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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 8057

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15686 Posts
July 11 2017 18:47 GMT
#161121
On July 12 2017 03:42 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


Of course they are, if it is illegal, it's a federal crime, and Trump pardons him.

It won't even hurt him much if he does since it is his first born son, and namesake, so plenty of people will empathize. What kind of asshole would let his son rot in prison if he could just free him?

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it will even come to that.
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
July 11 2017 18:47 GMT
#161122
On July 12 2017 03:41 Nevuk wrote:


Something just always is off with Donald's ductus (is this an english word?) A 'high quality person' sounds like he is talking about a car tire. The man just can't articulate himself
Zambrah
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States7297 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 18:54:56
July 11 2017 18:54 GMT
#161123
On July 12 2017 03:47 Nyxisto wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:41 Nevuk wrote:
https://twitter.com/kaitlancollins/status/884842004672376832


Something just always is off with Donald's ductus (is this an english word?) A 'high quality person' sounds like he is talking about a car tire. The man just can't articulate himself. Sad!


I dunno this seems pretty normal for Trump, his grasp on words has been rather limited. I'm more interested in the fact that he's now chosen to tweet about the situation, and he's not #fakenewsing it. Also how has his track record been for this type of tweet? Doesn't the person usually go down?
Incremental change is the Democrat version of Trickle Down economics.
a_flayer
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Netherlands2826 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 18:55:34
July 11 2017 18:54 GMT
#161124
On July 12 2017 03:47 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:42 GreenHorizons wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


Of course they are, if it is illegal, it's a federal crime, and Trump pardons him.

It won't even hurt him much if he does since it is his first born son, and namesake, so plenty of people will empathize. What kind of asshole would let his son rot in prison if he could just free him?

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it will even come to that.

Unless the FBI digs up some evidence that the Trump campaign took any information from the Russians as a result of that meeting, I doubt anything will come from it as well.
When you came along so righteous with a new national hate, so convincing is the ardor of war and of men, it's harder to breathe than to believe you're a friend. The wars at home, the wars abroad, all soaked in blood and lies and fraud.
brian
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States9618 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 18:58:25
July 11 2017 18:54 GMT
#161125
On July 12 2017 03:47 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:42 GreenHorizons wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


Of course they are, if it is illegal, it's a federal crime, and Trump pardons him.

It won't even hurt him much if he does since it is his first born son, and namesake, so plenty of people will empathize. What kind of asshole would let his son rot in prison if he could just free him?

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it will even come to that.

i mean there's a difference between committing a crime and proving it. you can't prove it with what he released but we know it did actually happen. at the very least he has clearly committed conspiracy. but you absolutely can't prove it without being at the meeting. the emails only insinuate they were going to commit this crime at the meeting. we know they met. we don't know what actually happened at the meeting. i think, is what i'm seeing.

i thought i could leave this thread. but man that is spicy.

regardless, i'm not sure if i read it here or on reddit, but i'd like to either emphasize or point out that nobody should expect anything to come of this. it'll just be added to the pile of evidence being built in the investigation. nobody's going to try to lock someone up without having this investigation closed. once you arrest someone you're on the clock to get his trial over with expeditiously. until then they'll carry on with their investigation until such time that they're ready to either arrest and try or just say there's nothing there.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 19:01:29
July 11 2017 18:57 GMT
#161126
On July 12 2017 03:54 a_flayer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:47 Mohdoo wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:42 GreenHorizons wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


Of course they are, if it is illegal, it's a federal crime, and Trump pardons him.

It won't even hurt him much if he does since it is his first born son, and namesake, so plenty of people will empathize. What kind of asshole would let his son rot in prison if he could just free him?

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it will even come to that.

Unless the FBI digs up some evidence that the Trump campaign took any information as a result of that meeting, I doubt anything will come from it as well.

There is an argument that even accepting the meeting is a violation of campaign finance laws. You can’t solicit aid of any form from a foreign government. Even if the information was useless, the act of taking the meeting counts as soliciting the information.

