If you browse the web a little bit, you will find posts containing quotes of Naniwa commenting on his win. I have one of his quotes here, "....I thought that he would do some smart shit like building a hatchery far away and just transferring it, I thought he was that genius but apparently he is just an idiot, what he did made no sense... " (Video souce posted, skip to 10:10) This is Naniwa's comment on pulling drones by Nestea.
Although I was, and still am, very happy for his wins, I do not appreciate this type of attitude. Do not forget that Nestea has won 3 GSLs, Being in a slump does not make anyone an idiot. Honestly, I would more appreciate a modest attitude, how can Naniwa be so proud to a level that he insults on of the the starcraft pillars?
We are the starcraft community, and we have influence. Maybe we should respond to this kind of attitude by simply disliking it. Let's not hate anyone, and simply show that we appreciate pro players who work hard, even if they are in a temporary slump.
On November 20 2011 01:21 Theeakoz wrote: "I thought he (NesTea) was just a genius but apparently he's just an idiot."
I simply dont believe that he said that - Source please
Also - What he did say in an interview was (Slasher Interview): "I didn't expect to win, but they (MVP and NesTea) seemed easier than I anticipated."
Edit: I've seen the source interview - I think that you are over analyzing this, note that english isnt Naniwas first language, he might not mean that NesTea is an idiot, but that the descision he made was idiotic
well unless your nestea in disguise it doesnt really matter. plus nestea did play dumb during the games. nowhere near the top nestea could play. nestea was just playing flat out bad
Is this an actual quote? Seems highly unlikely that he'd call a 3 time GSL champion an idiot. Everyone does dumb things sometimes. After all this is Naniwa, the guy who 1 gate expanded vs a speedling opening in GSL a few days ago.
Player vs Player bashing is fine especially at the pro level as they aren't taking potshots from the dark but putting there ego on the line. It's what makes entertaining stories and games, especially when there's grudge involved.
To be honest I don't understand why 1/2 of this community is so uptight at any offensive comment.
On November 20 2011 01:25 Little-Chimp wrote: Is this an actual quote? Seems highly unlikely that he'd call a 3 time GSL champion an idiot. Everyone does dumb things sometimes. After all this is Naniwa, the guy who 1 gate expanded vs a speedling opening in GSL a few days ago.
His just talking about that game and what Nestea did in and your taking it way out of context. Nothing diffrent from all the bashing at nestea about the blizzcon finals.
If he commented somewhere on the side, specifically stating that he hated Nestea, then yes, maybe.Now it was just a random description on how Nestea reacted to that specific event and how Naniwa was prepared for something more, but was dissapointed.
Please don't try and making useless drama with these kind of useless threads.
To be fair Naniwa does have a point to some extent.He says it a bit harsh but all Nestea had to do was build a expansion somewhere on the map and drone up because Naniwa wouldn't be able to do anything anyway because he invested so much into cannons and a nexus cancel.Instead he made like 20 lings to kill the cannons at his natural and he could have done that with 4 roaches after he got his expo up at some place which would be super hard for Naniwa to stop or even punish.
I just saw him say it. He should be thankful it's such a beast win! MVP TO NESTEA?!?! I never liked naniwa and his ZvPs werent all that good, nestea did seem to be playing sub par but his PvT was actually insane and top notch. But that was a pretty smug comment.
you have to consider that english is not his first language. Sometimes its difficult to find the right words instantly...if he TRULY would find that Nestea is an IDIOT...than he would be an ass...but i guess it was more like "his move to send drones made no sense for me".
The drones were a mindgame move, so of course its not the most logic move.
You're twisting the situation. He called his strategy idiotic (because he had no secret expansion) not necessarily his character. Please don't create bullshit out-of-context drama.
On November 20 2011 01:26 darkevilxe wrote: if you're talking about pillars of starcraft in general I don't think zergbong is the best example of that. flash, maybe..
Since he was talking about a specific situation, surely Idra's regular insults towards players he doesn't like would be a more important target? Unless this is just because he dared criticize poor Nestea instead of some scrub like Cruncher I guess...
