|
Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this.
I'm surprised you weren't instantly convinced by the great argument "Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration."
On May 09 2016 07:56 On_Slaught wrote:
By November, Trump will be more liberal/leftist than Hillary.
No, he really won't. He'll go for a couple of tentative nods to the left (like he's currently doing with regards to the minimum wage) in addition to his populist stance on trade, but that won't make him more progressive that Hillary.
|
On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this.
Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world.
Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch.
Trumps base is real and growing rapidly.
|
On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly.
You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans?
You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world."
|
re: testie
Actually getting those jobs back is not feasible.
Nor is his immigration plan.
Energizing people by promising things you can't deliver isn't very helpful.
I agree zero's post wasn't high quality, but you didn't have much of a sound basis for many your claims about trump either.
|
On May 09 2016 08:09 kwizach wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. I'm surprised you weren't instantly convinced by the great argument "Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration." Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 07:56 On_Slaught wrote:
By November, Trump will be more liberal/leftist than Hillary. No, he really won't. He'll go for a couple of tentative nods to the left (like he's currently doing with regards to the minimum wage) in addition to his populist stance on trade, but that won't make him more progressive that Hillary.
A couple, huh?
- Keep Planned Parenthood open
- Transgender to be able to use any bathroom they want
- Raise taxes on the rich/close loop holes they use
- Iraq war bad
- Anti Free Trade
- Stop US from policing the world (so much for the party of Tear Down this Wall)
- Back out of NATO, a major buffer between the West and Russia
- Threaten US companies to pay more or get essentially tariffs on their goods
- Wants to create a new national healthcare system, keeping it a federal issue
- Just hired Steven Mnunchin to be his Financial Chief
- Doesn't go to church, nor has he ever asked forgivness (sadly this matters)
- Eminent Domain good
- Is against a Flat Tax
- Subsidies for Ethanol
- Isn't Anti-Palestine enough
- Thinks affirmative action is ok
- Doesn't want to cut social security or medicare
This isn't even counting all the positions he has been "liberal" on for his entire life, save the last 6 months when he changed them (for now).
Conservatives voting for a megalomaniac doesn't surprise me in the least. Voting for a liberal one does.
|
On May 09 2016 08:17 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly. You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans? You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world."
When you say mobs of pure hatred, are you referring to his supporters or protesters? Have you watched one of his campaign rallies?
On May 09 2016 07:56 On_Slaught wrote:
By November, Trump will be more liberal/leftist than Hillary.
Double whammy of stupidity from conservative voters. Voting for somebody who is uniquely unqualified to be President based solely on demeanor and temperament, as well as voting for somebody who is overtly not Conservative.
In that case it should be good news for him in the general election if he picks up a lot of voters from the left.
|
On May 09 2016 08:17 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly. You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans? You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world."
This shitty little narrative has no basis in reality. It's rather old and tiresome.
|
On May 09 2016 08:17 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly. You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans? You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world."
The only mobs we saw were Bernies crowd of "highly educated" voters. I've seen at least 3 ambulances blocked on video and massive irrational and immature behavior. Trumps crowds conduct themselves like good human beings with the exception of like 2 guys who punched some assholes who came to disrupt the events.
You post this nonsense and want to pretend you're oh so mighty and intelligent? Get real.
|
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:09 kwizach wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. I'm surprised you weren't instantly convinced by the great argument "Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration." On May 09 2016 07:56 On_Slaught wrote:
By November, Trump will be more liberal/leftist than Hillary. No, he really won't. He'll go for a couple of tentative nods to the left (like he's currently doing with regards to the minimum wage) in addition to his populist stance on trade, but that won't make him more progressive that Hillary. A couple, huh? - Raise taxes on the rich/close loop holes they use Under his tax plan, the rich actually get taxed less.
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Anti Free Trade
- Stop US from policing the world (so much for the party of Tear Down this Wall)
- Back out of NATO, a major buffer between the West and Russia Not liberal/progressive stances but protectionist/slightly isolationist stances.
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Subsidies for Ethanol
- Doesn't go to church, nor has he ever asked forgivness (sadly this matters)
- Just hired Steven Mnunchin to be his Financial Chief
- Eminent Domain good Not progressive stances in themselves.
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Is against a Flat Tax Plenty of people on the right are against a flat tax. It's a retarded idea embraced by demagogues like Cruz.
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Iraq war bad That came after the start of the war, but ok. Plenty of right-wingers were against the war from the start, though (see the letter to the Bush administration penned by realist scholars in 2002).