On July 12 2017 03:54 brian wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:47 Mohdoo wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:42 GreenHorizons wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


Of course they are, if it is illegal, it's a federal crime, and Trump pardons him.

It won't even hurt him much if he does since it is his first born son, and namesake, so plenty of people will empathize. What kind of asshole would let his son rot in prison if he could just free him?

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it will even come to that.

i mean there's a difference between committing a crime and proving it. you can't prove it with what he released but we know it did actually happen. at the very least he has clearly committed conspiracy. but you absolutely can't prove it without being at the meeting. the emails only insinuate they were going to commit this crime at the meeting. we know they met. we don't know what actually happened at the meeting. i think, is what i'm seeing.

i thought i could leave this thread. but man that is spicy.

Going to the meeting could be a crime all on its own. And there are other problems created by this for Trump, since he was so keen to kill the Flynn/Russian investigation. If he knew about this meeting, it is easy to argue that this was one of the reasons he wanted to kill the investigation. But nothing will happen instantly.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23221 Posts
July 11 2017 19:03 GMT
#161127
On July 12 2017 03:54 a_flayer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:47 Mohdoo wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:42 GreenHorizons wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


Of course they are, if it is illegal, it's a federal crime, and Trump pardons him.

It won't even hurt him much if he does since it is his first born son, and namesake, so plenty of people will empathize. What kind of asshole would let his son rot in prison if he could just free him?

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it will even come to that.

Unless the FBI digs up some evidence that the Trump campaign took any information from the Russians as a result of that meeting, I doubt anything will come from it as well.

Exactly, they need to have something like a check from Trump dated in 2015 made out to "My Anti-Clinton Russian Hit Squad" and "For illegally coordinating and helping me win the 2016 election"

And I'm not positive that would get enough Republicans on board to impeach Trump (which just leaves us with a much more superficially amiable Pence anyway).

So the media is going to keep feeding people a trickle of the investigation and pilling up those clicks as long as people keep thinking this is all going anywhere.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
July 11 2017 19:05 GMT
#161128
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?

I haven't looked at the details, but my best guess is that this is the correct analysis.
On_Slaught
Profile Joined August 2008
United States12190 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 19:09:13
July 11 2017 19:08 GMT
#161129
On July 12 2017 03:54 a_flayer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:47 Mohdoo wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:42 GreenHorizons wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


Of course they are, if it is illegal, it's a federal crime, and Trump pardons him.

It won't even hurt him much if he does since it is his first born son, and namesake, so plenty of people will empathize. What kind of asshole would let his son rot in prison if he could just free him?

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it will even come to that.

Unless the FBI digs up some evidence that the Trump campaign took any information from the Russians as a result of that meeting, I doubt anything will come from it as well.


1. There is definitely a timeline which looks really bad starting on the date of the meeting which indicates that Jr is lying when he says that they received nothing.
2. This is proof they lied dozens of previous times.
3. Would not be a stretch to say this is a violation of campaign finance law, so he could actually be charged.
4. This feeds the narrative in the most epic way possible. Guarantees Trump will never get out from under this story now.
5. Is proof that the campaign was willing to collude. Anyone think this is really the only shoe to drop?
6. Another piece in Muellers investigation puzzle.

Watch Manafort testify about what was said for immunity.
Diavlo
Profile Joined July 2011
Belgium2915 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 19:15:55
July 11 2017 19:12 GMT
#161130
"My son is a high quality person and I applaud his transparency."

Who the fuck even talks like that? A high quality person? It sounds like something a badly translated NPC would say in an RPG or what a non-english rbnb host would use to describe you on your profile.



