russian rebels shot down a Ukrainian helicopter in fierce fighting near the eastern town of Slovyansk yesterday, as Kiev drafted police special forces to the south-western port city of Odessa to halt a feared westward spread of rebellion.

Ukraine said the Odessa force, based on “civil activists”, would replace local police who had failed to tackle rebel actions at the weekend. Its dispatch was a clear signal from Kiev that, while tackling rebellion in the east, it would vigorously resist any sign of a slide to a broader civil war.

Meanwhile in Moldova, President Nicolae Timofti said security forces had been ordered “to take all necessary actions to ensure public order inside the country” and declared an alert on the country’s borders in response to the crisis in neighbouring Ukraine. Moldova has 1,500 Russian troops stationed in the separatist republic of Trans-Dniester, which has said it wants to become part of Russia.

Odessa, with its ethnic mix from Russians to Ukrainians, Georgians to Tatars – a cultural contrast to the pro-Russian east– was quiet yesterday. Ukrainian flags flew at half-mast for funerals of some of the dozens killed in clashes on Friday.

But in the east, fighting intensified around the pro-Russian stronghold of Slovyansk, a city of 118,000, where rebel fighters ambushed Ukrainian forces early in the day. The Interior Ministry said five Ukrainian paramilitary police were killed. Separatists said four of their number had also been killed.

On May 06 2014 14:19 nunez wrote:
@judi
i'm not sure i ever made that strong of a claim. if we're gonna take hunts word for it i would have to admit that it was purely speculation on my part, and quite farfetched.

Ukraine troops ambushed by pro-Russia gunmen in eastern town; 14 die

At least 14 people were killed and scores were wounded as government forces seeking to win back this eastern Ukrainian city from pro-Russia separatists ran into an ambush Monday set up by the rebel gunmen.

Operations by the Interior Ministry, army and national guard troops for the last two weeks — often more off than on — erupted in a massive shootout as their armed convoy rolled into Semyonvka, a suburb of Slovyansk. They were met by separatists firing Kalashnikovs, grenade launchers and large-caliber machine guns.

The gun battle underscored the tough resistance government forces have faced in confronting the rebels — directed, they say, by Moscow — who have seized control in more than a dozen towns and cities in eastern and southern Ukraine in a bid for greater autonomy, independence or annexation by Russia.

.....

The Interior Ministry said government forces suffered four dead and 30 injured, UNIAN news agency reported. Seven rebels were slain and three were injured, said Vyacheslav Ponomaryov, the self-proclaimed mayor of Slovyansk. In addition, three civilians were killed and 15 were wounded.

.....

The government forces "are now bogged down in the heavy fighting in Slovyansk, but we are waiting for them down here to avenge the death of young Julia," said a masked separatist who said his code name was Spets. "They can't be at all places at once. They said last week that they cleared Kramatorsk of separatists. But now they have gone to Slovyansk and we are back in command of our town."

.....

Source

On May 06 2014 14:28 sgtnoobkilla wrote:
Kiev's greatly overextending itself for this operation. I'm not exactly sure why they're trying to hold onto so many towns when they're struggling to make just even one clear of separatists, especially when crap like this happen as a result of it:



Cossacks (?) arrive in Antratsit, south of Lugansk:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xi20JwfkB1c

I counted no less than fifty of these armed units are moving west. Not sure if these guys are from Russia (and no, I'm not being paranoid or sarcastic) or are from Lugansk itself, but either way if this is legit then that is a LOT of manpower moving in.

EDIT: New claims that the military is setting up a No Fly Zone over Donetsk; trying to find sources.

On May 06 2014 15:22 kukarachaa wrote:
They are not Russian military by the way, in case you couldn't tell by many civilian vehicles.

On May 06 2014 15:22 kukarachaa wrote:
They are from Russia more specifically Cossacs from Rostov on Don region, which borders Donetsk region in Ukraine. As I understand separatists took control of the town along with a border control post on Ukrainian side. What the fuck Russian border control is doing and why the let them through on their way to Ukraine, I have no idea.

On May 06 2014 13:11 JudicatorHammurabi wrote:


You don't know the total truth, so instead, your "total truth" is what the Ukrainian prime minister and Kerry/Obama said, with no basis, and purely for political reasons, and even some crazy old rabbi. At the very least, you're admitting there's things you don't know. It wasn't too long ago you were trying to act like some prophet with divine insight, knowing things that no one else knows, and demanding that it is total truth XD. You're making improvements. That's good. You're not as hopeless as I thought. For a second, I thought you were a monkey who learned how to type.

Very well. I'm sorry, but when journalists and observers whose ONLY goal is to catch Russia in the act of having military forces in eastern Ukraine and arms/money to the insurgents are turning up nothing of the sort, then I have to say you are talking out your ass. Please excuse me for going off of the facts, rather than political propaganda and entirely illogical speculation. We should all be believing that Nazis are running Kiev, by your logic.

So admit that everything you're saying is purely speculation (even though the actual evidence on the ground disproves that) and leave it at that. I entirely believe in your right to believe whatever you wish. And please, do accept my apologies for being one of the voices of reason in this thread. My apologies also go to LocalPredictor, zeo, and PaleMan.

On May 06 2014 14:55 Ghanburighan wrote:
The cia,as well as other intelligence services in Europe, provides low level Intel and provides advice together with a quick communication channel. Source: a little bird.

On May 06 2014 15:38 LocalPredictor wrote:

Ohh, there is no such thing to apologize for. I'm all for reasonableness in all forms as, I think, everyone here is. But there are "declared reasonableness" and "actual reasonableness". My opponents, relying on the first one, are basically trying to fight with illusions that's why (to my regret) they are still unable to speak of what's REALLY going on right now (hint: overall it's not about Ukraine as a state) They don't undestand "things" not because their concept is weak, but because these "things" ARE NOT included in their concept. That is actually why I try not to argue with them. I truly think this is a waste of time only, at least for the time being.

On May 06 2014 17:46 Fjodorov wrote:
Before the separatists, armed with guns, took control of government buildings and towns, took hostages and so on, what exactly did the interim government do to warrant this? Putin said fascists in kiev would lead to russian speakers being persecuted because of their ethnicity but that didnt happen between maidan and crimea crisis, not even after russias annexation of crimea.

What do these weeks leading up to the elections mean to the separatists? Why are they not waiting to see if elections are done properly and see if the new government ends up being nazis and fascists who pass disgustling laws? The government has been very careful with use of force and the rhetoric has been that they want dialogue, agree with decentralisation and so on.

I know about the legitimacy issues with the interim government but im still finding it very hard to understand the separatists are fighting their war at this moment and not working for support for their issues in a democratic manner up until the elections. It looks to me that a few men with guns are hijacking the voice of "ethnic russians" or "eastern ukraine" when the voices and opinions of these people are in reality are very many, complex and not black and white. The separatist groups are even different from each other and they too seem to be unsure of what exactly it is they want.