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Active: 580 users

No more Siege Mode upgrade: My honest opinion.

Forum Index > Closed
Post a Reply
Reptile-Rome
Profile Joined January 2011
United States34 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-10 01:36:19
January 10 2013 01:35 GMT
#1
As of patch #11 (details here: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/7592400518), it says:

Siege Tank:
Siege Tanks no longer require an upgrade in order to enter Siege Mode.

Blizzard's reasoning for this change is this:

"This change should mainly affect TvP, so that teching to mech is easier." (source: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/7592400518).


When I first read this my jaw dropped. I could not believe it. I think I am pretty open to just about every change Blizzard makes. I don't like to argue with the balance changes. In fact, I have NEVER argued or complained about ANY balance changes since Brood Wars. I have welcomed each one, and found new ways to play and win.

You would expect that as a Terran player I would be THRILLED to see no more siege mode upgrade. "Yippie! No more upgrade! Time to win!"

But I am not thrilled. Listen, this upgrade is important to Terran. It is what makes Starcraft, Starcraft. The two BIGGEST upgrades as Terran are:
Stim Pack and Siege Mode.

The other races each have their own core upgrades. For example:

Zerg:
Metabolic Boost for Zerglings.

Protoss:
Psionic Storm for High Templars.

Why are these upgrades important?

They make the game strategic, exciting and fun. The strategy and excitement and fun comes from the anticipation of the upgrade as it is upgrading.

Your opponent is closing in on you and you are trying to distract or hold him off as that Siege Mode upgrade is finishing. Or you want to push. You are eager to push. He just did a stupid attack on you. You know if you push you will win. Your marines and units are piling up. But you have to wait for the Siege Mode upgrade... Maybe you can time it right and show up at his base just as it finishes... But do you know your timing? Do you know how long it will take? What if you get caught in the middle of the map and surrounded?

or

You know you are about to lose, because you chose to tech, but if you could hold on for a few more seconds as Psionic Storm finishes, you know you can fry his units and have the upper hand.

It is situations like these that make Starcraft a great game. These are common situations and the game really revolves around these important and well known upgrades.

The way I see it is, Blizzard is adding all this other stuff to the game, and it is affecting already effective parts of the game. They are adding some cool things. And I am open to change. But this is what I truly believe:

If you are going to add "good" things to the game that jeopardize other already GREAT parts of the game, then you are doing something WRONG.

Why go backwards? Could it be that someone at the top of the Starcraft development team wants to make a name for themselves? In the Book "Good to Great: Why Some Companies Make the Leap... and Others Don't" by Jim Collins, he talks about how when new leaders or CEO's join a company, they act selfishly. They don't care about the company (or game), they care about their own ego and fame. And they are willing to destroy things that past leaders have made (i.e. siege mode), with a reckless disregard for the public, just to meet their own ends. They take pride in destroying a community (Brood Wars) and then creating their own. They WANT to create their own. They want NO ties to the past.

There have been many signs in the past of this since the beginning of Starcraft WOL, and they were suspicious to me. Today, my suspicions are confirmed. I am sorry if this is ambiguous, but those who know what I am talking about will understand. They feel what I feel.

So again,

If you are going to add "good" things to the game that jeopardize other already GREAT parts of the game, then you are doing something WRONG.

I don't care what they add or change, but they CANNOT ruin core game elements that make the game Starcraft. It is an insult to all gamers past and present.

What do you guys think?
Duncaaaaaan
Profile Joined May 2012
United Kingdom101 Posts
January 10 2013 01:42 GMT
#2
I think you should put this in the patch 11 QQ thread, it's on 26 pages now and your opinion isn't important enough to warrant a new thread unless you have led some groundbreaking research in this which you will have not.
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
January 10 2013 01:44 GMT
#3
Protoss:
Psionic Storm for High Templars.


lol, I think you should have written warpgate upgrade instead.

I think your two main arguments are situational, but you didn't even consider what new situations this balance change makes.

I'm neither agreeing or disagreeing with you, but you clearly didn't evaluate the other side of the coin.

https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
Reptile-Rome
Profile Joined January 2011
United States34 Posts
January 10 2013 01:49 GMT
#4
On January 10 2013 10:42 Duncaaaaaan wrote:
I think you should put this in the patch 11 QQ thread, it's on 26 pages now and your opinion isn't important enough to warrant a new thread unless you have led some groundbreaking research in this which you will have not.


Yeah, I saw that, but with so many things being talked about, I was afraid my main point would get lost in the myriad of comments. I believe strongly enough in this that I think it does warrant it's own thread.

On January 10 2013 10:44 Torte de Lini wrote:

I'm neither agreeing or disagreeing with you, but you clearly didn't evaluate the other side of the coin.



What is the other side of the coin then? If you have a good argument, please let us know so we can discuss it.
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
January 10 2013 01:49 GMT
#5
On January 10 2013 10:49 Reptile-Rome wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2013 10:42 Duncaaaaaan wrote:
I think you should put this in the patch 11 QQ thread, it's on 26 pages now and your opinion isn't important enough to warrant a new thread unless you have led some groundbreaking research in this which you will have not.


Yeah, I saw that, but with so many things being talked about, I was afraid my main point would get lost in the myriad of comments. I believe strongly enough in this that I think it does warrant it's own thread.

Show nested quote +
On January 10 2013 10:44 Torte de Lini wrote:

I'm neither agreeing or disagreeing with you, but you clearly didn't evaluate the other side of the coin.



What is the other side of the coin then? If you have a good argument, please let us know so we can discuss it.


The situations that are created with this change.
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
MasterCynical
Profile Joined September 2012
505 Posts
January 10 2013 01:52 GMT
#6
I think that the anticipation that the siege upgrade brought has now been moved to when you are building the siege tank.

Before the anticipation was spread over both getting out the tanks and researching the upgrade, now its just been condensed down to just building the tanks. Is this better or worse for the game? Well that would depend on person.

Yeah, the strategy it brought was good, but after a few hundred of games and replays you will pretty much know the key timings for siege mode, getting the upgrade in addition to the tanks just feels a bit redundant, it feels like creating an artificial layer of strategy. I think this is simplifying the game in a good way.
BrandFilt
Profile Joined April 2009
Sweden57 Posts
January 10 2013 01:52 GMT
#7
Bad thread. I would say it's a stupid change because it will change nothing in mech TvP. The problem is how the armies interact and not how costly it is to get siege.
Myles
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States5162 Posts
January 10 2013 01:55 GMT
#8
This is mostly a rant thread.
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