On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


He knew the emails were going to be released, this is a last grasp at transparency. He's actually banking on people having your approach.
"I don't know how many years on this Earth I got left. I'm gonna get real weird with it."
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 19:14:02
July 11 2017 19:13 GMT
#161131
Don Jr might not have directly tweeted something illegal (I doubt he consulted his new lawyer on this) but he certainly tweeted something that blew gaping holes in the already Swiss-cheese narrative about what the campaign did and didn't do with Russia and its representatives in such a way that they can't deny it. Which means another week of Donnie throwing hissy fits in the White House.
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
July 11 2017 19:13 GMT
#161132
Any notion that Manafort and Kushner weren't told of the nature of the meeting beforehand is not believable.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 11 2017 19:16 GMT
#161133
On July 12 2017 03:47 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2017 03:42 GreenHorizons wrote:
On July 12 2017 03:40 Mohdoo wrote:
I just can't imagine a situation where jr tweets something showing something illegal. Is everyone just overreacting?


Of course they are, if it is illegal, it's a federal crime, and Trump pardons him.

It won't even hurt him much if he does since it is his first born son, and namesake, so plenty of people will empathize. What kind of asshole would let his son rot in prison if he could just free him?

I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think it will even come to that.

Do you mean in the next month? Or ever? Those emails are not great and pretty much confirm Russian government contact the top most members of the Trump team. Are they criminal on their own? Maybe. Are they bad if the Trump team knew or suspected that DNC hack took place and just kept it to themselves? You bet.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
Netherlands30548 Posts
July 11 2017 19:39 GMT
#161134
Jr. was inspired by Assange?



Neosteel Enthusiast
Diavlo
Profile Joined July 2011
Belgium2915 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 19:55:12
July 11 2017 19:54 GMT
#161135
On July 12 2017 04:39 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
Jr. was inspired by Assange?

https://twitter.com/JulianAssange/status/884853347815235584





Definitely not taking side I see, wonder if he had the same courtesy toward Clinton when he leaked her emails.
Probably not.
"I don't know how many years on this Earth I got left. I'm gonna get real weird with it."
Wulfey_LA
Profile Joined April 2017
932 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 20:15:52
July 11 2017 20:15 GMT
#161136
I like how all future pages of this thread will be debates on the extent of Trump campaign collusion with Russian operatives. DonJR has confirmed that yes, collusion and/or conspiracy was attempted at the highest levels of the Trump campaign staff. Just read the header on that email. David French at NRO has some choice words.

Going further, at long last we can now put to bed the notion that the Russia investigation is little more than frivolous partisan harassment, and it casts in an entirely different light the president’s fury and frustration at its continued progress. As recently as last week, it appeared that the “collusion narrative” had lost steam, and that the so-called “Russia scandal” had morphed into an attack on Donald Trump’s handling of the investigation, rather than the investigation itself. If you had told me last week that there existed an e-mail chain where a Trump contact explicitly tried to set up a meeting between a purported Russian official and the Trump senior team to facilitate official Russian efforts to beat Clinton, I’d have thought you’d been spending too much time in the deranged corners of Twitter.

As of now, we should have zero confidence that we know all or even most material facts. We should have zero confidence that Trump’s frustration is entirely due to his feeling like an innocent man caught in the crosshairs of crazed conspiracy theorists. It now appears that his son, son-in-law, and campaign chair met with a lawyer who they were told was part of an official Russian government effort to impact the presidential election. The Russian investigation isn’t a witch hunt anymore, if it ever was. It’s a national necessity.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/449376/donald-trump-jr-e-mails-proof-trump-campaign-attempted-collusion-russia



http://www.nationalreview.com/article/449376/donald-trump-jr-e-mails-proof-trump-campaign-attempted-collusion-russia
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42656 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 20:28:11
July 11 2017 20:21 GMT
#161137
/r/t_d is currently hi5ing that the failing NYT will no longer be able to control the narrative because Trump Jr. already gave everyone all the details about his conspiracy with Russia and so everyone already knows the truth, again showing that Twitter has beaten traditional media. Unlike Crooked Hillary, who covered up her secret conspiracies so that no evidence was ever found, Based Donald Trump Jr. doesn't delete the emails showing his conspiracy. What a patriot.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
July 11 2017 20:28 GMT
#161138
FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
Netherlands30548 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-07-11 20:39:17
July 11 2017 20:38 GMT
#161139
The story continues, the Emin and Aras mentioned in the email chain from Donald Jr., were working with him and Ivanka on a Trump Towers Moscow project. 'never had any dealings with Russia' turns out to be another lie. It also provides a possible motive for the administration trying to lift sanctions.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/new-details-emerge-moscow-real-estate-deal-led-trump-kremlin-alliance-190126219.html