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Threaten US companies to pay more or get essentially tariffs on their goods Not really sure how to characterize this. It's a rhetorical position he probably hasn't put a good deal of thought in.
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Wants to create a new national healthcare system, keeping it a federal issue That's not on his website, which actually advocates repealing the ACA and "reducing our dependence on public health programs". He's been all over the place on the issue, though, so his stance will probably keep "evolving".
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Isn't Anti-Palestine enough I guess.
On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Keep Planned Parenthood open
- Transgender to be able to use any bathroom they want
- Thinks affirmative action is ok
- Doesn't want to cut social security or medicare On affirmative action, he's said "I don't think we need it so much anymore". But yeah, he's closer to the center or the left on these issues than most Republicans. That won't make him more progressive than Hillary come November.
|
On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html
So this was intended to be a serious post? I thought this was still satire.
The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police.
Like shooting them or their children when they call them for help.
people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is
Must be nice to live in that reality.
|
On May 09 2016 08:51 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:17 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly. You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans? You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world." This shitty little narrative has no basis in reality. It's rather old and tiresome.
World leaders are expressing concern over his remarks, particularly South Korea and Japan. There's also all of the people, foreign and domestic, who express that the state of US politics has become a circus and that as Trump moves further and further along the election process, the standing of the US is dwindling lower and lower. Also, when you're running for the highest political office of the nation, it would be best to have some kind of actual data and plan for foreign policy, unemployment, social services, infrastructure rehabilitation, trade policies, healthcare, and education.
I've yet to read or hear anything that resembles a coherent and concrete idea from him that I can nod and think, "Okay, not bad Trump, not bad."
|
On May 09 2016 08:57 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:17 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly. You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans? You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world." The only mobs we saw were Bernies crowd of "highly educated" voters. I've seen at least 3 ambulances blocked on video and massive irrational and immature behavior. Trumps crowds conduct themselves like good human beings with the exception of like 2 guys who punched some assholes who came to disrupt the events. You post this nonsense and want to pretend you're oh so mighty and intelligent? Get real.
When you have two Muslim people escorted out of your rally for wearing stars as he has suggested, that's not really a good human being. When you have people openly hating any foreigner that isn't anglo-saxon, then that's not really being a good human being.
Trump Rally Violence Becomes Trend
I went through 5 pages of youtube videos to find one against Bernie Sanders but nothing besides the Chicago protests.
EDIT: And no, I don't come off as "oh so might and intelligent." I'm giving you my thoughts on the matter.
|
+ Show Spoiler +On May 09 2016 08:58 kwizach wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:On May 09 2016 08:09 kwizach wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. I'm surprised you weren't instantly convinced by the great argument "Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration." On May 09 2016 07:56 On_Slaught wrote:
By November, Trump will be more liberal/leftist than Hillary. No, he really won't. He'll go for a couple of tentative nods to the left (like he's currently doing with regards to the minimum wage) in addition to his populist stance on trade, but that won't make him more progressive that Hillary. A couple, huh? - Raise taxes on the rich/close loop holes they use Under his tax plan, the rich actually get taxed less. Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Anti Free Trade
- Stop US from policing the world (so much for the party of Tear Down this Wall)
- Back out of NATO, a major buffer between the West and Russia Not liberal/progressive stances but protectionist/slightly isolationist stances. Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Subsidies for Ethanol
- Doesn't go to church, nor has he ever asked forgivness (sadly this matters)
- Just hired Steven Mnunchin to be his Financial Chief
- Eminent Domain good Not progressive stances in themselves. Plenty of people on the right are against a flat tax. It's a retarded idea embraced by demagogues like Cruz. That came after the start of the war, but ok. Plenty of right-wingers were against the war from the start, though (see the letter to the Bush administration penned by realist scholars in 2002). Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Threaten US companies to pay more or get essentially tariffs on their goods Not really sure how to characterize this. It's a rhetorical position he probably hasn't put a good deal of thought in. Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Wants to create a new national healthcare system, keeping it a federal issue That's not on his website, which actually advocates repealing the ACA and "reducing our dependence on public health programs". He's been all over the place on the issue, though, so his stance will probably keep "evolving". I guess. Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Keep Planned Parenthood open
- Transgender to be able to use any bathroom they want
- Thinks affirmative action is ok
- Doesn't want to cut social security or medicare On affirmative action, he's said "I don't think we need it so much anymore". But yeah, he's closer to the center or the left on these issues than most Republicans. That won't make him more progressive than Hillary come November.
