• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 04:05
CEST 10:05
KST 17:05
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy9[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9
Community News
Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple2BSL Season 237Weekly Cups (Sep 7-12): SHIN, ByuN, MaxPax double down1StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon101Weekly Cups (Aug 30-Sep 7): herO thrives amid growing schism10
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool How do you feel about the StarCraft shooter announcement at BlizzCon 2026? The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser
Tourneys
Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 GSTL Announcement RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 544 Double Trouble The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 543 Enhanced Defenses Mutation # 542 The Ascended
Brood War
General
Bot on ladder PLAYzone Challenge - open offline tour in Prague BSL Season 23 BW General Discussion NaDa's Body
Tourneys
PLAYzone Challenge - open offline tour in Prague [ASL22] Ro8 Day 2 [ASL22] Ro16 Group D [ASL22] Ro8 Day 1
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Diablo IV Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine All you football fans (soccer)!
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The Creator Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Gaming Intensity, Problemati…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Dreaming of BW patches (mod…
c3rberUs
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7845 users

US Politics Mega-thread - Page 1251

Forum Index > Closed
Post a Reply
Prev 1 1249 1250 1251 1252 1253 10093 Next
Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44311 Posts
August 25 2014 19:03 GMT
#25001
For anyone interested in first hand US immigration experience I received provisional expedited right to work today. It took four months after filing for it and about six months of being in the US. I went through the quickest rush route possible as a GC can take years before finally being approved, depending upon the area and situation. This took various appointments and a guide to the system and how best to file it. So to immigrate legally under a family visa you'd need a middle class sponsor, about $3000 for forms and fees, six months living expenses, a job lined up once you get the right to work and familiarity with the system.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States24361 Posts
August 25 2014 19:52 GMT
#25002
On August 26 2014 04:03 KwarK wrote:
For anyone interested in first hand US immigration experience I received provisional expedited right to work today. It took four months after filing for it and about six months of being in the US. I went through the quickest rush route possible as a GC can take years before finally being approved, depending upon the area and situation. This took various appointments and a guide to the system and how best to file it. So to immigrate legally under a family visa you'd need a middle class sponsor, about $3000 for forms and fees, six months living expenses, a job lined up once you get the right to work and familiarity with the system.


6 months living expenses without a job? And $3k....

Fewer than one in four Americans have enough money in their savings account to cover at least six months of expenses, enough to help cushion the blow of a job loss, medical emergency or some other unexpected event, according to the survey of 1,000 adults. Meanwhile, 50% of those surveyed have less than a three-month cushion and 27% had no savings at all.


Source

So to come try to 'live the American dream' you have to be already doing better than 70%+ of Americans?
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Velr
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Switzerland10954 Posts
August 25 2014 20:09 GMT
#25003
Well... Thats kinda the point behind the costs i guess. You don't want poor people to immigrate.


But I guess there should be better ways to assure this than its done now.
Wolfstan
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada605 Posts
August 25 2014 20:14 GMT
#25004
Just assuring that this Kwark guy will be an asset rather than a burden. Countries being selective about immigration is a good thing. Deporting is a lot harder than importing, so it makes sense to have the 4 month+ screening for criminals, entitlement mooches, and assure they are not filling a job an american could do leading to wage depression.
EG - ROOT - Gambit Gaming
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States24361 Posts
August 25 2014 20:26 GMT
#25005
On August 26 2014 05:14 Wolfstan wrote:
Just assuring that this Kwark guy will be an asset rather than a burden. Countries being selective about immigration is a good thing. Deporting is a lot harder than importing, so it makes sense to have the 4 month+ screening for criminals, entitlement mooches, and assure they are not filling a job an american could do leading to wage depression.



I'm not arguing with the logic (only accepting probable assets over probably burdens) Just saying we really need to do something about the giant statue that says otherwise...
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Velr
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Switzerland10954 Posts
August 25 2014 20:29 GMT
#25006
I personally just think there should be other ways than basically frontloading tons of money to assure that only "assets" immigrate. I mean, if it stays like this you get uninformed people trying to immigrate bankrupting themselves in the process.

