EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 5010
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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:25 Mohdoo wrote: Maybe it is just to help me sleep at night, but I still have a lingering suspicion that the DNC or the Clinton's or Saudi Arabia or someone has some seriously explosive shit on Trump that they don't want to have to use but probably will. I still feel like something massive is going to come up soon before or soon after the first debate. If Clinton comes out of a dominating performance in the first debate, I think they hold onto whatever bombs they have and wait until a bad performance. Then again, the RNC or Trump or Wikileaks or Soviet Russia or someone has some seriously explosive shit on Clinton and don't want to have to use it but probably will, as well. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:28 ticklishmusic wrote: well court date for the child rape case is set for oct 14, though trump's lawyers will try to get that pushed to after the election Until that thing stops being a Jane Doe filing, that story has no legs. Reporters have said they can find nothing about the Plaintiff in that case. | ||
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CorsairHero
Canada9491 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:22 Gorsameth wrote: Can he not lie for even a second? Seriously. why the fuck is he stupid enough to try to claim that Clinton started the birther movement... Not directly from her or her team The other coauthor of the Politico story, Ben Smith, now the editor-in-chief of BuzzFeed, said in a May 2013 interview on MSNBC that the conspiracy theories traced back to “some of [Hillary Clinton’s] passionate supporters,” during the final throes of Clinton’s 2008 campaign. But he said they did not come from “Clinton herself or her staff.” http://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/was-hillary-clinton-the-original-birther/ | ||
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zeo
Serbia6344 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:22 Gorsameth wrote: Can he not lie for even a second? Seriously. why the fuck is he stupid enough to try to claim that Clinton started the birther movement... Because.... her campaign did start it? During the primaries she yapped on about 'it not mattering weather Obama was a muslim or not' even though nobody asked her about it, and her supporters went on to start the whole birther talk that the Republicans later jumped on for the elections. edit: CNN is having a meltdown its brilliant hahaha | ||
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biology]major
United States2253 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:46 zeo wrote: Because.... her campaign did start it? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJU37U5_rbc During the primaries she yapped on about 'it not mattering weather Obama was a muslim or not' even though nobody asked her about it, and her supporters went on to start the whole birther talk that the Republicans later jumped on for the elections. that's not her campaign, you can't control what your supporters do. Trump supporters show up with confederate flags to his rallies lol | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
Long story short, while there's a conspiracy theory element to the claim that Hillary started the birther movement, it's not entirely divorced from reality. And I note that many of these "fact checks" on this claim omit what Hillary's campaign actually did. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46686 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:46 zeo wrote: Because.... her campaign did start it? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJU37U5_rbc During the primaries she yapped on about 'it not mattering weather Obama was a muslim or not' even though nobody asked her about it, and her supporters went on to start the whole birther talk that the Republicans later jumped on for the elections. edit: CNN is having a meltdown its brilliant hahaha That video literally said that it wasn't Clinton or her staff or her campaign that started the birther movement. It was some stupid opponents of Obama, both in the Democratic primary and- of course- Republicans. But not Clinton, nor any other Democratic leaders. | ||
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Dan HH
Romania9256 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:51 xDaunt wrote: Saying that it is a "lie" that Hillary started the birther movement is kinda like saying that it is a "lie" that Hillary did anything illegal with her emails. Her campaign repeatedly smeared Obama as being a Muslim/foreigner/other and drafted memos highlighting this strategy. To the extent that her campaign in 2008 was not explicitly responsible for the birther movement, the birther movement very clearly was the product of her supporters taking the Hillary campaign's attacks to the next level. Long story short, while there's a conspiracy theory element to the claim that Hillary started the birther movement, it's not entirely divorced from reality. And I note that many of these "fact checks" on this claim omit what Hillary's campaign actually did. Suggesting that this means it's not a lie that Hillary started the birther movement, is like saying it's not a lie that Trump started the 'body double' conspiracy because his campaign questioned her health and his supporters took it to the next level. Do you not see the leap? If anyone made such a connection about Trump you would call them retarded | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
Whether said candidate enabled and encouraged said supporters, is the real question of interest. | ||
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zeo
