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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 4793

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Slaughter
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States20254 Posts
August 22 2016 03:17 GMT
#95841
To be fair didn't Trump have some physician basically put out some stupidly worded thing about his health?

I don't know why you link her lack of press conferences as a suspicious for her health, She still goes out and talks in public, she just hasn't done press conferences for whatever reason.
Never Knows Best.
IvanTheTerrible
Profile Joined May 2016
5 Posts
August 22 2016 03:20 GMT
#95842
When Mccain was running his health was a valid concern but Hillary's health is just right wing conspiracy theories.... The health of any candidate is a valid concern and Hillary clearly has some issues and again yes that does matter. Get ready for President Kaine...

It is especially relevant given that Huma Abedin said that Hillary has trouble concentrating and remembering issues so will she be able to do the job effectively? Hillary's handlers like Abedin and possibly even people like Kissinger might have more to do with government policy then she will. That then raises the question regarding who are these people and are they good?

BTW her personal doctor says she's fine I don't trust that when she has a handler following her around with anti seizure meds and needs help just to walk up a staircase.. Its as believable as Trumps 'doctor' saying Trump is the healthiest man ever to run for president..
IvanTheTerrible
Profile Joined May 2016
5 Posts
August 22 2016 03:22 GMT
#95843
As for the no press conference thing clearly Hillary doesn't want to face questions because many of them will be difficult to handle... Doing speeches is a different story she just reads it out and that's that so the message is completely controlled. I doubt Hillary would like to be asked questions about how she received bribes to sell Russian business American uranium reprocessing for example (lol)..
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42598 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-22 03:24:13
August 22 2016 03:23 GMT
#95844
On August 22 2016 12:17 Slaughter wrote:
To be fair didn't Trump have some physician basically put out some stupidly worded thing about his health?

I don't know why you link her lack of press conferences as a suspicious for her health, She still goes out and talks in public, she just hasn't done press conferences for whatever reason.

A bunch of psychiatrists tried to diagnose Trump and it got to the point that the APA had to send out a memo basically saying to shut the fuck up unless you've actually treated him.
https://www.psychiatry.org/news-room/apa-blogs/apa-blog/2016/08/the-goldwater-rule
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
hunts
Profile Joined September 2010
United States2113 Posts
August 22 2016 03:25 GMT
#95845
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richard-north-patterson/too-sick-to-lead-the-leth_b_10086768.html

It appears donald trump is unfit to lead due to mental illness. Given how useful leaked emails and random non doctor celebrity's testimonies were in determining hilary is sick, I think this evidence is enough to force trump to drop out, right guys?
twitch.tv/huntstv 7x legend streamer
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
August 22 2016 03:25 GMT
#95846
On August 22 2016 12:16 LegalLord wrote:
Trying to speculate about what "mental illness" someone has is almost always a stupid game of mudslinging anyways.

Like I said, it's the same shit that happened before when people were armchair-psychoanalyzing Trump.

It was stupid then, and it's stupid now.
Moderator
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States5570 Posts
August 22 2016 03:35 GMT
#95847
On August 22 2016 08:04 puerk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 06:33 oBlade wrote:
On August 22 2016 05:26 puerk wrote:
On August 22 2016 03:40 oBlade wrote:
On August 21 2016 18:30 puerk wrote:
just to clarify about the reuninfication: gorbachov is not a country.

Gorbachev is not a country. What a revelation. Only our parents' generation vividly remembers the day Ze Great Kimunikvator stood up to the president of the traditionally hard-line US and said "Komrade Reagans, teer down zis voll." Reunification didn't just happen by accident, it took diplomacy on the part of the US to make it happen both with the USSR, Poland that didn't want to get "breathing room"ed again, and those in NATO that were actually apprehensive about supporting a sovereign Germany.


Your understanding of the forces leading to reunification are so obnoxiously bad it hurts.
I am from Leipzig. I was born in the GDR, my parents protested in 1989 and were part of church organized groups, and understandably afraid, that there would be repeats of 1953, 68 or Tian'anmen.

The reunification happened because of the bravery of demonstrating people in the streets, the sowjet decision not to send tanks again as they did before, and the decision of the outnumbered police and secret police to not slaughter the 70000 people protesting peacefully on the 9.10.1989.

