EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 6130
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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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Ghostcom
Denmark4783 Posts
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SkyTheUnknown
Germany2065 Posts
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RvB
Netherlands6271 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:55 Incognoto wrote: I'm tuning in and speechless at what I'm listening to Indeed. What is this madness?! | ||
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Incognoto
France10239 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:53 xDaunt wrote: For all of you liberals standing at the edge of the cliff, take some solace in the following: 1) American institutions are tremendously resilient. The impact that Trump will have without some degree of bipartisan support won't be that big. 2) Yes, Obamacare is done. Good riddance to it. It's clearly a steaming pile of shit and an anchor on the Democrats. But here's the silver lining: I give it a better than even chance that Trump advocates for some sort of government option (think Medicare for all) as the replacement. 3) Abortion rights aren't going anywhere. Gay rights aren't going anywhere. You've won on these issues. Even if Trump gets capped and Pence takes over, there's nothing that the president can do to unwind the progress that's been made. Virtually no judge that Trump may appoint will overturn the precedents that have been set. Judges are egotistical assholes, and they'd rather not tarnish their reputations (see John Roberts). And the American people don't have the appetite for a protracted cultural war on these issues right now. Trump didn't even run on those issues. There are bigger fish to fry. Which takes me to my last point.... 4) Trump is a moderate at heart, and I fully expect him to govern like a moderate. Pay attention to his speech from last night. Notice how he didn't mention the wall? Or even the immigration issue at all? I know everyone is all wound up thanks to the media's relentless negative portrayal of him over the past six months, but I think that there is a real danger that Trump's supporters will be the ones who find themselves supremely disappointed over the next two-four years. Obamacare might be bad (because it's expensive? as far as I read that's the only issue with it?) but it did some very important things in regards to insurance companies no longer being able to fuck over people with health issues. You can't ethically allow health insurance companies to refuse social protection to people because they have health issues. It's fucking stupid | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
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Laurens
Belgium4557 Posts
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Logo
United States7542 Posts
3) Abortion rights aren't going anywhere. Gay rights aren't going anywhere. You've won on these issues. Even if Trump gets capped and Pence takes over, there's nothing that the president can do to unwind the progress that's been made. Virtually no judge that Trump may appoint will overturn the precedents that have been set. Judges are egotistical assholes, and they'd rather not tarnish their reputations (see John Roberts). And the American people don't have the appetite for a protracted cultural war on these issues right now. Trump didn't even run on those issues. There are bigger fish to fry. Which takes me to my last point.... This one seems incorrect (the abortion part)? There's already a bunch of states chipping away at abortion rights by imposing overly strict regulations on where abortions can be performed or allowing shady centers to operate that appear to be about family planning or offer abortions but then really hammer anti-abortion messages into you. See: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/06/01/14-states-have-passed-laws-making-it-harder-to-get-an-abortion-already-this-year/ among others. | ||
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Sent.
Poland9288 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:49 zatic wrote: Yeah, good thing we have a leader with a track record of standing up to authoritarian dickheads! *sarcasm* For real though, this is chance for Merkel to lead and defend Western values, against the US if necessary. I personally doubt she has it in her though. How do you lead and defend Western values without carriers, stealth bombers and military bases on five continents? | ||
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ACrow
Germany6583 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:09 Laurens wrote: He's gonna nuke everyone, right? Or at least that's what a significant part of my facebook friends think. Sending troops* and launching nukes is what is within the executive power of a POTUS. *He'll have congress to approve after the fact and a period of I believe 90(?) days. | ||
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Incognoto
France10239 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:58 Laurens wrote: LMAO THIS MUSIC Clown music which suits the end of this circus act of an election, I suppose? | ||
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Buckyman
1364 Posts
On November 09 2016 20:37 Simberto wrote: But i also never understood how the republican party gets elected in the first place, even without trump. Their positions on evolution, healthcare, religion, climate change, economics, abortion and pretty much anything they ever talk about are just simply the direct opposite of what i believe is correct, and even far away from anything i can reasonably imagine a person supporting. So i guess voting for the worst person i can imagine in office is a logical conclusion to that? Silo effect. You tend to talk mostly with "liberal"* types, they mostly talk with "conservative"* types and when you meet one of them you talk past each other because you don't understand how they think. You then make the mistake of writing them off instead of instead of trying to figure out what your actual differences are and go back to talking with people inside your political silo. Often you think of a controversy in entirely different terms, and don't care about the other point of view or about finding a neutral