- Naniwa got crushed by code A players - NesTea won the GSL 3 times over code S players - Naniwa beat him in a bo3 (- NesTea probably suffering from jetlag, because of his tight schedule in code S not allowing him to fly in sooner) => NesTea is an idiot
Sorry, but I've given students 0 points in math exams for conclusions that have been better than this one, and I mean this seriously.
I am pretty sure Naniwa doesn't really consider Nestea an idiot, I think he was just saying that he made a poor decision in that game and he was surprised that someone so skilled made such a decision.
You need to put it in context, he was commentating on a stupid move by nestea in that game, not that he's an idiot in general, there's a big difference there.
Oh wow I'm actually suprised that he actually said that?!?!? Could you link source? I know for fact that he been tayloring a build just for MVP and nestea and maybe his hard work has paid off and so he is letting off a bit of steam...? But man... This is unusual for Naniwa
Oh well if this is true, it's not gonna go down well for him in Korean PR lol
On November 20 2011 01:28 FrodoAndTheSlobStix wrote: To people saying it's out of context....Not really. He said he thought nestea was genius but I guess he's just an idiot.
its actually not out of context at all and he said just that, people are just trying to defend nani
He was talking about that decision. There were better ways to say it to prevent this type of thread, but that's Naniwa. He will say what's on his mind :D
On November 20 2011 01:26 darkevilxe wrote: if you're talking about pillars of starcraft in general I don't think zergbong is the best example of that. flash, maybe..
sc2 != scbw... stop confusing the two.
nestea IS a pillar of starcraft 2.
I understand this which is why I say "pillars of starcraft in general" as the OP said nestea was "a pillar of starcraft"
This is very context sensitive. Do you think Nani legitimately thinks Nestea is an idiot? No, at most he probably just meant that Nestea was playing idiotically in that game. Even if he was completely 100% honest and truly does believe that Lim Jae Duk, three time GSL champion, is an idiot. What do you want to achieve with this? Should we boycott him and lock his fanclub, or what? I don't know what good would come of this.
You're completely taking that quote out of context. Naniwa isn't saying Nestea is an idiot or a terrible player at all. He said that what he did that game made no sense it all (it didn't) and that that game definitely wasn't representative of his so-called "genius" reputation among foreigners. Quit trying to make this into something it isn't.
On November 20 2011 01:28 FrodoAndTheSlobStix wrote: To people saying it's out of context....Not really. He said he thought nestea was genius but I guess he's just an idiot.
its actually not out of context at all and he said just that, people are just trying to defend nani
should probably listen to all the interview not just 1/2 the sentence <3
Dear OP, You take the quote absolutely out of context. Please don't do that again.
Maybe the statement was a bit harsh but Naniwa is totally right about this one. You could even see ingame what he was thinking when he sent around a probe to all far away expansions.
stop calling people idiots and stop calling their actions idiotic. just say that maybe it would have worked better if he didn't do it or something like that. i would expect this from naniwa, he has a past with poor attitudes as far as i can understand. you can have an attitude without having a poor attitude and i just think that people who have poor attitudes are hurting esports.
On November 20 2011 01:28 FrodoAndTheSlobStix wrote: To people saying it's out of context....Not really. He said he thought nestea was genius but I guess he's just an idiot.
its actually not out of context at all and he said just that, people are just trying to defend nani
It is out of context. He was clearly talking about him pulling the drones making him seem like an idiot instead of a genius.
On November 20 2011 01:28 FrodoAndTheSlobStix wrote: To people saying it's out of context....Not really. He said he thought nestea was genius but I guess he's just an idiot.
It is out of context. I am by no means a huge Naniwa fan since he did do some pretty stupid things in the past but I have to defend him here. His wording is just poor. He certainly is talking about this particular situation in the game where Nestea made a mistake (or something stupid, did not see the game actually), which was idiotic. Idiots do idiotic things. Therefore Nestea is an idiot. There is no way that he means it as Nestea is an idiot in general.
I think Naniwa just comes off as an asshole sometimes, and doesnt mean to. Just the way he talks, Like when he was said "wrong team" But thats just my opionion
On November 20 2011 01:29 Grettin wrote: Does this really surprise you? Naniwa has been acting like a brat since the early months of SC2.
So has IdrA lol and people still worship his words like it comes from a demigod. Who the hell cares what he said anyways.Opinions are like "you know what" after all.