Thats not exactly what you want, at best your destroying the live of uninformed people and at worst your creating illegal aliens thanks to the immigration system.
Thats not exactly win/win...
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States24361 Posts
August 25 2014 21:09 GMT
#25007
On August 26 2014 05:29 Velr wrote:
I personally just think there should be other ways than basically frontloading tons of money to assure that only "assets" immigrate. I mean, if it stays like this you get uninformed people trying to immigrate bankrupting themselves in the process.

Thats not exactly what you want, at best your destroying the live of uninformed people and at worst your creating illegal aliens thanks to the immigration system.
Thats not exactly win/win...


I also agree with that. As segregated as America often feels it really is a global melting pot. Whether Americans like it or not we get influenced by cultures from all over the world (God knows most American's don't GO anywhere to experience culture).

Humans are worth a lot more than they can ever reflect on a balance sheet and it seems our immigration policy has a hard time dealing with that.

So immigrants have to know more about America and our systems and be far more economically stable than the majority of Americans actually are. I hadn't noticed but that's actually a really creative way to deal with pettifog the wealth disparity issue.

Immigrants (legal) will be our new middle class (In between the 1% and the rest of us). It won't be long before average Americans are outclassed by immigrants in every way (except skin color I suppose? Although white's are becoming a smaller and smaller group).

"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Wolfstan
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada605 Posts
August 25 2014 21:23 GMT
#25008
On August 26 2014 06:09 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 26 2014 05:29 Velr wrote:
I personally just think there should be other ways than basically frontloading tons of money to assure that only "assets" immigrate. I mean, if it stays like this you get uninformed people trying to immigrate bankrupting themselves in the process.

Thats not exactly what you want, at best your destroying the live of uninformed people and at worst your creating illegal aliens thanks to the immigration system.
Thats not exactly win/win...


I also agree with that. As segregated as America often feels it really is a global melting pot. Whether Americans like it or not we get influenced by cultures from all over the world (God knows most American's don't GO anywhere to experience culture).

Humans are worth a lot more than they can ever reflect on a balance sheet and it seems our immigration policy has a hard time dealing with that.

So immigrants have to know more about America and our systems and be far more economically stable than the majority of Americans actually are.
I hadn't noticed but that's actually a really creative way to deal with pettifog the wealth disparity issue.

Immigrants (legal) will be our new middle class (In between the 1% and the rest of us). It won't be long before average Americans are outclassed by immigrants in every way (except skin color I suppose? Although white's are becoming a smaller and smaller group).



Certainly, their worth should be evaluated by their income statement and and cash flow statement too. Immigration's goal should be to make the country better economically, you do that by increasing the average. If the average coloured person is better off than the white guy, maybe white dudes will be less racist too. Unfortunately, anti-semitism disproves that hope as well.
EG - ROOT - Gambit Gaming
JonnyBNoHo
Profile Joined July 2011
United States6277 Posts
August 25 2014 21:43 GMT
#25009
On August 26 2014 06:09 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 26 2014 05:29 Velr wrote:
I personally just think there should be other ways than basically frontloading tons of money to assure that only "assets" immigrate. I mean, if it stays like this you get uninformed people trying to immigrate bankrupting themselves in the process.

Thats not exactly what you want, at best your destroying the live of uninformed people and at worst your creating illegal aliens thanks to the immigration system.
Thats not exactly win/win...


I also agree with that. As segregated as America often feels it really is a global melting pot. Whether Americans like it or not we get influenced by cultures from all over the world (God knows most American's don't GO anywhere to experience culture).

Humans are worth a lot more than they can ever reflect on a balance sheet and it seems our immigration policy has a hard time dealing with that.

So immigrants have to know more about America and our systems and be far more economically stable than the majority of Americans actually are. I hadn't noticed but that's actually a really creative way to deal with pettifog the wealth disparity issue.

Immigrants (legal) will be our new middle class (In between the 1% and the rest of us). It won't be long before average Americans are outclassed by immigrants in every way (except skin color I suppose? Although white's are becoming a smaller and smaller group).