1. "Under his tax plan, the rich actually get taxed less."
- Trump has undermined this policy position in literally the last 48 hours. + Show Spoiler +http://www.businessinsider.com/chuck-todd-donald-trump-tax-plan-meet-the-press-2016-5
"This Week" host George Stephanopoulos pushed Trump to answer whether taxes on high-income earners will rise under a Trump administration.
"They will go up a little bit," Trump said.
"But they're going down in your plan," Stephanopoulos said.
"In my plan they're going down, but by the time it's negotiated, they'll go up," Trump replied. "Look, when I'm negotiating with the Democrats, I'm putting in a plan. I'm putting in my optimum plan."
2 & 3. "Not liberal stances, but protectionist/slightly isolationist."
- Fair enough. Rather than calling them liberal, I'll call them "Anti-Conservative."
4. "Plenty of people on the right are against a flat tax. It's a retarded idea embraced by demagogues like Cruz."
- The fact is it is an idea supported only by one side of the equation, even if not everyone on that side agrees. There is a not insignificant group of the right this is at odds with.
5. "That came after the start of the war, but ok. Plenty of right-wingers were against the war from the start, though (see the letter to the Bush administration penned by realist scholars in 2002)."
- He is using an argument used exclusively by the left for over a decade. This is a direct assault on the last Republican President.
6. "Not really sure how to characterize this. It's a rhetorical position he probably hasn't put a good deal of thought in."
- What a dangerous revelation that must be his supporters then. That an issue of such importance and with such obvious repercussions is one flippantly discussed by a Presidential Nominee. He's put in enough thought that (likely; talk to the NYT) calling and threatening US CEOs would be one of the first things he did in his 100 days in office.
7. "That's not on his website, which actually advocates repealing the ACA and "reducing our dependence on public health programs". He's been all over the place on the issue, though, so his stance will probably keep "evolving"."
- I never said he wouldn't repeal the ACA. I"m saying he wants to replace it with another federal program, whereas the conservative line is that it should be run by the states.
8. "I guess" (on Palestine).
- Turns out this is also a pretty important issue to Conservatives (god knows why).
9. "On affirmative action, he's said "I don't think we need it so much anymore". But yeah, he's closer to the center or the left on these issues than most Republicans. That won't make him more progressive than Hillary come November."
- I"m confused by your refusal to use the word Liberal. How do you differentiate between a liberal and a progressive?
|
Arguing with Testie (or most Trump supporters) is ultimately pointless because the two parties are not talking about the same person. Even Trump supporters themselves are not talking about the same person a lot of the time. Even people that dislike Trump are often talking about different people in their discussions with one another.
Any time Trump says something or mentions a policy a Trump supporter likes, he's speaking from his heart.
Any time Trump says something they don't like or that doesn't fit with the Trump they've created in their mind, he's being tactical.
Every nonsense policy is a smokescreen. Unless they like it, in which case it's a sketch he'll fill in later. It's a pretty good way to run public relations.
|
On May 09 2016 09:25 TheTenthDoc wrote:
Arguing with Testie (or most Trump supporters) is ultimately pointless because the two parties are not talking about the same person. Even Trump supporters themselves are not talking about the same person a lot of the time. Even people that dislike Trump are often talking about different people in their discussions with one another.
Any time Trump says something or mentions a policy a Trump supporter likes, he's speaking from his heart.
Any time Trump says something they don't like or that doesn't fit with the Trump they've created in their mind, he's being tactical.
Every nonsense policy is a smokescreen. Unless they like it, in which case it's a sketch he'll fill in later. It's a pretty good way to run public relations.
I think most people like that they can be openly ignorant, bigoted, racist, hypocritical, or whatever because he's a public figure and they "relate" to him. I don't see how any of his policies will work out in the long run.