expression of the issue - abortion is a strong example of this effect, where one side asks "When is it okay to murder a fetus" and the other side asks "When is it okay to force an unwilling woman to carry a pregnancy" when the actual question is something like "When should the basic rights of a new human organism outweigh the right of a woman to control her own body?" There is a further complication, that people don't understand some of their own beliefs well enough to explain them. If I were to ask a question in this thread like "Why is racism a bad thing?" I'd likely get several responses like "It's obviously bad and you must be stupid for even asking" before anyone comes up with any reason at all, much less one that would make sense to a "conservative"* without some clarifications. Fortunately, there's an easy two step process for fixing both of these: 1) Listen to people you disagree with 2) Talk to them about the reasons behind the disagreement It's important that you get the order correct! Otherwise you'll simply talk past each other. --- *used loosely; these terms are prone to definition drift. | ||
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Dav1oN
Ukraine3164 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:55 zeo wrote: A considerable part of Ukraine's post-Maidan elite are tied to the political structures under the control of the Democrats. They will now need to prove their worth to Republican political structures or get replaced by new puppets. So expect a few sweaty faces in parliament. As for the frozen war in Donbass nothing will change, everyone wants to keep the status quo so both sides can keep profiteering. u know nothing about ukraine and it's crisis | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:27 Jormundr wrote: Guess what. He couldn't have been worse than Hillary. Because she lost against the worst candidate republicans have fielded in 50 years. You are the policy dunce. You're the moron who thought that the current state of affairs just needed to be made more palatable to the idiotic masses. You were wrong. This country didn't want to continue the slow decline that Hillary promised. This country didn't want more of the same shitbirds who got us here. Now we have Trump. Maybe if Hillary hadn't cheated her way through the primary collusion with news networks and the DNC we wouldn't have DONALD J TRUMP AS A PRESIDENT, but hey you said that was fine because she would get elected. She didn't. Nobody wants your polished turd. There is literally nothing you can do to apologize the damage that you have done to minorities and the queer community in this country. A vote for Hillary in the primaries was a vote for Trump. You made america great again. Congratulations. User was warned for this post two things. 1. i am not a defender of the status quo/advocate for doing nothing. i'm very well aware of the depth of the problem beyond rosy gloss by official positions. which is why HRC's platform has a number of things specifically intended to address the continued labor market weakness, why yellen entertained running the economy hot for a few months without raising rates, why i wanted to see more of an issue based message from her etc. 2. continued war on HRC from the left, particularly the labor based groups, was very damaging. i would not blame the loss on this stuff but the far left quite obviously put war against establishment over the serious trump threat. at various points i've talked about how trump is for real and this is not the time to witch hunt HRC from the left, but no, she's the other devil in the race. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:57 Incognoto wrote: Obamacare might be bad (because it's expensive? as far as I read that's the only issue with it?) but it did some very important things in regards to insurance companies no longer being able to fuck over people with health issues. You can't ethically allow health insurance companies to refuse social protection to people because they have health issues. It's fucking stupid Obamacare is bad because it has 1) gutted the insurance coverage of those who had it and were happy with it (a lot of people), 2) it made that coverage more expensive, 3) and it forced expensive coverage on a lot of people who don't even want it. Yes, Obamacare does provide coverage to people with preexisting coverage, but the cost to everyone is way too high. Obamacare is clearly the wrong solution. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18248 Posts
Predictions? I'm now expecting Hillary to walk onto the stage in a Pepe suit. | ||
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Piledriver
United States1697 Posts
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Dan HH
Romania9188 Posts
On November 10 2016 01:02 Acrofales wrote: Brass band into metal... classic transition. DJs do it all the time. Predictions? I'm now expecting Hillary to walk onto the stage in a Pepe suit. It's some generic pop music on the ABC stream. What you're talking about is what that random youtuber is playing. | ||
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Laurens
Belgium4557 Posts
On November 10 2016 01:04 Dan HH wrote: It's some generic pop music on the ABC stream. What you're talking about is what that random youtuber is playing. Ooooooooooooooooh right. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On November 10 2016 00:58 Logo wrote: This one seems incorrect (the abortion part)? There's already a bunch of states chipping away at abortion rights by imposing overly strict regulations on where abortions can be performed or allowing shady centers to operate that appear to be about family planning or offer abortions but then really hammer anti-abortion messages into you. See: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/06/01/14-states-have-passed-laws-making-it-harder-to-get-an-abortion-already-this-year/ among others. Anyone can get an abortion in this country. Unless you're an advocate for late term abortions, the battle is being fought at the margins over convenience. This is a non-issue that is blown out of proportion by the left. | ||
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Sent.
Poland9288 Posts
White men opted 63% for Trump and 31% for Clinton; white women voted 53% for Trump and 43% for Clinton. | ||
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