I think this might be a case of not haveing english as your mother language. Nani can be abit BM sometimes i guess, but i really doubt he actually thinks Nestea is an idiot.
A side note: why does people go on about jet lag, Naniwa probobly arrived in the US the same time as Nestea (he lives in Korea aswell)
On November 20 2011 01:28 JustPassingBy wrote: - Naniwa got crushed by code A players - NesTea won the GSL 3 times over code S players - Naniwa beat him in a bo3 (- NesTea probably suffering from jetlag, because of his tight schedule in code S not allowing him to fly in sooner) => NesTea is an idiot
Sorry, but I've given students 0 points in math exams for conclusions that have been better than this one, and I mean this seriously.
If you can say NesTea is jetlagged than you should also say that NaNiwa was jetlagged since he also came on the same plane with the korean players.
In my experience people in Europe are much more blunt than is typical for Americans. I don't think he means this as an insult or a challenge. Moreover, it could be just a translation error. If you watch the video and take thte video in context, it seems much more acceptable.
Poor choice of words, but it's not like English is Naniwa's first language, and he was pretty clearly talking about the decision. Seems like a storm in a teacup really.
Naniwa explains that he was afraid of a hidden Expansion, when he saw all the drones come out of the base, when he canceled his building Nexus. He said (talking about Nestea's expansion, after the interviewer asked about the drone transfer twice):
I blocked it and thought he'd do some smart shit, like building a Hatchery far away, and then transferring it. I thought he was that genius, but apparently he was just a idiot. (interviewer laughs) what he did made no sense, (interviewer "yeah that was a little bit confusing") so I made just two canons and had the much better economy.
This is way overblown. It may be disrespectful to Nestea, but I doubt it hurts Tea's feelings.
LOL I got to the part where there's nothing to do in America or Europe, only South Korea. I hope he's referring only to starcraft. Still, I'm not hinging my happiness on Nani's remarks, and I doubt most pros are either.
On November 20 2011 01:32 Athroix wrote: Lost a lot of respect for Naniwa after saying this....he is constantly struggling on Code A, yet Nestea has WON 3 Code S titles....
Then you should watch the entire segment and not just take what the OP said as fact.
Artosis's hype is really starting to have some really negative effects on the community. Well it's been having bad effects for awhile but man this is just sad.
On November 20 2011 01:28 JustPassingBy wrote: - Naniwa got crushed by code A players - NesTea won the GSL 3 times over code S players - Naniwa beat him in a bo3 (- NesTea probably suffering from jetlag, because of his tight schedule in code S not allowing him to fly in sooner) => NesTea is an idiot
Sorry, but I've given students 0 points in math exams for conclusions that have been better than this one, and I mean this seriously.
Naniwa comes from Korea as well ffs... I'd be sad to have you as a teacher.
On November 20 2011 01:32 Morale wrote: I think this might be a case of not haveing english as your mother language. Nani can be abit BM sometimes i guess, but i really doubt he actually thinks Nestea is an idiot.
A side note: why does people go on about jet lag, Naniwa probobly arrived in the US the same time as Nestea (he lives in Korea aswell)
using 'x is an idiot' as shorthand for 'x did something dumb' is common among native speakers
On November 20 2011 01:28 FrodoAndTheSlobStix wrote: To people saying it's out of context....Not really. He said he thought nestea was genius but I guess he's just an idiot.
its actually not out of context at all and he said just that, people are just trying to defend nani
It is out of context. He was clearly talking about him pulling the drones making him seem like an idiot instead of a genius.
reading comprehension
IT: When he sent drones, your probe saw it obviously, and ... you lost minerals to nexus cancel and built cannons.. Nani: ....I thought that he would do some smart shit like building a hatchery far away and just transferring it, I thought he was that genius but apparently he is just an idiot, what he did made no sense...
On November 20 2011 01:28 FrodoAndTheSlobStix wrote: To people saying it's out of context....Not really. He said he thought nestea was genius but I guess he's just an idiot.
It was obviously a joke when taken in the context it was used in. It's the same situation as if I were playing basketball with someone I knew was pretty good at it and he put up an airball, and I were to say "I thought you were pretty good at this game, but apparently you suck". It's hyperbole for comedic effect.