While in Moscow for the Miss Universe pageant in November 2013, Donald Trump entered into a formal business deal with Aras Agalarov, a Russian oligarch close to Vladimir Putin, to construct a Trump Tower in the Russian capital. He later assigned his son, Donald Trump Jr., to oversee the project, according to Rob Goldstone, the British publicist who arranged the controversial 2016 meeting between the younger Trump and a Kremlin-linked lawyer.

Trump has dismissed the idea he had any business deals in Russia, saying at one point last October, “I have nothing to do with Russia.”

But Goldstone’s account, provided in an extensive interview in March in New York, offers new details of the proposed Trump project that appears to have been further along than most previous reports have suggested, and even included a trip by Ivanka Trump to Moscow to identify potential sites.

According to the publicist, the project — structured as a licensing deal in which Agalarov would build the tower with Trump’s name on it — was only abandoned after the Russian economy floundered. The economic downturn resulted in part from sanctions imposed by the U.S. and the European Union following Russia’s intervention in Ukraine.

Goldstone’s version of events implies a possible explanation for Trump’s interest in lifting sanctions on Russia — a policy move his administration quietly pursued in its first few weeks until it ran into strong opposition from members of Congress and officials within the State Department.


full text
+ Show Spoiler +

While in Moscow for the Miss Universe pageant in November 2013, Donald Trump entered into a formal business deal with Aras Agalarov, a Russian oligarch close to Vladimir Putin, to construct a Trump Tower in the Russian capital. He later assigned his son, Donald Trump Jr., to oversee the project, according to Rob Goldstone, the British publicist who arranged the controversial 2016 meeting between the younger Trump and a Kremlin-linked lawyer.

Trump has dismissed the idea he had any business deals in Russia, saying at one point last October, “I have nothing to do with Russia.”

But Goldstone’s account, provided in an extensive interview in March in New York, offers new details of the proposed Trump project that appears to have been further along than most previous reports have suggested, and even included a trip by Ivanka Trump to Moscow to identify potential sites.

According to the publicist, the project — structured as a licensing deal in which Agalarov would build the tower with Trump’s name on it — was only abandoned after the Russian economy floundered. The economic downturn resulted in part from sanctions imposed by the U.S. and the European Union following Russia’s intervention in Ukraine.

Goldstone’s version of events implies a possible explanation for Trump’s interest in lifting sanctions on Russia — a policy move his administration quietly pursued in its first few weeks until it ran into strong opposition from members of Congress and officials within the State Department.

Goldstone placed Donald Trump Jr. at the center of the Trump Tower deal, saying that his father assigned his eldest son the job of moving the project to fruition after the signing of a “letter of intent” between the Trump Organization and Agalarov’s company, the Crocus Group. It is not clear if the future president personally signed the “letter of intent,” but Michael Cohen, a longtime lawyer for Trump, told Yahoo News Tuesday that it would have been standard practice for Trump, as president of the Trump Organization, to do so.

Goldstone also said that Ivanka Trump flew to Moscow in 2014 and met with Emin Agalarov, the oligarch’s son, a pop singer and a vice president of the Crocus Group, to identify sites for the project.

Trump “put Donald Jr. in charge and then Ivanka went to Moscow to look around for what the location would be,” Goldstone said. But the plans for a Trump Tower fell apart because “the economy tanked in Russia’’ after the imposition of Western sanctions, he said.