Immigrants generally have less financial means than natives, and the system favors uniting families over attracting skilled workers.
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-25 21:45:02
August 25 2014 21:43 GMT
#25010
On August 26 2014 06:23 Wolfstan wrote:
Certainly, their worth should be evaluated by their income statement and and cash flow statement too. Immigration's goal should be to make the country better economically,

The last time I remember reading about the 'American dream' that wasn't exactly what it was all about. Collecting people with eight different degrees as government assets actually sounds like the very opposite.
Liquid`Drone
Profile Joined September 2002
Norway28895 Posts
August 25 2014 21:47 GMT
#25011
haha yeah, give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free. not really that anymore?
Moderator
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-25 21:55:48
August 25 2014 21:53 GMT
#25012
I'm not talking about taking anybody just for the sake of it, but I guess... you could at least try to keep the actual ideals intact? Taking all the smart Asians is already Canada's métier.
Millitron
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States2611 Posts
August 25 2014 21:58 GMT
#25013
On August 26 2014 06:47 Liquid`Drone wrote:
haha yeah, give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free. not really that anymore?

It wasn't even like that at the time though.
Who called in the fleet?
Wolfstan
Profile Joined March 2011
Canada605 Posts
August 25 2014 21:59 GMT
#25014
I don't think so, different times, different ideology. Picking yourself up by your bootstraps and making a better life for yourself is frowned upon now, let the government carry you has become the rallying cry of the masses now. We have too many freeloaders as it is on non-incentivized programs, we have to get more above average citizens to pay more into it.
EG - ROOT - Gambit Gaming
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18869 Posts
August 25 2014 22:15 GMT
#25015
Picking yourself up by your bootstraps isn't frowned upon, people who use that tired phrase to justify monetary Darwinism are.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Stratos_speAr
Profile Joined May 2009
United States6959 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-25 22:36:24
August 25 2014 22:31 GMT
#25016
On August 26 2014 06:53 Nyxisto wrote:
I'm not talking about taking anybody just for the sake of it, but I guess... you could at least try to keep the actual ideals intact? Taking all the smart Asians is already Canada's métier.


America hasn't actually lived up to its ideals for decades. This country is beyond hypocritical and probably only lives up to its "ideals" when it comes to the use of its military....

I don't think so, different times, different ideology. Picking yourself up by your bootstraps and making a better life for yourself is frowned upon now, let the government carry you has become the rallying cry of the masses now. We have too many freeloaders as it is on non-incentivized programs, we have to get more above average citizens to pay more into it.


It isn't frowned upon. Everything you said here is pure BS. People want to be able to work hard and make a better life for themselves. The problem is that It's practically impossible nowadays.

It is a fact that is is more difficult to "pick yourself up by your bootstraps" (i.e. economic mobility) in the U.S. than in a large number of other countries including Canada, England, France, Germany, The Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Norway, and Sweden, all of which are far more socialized than we are.
A sound mind in a sound body, is a short, but full description of a happy state in this World: he that has these two, has little more to wish for; and he that wants either of them, will be little the better for anything else.
JonnyBNoHo
Profile Joined July 2011
United States6277 Posts
August 25 2014 22:49 GMT
#25017
On August 26 2014 06:53 Nyxisto wrote:
I'm not talking about taking anybody just for the sake of it, but I guess... you could at least try to keep the actual ideals intact? Taking all the smart Asians is already Canada's métier.

Most immigrants fall into the category of 'family reunification.' We could actually do a much better job attracting smart Asians if we really wanted to. Many come here for higher ed (US attracts lots of international students) and then struggle to either grab an H1-B visa or a permanent immigrant status.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States24361 Posts
August 25 2014 23:05 GMT
#25018
On August 26 2014 07:49 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 26 2014 06:53 Nyxisto wrote:
I'm not talking about taking anybody just for the sake of it, but I guess... you could at least try to keep the actual ideals intact? Taking all the smart Asians is already Canada's métier.

Most immigrants fall into the category of 'family reunification.' We could actually do a much better job attracting smart Asians if we really wanted to. Many come here for higher ed (US attracts lots of international students) and then struggle to either grab an H1-B visa or a permanent immigrant status.