Serbia6344 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:52 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: That video literally said that it wasn't Clinton or her staff or her campaign that started the birther movement. It was some stupid opponents of Obama, both in the Democratic primary and- of course- Republicans. But not Clinton, nor any other Democratic leaders. Just because she didn't specifically state it doesn't mean she isn't responsible. Her rhetoric goaded her supporters into making a big deal out of it. | ||
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biology]major
United States2253 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:57 zeo wrote: Just because she didn't specifically state it doesn't mean she isn't responsible. Her rhetoric goaded her supporters into making a big deal out of it. In a land where there is no personal responsibility sure | ||
KwarK
United States44439 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:57 zeo wrote: Just because she didn't specifically state it doesn't mean she isn't responsible. Her rhetoric goaded her supporters into making a big deal out of it. In the same way that Galton is responsible for the Holocaust. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:57 zeo wrote: Just because she didn't specifically state it doesn't mean she isn't responsible. Her rhetoric goaded her supporters into making a big deal out of it. Glad you agree that Trump is responsible for all the racism and violence at this events because he goaded his supporters to act that way. | ||
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CannonsNCarriers
United States638 Posts
http://www.factcheck.org/2015/07/was-hillary-clinton-the-original-birther/ http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2015/sep/23/donald-trump/hillary-clinton-obama-birther-fact-check/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2015/09/23/republicans-are-blaming-hillary-clinton-for-the-birther-movement-thats-wishful-thinking/ | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:01 xDaunt wrote: So I'm seeing a lot of commentary from liberal folks who are taking Fallon to task for not being hard on Trump. Am I missing something, or is taking out Trump not Fallon's job? All I saw was twitter exploding. Maybe libs around me saw it, maybe they didn't, maybe it's just Trump fatigue, but never registered. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:57 LegalLord wrote: Everyone has terrible supporters who go too far. A lot has been said about Trump's less pleasant supporters. Bernie had the Bernie Bros who were not that great. Hillary is not without her own bad supporters. Whether said candidate enabled and encouraged said supporters, is the real question of interest. Exactly, and there's no doubt that the Clintons are well-versed in clandestinely spreading rumors such that they don't appear to be the source of the rumors. Higher level politicians do this all of the time. And it's not like Hillary ever came out and expressly denied it during the 2008 campaign (not to my recollection anyway). | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46686 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:57 zeo wrote: Just because she didn't specifically state it doesn't mean she isn't responsible. Her rhetoric goaded her supporters into making a big deal out of it. In other words, Trump is responsible for the KKK. Got it, thanks. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States46686 Posts
On September 17 2016 01:51 xDaunt wrote: Saying that it is a "lie" that Hillary started the birther movement is kinda like saying that it is a "lie" that Hillary did anything illegal with her emails. Her campaign repeatedly smeared Obama as being a Muslim/foreigner/other and drafted memos highlighting this strategy. To the extent that her campaign in 2008 was not explicitly responsible for the birther movement, the birther movement very clearly was the product of her supporters taking the Hillary campaign's attacks to the next level. Long story short, while there's a conspiracy theory element to the claim that Hillary started the birther movement, it's not entirely divorced from reality. And I note that many of these "fact checks" on this claim omit what Hillary's campaign actually did. No, it's an actual lie, period. And why would Trump want to perpetuate the birther issue anymore? It's only hurting him- not hurting Hillary. He should have said "I made a mistake; Obama was born in America". We all know that he's incapable of apologizing, so I was even fine with him saying "Obama was born in America; let's move on". But for him to say that it was Hillary's fault- when everyone knows that he's the only one pushing that stupid shit over and over again- was just a bad move on his part in my opinion. Hillary never said it, and is Trump really admitting that he was fooled by some Democratic (and Republican) supporters into thinking Obama wasn't born in America? How gullible can he be? He read it on the internet, so it must be true... | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
The media showed up to the presidential ballroom of the new Trump International Hotel on Friday morning expecting Donald Trump to take questions about whether he still questions if President Obama was born in the United States. Instead, they got more than a half hour of a variety of military heroes — generals, medal of honor recipients and a gold star wife — expressing support for the Republican nominee. And it all aired live on the cable news networks. Before the event, Trump tweeted: “I am now going to the brand new Trump International, Hotel D.C. for a major statement.” That was interpreted by the press to mean he was going to address “birther questions.” .... Realizing Trump was not using the occasion to address that subject — and instead focus it on the military — many in the press were not happy — and vented on Twitter. Source. Hilarious. | ||
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