Goldstone, a British-born publicist who once did worked for Michael Jackson, represents Emin Agalarov in his music career and was present in Moscow during the Miss Universe pageant when the Trump Tower project was discussed by Trump and Aras Agalarov. His role has gotten new attention this week after the New York Times disclosed that Goldstone emailed Donald Trump Jr. in June 2016 urging him to meet with a Russian lawyer to receive damaging information from the Russian government about Hillary Clinton.

Trump Jr. released his email exchange with Goldstone on Tuesday, confirming the key role of the publicist and, more significantly, the Agalarovs, in offering negative information about Clinton on behalf of the Kremlin. “Emin just called and asked me to contact you with something very interesting,” Goldstone wrote Trump Jr. on June 3, 2016.

A chief prosecutor in Russia “offered to provide the Trump campaign some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and would be very useful to your father. This is very high-level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support of Mr. Trump — helped along by Aras and Emin.”

Alan Garten, the chief lawyer for the Trump Organization, did not respond to requests for comment. In a telephone interview, Cohen, who is Trump’s personal lawyer, did not dispute any specific details of Goldstone’s account but offered to check them. He did not later respond. But Cohen adamantly rejected the idea there was anything improper about meeting with the Russian lawyer, Natalia Veselnitskaya, given that Trump Jr. was told she might have information helpful to Trump’s campaign. “The purpose of the election is to win,” said Cohen, adding, “Why is this any different?” than the unverified “dossier” on Trump’s ties to Russia prepared by a former British spy working for a Washington research firm hired by his political opponents.

Trump Jr., accompanied by then campaign manager Paul Manafort and senior adviser Jared Kushner, met with the Russian lawyer at Goldstone’s request to review the information she purported to have. “He met with her face-to-face to determine” the validity of the advertised documents and “no information was provided.”

Goldstone had played a key role in helping to broker the initial decision by the Miss Universe pageant — then owned by the Trump Organization and NBC — to hold its 2013 contest in Moscow.

According to Goldstone, he pitched the idea to Paula Schugart, then chief executive of Miss Universe, as a way to promote the music career of Emin Agalarov. Schugart was initially hesitant because of concerns about red tape in Moscow. “What if you had a partner who owns the biggest venue in Moscow?” Emin Agalarov responded, according to Goldstone’s account. “Between myself and my father, we can cut through the red tape. You have a new partner.”

The plans to bring Miss Universe to Moscow was announced by Trump in Las Vegas in June 2013 during the Miss USA contest. Trump at the time quickly expressed hope that it would lead to a meeting with Putin. “Do you think Putin will be going to the Miss Universe pageant in November in Moscow — if so, will he become my new best friend?” Trump had tweeted at the time.

A meeting with Putin never came off during Trump’s Moscow trip; the Kremlin expressed regret that the Russian president wouldn’t be able to fit it into his schedule on the day in question because he had a meeting with the King of Holland. But the trip gave Trump an opportunity to discuss the plans for the Trump Tower in Moscow with Agalarov, a billionaire who has been called “the Trump of Russia” and “Putin’s builder” because of massive construction projects he has done on behalf of the Kremlin. Just 10 days before the Miss Universe pageant, Putin had given Agalarov a prestigious award at a ceremony at the Kremlin: Order of Honor of the Russian Federation.

In an interview with Forbes this March, Emin Agalarov confirmed the plans for Trump Tower in Moscow. “We thought that building a Trump Tower next to an Agalarov tower — having the two big names — could be a really cool project to execute,” Emin Agalarov told the magazine. Agalarov blamed the abandonment of the project on Trump’s decision to run for president, rather than the imposition of sanctions. “He ran for president, so we dropped the idea,” Agalarov said. “But if he hadn’t run, we would probably be in the construction phase today.”

But Emin Agalarov said he and the now president have continued to stay in touch, saying that Trump sent a handwritten note to the Agalaovs in November after they congratulated him on his victory. “Now that he ran and was elected, he does not forget his friends.”