Jesus fucking christ, you people are oversensitive.
On November 20 2011 01:28 FrodoAndTheSlobStix wrote: To people saying it's out of context....Not really. He said he thought nestea was genius but I guess he's just an idiot.
It is out of context. I am by no means a huge Naniwa fan since he did do some pretty stupid things in the past but I have to defend him here. His wording is just poor. He certainly is talking about this particular situation in the game where Nestea made a mistake (or something stupid, did not see the game actually), which was idiotic. Idiots do idiotic things. Therefore Nestea is an idiot. There is no way that he means it as Nestea is an idiot in general.
That is exactly what I am talking about, the way you word things. What does respect really mean? respect is shown by the way you put words next to each other in a sentence.
On November 20 2011 01:33 K_Dilkington wrote: Either way, Idra get's away with saying worse shit than this every day so I don't see how this warrants a thread.
Idra telling mana to fuck off in a tournament and calling other players retarded like every weak - LOLOL SO FUNNY. Naniwa calling nesteas decision to pull drones idiotic - Grow up.
@OP .Sure his words might have been abit harsh, but are your retarded? You can't just pull something out of context like that.. and quite frankly, Nestea actually fucked up pretty badly that game....
calling someone you don't know an idiot, especially someone who is 10 years older than you, is pretty disrespectful, and completly unnessesary. and no, it was not out of context. he could've said it was a bad decision, but know, he call him an idiot. hey, guess he wouldn't say that in his face. is easy to call someone an idiot infront of a camera. classless
to the OP!! You are a perfect example of what TMZ is. How can you just take things out of context. Listen to what context "idiot" refers to! But anyways its just my opinion. No need to flame Nani for that. He is BM and thats his style, just like IdrA
If the quote seemed rather out of context, I have changed it now. Please go read it again and listen to the video again, and you will see what I am talking about. Also, please read the rest of OP, and focus more on what my purpose actually was when I posted this on TL.
dont you think it was pretty silly that nestea pulled drones?- yes it was nani built the canons and that was the right decision the drones didnt change anything
I'm a bit confused, if anything that drone pull seemed quite brilliant. Nestea was pretty fucked if he let nani get that nexus up and close the front door. Getting that cancel and then moving back seemed like the best possible move he could've done, though the followup of massing zlings and killing the cannons instead of expanding to the 12 oclock seemed... not vice.
bad communication-skills in a language that is not your native, prob. jetlag, crazy emotions going on AND the fact that he was right about the things he said don´t count, uhhh? if you watch the whole vid, you´d probably notice that he doesn´t even know specific words to express what he actually means sometimes. you can´t compare sarah palin with the things naniwa said btw. at the end of the day, i think a lot of people bash other players even more than he did + he was kinda right to say that the things nestea did were kinda bad. duuuhhh. stop hating, and DON´T take everything so f* seriously guys. this is not politics(and don´t get me started on this one).
NaNiwa simply finds it hard to construct his sentences, listen to the entire interview and he has a difficult time trying to word out "feeling homesick", just shows he finds it hard to express himself in english.
It was an idiotic move and he was right to say it I dont see the problem here? There was some thought behind the idea, but it wasn't planned or thought out very well or executed very well. Pretty dumb to do something so gimmicky on the best Zerg map in the map pool.
On November 20 2011 01:33 K_Dilkington wrote: Either way, Idra get's away with saying worse shit than this every day so I don't see how this warrants a thread.
Idra telling mana to fuck off in a tournament and calling other players retarded like every weak - LOLOL SO FUNNY. Naniwa calling nesteas decision to pull drones idiotic - Grow up.
To be frank, Idra is funnier when he does this stuff. Completely regardless of how I feel about this cute little "incident," Idra's just funnier when flaming others.
naniwa is just really straight forward an mostly say the first thing that pops up in his head, but I am sure he doesn't mean too disrespecy anyone. He just seem a little too fast with his words, not overthinking what impact is of the things he says, probably an improving point for him =).
On November 20 2011 01:28 FrodoAndTheSlobStix wrote: To people saying it's out of context....Not really. He said he thought nestea was genius but I guess he's just an idiot.