But you're right. I'm going to just remove myself from the discussion.
|
On May 09 2016 09:21 On_Slaught wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On May 09 2016 08:58 kwizach wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:On May 09 2016 08:09 kwizach wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. I'm surprised you weren't instantly convinced by the great argument "Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration." On May 09 2016 07:56 On_Slaught wrote:
By November, Trump will be more liberal/leftist than Hillary. No, he really won't. He'll go for a couple of tentative nods to the left (like he's currently doing with regards to the minimum wage) in addition to his populist stance on trade, but that won't make him more progressive that Hillary. A couple, huh? - Raise taxes on the rich/close loop holes they use Under his tax plan, the rich actually get taxed less. Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Anti Free Trade
- Stop US from policing the world (so much for the party of Tear Down this Wall)
- Back out of NATO, a major buffer between the West and Russia Not liberal/progressive stances but protectionist/slightly isolationist stances. Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Subsidies for Ethanol
- Doesn't go to church, nor has he ever asked forgivness (sadly this matters)
- Just hired Steven Mnunchin to be his Financial Chief
- Eminent Domain good Not progressive stances in themselves. Plenty of people on the right are against a flat tax. It's a retarded idea embraced by demagogues like Cruz. That came after the start of the war, but ok. Plenty of right-wingers were against the war from the start, though (see the letter to the Bush administration penned by realist scholars in 2002). Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Threaten US companies to pay more or get essentially tariffs on their goods Not really sure how to characterize this. It's a rhetorical position he probably hasn't put a good deal of thought in. Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Wants to create a new national healthcare system, keeping it a federal issue That's not on his website, which actually advocates repealing the ACA and "reducing our dependence on public health programs". He's been all over the place on the issue, though, so his stance will probably keep "evolving". I guess. Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:30 On_Slaught wrote:
- Keep Planned Parenthood open
- Transgender to be able to use any bathroom they want
- Thinks affirmative action is ok
- Doesn't want to cut social security or medicare On affirmative action, he's said "I don't think we need it so much anymore". But yeah, he's closer to the center or the left on these issues than most Republicans. That won't make him more progressive than Hillary come November. 1. "Under his tax plan, the rich actually get taxed less." - Trump has undermined this policy position in literally the last 48 hours. + Show Spoiler +http://www.businessinsider.com/chuck-todd-donald-trump-tax-plan-meet-the-press-2016-5 "This Week" host George Stephanopoulos pushed Trump to answer whether taxes on high-income earners will rise under a Trump administration. "They will go up a little bit," Trump said. "But they're going down in your plan," Stephanopoulos said. "In my plan they're going down, but by the time it's negotiated, they'll go up," Trump replied. "Look, when I'm negotiating with the Democrats, I'm putting in a plan. I'm putting in my optimum plan."
So he's not defending higher taxes on the rich. He's saying he wants them to go down, but because Democrats want them to go up and he wants to make a deal, they'll go up slightly. In any way, he's inventing positions as he goes along. The only plan he's put forward has taxes on the rich going down.
On May 09 2016 09:21 On_Slaught wrote:
4. "Plenty of people on the right are against a flat tax. It's a retarded idea embraced by demagogues like Cruz."
- The fact is it is an idea supported only by one side of the equation, even if not everyone on that side agrees. There is a not insignificant group of the right this is at odds with.
We'll, you're right but I wouldn't say that not wanting a flat tax is a left-wing position, and it would certainly not make him more liberal than Hillary. If you compare their current tax proposals, hers are significantly more progressive (literally).
On May 09 2016 09:21 On_Slaught wrote:
7. "That's not on his website, which actually advocates repealing the ACA and "reducing our dependence on public health programs". He's been all over the place on the issue, though, so his stance will probably keep "evolving"."
- I never said he wouldn't repeal the ACA. I"m saying he wants to replace it with another federal program, whereas the conservative line is that it should be run by the states.
What federal program does he want to replace it with? I haven't found any mention of this in his healthcare proposals on his website.
On May 09 2016 09:21 On_Slaught wrote:
9. "On affirmative action, he's said "I don't think we need it so much anymore". But yeah, he's closer to the center or the left on these issues than most Republicans. That won't make him more progressive than Hillary come November."
- I"m confused by your refusal to use the word Liberal. How do you differentiate between a liberal and a progressive?
I didn't mean to specifically avoid using it. I'm just saying I disagree with the idea that he will be to the left of Hillary overall come November.
|
On May 09 2016 09:00 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 08:51 xDaunt wrote:On May 09 2016 08:17 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. Donald Trump, the presumptive GOP nominee, said Sunday that "people have to get more," after spending time on the campaign trail striking down the possibility of a minimum wage hike.
"I am looking at it, and I haven't decided in terms of numbers. But I think people have to get more," Trump said on ABC News' "This Week."
Trump has said that the wages were too high in the country, notably at a debate in November. Trump told ABC host George that it was a different opinion than previously expressed.