Reagan had no influence on those people. None at all. The people in power and responsible that it didn't turn into a bloodbath, looked to the east for guidance, not across the ocean. The Kremlin not sending troops, and not ordering a violent crackdown on protests, was vital, but it was inaction that allowed local action to succeed not action inspired by reagan or what ever you imagine in your purposefully ridiculous version of history you wrote.

Maybe this helps you understand: http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/09/lets-please-stop-crediting-ronald-reagan-for-the-fall-of-the-berlin-wall/262647/

but i doubt it judging your post history.

You said in a one-liner something to the effect of Gorbachev reunified the country and I was mocking you. You now thought that I was the one representing the literal claim that everything good in the world is directly owed to Ronald Reagan? He wasn't even president. The things you are describing are not historical accidents that just happened to result in a smooth reunification. Gorbachev didn't set out to gift-wrap East Germany to NATO and do everything in his power to weaken the Soviet sphere. Yes, it started with the people. But that isn't the whole story or you're doing a disservice to everyone who protests in the name of democracy and self-determination and fails to get it. Like the Czechs under the USSR. The protests and mass migration were an opportunity seized by the Bush administration.

We owe deep gratitude to President Bush, Secretary of State Baker and the US negotiating team headed by Robert Zoellick. Without their commitment and determination German unification would not have been brought about. The “Treaty on the Final Settlement with respect to Germany” has stood the test of time.

Dieter Kastrup, Director General for Political Affairs, West Germany, 1988-1990

Saying that:
"I just think the country that brought East and West Germany together can do better."
is still totally wrong..

So I see you disagree with Kastrup.

On August 22 2016 08:04 puerk wrote:
but you apparently can never concede, when you are wrong about stuff, you do not know very much about, then you get defensive and mock people with accents... as if that constitutes an argument and get even more defensive if you get called out for your contentless post...

You posted "just to clarify about the reuninfication: gorbachov is not a country." and are presuming to take me to task for posting without content.

On August 22 2016 08:04 puerk wrote:
the country that brought germany together was germany not the us.
and even gorbachov had a bigger role than any american politicians....

Erasing the US from the picture, Germany firstly would have been unified under communism, but anyway:
-If divided, wouldn't have been reunified due to bilateral opposition
-If reunified, wouldn't have been sovereign
-If sovereign, would have been neutral/wouldn't have been in NATO due to Soviet opposition to the eastward creep
You can't look after the fact and go oh, this thing happened, therefore it was historically inevitable, so this party doesn't get any credit for its success. There were many and rapid Two Plus Four negotiations by the State department. There were multiple presidential summits. That's Gorbachev and Bush. Not Gorbachev and himself. I brought this up in the context of US foreign policy successes, which I want to see more of. How is this controversial, because I trespassed on German national honor? I'm sure "Germany" in some sense had more to do with its own reunification than the US did. That's almost trivially true.
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
August 22 2016 03:53 GMT
#95848
On August 22 2016 12:17 Slaughter wrote:
To be fair didn't Trump have some physician basically put out some stupidly worded thing about his health?

I don't know why you link her lack of press conferences as a suspicious for her health, She still goes out and talks in public, she just hasn't done press conferences for whatever reason.

Yes, it was filled with typos starting from the header being “To Whom My Concern”

https://assets.donaldjtrump.com/Health_Record.pdf


Like, there's no way an actual doctor wrote that note - the lab results were "astonishingly excellent." wtf?
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42598 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-22 04:03:46
August 22 2016 04:02 GMT
#95849
On August 22 2016 12:53 Nevuk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 12:17 Slaughter wrote:
To be fair didn't Trump have some physician basically put out some stupidly worded thing about his health?

I don't know why you link her lack of press conferences as a suspicious for her health, She still goes out and talks in public, she just hasn't done press conferences for whatever reason.

Yes, it was filled with typos starting from the header being “To Whom My Concern”

https://assets.donaldjtrump.com/Health_Record.pdf


Like, there's no way an actual doctor wrote that note - the lab results were "astonishingly excellent." wtf?

Degree in Medicine from Trump University perhaps?
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23209 Posts
August 22 2016 05:13 GMT
#95850
Well the physician is obviously lying, I've seen people in their 70's that are in "excellent health" and they don't constantly need something to sit on or help up stairs and stuff. She's quite obviously not in "excellent health".

That said, I'm not convinced it's anything super serious that would prevent her from serving but please stop with pretending you all can just wave it away with "but her doctor said" and "but it's infowars an /r/thedonald"

Reagan, and Cheney's doctors said they were in excellent health too. Fine if you think Hillary is the best option we have, but can we not pretend that she's in "excellent health" because her doctor said so?