Neosteel Enthusiast
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
July 11 2017 20:41 GMT
#161140
On July 12 2017 05:38 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
The story continues, the Emin and Aras mentioned in the email chain from Donald Jr., were working with him and Ivanka on a Trump Towers Moscow project. 'never had any dealings with Russia' turns out to be another lie. It also provides a possible motive for the administration trying to lift sanctions.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/new-details-emerge-moscow-real-estate-deal-led-trump-kremlin-alliance-190126219.html

Show nested quote +
While in Moscow for the Miss Universe pageant in November 2013, Donald Trump entered into a formal business deal with Aras Agalarov, a Russian oligarch close to Vladimir Putin, to construct a Trump Tower in the Russian capital. He later assigned his son, Donald Trump Jr., to oversee the project, according to Rob Goldstone, the British publicist who arranged the controversial 2016 meeting between the younger Trump and a Kremlin-linked lawyer.

Trump has dismissed the idea he had any business deals in Russia, saying at one point last October, “I have nothing to do with Russia.”

But Goldstone’s account, provided in an extensive interview in March in New York, offers new details of the proposed Trump project that appears to have been further along than most previous reports have suggested, and even included a trip by Ivanka Trump to Moscow to identify potential sites.

According to the publicist, the project — structured as a licensing deal in which Agalarov would build the tower with Trump’s name on it — was only abandoned after the Russian economy floundered. The economic downturn resulted in part from sanctions imposed by the U.S. and the European Union following Russia’s intervention in Ukraine.

Goldstone’s version of events implies a possible explanation for Trump’s interest in lifting sanctions on Russia — a policy move his administration quietly pursued in its first few weeks until it ran into strong opposition from members of Congress and officials within the State Department.


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While in Moscow for the Miss Universe pageant in November 2013, Donald Trump entered into a formal business deal with Aras Agalarov, a Russian oligarch close to Vladimir Putin, to construct a Trump Tower in the Russian capital. He later assigned his son, Donald Trump Jr., to oversee the project, according to Rob Goldstone, the British publicist who arranged the controversial 2016 meeting between the younger Trump and a Kremlin-linked lawyer.

Trump has dismissed the idea he had any business deals in Russia, saying at one point last October, “I have nothing to do with Russia.”

But Goldstone’s account, provided in an extensive interview in March in New York, offers new details of the proposed Trump project that appears to have been further along than most previous reports have suggested, and even included a trip by Ivanka Trump to Moscow to identify potential sites.

According to the publicist, the project — structured as a licensing deal in which Agalarov would build the tower with Trump’s name on it — was only abandoned after the Russian economy floundered. The economic downturn resulted in part from sanctions imposed by the U.S. and the European Union following Russia’s intervention in Ukraine.

Goldstone’s version of events implies a possible explanation for Trump’s interest in lifting sanctions on Russia — a policy move his administration quietly pursued in its first few weeks until it ran into strong opposition from members of Congress and officials within the State Department.

Goldstone placed Donald Trump Jr. at the center of the Trump Tower deal, saying that his father assigned his eldest son the job of moving the project to fruition after the signing of a “letter of intent” between the Trump Organization and Agalarov’s company, the Crocus Group. It is not clear if the future president personally signed the “letter of intent,” but Michael Cohen, a longtime lawyer for Trump, told Yahoo News Tuesday that it would have been standard practice for Trump, as president of the Trump Organization, to do so.

Goldstone also said that Ivanka Trump flew to Moscow in 2014 and met with Emin Agalarov, the oligarch’s son, a pop singer and a vice president of the Crocus Group, to identify sites for the project.

Trump “put Donald Jr. in charge and then Ivanka went to Moscow to look around for what the location would be,” Goldstone said. But the plans for a Trump Tower fell apart because “the economy tanked in Russia’’ after the imposition of Western sanctions, he said.