"Sure, it's a change. I'm allowed to change," he said. "But my real minimum wage is going to be — I'm going to bring companies back into this country, and they're going to make a lot more than the $15 even." Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly. You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans? You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world." This shitty little narrative has no basis in reality. It's rather old and tiresome. World leaders are expressing concern over his remarks, particularly South Korea and Japan. There's also all of the people, foreign and domestic, who express that the state of US politics has become a circus and that as Trump moves further and further along the election process, the standing of the US is dwindling lower and lower. Also, when you're running for the highest political office of the nation, it would be best to have some kind of actual data and plan for foreign policy, unemployment, social services, infrastructure rehabilitation, trade policies, healthcare, and education. I've yet to read or hear anything that resembles a coherent and concrete idea from him that I can nod and think, "Okay, not bad Trump, not bad."
They are expressing concern because Trump is openly threatening their national interests with his foreign policy and trade policy statements.
|
On May 09 2016 09:37 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 09:00 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 08:51 xDaunt wrote:On May 09 2016 08:17 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. [quote] Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly. You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans? You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world." This shitty little narrative has no basis in reality. It's rather old and tiresome. World leaders are expressing concern over his remarks, particularly South Korea and Japan. There's also all of the people, foreign and domestic, who express that the state of US politics has become a circus and that as Trump moves further and further along the election process, the standing of the US is dwindling lower and lower. Also, when you're running for the highest political office of the nation, it would be best to have some kind of actual data and plan for foreign policy, unemployment, social services, infrastructure rehabilitation, trade policies, healthcare, and education. I've yet to read or hear anything that resembles a coherent and concrete idea from him that I can nod and think, "Okay, not bad Trump, not bad." They are expressing concern because Trump is openly threatening their national interests with his foreign policy and trade policy statements.
They are expression concern because he's unstable and utterly ignorant.
|
On May 09 2016 09:37 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2016 09:00 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 08:51 xDaunt wrote:On May 09 2016 08:17 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 08:13 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 08:01 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:On May 09 2016 07:42 SK.Testie wrote:On May 09 2016 05:04 Liquid`Drone wrote:On May 09 2016 04:10 Mohdoo wrote:On May 09 2016 02:47 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Conspiracy theory: Trump will slowly force the GOP to become more moderate in areas than the Democrats are. [quote] Source Donald trump is a new york Democrat. There's no two ways about it. People do not change as much as he claims to have. Not someone as thoughtful and intelligent as him. He's a thinker. He's used these talents in terrible ways, but I still view Donald as a very intelligent, thoughtful person who really wanted to be president and knew how to do it. If he wins, his presidency will be more liberal than Obama. Guaranteed. by what metric is he going to be more liberal than obama? more isolationist and protectionst are the only ones I can think of, and even those for entirely illiberal reasons. he's certainly far less liberal on all types of identity politics, abortion, taxation, crime, education, immigration, warfare. Health care I could conceivably see him shut down ACA for something more liberal based on things he has said in the past, but going by his webpage, he's not gonna try to implement single payer or whatever.. I can accept that conservatives would also be unhappy with him because he wouldn't be consistently anything, but I don't understand what Trump has said that makes you think he would be more liberal than Obama. Trump comes off as an idiot but he's absolutely brilliant. It shows time and time again not with the words he says, but with the results he gets and how he gets them. The man is fucking brilliant. His base absolutely loves a self identifying "dangerous faggot who completely loves black cock". They're clearly not serious about racism, sexism, and all that stupid crap the left keeps making an issue of. All the identity politics are fucking non-issues at this point in time. We have gay marriage, people really don't care what colour your fucking skin is, there's no more identity politics to push that's why this Trans thing feels so forced. We're talking about 0.04% of the population or some shit as if it's national news. It's not. If you're a man with a beard in a dress, you're not a national issue. The people that think this is a national issue are so out of tune with what is going on in the world. With abortion the issue is: "If it is against the law.. we punish people who break the law, correct? The law has to hold up". That's not an unreasonable issue. However, I really doubt he cares about that at all, abortion will stand. Taxation? Everyone keeps more of what they earn & smaller, smarter government. The government is extremely wasteful. There's countless examples to choose from but they aren't sexy so liberals don't pay attention. Former liberal here, guilty. Crime? He's right on crime. Let