It is out of context. I am by no means a huge Naniwa fan since he did do some pretty stupid things in the past but I have to defend him here. His wording is just poor. He certainly is talking about this particular situation in the game where Nestea made a mistake (or something stupid, did not see the game actually), which was idiotic. Idiots do idiotic things. Therefore Nestea is an idiot. There is no way that he means it as Nestea is an idiot in general.
That is exactly what I am talking about, the way you word things. What does respect really mean? respect is shown by the way you put words next to each other in a sentence.
Yes, so we should vilify him for saying one thing that can be taken as disrespectful. In a live interview. In his non-native language.
Or, maybe we should just accept that there was a better way to word it and give him the benefit of the doubt.
Ultimately, it's up to us to decide what he intended by that remark. For me, the fact that it's a relative outlier suggests that no harm was intended. Had it been Idra, then it would be simply another in a long chain of disrespectful behavior.
Why conclude malice when error is the more likely answer?
On November 20 2011 01:38 Pulzlulz wrote: Congratulations, you destroyed someone's reputation.
what? it was an interview. naniwa should've chosen his words more carefully.
he gave an honest opinion. nestea did something stupid and naniwa won the game. from that you can infer that nani isnt cocky but infact believes nestea is very good (mechanically etc) but this weekend has been playing stupid/bad whatever you want to call it.
being seconds away from losing to idra, while being outplayed every game of their series, then losing to naniwa who couldnt win a game in code a. either nestea forgot how to zerg or hes been playing bad so far this weekend, theres no arguing with it.
id be a lot more bored with ESPORTS interviews if people started never speaking their minds. politicians giving interviews is one of the most boring things in tv, hearing nani say "ye, that was a dumb thing to do" makes it worth listening to
On November 20 2011 01:33 K_Dilkington wrote: Either way, Idra get's away with saying worse shit than this every day so I don't see how this warrants a thread.
Idra telling mana to fuck off in a tournament and calling other players retarded like every weak - LOLOL SO FUNNY. Naniwa calling nesteas decision to pull drones idiotic - Grow up.
To be frank, Idra is funnier when he does this stuff. Completely regardless of how I feel about this cute little "incident," Idra's just funnier when flaming others.
funnier? i don´t know, really ... seems to me that its kinda sad, but definitely not "funny".
Oh crap, Naniwa called Nestea an idiot! Call the internet police! Why is this even a thread? I mean honestly? Nestea made so many terrible decisions that game but I have no room to talk since both of them are far better players than I.
On November 20 2011 01:35 Numy wrote: Artosis's hype is really starting to have some really negative effects on the community. Well it's been having bad effects for awhile but man this is just sad.
Yeah I hope someone sends a question to the next SotG about this whole Nestea overblown hype thing. Artosis is so busy worshipping Nestea that he's actually not giving any credit/spotlight to people who deserve it more, and that detracts from his performance as a caster.
Naniwa also said he wasn't afraid of NesTea, that NesTea was overrated and that there were lots of better ZvP players than NesTea. He dissed him pretty hard, but that's okay, isn't Naniwa allowed to have an opinion like that? And I'm sure Naniwa is proficient enough in English that he can construct a simple sentence, he is Swedish, travels internationally and is pretty smart. Why shouldn't he have good English?
Naniwa never changed he is just not being as open with his opinions anymore (for good reason). That being said people think things like this all the time most of them just don't say it.
Can't beleve people care THIS much. It's a persons own right to say and state whatever he wants from his point of view. To say "He wont last long" or "He doesnt deserve anything" is just utter lame. You can maybe disrespect him as a person but as a player he's still a great gamer. It's like looking down on player X cause it accidentally came out that he was a socialist/right wing conservatism etc. He DOES deserve what he won/is winning/is going to win, cause he is a good player. And it's no meaning to make such a big deal out of this. This just saddens me to see the community beeing so hatefull just cause he doesn't say whatever other people want him to say, especially when it's such a small thing.
(This is of course my oppinion and you have the right to disagree)
On November 20 2011 01:40 K_Dilkington wrote: You're all a bunch of drama queens, the SC2 community must be the most sensitive community in the world.
and damn we should be darn proud of that, because this communitie actually cares about behaviour and their players. This scene reaches new hights in esports.
EPT