Think Michael Jackson proved you can get doctors to say or do just about anything (like anyone else for enough money).
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Thieving Magpie
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States6752 Posts
August 22 2016 05:15 GMT
#95851
On August 22 2016 12:22 IvanTheTerrible wrote:
As for the no press conference thing clearly Hillary doesn't want to face questions because many of them will be difficult to handle... Doing speeches is a different story she just reads it out and that's that so the message is completely controlled. I doubt Hillary would like to be asked questions about how she received bribes to sell Russian business American uranium reprocessing for example (lol)..


Hillary doesn't want to do press conferences since her opponent is doing fine destroying his reputation as is. If you're opponent is hurting himself, the best course of action is to let him.

She just needs to be visible enough so people know she's someone you vote for to beat Trump. If people liked Trump, then she would need to get out there and get ahead. But with her being 85% favored right now, putting herself out there does nothing but hurt her chances.

Its not fear, its strategy.
Hark, what baseball through yonder window breaks?
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-22 05:27:52
August 22 2016 05:27 GMT
#95852
It really blows my mind that a thinking conservative could look at Trump and not conclude that he's fatally flawed as a prospective president. If they didn't have such a strong preconceived opinion of the media, I have a feeling they would discount him pretty quickly.
zeo
Profile Joined October 2009
Serbia6284 Posts
August 22 2016 08:50 GMT
#95853
On August 22 2016 11:09 Nyxisto wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 11:05 xDaunt wrote:
It doesn't take a genius to see that Hillary has health problems. She very clearly has suffered from some sort of cognitive disorder, though we can only speculate as to its nature and severity.


Her Health records are public, she's had a concussion years ago but is otherwise healthy. Are you kidding?

Oh please, like millionaires can't hide their health conditions. Just pay a doctor to come privately off the books.

Are health records really public in the US?
"If only Kircheis were here" - Everyone
Ghostcom
Profile Joined March 2010
Denmark4782 Posts
August 22 2016 09:20 GMT
#95854
Health records are NOT public in the US. Their HIPAA and PIPA are probably the most strictly enforced in the world. That being said, a person can of course always decide to themselves publish their healthrecords - I've no idea whether or not Hillary did that.
ragz_gt
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
9172 Posts
August 22 2016 10:50 GMT
#95855
I don't think she did, or why she would.
Health record has a lot of stuff in there that's no one's business.
I'm not an otaku, I'm a specialist.
puerk
Profile Joined February 2015
Germany855 Posts
August 22 2016 11:31 GMT
#95856
On August 22 2016 12:35 oBlade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 08:04 puerk wrote:
On August 22 2016 06:33 oBlade wrote:
On August 22 2016 05:26 puerk wrote:
On August 22 2016 03:40 oBlade wrote:
On August 21 2016 18:30 puerk wrote:
just to clarify about the reuninfication: gorbachov is not a country.

Gorbachev is not a country. What a revelation. Only our parents' generation vividly remembers the day Ze Great Kimunikvator stood up to the president of the traditionally hard-line US and said "Komrade Reagans, teer down zis voll." Reunification didn't just happen by accident, it took diplomacy on the part of the US to make it happen both with the USSR, Poland that didn't want to get "breathing room"ed again, and those in NATO that were actually apprehensive about supporting a sovereign Germany.


Your understanding of the forces leading to reunification are so obnoxiously bad it hurts.
I am from Leipzig. I was born in the GDR, my parents protested in 1989 and were part of church organized groups, and understandably afraid, that there would be repeats of 1953, 68 or Tian'anmen.

The reunification happened because of the bravery of demonstrating people in the streets, the sowjet decision not to send tanks again as they did before, and the decision of the outnumbered police and secret police to not slaughter the 70000 people protesting peacefully on the 9.10.1989.

Reagan had no influence on those people. None at all. The people in power and responsible that it didn't turn into a bloodbath, looked to the east for guidance, not across the ocean. The Kremlin not sending troops, and not ordering a violent crackdown on protests, was vital, but it was inaction that allowed local action to succeed not action inspired by reagan or what ever you imagine in your purposefully ridiculous version of history you wrote.

Maybe this helps you understand: http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/09/lets-please-stop-crediting-ronald-reagan-for-the-fall-of-the-berlin-wall/262647/

but i doubt it judging your post history.