the police do their jobs. Bernie and Hillary are literally pandering to the black community and it makes no sense. "Stop overpolicing of black neighbourhoods". Ok, Chicago. Let's just let people murder each other. I've read all about police abuse and all about "overpolicing". The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. A lot of witness intimidation etc goes on as well, and an outing of someone who's against the tribe. Just put yourself in the position of a gang infested neighbourhood. Pretend you yourself are there. Think, as the person you are, if there's a person shot every 2.5 hours in your city... do you want less police? Bernie & Hillary are the actual racists on this issue. http://heyjackass.com/Education? I honestly don't know if he knows what he's talking about on common core, and this is an issue I'm ignorant of. I'm unsure if "the state should decide" is a good idea because maybe Texas will go gungho on creationism. Immigration? He's 100% correct on immigration. Warfare? No president is great on warfare, they all get briefed when they become president. I think he's fine on warfare. Healthcare? He's fine on. I was surprised to learn my black friends in the states HATE Obamacare. Really, really hate it. A lot. He's not lying about the "premiums" going up or w/e for them. I think that's probably on Republicans but Donald is not a Republican. Not the same type of "sell the country out" Republican you're used to. He's just a very intelligent businessman and he has destroyed the competition. Build wall, MAGA, deport illegals. "They're rapists." "Someone's doing the raping." http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/12/central-america-migrants-rape_n_5806972.html I've officially lost 10% of my brain cells reading this. Great post, high quality. You really made a clear point. If the world were full of snappy people like you, hot topic would be the most popular store in the world. Trump has energized a base of people of all different creeds whom are uniting on one message. "we want our shitty manufacturing jobs back and we'll be glad to work them". He's made people excited about just having a job. That's pretty ideal. The entire media attacked him, and failed. It's glorious to watch. Trumps base is real and growing rapidly. You're excited to see a man whip crowds of people into mobs of pure hatred and bigotry? You're clamoring and championing for a man who wants to not only alienate most of the world, but also those that live here, with his xenophobia and outrageous vitriolic remarks? You're amused by and praying for, a person who will divide this nation worse than the Civil War and WW2 against Japanese Americans? You are right though. He has energized a base of people. A base of people that shows the world just how shitty America really is and that we really aren't leaders of the "free world." This shitty little narrative has no basis in reality. It's rather old and tiresome. World leaders are expressing concern over his remarks, particularly South Korea and Japan. There's also all of the people, foreign and domestic, who express that the state of US politics has become a circus and that as Trump moves further and further along the election process, the standing of the US is dwindling lower and lower. Also, when you're running for the highest political office of the nation, it would be best to have some kind of actual data and plan for foreign policy, unemployment, social services, infrastructure rehabilitation, trade policies, healthcare, and education. I've yet to read or hear anything that resembles a coherent and concrete idea from him that I can nod and think, "Okay, not bad Trump, not bad." They are expressing concern because Trump is openly threatening their national interests with his foreign policy and trade policy statements.
or because they show a deep ignorance of the rest of the world's history and diplomatic situations.
|
On May 09 2016 08:59 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote + The good black people in these neighbourhoods want the police, but they're afraid of so many different things with the police. Like shooting them or their children when they call them for help.
Ok, seriously. Please check the numbers on police shootings and wrongful deaths vs the deaths in Chicago alone. Please don't pretend there isn't something seriously wrong that liberals are absolutely ignoring and making it 'not ok' to talk about. Less police in a gang infested neighbourhood is a terrible idea. There is serious witness intimidation in these areas and threats towards good people that need help. The only help they will get is from the police because liberals pretend to care but do nothing. Which is a very common theme among them. "I care so much! But I'll let someone else do it". 90% of the Chicago police department is voting for Trump for a reason. They saw Bernies crowd and how they acted and they saw Trumps crowd and how they acted.
So say there's 28 wrongful deaths of black men a year, vs how much violence they face actually. Again, heyjackass.com. This doesn't even include Baltimore, St. Louis, Detroit, and hundreds of smaller communities you liberals have heard nothing about. Bernies solution is pants on head retarded. There's police harassment that legit needs to be looked at like the cops who stopped the guy going to his job 278 times. Sadly that needs to be looked at on a micro case by case basis. When Bernie & Hillary tout the line of "systemic racism" they need to realize they are using the exact same mindset of actual racists. They are painting a large swath of people with a brush and discounting individuality.
What the MSM covers are actual outliers. There's real deaths on the BLM movement that are horrible. Eric Garner being one of them. Gentle Giant wasn't one of them however. Not separating these two hurt their movement considerably. That and lighting fires and rioting and blocking traffic.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