Best I could tell there are leftovers of both from year to year. When there are less of one the slots go to the other. I don't think anyone would really argue that we couldn't allow more highly skilled immigrants (except maybe the most extreme of the tea party).

I don't think leaving American-Immigrant families intentionally fractured plays particularly well on either side, so reducing unification seems like political suicide also.

Immigration reform is desperately needed (totally independent of any border issues) for a multitude of reasons, the longer people on the right live in denial of that fact the worse off their party will be.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
jellyjello
Profile Joined March 2011
Korea (South)664 Posts
August 26 2014 00:12 GMT
#25019
On August 26 2014 08:05 GreenHorizons wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 26 2014 07:49 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On August 26 2014 06:53 Nyxisto wrote:
I'm not talking about taking anybody just for the sake of it, but I guess... you could at least try to keep the actual ideals intact? Taking all the smart Asians is already Canada's métier.

Most immigrants fall into the category of 'family reunification.' We could actually do a much better job attracting smart Asians if we really wanted to. Many come here for higher ed (US attracts lots of international students) and then struggle to either grab an H1-B visa or a permanent immigrant status.


Best I could tell there are leftovers of both from year to year. When there are less of one the slots go to the other. I don't think anyone would really argue that we couldn't allow more highly skilled immigrants (except maybe the most extreme of the tea party).

I don't think leaving American-Immigrant families intentionally fractured plays particularly well on either side, so reducing unification seems like political suicide also.

Immigration reform is desperately needed (totally independent of any border issues) for a multitude of reasons, the longer people on the right live in denial of that fact the worse off their party will be.


Agreed on the immigration reform. However, the border must be secured first, or at least show a concerted and genuine effort to securing the border.
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
August 26 2014 00:28 GMT
#25020
On August 26 2014 09:12 jellyjello wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 26 2014 08:05 GreenHorizons wrote:
On August 26 2014 07:49 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On August 26 2014 06:53 Nyxisto wrote:
I'm not talking about taking anybody just for the sake of it, but I guess... you could at least try to keep the actual ideals intact? Taking all the smart Asians is already Canada's métier.

Most immigrants fall into the category of 'family reunification.' We could actually do a much better job attracting smart Asians if we really wanted to. Many come here for higher ed (US attracts lots of international students) and then struggle to either grab an H1-B visa or a permanent immigrant status.


Best I could tell there are leftovers of both from year to year. When there are less of one the slots go to the other. I don't think anyone would really argue that we couldn't allow more highly skilled immigrants (except maybe the most extreme of the tea party).

I don't think leaving American-Immigrant families intentionally fractured plays particularly well on either side, so reducing unification seems like political suicide also.

Immigration reform is desperately needed (totally independent of any border issues) for a multitude of reasons, the longer people on the right live in denial of that fact the worse off their party will be.


Agreed on the immigration reform. However, the border must be secured first, or at least show a concerted and genuine effort to securing the border.
Now if only we could get a Congress and President that would think likewise.
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
Prev 1 1249 1250 1251 1252 1253 10093 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 55m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 2115
sorry 111
Shinee 69
HiyA 45
Bale 40
NaDa 37
ToSsGirL 30
ajuk12(nOOB) 9
Dota 2
XaKoH 386
NeuroSwarm174
League of Legends
JimRising 504
Counter-Strike
shoxiejesuss88
Other Games
gofns11112
summit1g10823
ceh9495
Happy433
crisheroes226
Sick173
Maynarde148
Livibee122
Mew2King93
KnowMe54
UpATreeSC40
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream9809
Other Games
gamesdonequick655
StarCraft: Brood War
Afreeca ASL 481
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 36
• mYiSmile110
• Letter145
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota2132
League of Legends
• Lourlo1209
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
1h 55m
Replay Cast
15h 55m
Korean StarCraft League
1d 19h
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
GSL
2 days
Yamato Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Afreeca Starleague
4 days
Soma vs Jaedong
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Afreeca Starleague
5 days
Leta vs Soulkey
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Super Anchor Qualifying S3
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Calamity Invitational
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSB
Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Custodian Cup
Copium Cup
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.