You said in a one-liner something to the effect of Gorbachev reunified the country and I was mocking you. You now thought that I was the one representing the literal claim that everything good in the world is directly owed to Ronald Reagan? He wasn't even president. The things you are describing are not historical accidents that just happened to result in a smooth reunification. Gorbachev didn't set out to gift-wrap East Germany to NATO and do everything in his power to weaken the Soviet sphere. Yes, it started with the people. But that isn't the whole story or you're doing a disservice to everyone who protests in the name of democracy and self-determination and fails to get it. Like the Czechs under the USSR. The protests and mass migration were an opportunity seized by the Bush administration.

We owe deep gratitude to President Bush, Secretary of State Baker and the US negotiating team headed by Robert Zoellick. Without their commitment and determination German unification would not have been brought about. The “Treaty on the Final Settlement with respect to Germany” has stood the test of time.

Dieter Kastrup, Director General for Political Affairs, West Germany, 1988-1990

Saying that:
"I just think the country that brought East and West Germany together can do better."
is still totally wrong..

So I see you disagree with Kastrup.

Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 08:04 puerk wrote:
but you apparently can never concede, when you are wrong about stuff, you do not know very much about, then you get defensive and mock people with accents... as if that constitutes an argument and get even more defensive if you get called out for your contentless post...

You posted "just to clarify about the reuninfication: gorbachov is not a country." and are presuming to take me to task for posting without content.

Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 08:04 puerk wrote:
the country that brought germany together was germany not the us.
and even gorbachov had a bigger role than any american politicians....

Erasing the US from the picture, Germany firstly would have been unified under communism, but anyway:
-If divided, wouldn't have been reunified due to bilateral opposition
-If reunified, wouldn't have been sovereign
-If sovereign, would have been neutral/wouldn't have been in NATO due to Soviet opposition to the eastward creep
You can't look after the fact and go oh, this thing happened, therefore it was historically inevitable, so this party doesn't get any credit for its success. There were many and rapid Two Plus Four negotiations by the State department. There were multiple presidential summits. That's Gorbachev and Bush. Not Gorbachev and himself. I brought this up in the context of US foreign policy successes, which I want to see more of. How is this controversial, because I trespassed on German national honor? I'm sure "Germany" in some sense had more to do with its own reunification than the US did. That's almost trivially true.


You are still not getting it: yes the us played a role, they were the 3rd most important country to the reunification. Which is pretty important considering there were like 180 more countries down the list. But your statement that the US reunified Germany is still stupid, and your refusal to drop it speaks for itself.
zeo
Profile Joined October 2009
Serbia6284 Posts
August 22 2016 11:59 GMT
#95857
On August 22 2016 19:50 ragz_gt wrote:
I don't think she did, or why she would.
Health record has a lot of stuff in there that's no one's business.

If you want to be the president of the United States possibly having brain damage is something people should know about. No?

I guess its only fair to make an issue about health records if your target is a Republican:

"If only Kircheis were here" - Everyone
ragz_gt
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
9172 Posts
August 22 2016 12:09 GMT
#95858
I don't recall asking for McCain's health record, or any person's health record for that matter, but whatever floats your boat.
I'm not an otaku, I'm a specialist.
Liquid`Drone
Profile Joined September 2002
Norway28654 Posts
August 22 2016 12:56 GMT
#95859
This is a completely ridiculous fabricated attack. There's a picture of her being helped up some stairs, and people are extrapolating this picture to mean that she is physically unfit to be president? what? Your arguably best president of the past century (you may absolutely feel free to disagree with this assessment, whether he was the best or just 'good' is irrelevant) was a paraplegic.

Releasing health records in the name of transparency, meh, I don't really object to that as a principle, with the caveat that only some health issues are relevant. An STD for example should not matter at all, but yeah, I'd like to know about strokes or heart attacks or cancer or diseases somewhat likely to kill or severely impair the candidate within the next 4 years. I do however think that from that angle, tax returns are just as important (and that is an actually established principle, unlike health records), and thus it becomes a bit silly for Trump supporters to be okay with him failing to release those but harping on wanting Clinton's health records.
Moderator
PassiveAce
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States18076 Posts
August 22 2016 13:00 GMT
#95860
good thing trump is the picture of health

+ Show Spoiler +
(skip to 4:20)

Call me Marge Simpson cuz I love you homie
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