Goldstone, a British-born publicist who once did worked for Michael Jackson, represents Emin Agalarov in his music career and was present in Moscow during the Miss Universe pageant when the Trump Tower project was discussed by Trump and Aras Agalarov. His role has gotten new attention this week after the New York Times disclosed that Goldstone emailed Donald Trump Jr. in June 2016 urging him to meet with a Russian lawyer to receive damaging information from the Russian government about Hillary Clinton.

Trump Jr. released his email exchange with Goldstone on Tuesday, confirming the key role of the publicist and, more significantly, the Agalarovs, in offering negative information about Clinton on behalf of the Kremlin. “Emin just called and asked me to contact you with something very interesting,” Goldstone wrote Trump Jr. on June 3, 2016.

A chief prosecutor in Russia “offered to provide the Trump campaign some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and would be very useful to your father. This is very high-level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government’s support of Mr. Trump — helped along by Aras and Emin.”

Alan Garten, the chief lawyer for the Trump Organization, did not respond to requests for comment. In a telephone interview, Cohen, who is Trump’s personal lawyer, did not dispute any specific details of Goldstone’s account but offered to check them. He did not later respond. But Cohen adamantly rejected the idea there was anything improper about meeting with the Russian lawyer, Natalia Veselnitskaya, given that Trump Jr. was told she might have information helpful to Trump’s campaign. “The purpose of the election is to win,” said Cohen, adding, “Why is this any different?” than the unverified “dossier” on Trump’s ties to Russia prepared by a former British spy working for a Washington research firm hired by his political opponents.

Trump Jr., accompanied by then campaign manager Paul Manafort and senior adviser Jared Kushner, met with the Russian lawyer at Goldstone’s request to review the information she purported to have. “He met with her face-to-face to determine” the validity of the advertised documents and “no information was provided.”

Goldstone had played a key role in helping to broker the initial decision by the Miss Universe pageant — then owned by the Trump Organization and NBC — to hold its 2013 contest in Moscow.

According to Goldstone, he pitched the idea to Paula Schugart, then chief executive of Miss Universe, as a way to promote the music career of Emin Agalarov. Schugart was initially hesitant because of concerns about red tape in Moscow. “What if you had a partner who owns the biggest venue in Moscow?” Emin Agalarov responded, according to Goldstone’s account. “Between myself and my father, we can cut through the red tape. You have a new partner.”

The plans to bring Miss Universe to Moscow was announced by Trump in Las Vegas in June 2013 during the Miss USA contest. Trump at the time quickly expressed hope that it would lead to a meeting with Putin. “Do you think Putin will be going to the Miss Universe pageant in November in Moscow — if so, will he become my new best friend?” Trump had tweeted at the time.

A meeting with Putin never came off during Trump’s Moscow trip; the Kremlin expressed regret that the Russian president wouldn’t be able to fit it into his schedule on the day in question because he had a meeting with the King of Holland. But the trip gave Trump an opportunity to discuss the plans for the Trump Tower in Moscow with Agalarov, a billionaire who has been called “the Trump of Russia” and “Putin’s builder” because of massive construction projects he has done on behalf of the Kremlin. Just 10 days before the Miss Universe pageant, Putin had given Agalarov a prestigious award at a ceremony at the Kremlin: Order of Honor of the Russian Federation.

In an interview with Forbes this March, Emin Agalarov confirmed the plans for Trump Tower in Moscow. “We thought that building a Trump Tower next to an Agalarov tower — having the two big names — could be a really cool project to execute,” Emin Agalarov told the magazine. Agalarov blamed the abandonment of the project on Trump’s decision to run for president, rather than the imposition of sanctions. “He ran for president, so we dropped the idea,” Agalarov said. “But if he hadn’t run, we would probably be in the construction phase today.”

But Emin Agalarov said he and the now president have continued to stay in touch, saying that Trump sent a handwritten note to the Agalaovs in November after they congratulated him on his victory. “Now that he ran and was elected, he does not forget his friends.”




Do we have any idea who the 'Rhona' mentioned is?
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
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